Ireland West Airport Knock

[sawtooth]

Hasn't been much news 2018 so starting a new thread with a few recent updates:

Link to previous IWAK thread here:
https://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes/252725-ireland-west-airport-knock-104.html?highlight=Knock+Airport

[airnoc]

Is IWAK going to get a base with Ryanair first flight for June1st 2019 is direct from IWAK at 0705 am?

[sawtooth]

Phase 1 of €15m "transformation programme" completed
Lot of infrastructure investment happening this year to enhance passenger experience, cope with growing numbers and upgrade old equipment.

Terminal upgrades

Re-branding and terminal interior makeover
New signage and wayfinding system across airport
New Aviation Gallery / Museum area
Re-modelled larger immigration, arrivals, retail, catering and toilet facilities
250 additional surfaced car park spaces and number plate scanning entry
New flight information digital displays and video walls throughout the airport
Visitor Discovery Centre
New "state of the art" Wild Atlantic Way tourism center is almost complete in arrivals

Infrastructure

Covered aircraft boarding stairs
Upgraded handling equipment, snow clearing and safety vehicles
Fire station extension & new equipment
Upgraded runway lighting system

Phase 2 upgrades 2019

Re-modelling departures area
Upgrading of Screening and ATC equipment
Further upgrade to the airport car parks and road access
Runway Upgrade
Dep of Transport funding €8.4m (75%) to complete first overhaul of airports 30 year old runway in 2019.​

Full resurfacing overlay and new LED ground lighting system
ILS systems upgrade (ILS on 08 ?)

[sawtooth]

Fairly quiet on route front for Knock this year. New FR Girona and TUI Majorca services operated over Summer 2018 and FR added capacity on Milan.

Increased Winter Services

FR adding 7000 UK seats:

STN 10x weekly
LPL 6x weekly
LTN 6x weekly
EMA 4x weekly
BRS 3x weekly
ACE 1x weekly
BE operating Man, BHX and EDI
EI LGW no change

Sunway operating Lapland charter

------

Cologne
FR announced first German route from Knock with a 2x weekly service to Cologne for Summer 19 starting June.
Huge catchment population, could do well if promoted well. Launch media focusing on inbound potential and Wild Atlantic Way.
CGN – T – – – S –

New Ryanair service connects Cologne to Wild Atlantic Way as German visitor numbers boom (https://www.independent.ie/life/travel/new-ryanair-service-connects-cologne-to-wild-atlantic-way-as-german-visitor-numbers-boom-37436678.html)

[iwak]

Great news about the Cologne route . Leeds Bradford needs to be the next new route from knock operated by Flybe . Manchester has seen fantastic numbers this year .im sure a 3 per week service to Leeds would be well supported

[EI-BUD]

airnoc,
which route is this 0705 departure on?
Having a based airline sounds insane from the perspective of opening hours and costs.

[robbie1973]

I have checked all Ryanair departures for Saturday 1st June and can’t find any flights that are scheduled to depart before 9am ?

Where have you got the information regarding the earlier flight ?

[840]

Are there any family/economic links between the North-West and Yorkshire that make Leeds-Bradford likely to succeed?

Aside from it's previous time at Knock, it's been tried by Ryanair from Shannon, and Aer Lingus Regional and BMI Regional from Cork and none of those have been successful, so it doesn't have a great record as a route from Irish airports outside Dublin.

[AerRyan]

sawtooth

You've mixed up a bit here, Stansted is only 10x weekly. 20x weekly would entail triple daily return flights on all bar one day.

[Dreamliner_01]

I notice a season extension for Girona which has gone from peak season operation to a april to October service which will be good boost for passenger numbers - all in all with the new service etc should see NOC get close to the 800,000 passenger milestone

[Chris_747]

TUI seem to have dropped Palma for Summer 19

Only showing Costa Dorada on the website for next summer, surprising!

[Dreamliner_01]

Not really surprising the hot summer this year killed it poor enough loads and were selling it very cheap towards the end - surprised it didn’t work though as should have

[iwak]

Fly be summer flights released today bhx not bookable after mid June and Edinburgh only via man in July but direct in August would be a shame if knock loses these routes

[Dreamliner_01]

Seems a very strange schedule to take a service out in July when it’s one of the few months they make money - I notice EDI is back in for September ! Very strange that they would operate BHX up until June and then pull it - why not pull it before summer season starts ? I’d say things definitely not finalized and lot of chopping and Changing going on

[iwak]

Flybe flights for next summer are all on sale now

bhx 6 weekly

Edi 6 weekly

Man daily

[Dreamliner_01]

Good to see as was worried about that one - if all stays as is Knock should be very close to 800,000 next year which will be another milestone

[sawtooth]

Ryanair adding TFS for winter 19. Good to see another winter route, along with more seats on BRS and longer season for GRO/BGY.

FlyBe —> Virgin
Interesting to see how the reported Flybe rebrand to Virgin plays out. Virgin brand more established in Ireland now with Virgin Media, but it took NOC several years to rebuild the 3 routes after BMI demise. It does open up possability of interline booking 6 USA destinations from MAN if times better matched those connections.

[iwak]

Great to see the Tenerife route extension for winter and the 2weekly cologne summer service . Certainly stacking up to be a good year for knock . Fingers crossed that virgin keep the existing knock routes .Slow and steady growth is always best .

[Kinocker]

Knock seems to be having a good year but some possible headwinds on the way if the Ryanair base closures in Spain go ahead. Knock's position without any based aircraft leaves it vulnerable to issues affecting the base airports that serve it.

Three of the four affected Spanish airports - Tenerife South, Lanzarote and Girona are destinations served from Knock. It would be quite a dent in the bucket and spade offering from the airport if all three were lost. The fourth airport, Las Palmas, is also an former Knock destination and one that they may have looked to get back if the sun routes were doing particularly well.

I suppose W routings from UK airports could work as an alternative but I'm not sure if Ryanair tend to use that option too often.

[Jack1985]

It will not be possible to service Canary routes via W patterns due to EASA FTL limitations.

[FRatSTN]

Indeed, Canary Islands are too far to be served on W patterns as would only be able to be served by a single crew with no changes (a UK/Ireland to Canaries return is about getting to limits as it is).

The only other ways this possibly could work is night stopping aircraft/crew. ie a STN based crew could do STN-NOC-TFS (overnight in TFS) then do TFS-NOC-STN.

Alternatively, a DUB crew could operate DUB-TFS-NOC (then transfer back to DUB) whilst a second crew from DUB would travel to NOC and operate NOC-TFS-DUB.

EasyJet do the former a fair bit with LGW crew and the likes of Jet2/TUI will do the latter in some cases. But for Ryanair, both cases would be unlikely I'd have thought.

[EI-BUD]

Unlikely Ryanair would taxi crews from Dublin to Knock and v.v. Equally, nightstops without a base would not be in keeping with Ryanair's cost base. The airport enjoyed limited opening hours, a night stoppping aircraft would mean a 06xx departure time, driving costs at the airport for extended opening hours....

[iwak]

Would Ryanair consider a base at knock ? 1 aircraft in winter 2 in summer ?? All knock uk routes have been in place for a long time and achieve decent loads so I’m sure they would have been dropped by now if yield wasn’t performing . My point is that these routes could be run by knock based aircraft without it being a risk to Ryanair with a possible few additional sun routes over the summer .

[Gulf Julliet Papa]

In a period where they are closing and down sizing bases if say it’s the wrong time to be hoping for a base

[fivejuliet]

Lanzarote base closure now also confirmed - certainly not good for NOC.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2019/0823/1070574-ryanair-to-close-4-spanish-bases-next-year-union/

[virginblue]

Why? They need to keep their planes busy and they can either do that by growing the remaining bases or adding new ones. I'd say adding new ones is the prefered option if that means pocketing "marketing support", steahlty subsidies etc. One could argue that this is the at the core of Ryanair's business model and results in Ryanair moving across Europe like locusts. Whether or not Knock is the most likely choice for such a move is, of course, another question.

[Gulf Julliet Papa]

Part of the issue is lack of maxs, I think FR were meant to have either 30 odd or 50 odd by next Summer. On the basis you are now short of aircraft as planned, you are going to focus your remaining assets on the higher-yielding routes and bases. I'd say it's very unlikely that you would move your limited assets to an unknown yielding "base". I appreciate these routes already exist in part, but not on the same schedule you would run if aircraft were based in NOC. Remember it actually looks like there will be a reduction of aircraft in Ireland next year, certainly not an increase.

[Europilot320]

Recently I have read that it was considered alongside with Brighton airport as a place where to test a potential electric plane by a Norwegian company
It would be nice to know if they also would consider it as a manufacturing location...

[fivejuliet]

NOC-ACE/TFS dropped as of 2 Jan 2020.

[Kinocker]

Apparently a new route will be announced from Knock by Lauda this week. Their bases are Dusseldorf, Stuttgart and Vienna, so presumably a service to one of those airports.

Would be good to see a new airline, albeit it's a Ryanair subsidiary.

[iwak]

That’s great news 👍 just a pity about ace and Tfs I’m thinking they will get TUI or sunway to operate a charter series on these 2 routes over the summer months if they can’t get a scheduled operator .

[brian_dromey]

Probably the best bet. I wonder if TUI have any fleet capacity with the MAX grounding, though.

[sawtooth]

Kinocker

Also 2 aircraft at Palma Mallorca.

*Palma loaded in booking system now.

[BFS BHD]

https://irelandwestairport.com/news/austrian-airline-lauda-launches-first-ever-route-from-regional-ireland-with-new-majorca-service?fbclid=IwAR2meKV4yNzlOK0bBWIXoM9jXuMOZKII-43q_gUWI8iVamN2SJM6M0cUsg8

[iwak]

I see cologne is loaded for June to sept next summer . I have a funny feeling that something will be worked out between ryanair and the Canary Islands airports as with the loss of Thomas cook now surely they won’t let ryanair go. They will be desperate for passengers .🤞

[sawtooth]

"Operated by Air Malta", another Ryanair subsidiary, along with with Lauda there will be a bit more colour at NOC next summer.

[DC3 Dave]

Malta Air, not Air Malta. Not being a smart arse, two separate entities.

[Kinocker]

Will Malta Air have a base in Cologne or will this be a W routing originating from Malta?

Probably a long shot but I wonder if this might lead at some stage to flights from Malta to Knock. I'm guessing not all Malta Air aircraft will be based on the island though.

[iwak]

Knock has done well of late with its slow and steady growth over the last few years . However I feel there is definitely potential in the uk left . I feel a 3 weekly to Leeds would be viable but hopefully not at the expense of manchester . Maybe loganair with their new Atrs or flybe . Glasgow like wise but would this effect the successful edinburgh service ?

a daily heathrow maybe an option when the new runway is built and with the new flybe virgin brand comes into being as they want to introduce more connectivity through Heathrow and Manchester .

Ryanair does extremely well on ltn and stn from Knock surely a 4 weekly to London Southend would be a runner .

The bucket and spade routes will always do well however mainland Europe definitely has high season potential . Looking back to when knock had the Eindhoven route loads were good over June July and August months and it certainly does take more than one summer season to build a route .

Just a few thoughts on where knock could possibly hit the 1million passenger mark in my opinion .

[840]

Leeds-Bradford - My first reaction was that this never worked from Cork or Shannon with their larger catchment, but am I right in thinking there is a history of substantial emigration from the North-West to Yorkshire? Possibly strong family ties may produce a boost.

Heathrow - Almost every Irish airport, including Kerry, or even an effectively closed airport like Waterford, could support a connection to Heathrow. The problem is at the other end. If/when a new runway is built, there is likely to be serious competition for access.

Southend - Might work, but I would have thought increased frequency on one of the other London routes would be a better bet for a capacity increase.

Sun Routes - There does seem to be a bit of scope for growth here, both in terms of capacity on existing routes and some potential new ones. Fuerteventura, Dubrovnik, Verona, Nice and Lisbon could be possibilities for new routes, although too many launching could cannibalise each other. An important figure here is when people from Galway have a choice between Knock, Shannon and Dublin for existing routes, how many opt for Knock.

Inbound tourism - The place to look for inspiration here is Kerry Airport, which has pitched their tourist offering to Germans to such an extent that they overfly Dublin, Cork and Shannon into Kerry. Kerry can't even support UK routes outside London, but makes these routes to Germany work. The route to Cologne/Bonn is a start in that regard, but there's a lot more potential than that.

One other one to add to the mix is Polish routes. Cork and Shannon both support in the region of 75K-80K passengers per year to Poland and that before the route from Cork to Katowice launches. You'd have to think that Knock could support some kind of frequency to Poland.

[iwak]

I see noc Edi is reduced to just a weekend service from April and increases to 4 weekly in July and August . Disappointing considering numbers had built well .

[VickersVicount]

I thought they were always at the lower end of what might be seen as a reasonable load and had plateaued? Although better it was always one of the worst performing Irish routes.
Guess someone knows what they're doing and could get more out of that sector equipment

[Kinocker]

I think it's a gonner to be honest, Virgin Connect is going to be mostly about connecting to their hubs, unless other more peripheral routes are especially profitable they don't stand a chance.

Could easily see the likes of Loganair taking on the route in a year or two.

[brian_dromey]

Connect Airways is far from “mostly about connecting their hubs”. BE and VS remain operationally and commercially separate. They won’t share infrastructure, or even a frequent flyer programme, they will have a common currency though. Virgin and BE have implied that LHR and MAN will become a pair of mega-hubs, that’s just not going to happen. They don’t have the slots between them or suitable aircraft.

[M-JCS]

That begs the question; what advantages does the Connect tie-up bring to BE and VS apart from code-sharing arrangements?

[brian_dromey]

I’m not quite sure to be honest. But VS only owns 20% of the overall Connect Airways, which also includes Stobart Air. In time VS and BE might have a closer relationship, particularly at MAN, but LHR is a pipe dream, unless and until BE get some small/medium narrow bodies, T3 can accommodate domestic UK/Ireland arrivals, or Virgin move to T2 and the third runway is opened and VS/BE/DL/AF/KL get a lot of slots.

[Kinocker]

806,000 passengers used Ireland West in 2019, an increase of 4.5% on 2018. That's the fourth consecutive year of growth at the airport and the first time they have exceeded 800,000 passengers in a year.

[airnoc]

What routes preform the best to increase passengers numbers?

[ExoticSkier]

https://www.flightradar24.com/AFR373S/23ed422b

Should be a spectacular sight, shame about the fate of the aircraft.

[EI-BUD]

We patiently wait to see what happens with Flybe. In the case of NOC, 3 routes could be impacted; BHX, MAN & EDI.

​​​​​​BHX & MAN have been very long standing and sustained 737 operations at times inn the past. Is Ryanair likely to pick these routes up and would Loganair look at EDI?

​​​​​​Hopefully the management team have looked at possibility....

[840]

It's certainly a major concern for Knock.

FlyBe were responsible for 14% of all passengers at the airport in 2018. Only Belfast City is worse affected in Ireland as a whole, while south of the border, Dublin (1%), Cork (0.4%), Shannon (0%) and Kerry (0%) will see very little impact.

It could be an issue to attract in another carrier, with Ryanair flying to Liverpool and East Midlands, and Edinburgh the most marginal of the three. There aren't many carriers around these islands with the right equipment for the routes either.

A best bet may be Stobart/Aer Lingus Regional, but that would imply plenty of Ws, unless they could be persuaded to actually base an aircraft in Knock. At the moment, they have 5 aircraft dedicated to FlyBe and the wet-leased ATR72 could probably be pretty quickly repurposed.

[globetrotter79]

Stobart Air have EDI based aircraft as of this summer - one ATR for Aer Lingus and also one E190 operating for Flybe. It is perhaps not beyond the bounds of reality that they'd consider Edinburgh-Knock?

[iwak]

This is not going to be a great year for knock if they don’t get the lost flybe routes replaced. I see Loganair have announced today that they are taking over some of the flybe routes but edinburgh knock not included ☹️ Hopefully ryanair will take manchester and Birmingham maybe Aer Lingus might be in the mix . Anyway hopefully something is announced shortly

[Kinocker]

The last few posts on this thread really have a written in a different era feel about them now, probably because they were written in a different era I suppose.

It almost feels strange to be posting about new, or at least reinstated, routes at the moment but very interesting to see that Ryanair are provisionally going to take on the NOC-MAN and NOC-EDI routes from the beginning of September.

There's obviously a real possibility that these dates get pushed back depending on how things go over the summer and if the South African variant of Covid takes hold in these parts I think we can forget about much air traffic from Knock at all in 2021, but even then it's good to see that the airport have been working on filling the gap left by Flybe and, whenever things can get back to some kind of normal, Ryanair are looking to take on these two routes.

Some rare good news. Hope all of the currently inactive staff at Knock are doing OK and we'll see most of them back at the airport when it reopens.

[OzzyOzBorn]

Can somebody resident in Eire update us on the latest mood music emerging from the Dail with regard to allowing unrestricted visits from across the water to resume? Any timescale? Thanks!

[Kinocker]

Not any time soon I'm afraid. Ireland is a long way behind the UK in terms of vaccinations and, although that gap should close in the next couple of months, there is little appetite to accommodate overseas visitors for the next few months at least.

Of course, the sea crossing between GB and NI is still open, as is the land border between NI and ROI, so any restrictions on arrivals from the UK can only have a limited effect on Covid cases as there is an open route between the two jurisdictions. The best case scenario would be a UK and Ireland wide joint effort later in the year that sees free movement right across the common travel area. I see little prospect of free movement into Ireland from beyond GB anytime soon.

[OzzyOzBorn]

Thanks for the update.

[BACsuperVC10]

NOC - LPL is down for re-starting in May so I see.

[sawtooth]

Good to see FR network bookable (for now), and replacing 2 BE routes only BHX absent. Frequencies will take time.
LGW remains in EI system though no clarity on their plans.

Only other activity over last few months has been the Coast Guard and at Eirtrade Aviation. They have completed the first A380 parting out and continue to receive A320s, latest VT-IHL IndGo arrived from Istanbul last week. Eirtrade also received planning permission to start work on the new wide-body hangar and apron expansion.

[EXEL1966]

Another IndiGo 320 arrived yesterday, IHK from memory.

[MCDU2]

OzzyOzBorn

Fly into BHD or BFS and save yourself the possibility of paying a small fortune for qarantine fees as leaky Leo is threatening to keep on expanding the no fly list.

[Alteagod]

Please don't do that.

[Kinocker]

Honestly, given the differing rate of vaccinations between the two countries, the restrictions should be in the other direction than what they are. UK arrivals into Ireland are likely to lose much less of a risk than the risk posed by Irish people meeting each other within the country.

[Kinocker]

Knock seems to be emerging from the pandemic fairly well judging by the schedule for next summer. 16 Ryanair routes in addition to the daily Aer Lingus service. Good to see Lanzarote back with the return of the base there, though maybe a surprise that it's only once a week for now as it's such a popular route locally, especially with Tenerife not coming back at this point in time.

Other than that all the summer 2022 routes are back, including Edinburgh and Cologne as well as the year round Bergamo route being retained. Increased frequencies on a number of the regional English routes also.

It's very much a Ryanair airport now since the old Flybe went bust, with Ryanair having taken on all of the old Flybe routes other than Leeds, which is still unserved. There's positives and negatives to that obviously. On the plus side the total available seat capacity for 2023 will be well over a million, probably the highest there has ever been at Knock and there's certainly the potential for a record breaking year in 2023 if any of the obvious threats ranging from Covid to oil prices to the recession don't do too much damage.

The main downside is probably that it's hard to see a regional or a charter airline trying anything new from Knock anytime soon with Ryanair's coverage of the core UK and sun routes being so extensive at the moment.

The other issue is that the airport, particularly the apron, is really operating at capacity now at certain times of the day for much of the summer. It's not uncommon to see aircraft having to hold over Boyle/Carrick on Shannon or having to wait on the runway as there is no available apron space for aircraft. While I know there were larger infrastructure plans in place to resolve this, if it isn't going to be possible to fund this work anytime soon maybe a smaller scale expansion of the apron onto existing grass areas could be funded to accommodate another aircraft or two and fix this bottleneck for now.

[LGWAlan]

The terminal wouldn't cope with another 189 (assuming a FR 738) - there are only 3 gates. Not helped by everyone funnelled through 1 ADF payment point after checkin to then have 1 queue for 1 x-ray machine (there are 2 but I have only ever seen 1 operational) which spit you directly out into the duty free shop. The departures area would need some remodelling to say the least!

[840]

Rumours are that NOC-LHR is going to be announced very soon. Seems a bit of a game changer in terms of connectivity if it is true.

[fivejuliet]

Rumours are that NOC-LHR is going to be announced very soon. Seems a bit of a game changer in terms of connectivity if it is true.

Replaces LGW and with a single daily return, options will be limited. Given how VFR orientated NOC is, this might not be as positive as it appears

[Kinocker]

Confirmed now. Had seen it rumoured a few weeks ago as EI were still selling Gatwick but there was no slot left free in the Gatwick schedule for the flights.

It's massive news though, finally offers some decent connections from Knock. While it's not the same as having double daily flights to feed into a full schedule of BA routes in both directions, I know of far too many cases where people have been caught out trying to connect to places via Ryanair and then were caught with delayed flights causing missed connections. This gives a realistic through ticket option for far more destinations and should mop up most of the old Gatwick traffic as well.

[Kinocker]

Incidentally, I wonder will the airport try to fill the soon to be vacant Gatwick route to cater to the point to point traffic to areas south and south east of London that may not want to fly into Heathrow?

Difficult to see who would take it on though. I couldn't see EasyJet entering the Irish market again. BA obviously won't. Wizz maybe - they have served Cork previously? Or might Ryanair try a W route from Dublin - you wouldn't put it past them.

The best outcome I suppose would be if the Heathrow route was successful enough that Aer Lingus felt they could operate both Heathrow and Gatwick daily on W routes from Dublin.

[840]

Incidentally, I wonder will the airport try to fill the soon to be vacant Gatwick route to cater to the point to point traffic to areas south and south east of London that may not want to fly into Heathrow?

Difficult to see who would take it on though. I couldn't see EasyJet entering the Irish market again. BA obviously won't. Wizz maybe - they have served Cork previously? Or might Ryanair try a W route from Dublin - you wouldn't put it past them.

The best outcome I suppose would be if the Heathrow route was successful enough that Aer Lingus felt they could operate both Heathrow and Gatwick daily on W routes from Dublin.

Wizz served Cork from Eastern Europe. They never attempted a UK route. Doing so would have been seen to be treading on Ryanair’s toes and they were probably trying to avoid the reaction they got anyway. Ryanair are probably the best prospect of a return to Gatwick.

[Kinocker]

Heathrow service up and running today. The airport's social media channels are full of stories of people flying in from Brisbane and Adelaide and the likes via Heathrow, great that these people have the option to fly straight into the west of Ireland now. Unfortunately it's at the expense of former users of the Gatwick service though. Would be good to have services from both airports in the near future.

​​​​​​Tuesday mornings are looking a bit congested at the airport for the summer season with five arrivals due between 8am and 9am and the same five flights departing again between 8:30 and 9:30. With the apron only able to cater for three aircraft at a time that's going to cause some issues. It could also mean potentially in the region of 1000 people being crammed into the departure lounge at the same time during peak season. I've been in there when three full flights are departing around the same time and it's not great. Having five going at the same time is not going to be an at all comfortable experience for departing passengers.

[Kinocker]

Just on that Tuesday morning situation - all aircraft stands are currently occupied at NOC this morning with three more aircraft holding over Boyle/Carrick-On-Shannon and two more en route to the airport from sun destinations. That proposed apron/departure area extension is badly needed at this point.

[confused atco]

Just on that Tuesday morning situation - all aircraft stands are currently occupied at NOC this morning with three more aircraft holding over Boyle/Carrick-On-Shannon and two more en route to the airport from sun destinations. That proposed apron/departure area extension is badly needed at this point.
Or they could just open earlier.

[Kinocker]

Good to see Tenerife coming back from Knock this winter after a few years without the route after the Ryanair base there previously closed.

[mart901]

Good to see Tenerife coming back from Knock this winter after a few years without the route after the Ryanair base there previously closed.

Positive to have a year round route also

[airnoc]

Postive year for Knock airport.

Next destination is a few French routes and Polish as well.

[EI-BUD]

So great to see the airport rebounding so strongly and so much traffic. Take yesterday, 13 flights in and out. 7 of which were to the UK and 6 further afield into Europe. If the airport can get to these kind of levels every day, 1M annual passengers won't be far away.

[davidjohnson6]

So great to see the airport rebounding so strongly and so much traffic. Take yesterday, 13 flights in and out. 7 of which were to the UK and 6 further afield into Europe. If the airport can get to these kind of levels every day, 1M annual passengers won't be far away.
Beware of the curse of Doncaster-Sheffield

[AVGEEK7812]

Is there any news on Knock apron extension?

Ryanair had to hold for a short time on Tuesday because of congestion on the ground. An aircraft had gone tech. All the other stands were full.

Great to see NOC busy

[22/04]

Beware of the curse of Doncaster-Sheffield

I think Irish airports must be funded differently. Otherwise how would Kerry for example, survive?

[AVGEEK7812]

I think Irish airports must be funded differently. Otherwise how would Kerry for example, survive?

I dont think they could fund the airports in England same as here. Theres way more airports there than here.

[Kinocker]

Is there any news on Knock apron extension?

Ryanair had to hold for a short time on Tuesday because of congestion on the ground. An aircraft had gone tech. All the other stands were full.

Great to see NOC busy

That has happened most Tuesday mornings this summer, not unusual to have two or three Ryanair aircraft holding over Leitrim at around half eight on a Tuesday morning. No further developments with the Apron or other proposed improvements that I'm aware of. It's an ambitious terminal and apron expansion proposal, one of those that will either happen in one big investment or won't happen at all.

[Mr Jetlag]

I think Irish airports must be funded differently. Otherwise how would Kerry for example, survive?

There are one or two state funding streams for Irish regional airports.

For example, the Irish government earlier this year announced €5m in capital funding for Knock, €400k for Kerry, and more for other Irish regional airports, totalling €17m. The government is reportedly also providing €12m in operational expenditure support for the regional airports in 2023 (I would include a link but PPRUNE does not allow me to do so.)

The other disguised funding stream for regional airports is the PSO programme. Until Ryanair put paid to Kerry's PSO service by launching a commercial (unsubsidised) Dublin-Kerry route, Kerry Airport made a very nice income from the PSO.

The idea of a PSO service is that the government subsidises an airline to fly a route which would not be economic. What is less recognised is that the airport can quietly extract quite a lot of cash from that too.

In the case of the last Kerry PSO contract award a few years ago (2018?) , Kerry Airport published two separate sets of fees and charges, one for ordinary commercial flights and one (much higher) for PSO flights. Now Ryanair won't even pay the normal commercial charge, but in the case of the PSO flights, no-one negotiates with the airport (the PSO airline doesn't care, because it's being reimbursed for whatever it pays, and the government doesn't care, because why rock the boat?). Plus, last time round, the PSO covered the cost of out-of-hours opening of the airport, while Ryanair took the benefit.

This two-tiered charging scheme for PSOs is not unique to Kerry. Donegal was doing something similar. Perhaps it also happens in other countries. It's just a very "convenient" :-) way for government to "quietly" funnel more money to regional airports, over and above publicly declared financial support.

[Dannyboy39]

So with nearly a million pax coming through the door in a year and a nice government grant, surely the €10 development fee will be knocked on the head sooner than later… LOL.

[EI-BUD]

So with nearly a million pax coming through the door in a year and a nice government grant, surely the €10 development fee will be knocked on the head sooner than later… LOL.
I'd hardly think so, I'm guessing they'd need to double their passenger numbers to recover that. They've also fought hard to keep it, i.e. many moons ago when FR threatened to walk. I thoroughly enjoy the experience of the airport therw and am happy to pay the fee to support it. It's not my local airport but last year I chose a drive to NOC and reasonably priced parking above the mess that was Dublin Airport.

[Kinocker]

I'm sure it was said at one point that 1 million passengers a year was the point at which the development fer could be reassessed. However I suspect that if and when that number is reached, it won't be. A funding stream like that is something of a drug, once you have it it's very hard to let it go. Based on current passenger numbers, and allowing for under 12s not paying it, it must be generating close to €4m a year for the airport. I think any suggestion of ever increasing it due to inflation etc would be very poorly received however.

[LGWAlan]

That has happened most Tuesday mornings this summer, not unusual to have two or three Ryanair aircraft holding over Leitrim at around half eight on a Tuesday morning. No further developments with the Apron or other proposed improvements that I'm aware of. It's an ambitious terminal and apron expansion proposal, one of those that will either happen in one big investment or won't happen at all.

Do you have any details of said expansion proposal that you can post at all? Would be very interested to see - we use the airport when we go off to see my OH's folks so vested interest :)

[Kinocker]

If you Google "Knock airport development plan pdf", and download the first link that comes up you will see the general proposals.

Page 65 shows the proposals for the terminal building itself. It's basically a major expansion of the apron to make space for a passenger boarding bridge, serving a (frankly excessive) 15 aircraft stands, as well as an additional taxiway to the runway. Would require significant investment, including relocation of the fuel bunds and major earthworks.

[LGWAlan]

If you Google "Knock airport development plan pdf", and download the first link that comes up you will see the general proposals.

Page 65 shows the proposals for the terminal building itself. It's basically a major expansion of the apron to make space for a passenger boarding bridge, serving a (frankly excessive) 15 aircraft stands, as well as an additional taxiway to the runway. Would require significant investment, including relocation of the fuel bunds and major earthworks.

Thanks!