Chances of a job

[wallyfly]

What are my chances of getting a sponsorship? 3 Years from now i'll have PPL,IMC,Night and around 150 hours flight time (maybe even a FTPL). I'll also have a IT degree under my belt but with no A-levels. I read that KLM offer full sponsorship to pilots with a PPL and 180 hours minimum PIC. I understand there is a big job shortage right now but in 3 or 4 years what do you think my chances might be?
:confused:

[Elvis21]

At the moment jobs for low hrs pilots are about as common as rocking horse sh*t.

In 3-4 years things MAY have improved and you MAY have a much better chance of a job. If you regularly visit this forum you will know that there are 1001 opinions as to when jobs will be available (mine is just another). But stick with it and who knows.... you may even win the lottery.

Best of luck:)

[OBK!]

Why 3-4 years?

Wallfly, there have been rumours, that Britannia airways are to start sponsorship with BAE Systems in Jerez next year (Feb/March time?). This is unofficial, but I have heard that they have signed something with BAE.

Also, Britannia Airways take on Second Officers...ie FATPLS with 200hrs, where you build up your experience behind the controls but your not actually allowed to by pilot flying below 10,000ft until you have satisfactoraly completed a certain amount of hourse/schooling to get F.O position. I have heard too, that BY are to take on a few SO's next year or was it 2004?

There are many other airlines, easyJet, and RyanAir but they do want experience. Have you heard of CTC. They provide airline qualification training for low houred FATPLS, and upon successful completion of the course, the possiblity of a placement interview with an airline. Many of there trained pilots are now flying with easyJet, JMC (I think) and several other budget/charter airlines.

I don't see why people still beleive there is a 3/4 year waiting period. RyanAir need 800 type rated pilots (300hrs 737) for next year...so if you can scrounge the money lol (£100,000?).

Also, try talking, get the word around your interested (pretty much like me, I start ATPL's at the end of this year, just trying to get the word around that I am HERE!). There are several Executive Jet type companies who do actually take on people through word of mouth. There is someone who posted on this forum about they got the RHS with a company flying Beechcrafts? I think that was the aircraft.

Very best of luck anyway.

[Slotted-Flap]

Just like to clear up a few of those points about Britannia. The 'second officers' are NOT cruise pilots. All BY are two crew ops so you will perform exactly the duties required of FO except you will be paid less, have one less stripe and less experience. Much more of a positive than a negative, I am sure you will agree. BY also have a bunch of guys in holdpool at moment so I am not sure where there recruitment stands this year.

It will be very hard for a newly qualified, low pilot to get a job at the moment. But not impossible. There will be movement and then sponsorship opportunites will appear. Expect stiff competion for selection.

;)

Good Luck.

Flaps.

[sickBocks]

...oops, beat me to it.

Just for reference the Second Officer position at Britannia is a full-operating position. Unlike Cathay Pacific who denote their Cruise Pilots (no touchy below FL200) as Second Officers, Britannia SOs are only designated that so they can be identified as having less than 1500hrs TT and less than 500hrs Jet or less than 1000hrs turbine. They still 'get a go'.

Pedants rule UK

sB

:D

[El Desperado]

In 3 to 4 years time.. pure guess, but I reckon your chances will be as good as they ever were.

Airlines are operating on skeleton crews at the moment (we have contract pilots in for the summer on the Airbus) and they will need new blood soon otherwise the whole thing will grind to a messy halt.

I can only speak from a charter point of view - I have no idea what the scheduled/low-cost mob will be doing - but the word is the recruiting freeze is soon to end. Murmers of aircraft being dug out of sand-dunes in Arizona and put on the UK register are plentiful, and not just us.

Each new aircraft needs around 7 captains and 7 f/os. Make sure your cv shows the necessary hours and courses, as in 24 months time, we'll be needing you. (I hope). We actually need you now, but you're not experienced enough and our companies aren't hiring anyway. Tschh.

Best of luck.

[foghorn]

Here's my twopenneth as someone on the outside with a (fairly) new licence and low hours staring in at the world of professional aviation.

The potential winners at the moment are those who can keep their head above water in a job outside aviation, paying off debts, flying as often as possible, as complex as they can sensibly afford - IFR piston twin ideally (I know, pigs will fly, however there are many reasonably-priced simulators around).

Openings for professional pilots at all levels are few and far between from instructors upwards. This will change. The nature and timescale of the change is very much a matter of opinion, timescales from 1 to 4 years for a full recovery have been mooted, and there is no doubt that low-hour people are at the back of a long queue. What is irrefutable, is that the first green shoots of recovery are visible - many pilots laid off after September have been rehired, some CTC cadets have been taken on by airlines, many airlines are reporting a tight crewing situation this summer etc.

Personally, I think that there will be quite an active hiring season this autumn, which will leave the jobs market in a much better situation than it is now for next year. What next year brings, much has been made of the potential of a major conflict in the Gulf, so I won't revisit that. Thankfully I'm better at flying than reading tea leaves. What I do know is that the CAA's own figures seem to imply that on the rate of issue of new IRs, there are less unemployed fATPLs out there than some people think. I've made something of this before (see my threads passim): due to the post-JAR complexity of the job market, it could be a meaningful statistic, or it could turn out to be a red herring. I'll leave that up to you.

Getting that airline job was always going to be a marathon not a sprint, it's just that last September someone moved the finish line just as (for me) it was starting to become a tangible goal. I am sure I don't need to tell the other people in a similar position to me how frustrating and depressing at times this can be, however some of you out there now contemplating taking your first steps in professional aviation training need to think about this and face up to real possibility that your huge personal and financial venture may come to naught. Many do fall by the wayside with their dreams in tatters and their bank balances a lot worse off.

This doesn't mean that there won't be winners, though. The only sure fire way of losing is to give up. You've got to be in it to win it. All the extra tribulations and heartache will just make getting there that much sweeter.

Keep that chin up!
foggy.

[Wee Weasley Welshman]

Pilots are retiring. The industry is once again growing. Therefore there will once again be a demand for flightcrew.

Keep an eye on what happens on the continent though. For example I now fly with a lot of ex-Sabena aircrew. There is plenty of fat left to trim over sausage side. Just wait until easyJet and Ryanair start big bases in France and Germany.

Job losses on the continent are now a big issue for UK Wannabes in the shiny happy world of JAA.

Gulf War 2 could have a pretty negative effect also.

In essence its a gamble. We have all made it. You can be lucky or unlucky. I wouldn't personally look to be graduated with Frzn ATPL and <500hrs and no job for at least another 18 months.

That might mean you could start modular now.

Good luck,

WWW

[Freak On A Leash]

Wallyfly,

To answer your question; With a PPL,IMC and Night rating and about 150 hours and the beforementioned degree you chances are ZERO!!!Why you ask?Could it be because you need at least a CPL (you know, a COMMERCIAL pilot`s license)to be employed(read payed) as a pilot.

Now that that has been sorted out... yes I think you`ll have a fair shot at being employed with those qualifications, albeit maybe not with the majors, but definitely with an air taxi operator.Have you thought about getting an instructor rating as well?It won`t be to your disadvantage.;)