View Full Version : Ground Examiner to PPL ratio
Am sending off my £249 for another three years. A download from the CAA showed there are 386 others out there doing the same. Given around 1600 PPL issues per year, there's around one examiner for each 4 PPLs. It would explain why I do seem to do about 30 to 40 exams per year, probably a complete set for 3-5 candidates per year.
Do all flying Examiners also get automatic GR privileges as well ? I don't know how unique I am to be a GR(A) only. I assume that there is just one set of papers for each RF ?
is this a case of "overmanning" ?
Whopity
30th Sep 2018, 18:32
A FE (PPL) can add GR privileges at no additional cost, but since the introduction of JAR-FCL only one set of papers has been issued to each RF or ATO. In the days of UK only training all PPL Examiners held the Exam Papers but thats probably how they finished up in the PPL Confuser.
Fl1ingfrog
30th Sep 2018, 20:48
Yes, and we know who that was. But instead of one rogue examiner we now have a phletherer of other people with access to the exam papers. I've witnessed myself and heard of too many other occasions that the club admin staff are issuing exam papers to students and even marking them. Some examiners, I understand, are providing little or no input other than adding their signature. The exam questions are now published contemporaneously internet wide and control has been lost for some time. Some schools/clubs administrators have gone so far as to take ownership of the papers believing their so called "keeper of the examination papers" is simply and only that.
Whopity
30th Sep 2018, 21:24
It is perhaps not surprising that the IAA has ceased accepting UK theory passes!
If an FE can add GR privileges at no cost, that would explain why the numbers are so high.
It would make more sense to issue the exam papers to the examiner rather than to an RF or an ATO - in theory they could have exam papers, but not actually have an examiner around who could mark them ?
I think the IAA actually set the PPL exams at their exam centre in Dublin, so that reduces flexibility. At least they don't make the poor student sit 9 exams. I think they have 6 to do ?
Why don't the CAA just combine them into a smaller, more sensible number ? It was silly to split AGK and PoF into two separate exams, likewise Air Law and Operational Procedures.
I was under the impression that AOPA were going to produce new exams, but nothing seems to have happened for two years on this
Whopity
1st Oct 2018, 12:18
Why don't the CAA just combine them into a smaller, more sensible number ? No money, no examiners, no incentive! They were planning to introduce a centralised computerised exam system but again there is no driving force to do this. The original concept was to copy the FAA and have a single exam or maybe two. Why hasn't EASA prodiced any exams for their licence? mind you, having seen their attempt to produce ATPL exams we are better off without them. Technology is passing us by and we still haven't got to grips with the steam engine!
Looks like out selection of nine miniature papers will continue for years into the future ?
Why they don't they put the production of a new paper out "to industry ", as they normally do ?
A straight adoption of FAA or Transport Canada papers adapted to EASA regs should not be a major task. May as well do the questions and answers books, as the likes of Pooleys and AFE would only come out anyway.
S-Works
4th Oct 2018, 08:08
Looks like out selection of nine miniature papers will continue for years into the future ?
Why they don't they put the production of a new paper out "to industry ", as they normally do ?
A straight adoption of FAA or Transport Canada papers adapted to EASA regs should not be a major task. May as well do the questions and answers books, as the likes of Pooleys and AFE would only come out anyway.
what makes you think the FAA or TC papers are any better!! Grass always greener?
tescoapp
4th Oct 2018, 08:14
I think RT examiners will also be included in those numbers because they used to hold the communications ground exam papers.
TheOddOne
5th Oct 2018, 07:35
I probably do about the same number of exams as the OP. The CAA examiner fee element works out at around £2.50 per paper set. I encourage my students to do exams in pairs (to meet the 'sittings' requirement). I also charge what I would otherwise be paid if I was flying instead of invigilating. As far as I'm concerned, this is a service I offer students, not a means of earning a living.
I keep the papers and completed scripts in a filing cabinet with a lock on it. I invigilate, mark and de-brief candidates myself. I know others who do the same. Hopefully, when we Declare later this year, this sort of thing will be inspected by the CAA during their visit. Funnily enough, I would suggest it's not the small outfits like ours that bend the rules, it's the bigger commercial concerns. 'Club admin staff'? I can only dream of having such!
TOO
Some playing around with Excel and a download of the FE list shows that around half of FEs have GR privileges (I think there is no extra cost to do this) so that leaves 134 stand-alone GRs, self included.
Yes am happy to do as a service, but not so keep on paying the CAA for the privilege of doing so. I maintain an RF for Theoretical Knolwdge only, , cost £104 per year. So a double cost to be able to set exams.
i can see the logic in an initial charge to be a GR(A), I don't see why I have to pony up the same figure again every 3 years, especially when it clearly is not going into any effort to provide a more consolidated or relevant set of exams. What exactly is it paying for ? Especially galling as an FE in effect gets the GR bit for the price of a tick in a box.
if the cost was lower, I could just pass on the saving and charge less per paper.