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View Full Version : What Car? Would you not buy?


Pontius Navigator
24th Sep 2018, 21:12
Not looking for past rubbish cars like Marina or Alegro, but current cars you would not buy again.

G-CPTN
24th Sep 2018, 21:36
Not a specific model, but a car with an electric handbrake.
I live on a steep hill with parallel parking, and occasionally have to 'rescue' drivers who have parked behind another car, then cannot manage the handbrake/reverse gear manoeuvre to avoid running forwards into the car in front.
I provide a large stone to put in front of the front wheel so that they can do a reverse hill start without worrying about the handbrake. I've even seen cars drive over a 'brick' and stop in contact with the car in front.
No doubt there is a procedure for achieving a reverse hill start, but some drivers haven't mastered it.

Espada III
24th Sep 2018, 21:41
Electric handbrakes work perfectly if you are wearing a seat belt. The reason these people are having difficulty with hill starts etc is because they are not wearing their seat belts. The interconnection between hand brake and seat belt is such that a hill start is easy if one is wearing them.

I know ; I have owned three cars with them and love the feature.

chevvron
24th Sep 2018, 21:48
Any small Subaru. My garage lent me one once as a courtesy car and that flat 4 engine has to be the roughest ever built.

ELondonPax
24th Sep 2018, 22:01
Any Peugeot with that ridiculous small steering wheel. I've had a few as rentals - no matter how I adjust the steering column I cannot see the instruments. Utterly idiotic design.

ethicalconundrum
24th Sep 2018, 22:16
Any small Subaru. My garage lent me one once as a courtesy car and that flat 4 engine has to be the roughest ever built.

I currently have a Forester, I've also owned a Legacy and a small sedan. All had the flat 4 non-turbo engine. They all ran fine, the Forster is on 200k miles, I tow with it, and use it in very hot climate and in the mtns. It is not babied at all and going strong. I would opine that the 'loaner' you got wasn't working correctly. My only complaint about the Subie is the tire wear being full time AWD. It has a habit of not making the mfg rated distance on tires. But - that could be my driving condition too.

CAP A330
24th Sep 2018, 23:05
I would not switch from my A330 even if it meant an increase in salary. Itís a great plane that I will fly till the end of time. Kids these days want to move quickly onto the 787 or the 777 but itís not for me.

cavortingcheetah
24th Sep 2018, 23:09
Anything other than a Mercedes Benz.

gemma10
24th Sep 2018, 23:09
CLIO and any of its derivatives, MODUS etc. Biggest pile of french junk on the planet.

BehindBlueEyes
24th Sep 2018, 23:13
Had an Alfa Romeo Giulietta as a holiday hire car a couple of weeks ago. Not impressed with dashboard layout or the drive at all, although Mrs BBE thought I was being a miserable git and said she thought it was a ‘fun’ car and should be treated as such.

Mostly Harmless
24th Sep 2018, 23:24
Ford. Any Ford. If the transmission doesn't self-destruct, the head gasket will.

G-CPTN
24th Sep 2018, 23:29
I would not switch from my A330 even if it meant an increase in salary. It’s a great plane that I will fly till the end of time. Kids these days want to move quickly onto the 787 or the 777 but it’s not for me.

A bold statement from someone who claims to be aged 21, and who, if actually involved in being a pilot, should expect to have 40 plus years ahead of them.
The A330's origin dates to the mid-1970s.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!
24th Sep 2018, 23:34
Anything with a Steering Square

Oh sorry I forgot we can't mention the Allegro


A mate of mine once took his dad's Maxi to the shops and he got to a junction and there was this rather pretty young girl from school walking down the road. He waited till there was no traffic, then pulled out carefully, relaxing into the driver's seat. Unfortunately the Maxi had a problem where the main seat hinge would fail and that's exactly what happened here.

So he fell backwards and his foot immediately came off he pedal, which meant because the car being in first gear, immediately and dramatically slowed down ... causing him to stomp on the accelerator ... etc etc

Apparently the young lady was not impressed with his driving abilities

tartare
24th Sep 2018, 23:52
Any Volvo.
Complete shite - transmissions are a nightmare.
Australia dealt to ours - shat itself halfway through a drive back from Melbourne.
"I roll" in Latin?
Bollocks.

ShyTorque
25th Sep 2018, 01:31
I probably won't ever buy another car with low profile tyres. The roads in the area are so bad that it's impossible to miss all the potholes.

megan
25th Sep 2018, 03:41
Ford. Any Ford. If the transmission doesn't self-destruct, the head gasket will :D Last five years have put up with ownership of a Ford Territory. Lovely car in concept, but execution ie build standard, is crap. More troubles with it than the previous 50 years of car ownership put together. The head gasket blew long ago, the one in MY head that is. Previous Peugeot and Mazda vehicles outstanding. Can't wait to get rid of the Ford but need it for towing at the moment.

chevvron
25th Sep 2018, 04:03
CLIO and any of its derivatives, MODUS etc. Biggest pile of french junk on the planet.
Yes come to think of it. I had a Clio hire car (brand new) while my Polo was being repaired having been reversed into by an elderly lady. The Clio was terrible compared to the Polo; noisy, tinny, no guts, complicated start system.

SMT Member
25th Sep 2018, 04:44
Anything built in France or the US, and in the latter I include various Chelsea tractors from MB and BMW. Wouldn't buy an Audi either; understeering carriages from hell they are. Nice interior, and quite comfortable, but they're anything but comfortable negotiating a series of twists in the road. I'm rather convinced there's an electronic gizmo sending a coded message to Ingolstadt whenever you turn the wheel, with the car only changing direction once it's received approval to do so from HQ. Nice interiors though.

sitigeltfel
25th Sep 2018, 06:01
Ford. Any Ford. If the transmission doesn't self-destruct, the head gasket will.

There is a known issue with the head gaskets on the Focus RS, leading to overheating and engine failure.
The gasket from the Mustang Ecoboost model has been incorrectly fitted in some cases to the RS engine, it is nearly identical in design, but crucially some of the ports for the water galleries are blanked off, restricting coolant flow.
There seems to have been a misidentification of the gasket, either by the wrong part number being put on during manufacturing, or by careless handling at the plant where the engines are assembled.

Falcon Al
25th Sep 2018, 06:49
Any car from China.

ShyTorque
25th Sep 2018, 08:11
Wouldn't buy an Audi either; understeering carriages from hell they are. Nice interior, and quite comfortable, but they're anything but comfortable negotiating a series of twists in the road. I'm rather convinced there's an electronic gizmo sending a coded message to Ingolstadt whenever you turn the wheel, with the car only changing direction once it's received approval to do so from HQ. Nice interiors though.

I would have said that they can change lane, but unfortunately the indicators and rear view mirrors don't work properly. Thankfully, yesterday the horn on my car did work and prevented a collision. I prefer to keep the side of my car intact. The Audi driver seemed very angry that I should even be there alongside her tank in the lane she wanted.

rogerg
25th Sep 2018, 08:30
All these "faults" seem to be just owners preferences. I had an A3 for years and it seemed OK to me and Mrs RG. My daughter has an Q5 without any probs. The Q3 she had before saved her and baby's life when a motorcyclist drove into the front at speed. He died and they were OK. Certainly tough.

Hydromet
25th Sep 2018, 08:40
Ford. Any Ford. If the transmission doesn't self-destruct, the head gasket will.... and if they don't, a tie rod bolt will fall out on a mine haul road, with a 105 ton ore truck bearing down on you. DAMHIKT. I, also, will never touch another Ford.

denachtenmai
25th Sep 2018, 09:09
Have driven Fords for over 20 years now and never had a breakdown!!
From Escorts to the Ka, through the Puma, Focus and Fiesta.
Ka needed a new steering rack after 4 years, so that was a setback, but I
drove a Puma for nearly 11 years without a problem, needed a seat belt mounting
welded on one MOT and a couple of minor fails but all told I would say that it
probably cost me no more than two to three hundred pounds over that time.
Sold it for £2500 and bought a Fiesta ST which I've had for four years now
and still no breakdowns, like it so much that I am now buying a new one.
Maybe I've been lucky.

DType
25th Sep 2018, 09:34
ANY diesel.
How on earth did that stinking, smokey, slimy fuel ever manage to be considered eco friendly?
And then you get it on your shoes at the filling station and walk it onto your car and house carpets.
And then they drop it on the road and you have to rescue victims from the ditch.
And then it freezes up and you have to light a fire under the fuel tank!
NO thanks.

and I am now running for shelter from the diesel fans' responses!

TangoAlphad
25th Sep 2018, 09:35
On Ford hit or miss.. had a Fiesta 2009 that I loved for a small car and an early 2000's Mondeo that was a tank. The old man bought a Ranger that was never ending trouble and went very quickly.

As has been said above a lot seems preference and we have already covered the main brands almost in full it seems! I've recently returned to volvo and extremely happy! Would never in a million years touch another Citroen/Peugeot etc.

Edit: Oh and Mitsubishi Shoguns... we had a run of 4 and I must say given the cost I never felt good value for money but I wasn't paying. Fairly unrefined even in high specs.

ShyTorque
25th Sep 2018, 09:37
All these "faults" seem to be just owners preferences.

Bearing in mind the title, isn't that what the thread is all about?

pulse1
25th Sep 2018, 09:45
I did about 150,000 miles in a series of Peugeot 405. A really competent car. Then, a few years ago I hired a small Peugeot and discovered that one of the headlamp bulbs had gone. It took a mechanic about 30 minutes and lots of tools to replace that bulb. I wouldn't buy any car that I couldn't change a bulb myself in about 5 minutes. What is the point in the French insisting that you carry spare bulbs when they allow cars to be sold for which it requires outside assistance to replace them. Crazy!

ShyTorque
25th Sep 2018, 09:51
ANY diesel.
How on earth did that stinking, smokey, slimy fuel ever manage to be considered eco friendly?
And then you get it on your shoes at the filling station and walk it onto your car and house carpets.
And then they drop it on the road and you have to rescue victims from the ditch.
And then it freezes up and you have to light a fire under the fuel tank!
NO thanks.

and I am now running for shelter from the diesel fans' responses!

In order:
1. Don't ask me, flawed politics I suppose, an ignorant government convinced by a political need to reduce CO2 emissions (then once they had convinced enough car owners to use it, they disproportionately increase the tax on it).
2. I'm careful enough not to spill it or tread on that spilled by others (and I take my shoes off in the house).
3. Agreed, as a motorcyclist I once got caught out when a Transit van driver had no fuel cap on his tank and about a gallon of diesel flooded the sharp corner right in front of me. Still have the reminder on my elbow some 45 years later!
4. You're about fifty years out of date with that; modern winter grade diesel doesn't easily wax up and so that's no longer required in most climates. I do remember seeing HGV drivers doing it up until about 1968.

But quite a few "petrol headed" people have been passengers in my (fast) diesel saloon and didn't believe me when I told them it was diesel engined.

Pontius Navigator
25th Sep 2018, 10:13
Some very useful answers here. Interesting to see no Japanese or Korean cars or Vauxhalls feature. I have been anti Vauxhall since I brained myself getting out of the back of one, and the drivers seat collapsing on another of you cornered at more than 1.1g

TangoAlphad
25th Sep 2018, 10:34
I've had a few Vauxhalls.. while fairly bland they have been reliable and cost effective. Few wee niggles here and there but they are cheap (if bought used.. definitely letting someone else take the hit on the depreciation of a Vx).

ImageGear
25th Sep 2018, 10:45
Years ago I got allocated a Mondeo from the company car pool. Bit if a hot ship, low profiles, 2.2 engine, hard suspension, but nobody seemed to want it.

After driving it down to the South of France, I began to ache in all sorts of places. Turns out the front seats were moulded to the shape of a 22 year old boy racer, and seat "wings" ostensibly to prevent "head wobble" on cornering, problem was my "wings" were incompatible with the Mondeo's wings, hence the aching back/side/neck problems. Dumped the Mondeo at the first opportunity.

IG

ShyTorque
25th Sep 2018, 10:54
I've had a few Vauxhalls.. while fairly bland they have been reliable and cost effective. Few wee niggles here and there but they are cheap (if bought used.. definitely letting someone else take the hit on the depreciation of a Vx).

I once was given a six month old Vauxhall Vectra as a company car. It was without doubt the worst handling barge of a car I've ever driven. I ditched it as soon as I was allowed to (not literally, but it came close a couple of times). I'm not afraid to say I'll never own any Vauxhall in the future. I did previously enjoy driving an old Vauxhall Victor estate (1960s) with a column gear change and a three speed gearbox; that had real character, a nice exhaust note and handled better!

TangoAlphad
25th Sep 2018, 10:57
I once was given a six month old Vauxhall Vectra as a company car. It was without doubt the worst handling barge of a car I've ever driven. I ditched it as soon as I was allowed to. I'm afraid to say I'll never own one. I did previously enjoy driving an old Vauxhall Victor estate (1960s) with a column gear change and a three speed gearbox; that had real character, a nice exhaust note and handled better!
The Vectra was in it's own class of sh*** handling.

pasta
25th Sep 2018, 11:28
How on earth did that stinking, smokey, slimy fuel ever manage to be considered eco friendly?

Depends what you're measuring. It beats petrol on CO2 emissions.

When I bought my last diesel I naiively thought the DPF would sort out the particulate emissions, and didn't even know about the NO2 issue. The higher torque at lower revs suited my driving.

Fuel went waxy on me on a very cold (-20 C) day in the Alps; my previous fill had been from a truck filling pump, and I'm speculating they don't have the same additives (maybe trucks have their own additives or fuel warming systems?). Couple of years later the DPF blocked and was going to cost a fortune to fix, so I ditched the car.

Replaced a 2 litre Diesel Mazda with a 1.4 litre petrol Skoda; the Skoda feels both torquier and more powerful than the Mazda; so far I have zero inclination to get another diesel car, or another Mazda.

jez d
25th Sep 2018, 11:31
Yellow ones. I doubt even the UN could adjudicate the 'Yellow Car Game' successfully in our family.

ian16th
25th Sep 2018, 12:07
Replaced a 2 litre Diesel Mazda with a 1.4 litre petrol Skoda; the Skoda feels both torquier and more powerful than the Mazda; so far I have zero inclination to get another diesel car, or another Mazda.

Driven petrol engined Mazda's for the last 16 years.
Driven my current 2.3l Mazda6 'Atenza' for 11 years from new, only problem, the low profile tyres are wrong for the roads where I now live in. Should have swapped the wheels & tyres when I moved.

Wouldn't buy, anything French, Italian or a current Ford.

Ancient Mariner
25th Sep 2018, 12:10
I did about 150,000 miles in a series of Peugeot 405. A really competent car. Then, a few years ago I hired a small Peugeot and discovered that one of the headlamp bulbs had gone. It took a mechanic about 30 minutes and lots of tools to replace that bulb. I wouldn't buy any car that I couldn't change a bulb myself in about 5 minutes. What is the point in the French insisting that you carry spare bulbs when they allow cars to be sold for which it requires outside assistance to replace them. Crazy!
Then I suggest you forget about buying a new car.
Per

cattletruck
25th Sep 2018, 12:12
New cars are fast becoming like mobile phones - people just want to play with the buttons rather than use it as was intended. They are not for me obviously as I've been trying to update for the last 5 years and all that electronic crap puts me right off.

arketip
25th Sep 2018, 12:40
They are not for me obviously as I've been trying to update for the last 5 years and all that electronic crap puts me right off.

Exept for engine/gearbox and safety management and safety , the rest of the "crap" is not mandatory to use.

Pinky the pilot
25th Sep 2018, 12:42
My current vehicle of conveyance is an XG Ford Falcon Ute! A 4 litre straight 6 engine fitted with extractors and a sports exhaust system and a five speed manual transmission. Chassis is set up with mag wheels and a race/rally suspension. Goes 'round corners as if glued to the tarmac!!:ok: And will carry just over 600kg in the tray.

What I would NOT buy; Anything....., even a Ferrari/Maserati/Lamborghini/whatever....with an automatic transmission!:mad::ugh::yuk::*

I will not drive any car unless it has a clutch pedal operating a manual gearbox! End of.......:=

treadigraph
25th Sep 2018, 12:43
all that electronic crap puts me right off

Me too. I only drive hire cars these days, usually for 24 hours - too much tech wizzardry, all I want to do is be able to get from here to there and back again and be able to easily operate lights, wipers, heater, etc. Also had one car, pulled up at the fuel pump and took ages to find out how to open the filler cap. Little lever secreted under the dash-board. Another had a tail gate that defied opening until I happened to put my hand on the rear badge! Later realised the key had a release as well! Usually ask now...

First car I drove that had automatic lights was impressive until it went full beam in the countryside and I was fiddling with the switches, wondering how on earth to dip them when a car came the other way - oh it does that too, phew, the other car was a police car. I'd been delayed by a bad accident on the M25, should have been at my destination well before sunset.

TWT
25th Sep 2018, 13:10
Had the misfortune to drive a Nissan Micra hire car for a few days ( booked by my company).

What a piece of crap. But the Cruze was worse.

It was like they'd mated the engine to a random auto box out of a parts bin, and had never

tested them together before mass production.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!
25th Sep 2018, 13:39
Ford Transit Connect

Don't get me wrong it's a great design (small work van) and in the US the double sliding door is standard as is the raised roof. It's just big enough to move a fridge yet not a full sized work van

However, the build quality is shite!

So far I've had: the rear view mirror fall off, the seal round the drivers door come apart, the battery fail, the automatic doorlock stopped working, the radio needed replacing, the windows won't roll back up and it rattles so much it's like it's about to fall apart

So pretty much put me down for any Ford

Shandy52
25th Sep 2018, 14:29
Any Volvo.
Complete shite - transmissions are a nightmare.
Australia dealt to ours - shat itself halfway through a drive back from Melbourne.
"I roll" in Latin?
Bollocks.

I've had several second-hand ones over the years. Two of them have been less than wonderful, but considering what I paid for them I shouldn't complain. The other three have been great, and my present V70 automatic recently clocked 250,000 miles. Brilliant on motorways, though it'll never win prizes for fuel economy :(

BAengineer
25th Sep 2018, 14:34
Lexus

I had a rental Lexus hybrid the last time I was in the UK and I have to say that apart from the fuel consumption it was a disappointment. The build quality and design was nothing special, it was no different to a Toyota Corolla. I owned a Lexus when they first came out and it was a class above most other cars on the road but now I couldn't justify buying one.

Private jet
25th Sep 2018, 14:56
Pretty much any car designed this century! Back in the 1990's all the major car manufacturers had a problem, profits were down. The reason was their products at that time were lasting too long, or more accurately were too cheap and easy to repair. So designs became unnecessarily complicated and component quality was reduced, "built to a price", and a low one at that. Also they now lure in the gullible with electronic gizmo's that they charge thousands extra for but maybe cost only a couple of hundred per car. Today profits are soaring because margins on, and "turnover" of, new vehicles are both up. The problem now for the motorist is that they are all doing it, there is no alternative.

tdracer
25th Sep 2018, 15:10
Mitsubishi - I bought an Eclipse GSX new in 1991. Had to rebuild the engine 3 times in 120k miles (and came very near a fourth time when the timing belt started eating itself - fortunately I got home before it let go, and investigated the strange sound it was making discovering about half the timing belt was gone :eek:). Least reliable car I've ever owned - by a considerable margin.

I also swore off GM when I blew up the small block V8 in my GMC van at 70k miles (put a connecting rod through the side :eek:), and it had been something of a lemon prior to that with a string of more minor difficulties. I replaced it with a Ford E-series van - the improvement in build quality over the GMC was dramatic. I'd like to replace it with a Transit (the full size one, not the Transit Connect) since they drive much better but I can't justify the expense, especially since I don't drive it that much (7 years old and only has 23k miles). So far nothing but normal maintenance.

The wife's Mazda 3, the recently sold BMW 328xi, and my Honda S2000 have been brilliant.

vctenderness
25th Sep 2018, 16:26
Ssyangyong Musso!
Can you imagine meeting your mates down the pub and saying “just took delivery of my new car”. “Great what have you bought Mercedes, Lexus, BMW?” “No I’ve got the new Ssyangyong Musso”..........

Cheerio
25th Sep 2018, 17:39
Pretty much any car designed this century! .......

Well I can buy into that sentiment - my old MG will keep going until it is driven of the road by legislation or oil running out.....
But... It's a death trap, I'm under no illusions about that. I was driving right behind a current model Renault Clio last week. The driver seems to have fallen asleep or lost consciousness. It car crossed the white line at about 55MPH and collided head on with another car, some big 4x4, what a thump. I dreaded what I would find when I looked in the Clio.... There was the driver dazed and with a bloody nose. That was it. The doors opened, and the foot-well was still there intact. I was amazed. Those in the 4x4 were also unscathed. No doubt it would have been a fatal if the cars were from an earlier time, maybe not so long ago either.
So I'm a bit conflicted on that one.

Rwy in Sight
25th Sep 2018, 19:12
Almost any Opel - provided I pay for it. I had two Alphas as company cars and they were great.

Gertrude the Wombat
25th Sep 2018, 19:23
Not a specific model, but a car with an electric handbrake.
For extra points you can get one that also has an automatic gearbox. Then you have no control over the vehicle at all.

Ancient Mariner
25th Sep 2018, 19:49
For extra points you can get one that also has an automatic gearbox. Then you have no control over the vehicle at all.
My present car has both, and except for being unable to make handbrake turns I'm in total control.
Makes me wonder which type of car you're driving?
Per

G-CPTN
25th Sep 2018, 19:50
For extra points you can get one that also has an automatic gearbox. Then you have no control over the vehicle at all.
I would have thought that an automatic gearbox would allow you to 'hold' the car against the hill in reverse before releasing the handbrake (whether electric or mechanical) and/or the footbrake.
With an automatic you have an extra foot to play with - and no clutch to burn out.

Ancient Mariner
25th Sep 2018, 19:56
I would have thought that an automatic gearbox would allow you to 'hold' the car against the hill in reverse before releasing the handbrake (whether electric or mechanical) and/or the footbrake.
With an automatic you have an extra foot to play with - and no clutch to burn out.
Modern electric parking brakes will release themselves, couldn't be easier.
Per

Gertrude the Wombat
25th Sep 2018, 19:58
Makes me wonder which type of car you're driving?
One with manual handbrake and manual gearbox. But I don't always have as much choice as I would like when it comes to loan and rental cars.

G-CPTN
25th Sep 2018, 20:05
Modern electric parking brakes will release themselves, couldn't be easier.
Per
I have never driven a car with an electric handbrake - just had to rescue confused and incapable drivers attempting reverse hill-starts when parked too close to the car in front.

Another thing that amazes me is the difficulty which some drivers have attempting to reverse-park uphill - instead of turning the car around (it's a cul-de-sac) and approaching uphill in forward gear or 'coasting' down into the space in reverse gear.

I have seen serious smoke being emitted from the clutch area during some of the attempts.

gemma10
25th Sep 2018, 20:47
I really do wish you automatic, electric handbrake disbelievers would go and try a three litre auto beemer, and I am fully convinced you would not only eat your hat,you would want one for the weekend.

gemma10
25th Sep 2018, 20:49
PS. the wife`s car the Clio junk.

rogerg
25th Sep 2018, 21:01
three litre auto beemer
We cant all afford such expensive cars.

Gertrude the Wombat
25th Sep 2018, 21:14
I really do wish you automatic, electric handbrake disbelievers would go and try a three litre auto beemer, and I am fully convinced you would not only eat your hat,you would want one for the weekend.
I most certainly would not - somebody might see me!

Nervous SLF
25th Sep 2018, 23:57
I used to be a big fan of Australian built Holdens but as they are no longer in production in Australia they are now
added to my very extensive list of vehicle makers that I avoid at all costs. To make it easier I will just post the few
that I will consider when I again buy brand new.They are from Toyota, Lexus or Honda and that's it.

chevvron
26th Sep 2018, 03:38
I would have thought that an automatic gearbox would allow you to 'hold' the car against the hill in reverse before releasing the handbrake (whether electric or mechanical) and/or the footbrake.
With an automatic you have an extra foot to play with - and no clutch to burn out.
My 2003 Mercedes A class auto was great on hills; there was a set of traffic lights on a hill I regularly went through and if they were red, I could stop and leave it in drive without applying the handbrake and it wouldn't move. Trouble is the fuel consumption was horrendous so it had to go.
NB: I'm not one of those people who habitually sit at traffic lights with my foot on the brake (whether manual or auto gearbox), too lazy to apply the handbrake.

krismiler
26th Sep 2018, 04:54
Buying new or nearly new, Toyota, Lexus, Mazda, Hyundai, Kia. Consider Dacia if only keeping for a few years and selling during the warranty period, at that price it’s worth a go.

Buying older and out of warranty, Toyota or Lexus. Mazda possibly.

Pontius Navigator
26th Sep 2018, 07:38
Chevron, on a down slope in an E class not much choice. Foot on brake, right hand pull parking brake, left hand select neutral. Green light, left foot release parking brake, left foot on brake, left hand select drive, right foot gas.

crewmeal
26th Sep 2018, 07:42
Who would want a Corsa?

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/drivers-targeted-corsa-cannibals-birmingham-14985302

Trossie
26th Sep 2018, 07:46
ANY diesel.
How on earth did that stinking, smokey, slimy fuel ever manage to be considered eco friendly?
...
NO thanks.

Fully agree. For years we've been into dealers to enquire about future car purchases and (in the size range that we're interested in) the only cars have been diesel. When we've asked about petrol we were told those are gone, it's all diesel now. Funny old thing, petrol is available in all models now! People seem to be waking up to how horrible and dirty diesels are. More CO2 from petrols? Trees need CO2. Nothing needs that particulate [email protected] that diesels kick out.

NO thanks. I've never owned one of those particulate farting diesels and I never will.

Nervous SLF
26th Sep 2018, 07:47
NB: I'm not one of those people who habitually sit at traffic lights with my foot on the brake (whether manual or auto gearbox), too lazy to apply the handbrake.

The AA here in NZ recommend that you don't put your auto into neutral and apply the handbrake when stopped at traffic lights as in their opinion
it causes extra wear and tear in the gearbox over time.

gemma10
26th Sep 2018, 08:48
The AA here in NZ recommend that you don't put your auto into neutral and apply the handbrake when stopped at traffic lights as in their opinion
it causes extra wear and tear in the gearbox over time.

I have always put mine into neutral with the brake on and can`t understand the logic of thw AA`s statement.

Pinky the pilot
26th Sep 2018, 09:07
I really do wish you automatic, electric handbrake disbelievers would go and try a three litre auto beemer, and I am fully convinced you would not only eat your hat,you would want one for the weekend.

Better unconvince:D yourself, because I would not!:=

Uplinker
26th Sep 2018, 09:18
...............NB: I'm not one of those people who habitually sit at traffic lights with my foot on the brake (whether manual or auto gearbox), too lazy to apply the handbrake.


Not lazy, but unnecessary and adding extra complication with an auto. Selecting an auto to neutral, handbrake on, then handbrake off and back into gear again every time one stops in a traffic queue, is counterproductive, (and also negates a big advantage of auto boxes in traffic). To remove the interlock to allow selection of ‘drive’, one usually has to press the foot brake, so the first thing that would happen when a queue of traffic started moving would be that all the autos’ brake lights would come on, which would not be helpful.

Uplinker
26th Sep 2018, 09:30
Pontius: Chevron, on a down slope in an E class not much choice. Foot on brake, right hand pull parking brake, left hand select neutral. Green light, left foot release parking brake, left foot on brake, left hand select drive, right foot gas.

I used to left-foot brake when driving autos, but then I bought a car with a manual gearbox. One day in traffic, I was slowly moving forwards in gear, when I sneezed. Looking back at the road, I was approaching very close to the lorry in front. I stabbed for the brake with my left foot, but hit the clutch pedal instead. We were on a down slope, so the car kept rolling..........bang crunch. BOLLOCKS ! My lovely new car, smashed into a lorry. (Not a scratch on the lorry).

I never left-foot brake in autos now. ​Be careful sir.

BehindBlueEyes
26th Sep 2018, 09:41
I have always put mine into neutral with the brake on and can`t understand the logic of thw AA`s statement.

i seem to remember that, years ago when I was learning to drive, the instructor told me always to put the car into neutral with handbrake on at traffic lights so if someone rear ended you, there was less chance of being shunted forward and causing an even bigger smash, Not sure how true that theory actually was but I just do it out of habit now.

Tankertrashnav
26th Sep 2018, 10:14
What Car? Would you not buy?

Anything that cost more than about two thousand quid. Here in the depths of West Cornwall with "roads" about one car wide, reduced to below that with vegetation growth that the council trims about once a year, bodywork scratches are inevitable. Just like some people buy ripped jeans I buy my cars "pre- scratched" - saves a lot of worry!

sitigeltfel
26th Sep 2018, 12:36
My 2003 Mercedes A class auto was great on hills; there was a set of traffic lights on a hill I regularly went through and if they were red, I could stop and leave it in drive without applying the handbrake and it wouldn't move. Trouble is the fuel consumption was horrendous so it had to go.
NB: I'm not one of those people who habitually sit at traffic lights with my foot on the brake (whether manual or auto gearbox), too lazy to apply the handbrake.

My SL has a feature called SBC Hold. When you stop at lights, an extra firm push then release on the brake pedal keeps the brakes on. When the lights change just touch the accelerator pedal and off you go.
It's a bit anti social at night though because the brake lights stay on to annoy those behind you.

Fareastdriver
26th Sep 2018, 12:44
My 57 De Soto's parking brake, a pedal you pushed below the dashboard, would fly off as soon as you pressed the accelerator in Drive.

G-CPTN
26th Sep 2018, 12:54
My SL has a feature called SBC Hold. When you stop at lights, an extra firm push then release on the brake pedal keeps the brakes on. When the lights change just touch the accelerator pedal and off you go.

My first Jaguar (MKI) had that feature - very useful.

Just a spotter
26th Sep 2018, 13:01
As a day to day drive, any SUV.

Sure, come the apocalypse a Land Rover is a fine choice. But short of that, what a total waste of road space, raw materials and your money. You could be driving something nice and there are far better and safer options to stick your family in.

JAS

Dave Gittins
26th Sep 2018, 13:25
Wouldn't touch a diesel again. Had a brilliant 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee until this Feb, which had done us proud for 8 years but the new DPFs and all that stuff are a no-no with the short distances we drive.

Eventually after much searching replaced it with a PETROL Audi Q5 with auto gears and electric handbrake. Brilliant and 30mpg but slightly small in the boot area. I'd have had a Q7 but they only make diesels. Couldn't get a Merc SUV that wasn't diesel. Tried a Lexus hybrid but the tyre noise was deafening and I was pleased to get out after just a short test drive. It had nothing to recommend it.

Best ever car was a Cadillac Escalade 6 litres and 400 BHP. Only sustainable because petrol was £7 a tank in Qatar.

captainsmiffy
26th Sep 2018, 15:48
Have always yearned after a morgan....now that I can afford it and swmbo is happy, am pleased to note that nobody has slandered it here......yet!

ShyTorque
26th Sep 2018, 16:03
so the first thing that would happen when a queue of traffic started moving would be that all the autos’ brake lights would come on, which would not be helpful.

Best not over generalise - my wife's car doesn't need pressure on the brake pedal to get into "D"; but it does need it to move it from "D" to "N". My first automatic was like that, too.

Mine's the opposite. It's a diesel and an automatic.
I bought it when the UK government were pressing drivers to change to diesel fuel. I will never be able to afford a new car, so for now, it's staying with me!

GROUNDHOG
26th Sep 2018, 19:15
Mr Hertz lent me a Vauxhall Crossland I didn't know anyone made cars that bad anymore!....
Most surprising car, Skoda Octavia, really liked it...
Daily drive Mercedes C class brabus....
I wouldn't be buying ANY new car right now, I will wait a couple of years for technology to evolve to save losing a fortune.

Pontius Navigator
26th Sep 2018, 19:38
I never left-foot brake in autos now. ​Be careful sir.
Honest John swears by left foot braking and it may come naturally to those brought up on automatics, but I never have. Muscle memory means that left and right feet deliver entirely different pressures even though you think they are the same.
​​

Pontius Navigator
26th Sep 2018, 19:43
Here in the depths of West Cornwall with "roads" about one car wide,
In Guernsey the Lanes have useful cut outs for your wing mirrors😁

One year we specified as a hire car a Fiesta Ghia. When we arrived they apologised and gave us C280 Mercedes saloon, auto and 120 miles on the clock. I was petrified.

gemma10
26th Sep 2018, 21:18
My first auto was the Saab95 [fabulous car] and having been used to clutches previously, was advised to use left foot braking. What a mistake, if it hadn`t been for the seatbelt I would have shot through the windscreen.

hiflymk3
26th Sep 2018, 21:43
My first auto was the Saab95 [fabulous car] and having been used to clutches previously, was advised to use left foot braking. What a mistake, if it hadn`t been for the seatbelt I would have shot through the windscreen.
My first auto too, Saab95 estate and still have it five years on. Was dubious about an auto at first, now I love it. The garage lent me a 93 diesel manual, one build under the dictat of GM. Terrible car, clunky, rattly, cheap plastic trim. That's one car I'd never buy. Now a classic 900 aero convertible in black would do nicely thanks. But this would do as well.

https://d39a3h63xew422.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/21092217/IMG_2541-1000x667.jpg

TangoAlphad
26th Sep 2018, 21:52
I'd wager most people who hate automatics or swear off them haven't driven a decent autobox. The difference between a cheap nasty manual to a high end manual box is fairly narrow while a nasty cheap auto to the top end is the Grand Canyon. Obviously there will be exceptions and some of you just want to drive a manual, I get that.

The first Automatics I drove were all 4x4's or budget cars and there was nothing worse.. hated them. I love the 8 speed Auto in my new Volvo (I would only take an auto this time around actually which limited my car choice). The 7 speed in my mum's Merc is pretty decent. The DSG in the VAG range is pretty nice too. I hear excellent things of the kit in the BMW's too.
Anyway, if you hate Auto's just try drive a nice high end one. Given a cheaper car I'll take the manual every time.

Pontius Navigator
26th Sep 2018, 21:59
I drove 99s and 900s for 30 years and my daughter then drove a diesel for 8 until it self destructed somewhere in Austria. I loved the idiosyncratic design that in many ways led the standard features of modern cars. Loved the double belt seat belts. Got engine spares from Triumph provided you didn't tell them It was a SAAB. Easy to swap cruise counter fro m car to car. Early cars didn't have a rear wiper as aerodynamics meant it stayed dry - in theory.

And the security cage. Saw one hit by a 3 ton concrete pillar, broke the windscreen and dented the roof.

aerobelly
26th Sep 2018, 22:09
My first auto was the Saab95 [fabulous car] and having been used to clutches previously, was advised to use left foot braking. What a mistake, if it hadn`t been for the seatbelt I would have shot through the windscreen.

Must have been a different SAAB 95 to the one my boss had with a freewheel. That was weird, take your foot off the gas and it just kept going. Another boss had an early, very early, SAAB 99 turbo. The very epitome of not enough power instantly becoming TOO MUCH POWER on muddy roads. While driving it I never planted it in a ditch, but he did.

'a

gemma10
26th Sep 2018, 22:38
Where`s Loose? He`s had lots of high end specked beemers with auto.

jimtherev
26th Sep 2018, 22:54
Have always yearned after a morgan....now that I can afford it and swmbo is happy, am pleased to note that nobody has slandered it here......yet!

Ah yes, Morgans; I have heard that they will be producing their 2009 model before very long?

chevvron
26th Sep 2018, 23:08
Ah yes, Morgans; I have heard that they will be producing their 2009 model before very long?
With or without woodworm?https://www.pprune.org/images/icons/46.gif

G-CPTN
26th Sep 2018, 23:12
Many years ago, (early 1960s) my colleague picked me up in his brand new Morgan 4/4,and first we headed for a filling station,
Another motorist came over and admired the car then uttered the words "Ah" they don't make them like this any more . . ." - which upset my colleague.

Anilv
27th Sep 2018, 01:54
The first auto I liked was in a Mercedes W123 230E. This was the newer model with the M102 engine. A totally different car from the older M115 200, Great acceleration and smooth.
Having said that, currently all my cars are manual, they're getting rare in new cars for my 2011 Nissan will probably stay.

SMT Member
27th Sep 2018, 06:49
I've had BMW 530d in two varieties; the E61 and F10. The former had a 6-speed auto and manual handbrake, the latter an 8-speed and electric ditto. Both were absolutely fantastic to drive, and whilst I'm currently driving a manual, my next car will certainly be auto. The electric handbrake, which I've also got in my current car, is a non-issue which takes around 10 seconds to get used to.

tdracer
27th Sep 2018, 06:58
I never left-foot brake in autos now. ​Be careful sir.
When I was racing, we always used left foot braking (clutch only used when starting out from a stop - never used when moving). A few times when faced with an ill-handling car (serious push/understeer) I found that I could get the front end to grip and the car rotate by carefully timed stabs on the brake and throttle mid corner- something that wouldn't be possible if I was using the right foot for both pedals.
All that being said, I almost never left foot brake in a road car. When racing, braking was usually max capability - the only 'feel' needed was for lockup - it was 'hard' braking. Further, we'd bias the brakes such that the rears locked first - if they locked a quick stab at the throttle could get them turning again. Totally different technique to what you do in a road car. It's simply bad practice and can lead to problems (many left foot brakers put subtle pressure on the brake pedal without realizing it - hurting fuel mileage and killing the brakes). Heel and toe downshifting aside, it's nearly impossible to apply the brakes and throttle at the same time when using the right foot.
Last time I left foot braked in a road car was about 5 years ago headed home from the doctor with a serious case of gout in my right foot - applying the throttle was OK, but the pressure required to right foot brake was excruciating. So I used left foot braking to get home (manual trani in my S2000, working a clutch and left foot braking was tricky).

ShyTorque
27th Sep 2018, 09:25
The garage lent me a 93 diesel manual, one build under the dictat of GM. Terrible car, clunky, rattly, cheap plastic trim. That's one car I'd never buy.

That's probably because underneath it was a Vauxhall Vectra, as above the worst handling car I've ever driven.

Uplinker
27th Sep 2018, 10:02
Best not over generalise - my wife's car doesn't need pressure on the brake pedal to get into "D"; but it does need it to move it from "D" to "N". My first automatic was like that, too. Fair enough. My car, (DSG auto built in 2008), actually tells me in text on the dashboard to put my foot on the brake before selecting gear !

I really do wish you automatic, electric handbrake disbelievers would go and try a three litre auto beemer, and I am fully convinced you would not only eat your hat,you would want one for the weekend.

I have driven a Merc with an electric handbrake. The lever, (well, switch), was hidden under the dashboard on the outboard side of the car instead of on the centre console. It pushed to apply, pulled to release, which is the opposite way round to what you would expect. Secondly, I like the idea of having a totally separate, simple lever operated handbrake, since it needs no electrical power and therefore doubles as an emergency brake if all else fails. With a conventional lever handbrake, a passenger has at least a chance of stopping or slowing the car in the event of driver incapacitation.

Honest John swears by left foot braking and it may come naturally to those brought up on automatics, but I never have. (My mistake, in the bit of yours I quoted, you do say left foot on brake etc.)

Muscle memory means that left and right feet deliver entirely different pressures even though you think they are the same.

Exactly. Unless you have raced or rallied cars, your left foot is unlikely to have the fine control and feel required to left-foot brake subtlety and effectively.

Left foot braking is all very well, and I did it myself, but if you drive a mix of manual and auto cars as I do, you might find out the expensive way that it is much safer to use your right foot for go and stop, your left foot only for clutch or just bracing your body through the corners.:ok:

Autos don’t need a foot on the brake and accelerator pedals at the same time. (manuals do if you are heeling and toeing, but that is only really for racing). Autos either have torque convertors or auto clutches to hold them on an up-slope*, and some cars hold the brakes on for you when you push the pedal twice and then move your foot onto the accelerator for you to do a hill start.


* However, I would NOT recommend using a DSG auto clutch gearbox to hold oneself on a hill - the #1 clutch will wear out. But it will hold you while you move your foot from the brake pedal to the accelerator.

eal401
27th Sep 2018, 10:55
Where to start!

On gear boxes - my personal preference is manual and I would always, always encourage people to learn to drive with a manual. I think "automatic" only driving instruction should be banned - my opinion - caveated to say "for able bodied people" as obviously there are circumstances where automatic only may be necessary for an individual. I can and have driven automatic, no animosity towards them, in fact if driving overseas - they can be very helpful in allowing greater concentration on the road!!

On fuel - I have owned diesel cars for almost a decade. When I swapped from a 2l petrol to a 2l diesel (both second hand Mondeos), my fuel bill plunged. I'll be getting a new car next year though and would be looking at petrol again, but they seem to be a minority still in new vehicles.

On cars - well, I haven't hit the mother lode of a trouble-free vehicle yet! First car was a Rover 200 MkIII - K-series engine blew its head gasket pretty much on schedule at 66k. Second was a Ford Fiesta MkV, which was reasonably good for the first few years, but the engine and suspension deteriorated significantly over time, regardless of servicing and driving behaviour

I then had a high mileage Mondeo MkII (all I could afford post child and house move!) which was fine until a gentleman in a Beemer decided give-way markings are for other people and smacked in the side of it. It would have carried on for sometime more had it not been for that! I replaced that with a MkIII (The petrol to diesel move) - another high-miler. That was fine until the first week of a new job when it blew its head gasket. It was repaired but didn't feel right and it transpired that the cylinder head was cracked putting it beyond economic repair for me.

A few months later, I inherited my dad's Skoda Octavia which I still drive. Again, nice at first - but despite regular servicing and maintenance has suffered a raft of problems, continuous problems with the suspension (I suspect due to living somewhere with a far higher number of speed bumps that previously), failures in the air con system, dodgy connections in the electrics. Much to my surprise, it passed its MOT yesterday, despite the smoke it can sometimes produce on acceleration (yes it is a diesel too) - it'll be getting replaced within the next 6 months! The Octavia is also one of those cars where self-replacement of headlight bulbs is nigh-on impossible - unlike the Fords we have had.

My wife had the Fiesta, that was replaced with a Focus MkIII which she still runs. All is well with that car - but its 1.6l petrol engine can't accelerate worth a damn and it has the turning circle of a disabled oil tanker.

So, I will read this thread with interest for positives. Don't seem to be many yet!

Gordon17
27th Sep 2018, 11:22
Must have been a different SAAB 95 to the one my boss had with a freewheel. That was weird, take your foot off the gas and it just kept going. Another boss had an early, very early, SAAB 99 turbo. The very epitome of not enough power instantly becoming TOO MUCH POWER on muddy roads. While driving it I never planted it in a ditch, but he did.

I think some of you are confusing the Saab 95 from the 1960s with the Saab 9-5 from the 1990s.

Georg1na
27th Sep 2018, 11:30
Just passed 100k in our Lexus 350 RX running on LPG. Only faults in that mileage two light bulbs! Indeed the 4x4 centre that services the car says that if everyone bought Toyotas and Hondas he would be out of business - no money in just servicing. He just loves the Landrover/Range Rover products - they keep him in Caribbean holidays!

As to Morgans - if you enjoy the sensation of driving along two ladders, go for it! I have a 1966 Lotue Elan S3 SE and have now done over 180k in it over 32 years- not entirely without problems - but if you thrash a 52 year old car over the Alps/Dolomite/Pyrenees you have to expect the odd part to fail - but the grins per mile are amazing....................

NRU74
27th Sep 2018, 19:16
My SL has a feature called SBC Hold. When you stop at lights, an extra firm push then release on the brake pedal keeps the brakes on. When the lights change just touch the accelerator pedal and off you go.
It's a bit anti social at night though because the brake lights stay on to annoy those behind you.

Iíve a B Class and I agree about the Hold and also about inadvertently pi$$ing off people behind you in the dark -youíd have thought the Auto-boffins could have sorted that out. I also like the fact that when you open the door the handbrake comes on, although Iíve not tried it at speed.
What I donít understand is what/any advantage there is in having a keyless push start ignition. Iíve never locked myself out of the car ever in 55 years or so and I canít see any other benefit.
Anyone know better ?

TangoAlphad
27th Sep 2018, 19:27
What I donít understand is what/any advantage there is in having a keyless push start ignition. Iíve never locked myself out of the car ever in 55 years or so and I canít see any other benefit.
Anyone know better ?

If you have keyless entry I quite like it, especially in the rain. No fumbling around in my flight bag after a trip or if I've got the wee one in tow. Run up to the car, open the door and go.
Necessary? Nah. I still like it though.

wowzz
27th Sep 2018, 20:34
I can see the point of keyless entry. What I cannot fathom is the credit card sized card that Renault use, which you have to slot in, and then press the stop star button. No advantage whatsoever over a key, just bigger to carry around, and you can't combine it with any other keys.

NRU74
27th Sep 2018, 20:57
If you have keyless entry I quite like it, especially in the rain. No fumbling around in my flight bag after a trip or if I've got the wee one in tow. Run up to the car, open the door and go.
Necessary? Nah. I still like it though.

Keyless entry -yes but .... thereís all this stuff on the net about storing the key in a Ďfaradayí box etc to stop the car being stolen.
I use the key remotely to get in the car but I canít work out what the advantage is to starting the car with the key in my pocket.
If I pull that plastic push button thing out of the ignition key receptor and store it elsewhere, presumably any thief then, like me, needs a key ?

TangoAlphad
27th Sep 2018, 20:59
I can see the point of keyless entry. What I cannot fathom is the credit card sized card that Renault use, which you have to slot in, and then press the stop star button. No advantage whatsoever over a key, just bigger to carry around, and you can't combine it with any other keys.

That I'd agree with. Seems odd.
Mine isn't a standard key but keyless entry and start so it just stays in my pocket/ flight bag. I can't really justify or give many good reasons why.. I probably wouldn't pay extra if I'd had a choice but it was standard fit. A bit of a gimmick I suppose but I like it none the less.

sitigeltfel
27th Sep 2018, 21:07
I can see the point of keyless entry. What I cannot fathom is the credit card sized card that Renault use, which you have to slot in, and then press the stop star button. No advantage whatsoever over a key, just bigger to carry around, and you can't combine it with any other keys.

One of our cars has it. The routine goes like this.

Missus picks up key, uses the car and when she returns locks the car using the keyless function. Forgets key is in her handbag.
Next trip, she can't find the main key (still in her handbag) and uses the spare key. When she returns, she again locks the car using the keyless function and leaves the key in her handbag.
Next trip, she can't find any of the keys because she has forgotten they are buried in the depths of her handbags and takes one of our other cars.
While she is out I want to use the car, but can't, because she has all the f#£&@%g keys!

ShyTorque
27th Sep 2018, 21:11
Keyless entry... My son worked for a car hire company; his boss was a total w****r, always trying to catch out his employees for minor indiscretions - he seemed to like giving out "disciplinaries" as the company called them.

The "boss" delivered a brand new Mondeo to a customer who needed the car in a hurry to drive to Scotland. It had keyless ignition. The customer was waiting and desperate to set off so the engine was left running, he jumped in and roared off up the A1 to his important appointment. Some time after my son's boss got back to the office he realised he still had the key for that car in his pocket....

Made my son's day!

sitigeltfel
27th Sep 2018, 21:50
Keyless entry... My son worked for a car hire company; his boss was a total w****r, always trying to catch out his employees for minor indiscretions - he seemed to like giving out "disciplinaries" as the company called them.

The "boss" delivered a brand new Mondeo to a customer who needed the car in a hurry to drive to Scotland. It had keyless ignition. The customer was waiting and desperate to set off so the engine was left running, he jumped in and roared off up the A1 to his important appointment. Some time after my son's boss got back to the office he realised he still had the key for that car in his pocket....

Made my son's day!

Try that in our car and you get caption warnings "key out of car""and loud bongs.

Jhieminga
28th Sep 2018, 12:38
Muscle memory means that left and right feet deliver entirely different pressures even though you think they are the same.Exactly. Unless you have raced or rallied cars, your left foot is unlikely to have the fine control and feel required to left-foot brake subtlety and effectively.
The other exception being pilots of course. I do a lot of trial lessons and a large percentage of first-timers will have the aircraft pointing at the left edge of the taxiway at their first braking attempt. They feed in a measured amount of braking on the right pedal, but will just hammer down the left one as they're used to.

Apologies for aviation content...;)

Mike6567
28th Sep 2018, 17:01
Sorry but I am rather old fashioned and would not like to do my travels across France in any car that does not have a full size spare wheel.
Not many new cars come with this item now. (for info have a VW Passat Estate)

Ancient Mariner
28th Sep 2018, 17:38
Sorry but I am rather old fashioned and would not like to do my travels across France in any car that does not have a full size spare wheel.
Not many new cars come with this item now. (for info have a VW Passat Estate)
Optional on some cars, mine came with an emergency spare (at a cost) threw it out and replaced it with one of the car's winter tyres. Reverse in winter. Bay is large enough for a full size.
And what car would I not buy? Anything Land/Range Rover. Late nineties experience with two Discos still.....grumble, grumble, %:mad:$:oh:£"& and BWM (Who owned them at the time.)
Per

Mechta
28th Sep 2018, 19:06
I can see the point of keyless entry. What I cannot fathom is the credit card sized card that Renault use, which you have to slot in, and then press the stop star button. No advantage whatsoever over a key, just bigger to carry around, and you can't combine it with any other keys.

Wowzz, You forgot to mention wedging a chip fork and a bit of cardboard in with the 'credit card' to flex it enough that the fatigued solder joint on the induction coil makes contact with the PCB (once you jiggled it around for a minute or two). Not many Renaults will be used as get away cars though...

gruntie
28th Sep 2018, 19:15
I had the misfortune to have a ride with one of those ‘left foot brakers’ some years ago. In heavy London traffic, he held a constant throttle opening with his right foot, and moderated speed by repeated jabs at the brake pedal with his left. Knowing what was going on, I could then distinguish them as their brake lights were on all the time: up to then I assumed it was a faulty car, but in fact it was a faulty driver.

ian16th
28th Sep 2018, 21:48
Sorry but I am rather old fashioned and would not like to do my travels across France in any car that does not have a full size spare wheel.
Not many new cars come with this item now. (for info have a VW Passat Estate)

This is a pet hate of mine.

The problem is the politicly driven emmission laws.
Improve power to weight ration, and you emit less.
Removing the spare wheel, removes weight!

It should be mandatory to have the spare available as an option, and have somewhere to stow it.

Gertrude the Wombat
28th Sep 2018, 22:15
Sorry but I am rather old fashioned and would not like to do my travels across France in any car that does not have a full size spare wheel.
France wouldn't bother me, but discovering that I only had a fake spare wheel in a hire car on Vancouver Island, which was good for something like 50km, when the nearest garage was something like 100km (of gravel roads) away ...

layman
28th Sep 2018, 22:44
Full sized spares are essential when driving in regional areas (hundreds of km to next town). Remote areas even more so - some carry two spares!
'Run-flat' tyres cannot even get you (safely) to the next town.
Four flats in 40+ years - three 'foreign' objects spiking the tyre; one where the valve stem 'melted' !!

wowzz
29th Sep 2018, 00:36
Wowzz, You forgot to mention wedging a chip fork and a bit of cardboard in with the 'credit card' to flex it enough that the fatigued solder joint on the induction coil makes contact with the PCB (once you jiggled it around for a minute or two). Not many Renaults will be used as get away cars though...
Fortunately I have never had one with a card long enough to go down the chip shop fork route! I did have a Safrane in days of old - enormous squishy leather front seats - it was like driving a three peice sofa, with fuel economy to match!

The Nr Fairy
29th Sep 2018, 09:02
Exactly. Unless you have raced or rallied cars, your left foot is unlikely to have the fine control and feel required to left-foot brake subtlety and effectively.

Left foot braking is all very well, and I did it myself, but if you drive a mix of manual and auto cars as I do, you might find out the expensive way that it is much safer to use your right foot for go and stop, your left foot only for clutch or just bracing your body through the corners.:ok:

Autos donít need a foot on the brake and accelerator pedals at the same time. (manuals do if you are heeling and toeing, but that is only really for racing). Autos either have torque convertors or auto clutches to hold them on an up-slope*, and some cars hold the brakes on for you when you push the pedal twice and then move your foot onto the accelerator for you to do a hill start.


If one practices enough, then one trains the muscles to work properly. LFB is a great technique for really improving the smoothness and progress in a drive - and I'm talking open road here, not city driving - by allowing a later transition from braking to being on the gas, and a smoother transition as well.

I've driven with an individual who'll LFB in a manual, and if he needs to, will move LF to the clutch, RF to the brake, and then heel and toe. All seamlessly done and lovely to watch. For an example by a master, watch Walter Rohrl... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqREtbLe4sY

Pontius Navigator
29th Sep 2018, 09:04
Sorry but I am rather old fashioned and would not like to do my travels across France in any car that does not have a full size spare wheel.
Not many new cars come with this item now. (for info have a VW Passat Estate)
Why? Is it the 50km limit or is it 50kph limit? And why France?

We picked up a piece of steel like an arrow head an route the the ferry. Put the small wheel on and of course no space to put the punctured tyre anywhere though they had provided a bag. My children had to make space for the wheel.

First garage in Cherbourg just shrugged. Drove o another 20-30 miles and next garafer. Chap was brilliant, stopped work replaced the tyre and we were fixed. Had it been an odd tyre not in stock then it would have been a Green Flag moment.

Rush2112
29th Sep 2018, 09:49
Always a manual, always diesel and always European. I know Japanese cars are more reliable but they have no soul or style. Korean cars are plain awful and we won't even get started on American cars. That said, I live in Singapore and cannot afford one anyway :( but when on my hols and I rent a car, that what I try to adhere to. It doesn't always work, as I have had a Nissan Juke, or should that be Joke, what a piece of garbage it was...

krismiler
29th Sep 2018, 11:05
Good point about the full size spare wheel, I hired a Volvo XC90 and ended up with a flat rear tyre, unfortunately unrepairable. Managed to limp it as far as the nearest tyre center on the space saver, luckily they had the unusual sized tyre in stock and luckily it was in the UK where distances between towns aren't that great.

When renting a car, take it as an opportunity to try something different. I enjoy driving a Mercedes or BMW for a few days but wouldn't want to be saddled with the ownership costs. Korean cars have improved immensely in the last few years and are nearly on a level with the Japanese. I'll take reliability and lower running cost over soul anytime.

Pinky the pilot
29th Sep 2018, 11:40
Four flats in 40+ years - three 'foreign' objects spiking the tyre; one where the valve stem 'melted'!!

To the other extreme; Admittedly it was when I worked on a Seismic Survey Crew in the Aussie Outback (otherwise known as the GAFA) driving Toyota Landcruiser Diesel Utes, that I once set a record;:}

Seven flat tyres on one 12 hour working day!:eek::ooh::{

And of course you had to fix them yourself at the end of the day's work!:hmm:

When fixing the seventh and final one of the day; From splitting the rim to throwing the repaired wheel onto the back of my ute was timed, independently, at precisely seven minutes!:ooh:

ShyTorque
29th Sep 2018, 11:54
My car doesn't carry a spare wheel at all! Reason being that it has a limited slip diff and there is a size difference between the front and rear wheels (so you would need two spares to avoid diff damage). It was originally fitted with "run-flat" tyres, which are great for handling and grip, but not so good for comfort (there's a lot of bump-thump).

I got a hole in a rear tyre and drove it to a major tyre dealer, only to be told that it could be up ten working days to get a replacement because there were none in UK! I fitted a pair of normal tyres instead, which still had to be ordered in but only took three days(!). I now carry a latex injection/inflation pump and an old fashioned tyre repair kit, just in case I get another flat and can't get recovery (of which I'm fully aware, might be help, but might not).

Ancient Mariner
29th Sep 2018, 12:57
ShyTorque, would not the front and rear wheel still have the same circumference?
Per

Allan Lupton
29th Sep 2018, 14:06
I said I'd never have a car which had no spare wheel, but by now that pretty well means I can't have a new car. Best compromise was to get the estate version and carry a spare in the boot - modern wheels are so big that one would completely fill the boot of the equivalent saloon (if you could get it in there)..
Other bit of poor design logic are the so-called four wheel drive systems that are front drive and only give you driven rear wheels when it "thinks" you need 'em - i.e. when it notices that poor grip has let go. A real four-wheel-drive system won't get into that state as easily and if it does the clever stuff can change the front/rear proportioning if it "thinks" it would help.

ShyTorque
29th Sep 2018, 16:27
ShyTorque, would not the front and rear wheel still have the same circumference?
Per

No, the rear wheels are larger in diameter as well as in width. The slight issue is that there is no room in the boot well for a spare wheel of sufficient diameter (tried that, a standard wheel won't go in).

Buster11
29th Sep 2018, 16:38
Can't vouch for the veracity of this, but I believe there was a Porsche of some sort that had one of the ridiculous 'toy' spare wheels in a recess in its boot (at the front). In the event of a flat, the only place the deflated 'real' wheel could be carried once the 'toy' one was in place was on the passenger's lap.

When buying any new car the first thing I check is whether there's space for a proper spare wheel where the '50 miles and not over 50 mph' one is fitted. If so I insist on a real spare to replace the daft one; if no space, no sale.

In idle moments I try to imagine the reaction at a company's design meeting when someone first sugested that their new model should not come equipped with a fully functional spare wheel. Lunatics and asylums spring to mind, but it seems to have become normal.

ian16th
29th Sep 2018, 16:48
In idle moments I try to imagine the reaction at a company's design meeting when someone first sugested that their new model should not come equipped with a fully functional spare wheel. Lunatics and asylums spring to mind, but it seems to have become normal.

See my post #114.

It is all to do with reducing the weight of the car.
No other parameters are considered.

paulc
29th Sep 2018, 17:41
Would never buy a BMW for the simple reason that the bottom hinged accelerator causes a pain in my right ankle after a few miles. Top hinged ones o any of my previous cars cause no issue. Also would always buy a manual over an auto as i prefer to be the one who decides when to change gear.

TLDNMCL
29th Sep 2018, 19:01
I gave up driving regularly by choice about ten years ago (I still have to drive occasionally at work, pool vehicles) but I do not miss it otherwise. I acknowledge the convenience of owning a car, as I also realise that for a number of people it is an essential item; however for me a car has never been anything more than a practical tool, and one that I found I had an ever-decreasing need for.
My closest friend (complete car nerd - his admission) gets very frustrated that I don't see the beauty in them or have a desire to own one ever again; the very notion leaves him aghast. I hire one when absolutely necessary, and I don't much care what they give me; the fewer gadgets the better (ok, I do like to have a radiio in there). Good luck to all who enjoy them though.

Gertrude the Wombat
29th Sep 2018, 19:03
accelerator causes a pain in my right ankle after a few miles
Ah, now the cruise control is one bit of automation that I do go for.

Pontius Navigator
29th Sep 2018, 19:04
Some cars have automatic and manual. The Bentley and Lamborghini I drove both had an automatic with optional use of gear paddles on the steering column.☺
​​​​

Pontius Navigator
29th Sep 2018, 19:10
Ah, now the cruise control is one bit of automation that I do go for.
Had cruise control in my primary car for 40 years. The first was a SAAB extra, cost me £64 and I moved it through 5 models with the last two myself as the garages didn't have the ability.

Did a lot of mileage in a Fiesta diesel but very few gear changes required. Then driving a work Focus on the A12 out of town gave me a severe ache in the left leg. Went auto and cruise control as mandatory fit thereafter.

Loose rivets
29th Sep 2018, 22:12
Very strange.

Pal bought a used Hyundai 16 valve something-or-another SUV. About three grand in nice condition but with rather a lot of miles. Sorry, that's all I know other then it's a big car.

He gets the manual out and starts to learn the details. Lower the spare wheel by . . . oh, shoot!!!!!!!!! Nothing. Nothing except a piece of stainless cable that comes to an abrupt end.

He, and the dealer, conclude that the wheel was stolen by someone getting under and snipping the wire. Hmmmmm , , , not convinced.

Now this bloke is one of the most intelligent people I've ever met, but I'm still not sure. The previous owner for many years, a lady, was not aware of the problem whatsoever. Never given it a thought.

Okay, so there's a chance it may have been one of the huge full sized wheels. Hence the temptation to nick it. But wait, would they, could they, in the maddest of moments, hang a vast wheel on one wire, for years and years and years?

My little BMW has a bolt with a large plastic knob. One removes this in the boot, and then lowers A CRADLE with the spare in it.

I just can not believe a wheel can just hang. What think you?


My ex BMW 635d thing had no spare. I still have the 4 wheels with new tyres and one spare rim. Bloke that bought the car only wanted the fun wheels I put on to learn to handle the car. (Sheeesh, that two-stage EDS is beyond magic.)

Whan I buy a car, I always put on the space-saver wheel and check it out. Even my MB E500 Sport had one. The car drove surprisingly well with it on even the front. Yes, 50mph, but I know of no distance limit.


Psssst! Anyone want a set of wheels. Know what I mean, John?

treadigraph
29th Sep 2018, 22:15
I gave up driving regularly by choice about ten years ago (I still have to drive occasionally at work, pool vehicles) but I do not miss it otherwise. I acknowledge the convenience of owning a car, as I also realise that for a number of people it is an essential item; however for me a car has never been anything more than a practical tool, and one that I found I had an ever-decreasing need for.
I hire one when absolutely necessary, and I don't much care what they give me; the fewer gadgets the better (ok, I do like to have a radio in there). Good luck to all who enjoy them though.

Me too. Occasionally I miss the convenience but the rental place is 10 mins up the road...

Fareastdriver
30th Sep 2018, 10:19
I gave up my car earlier this year because it was costing me a £1/mile just for tax and insurance. There is a mass of convenient local and national transport options of which most is free. When I need a car I rent one but I avoid the renters trick of letting you have the car for peanuts but stinging you for excess insurance; I have my own excess insurance up to £35,000 for £45/year.

sitigeltfel
30th Sep 2018, 11:02
See my post #114.

It is all to do with reducing the weight of the car.
No other parameters are considered.

They pare away at everything to get the weight down..reducing the capacity of the windscreen washer bottle, plastic body panels instead of metal etc. The Mazda MX5 even has holes in the lower portion of the door windows below sill level to shave off a few grammes.

treadigraph
30th Sep 2018, 11:05
I avoid the renters trick of letting you have the car for peanuts but stinging you for excess insurance; I have my own excess insurance up to £35,000 for £45/year.

Me too, thanks to somebody on PPRuNe mentioning it before. Before that I took the risk, but far too many nutters on the road...

TWT
30th Sep 2018, 11:06
I just can not believe a wheel can just hang

Not unusual. Same arrangement on a Ford Transit that I used to drive. Wheel never fell off.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoM4DgKWEwg

dook
30th Sep 2018, 13:55
The Bentley and Lamborghini I drove both had an automatic with optional use of gear paddles on the steering column

Just like our second car. Schhhh - it's a Smart Car.

Our main car is an auto with a Tiptronic box. No prizes for guessing what that is.

Fareastdriver
30th Sep 2018, 14:00
Our main car is an auto with a Tiptronic box. No prizes for guessing what that is.

Hyundai? My 2002 Sonata had one of those.

dook
30th Sep 2018, 14:47
Hy what ?

Sorry - there's a three-pointed star on the front and rear.

Slow Biker
30th Sep 2018, 19:56
Saw a DeLorean today, 'W' suffix VRN. As far as I remember it's the first i have seen.

Pontius Navigator
30th Sep 2018, 20:40
SB, saw one a few years ago at the local filling station. Unmistakable but a bit tatty.

WingNut60
30th Sep 2018, 20:48
Not a specific model, but a car with an electric handbrake.
.

Let's combine yours with Chevrron (two posts later).

Brake issue forces massive recall (https://thewest.com.au/lifestyle/motoring/subaru-recalls-more-than-40000-cars-over-electronic-park-brakes-ng-b88976545z)

Subaru has recalled more than 40,000 vehicles following issues with electronic park brakes. (https://thewest.com.au/lifestyle/motoring/subaru-recalls-more-than-40000-cars-over-electronic-park-brakes-ng-b88976545z)

Local Variation
1st Oct 2018, 00:15
Full sized spares are essential when driving in regional areas (hundreds of km to next town). Remote areas even more so - some carry two spares!
'Run-flat' tyres cannot even get you (safely) to the next town.
Four flats in 40+ years - three 'foreign' objects spiking the tyre; one where the valve stem 'melted' !!


Drove from Glasgow to Leicester all the way on a run flat. The car was even usable the following day before finally giving up the ghost.

Pontius Navigator
1st Oct 2018, 08:54
Drove from Glasgow to Leicester all the way on a run flat. The car was even usable the following day before finally giving up the ghost.
Crazy man, why on earth did you do that? Front of back?

ian16th
1st Oct 2018, 10:08
Hy what ?

Sorry - there's a three-pointed star on the front and rear.

Useful for aiming the car at errant pedestrians.

ShyTorque
1st Oct 2018, 10:20
Iím fairly sure that a company in the USA can still build De Lorean cars because they bought all the spare parts, including body/chassis components.

krismiler
1st Oct 2018, 11:02
Correct, there is also a company in the UK which can build E Type Jaguars.

dook
1st Oct 2018, 11:10
Useful for aiming the car at errant pedestrians.

I can't do that - it's five inches in diameter and embedded in the front grill.

Anyway, aiming at arrogant cyclists would be far more appropriate.

Local Variation
1st Oct 2018, 11:19
Crazy man, why on earth did you do that? Front of back?

Yep, I was young and daft in those days PN compared to just daft these days. But just wanted to point out that run flats can go some time and distance. Think it was the left rear. Remembering stopping frequently to give it a kick. At that time, run flats were never stocked and you had to order and wait. I even drove the car to KF 2 days after the run flat activation to get the tyre replaced.

Had the miss fortune to drive a Vauxhall Insignia recently. Awful car in so many ways. And so is the Mini.

IFMU
1st Oct 2018, 16:00
No car with an automatic. I don't care how awesome they make them, I don't want to be one of those guys who drives an automatic. I have taught both my sons how to drive a manual.

TangoAlphad
2nd Oct 2018, 05:11
No car with an automatic. I don't care how awesome they make them, I don't want to be one of those guys who drives an automatic. I have taught both my sons how to drive a manual.
Please understand, I mean no offence. I'm guessing you are from the USA? I only say as it does seem that there is a culture of being able to dive stick and it being macho etc. We don't have the same in the EU as manuals are more common, although the auto's are catching.
I always assumed it was the road network that was the reason for the difference in common type transmissions. America with long straight roads and in Europe with generally more winding smaller roads the early day automatics were jusr unwelcome.

ShyTorque
2nd Oct 2018, 06:39
In UK, if you pass your driving test in a car with an auto transmission, that's all you can legally drive. The only person I know of with this limitation is my son's female partner.

layman
2nd Oct 2018, 07:08
Local Variation

picking up on PN's comment of you driving a fun-flat from Glasgow to Leicester (more than 300 miles)

This type of tyre is usually warranted for something 10 to 50 miles at 50 mph (80km at 80kmh in Aus)

Lucky? Or an accident waiting to happen? I've heard more than one story of cars rolling when tyres have disintegrated.

I wonder how a run-flat would go with a 600kg load in the back of something like a BMW X5?

Mechta
2nd Oct 2018, 22:01
Can't vouch for the veracity of this, but I believe there was a Porsche of some sort that had one of the ridiculous 'toy' spare wheels in a recess in its boot (at the front). In the event of a flat, the only place the deflated 'real' wheel could be carried once the 'toy' one was in place was on the passenger's lap.


If you do have to carry a damaged tyre in the cabin with you, deflate it first: US Servicewoman killed when tyre exploded (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinburgh_and_east/8600833.stm)

Thomas coupling
2nd Oct 2018, 23:57
Being seen in a BMW X6 or a range rover. Intimidating monsters of a car, designed to replace someones tiny todger.
People who drive these are either egotists or WAG's.

bugged on the right
3rd Oct 2018, 00:50
Agree Thomas, our crew of 3 was picked up by the hotel X6. Very nice we thought but it would only fit 1 small suitcase and our nav bags in the boot. The 2 of us in the back seat were stooped over because of the overhead clearance with our suitcases on our knees. What a heap.

Lechon
3rd Oct 2018, 01:50
Any Fiat, they will break as soon as you buy them