RAF Routes?

[GLIDER 90]

Hello All

In the 1960's &70's if an RAF Jet was going to fly to Australia or Gan from the UK, which way did the aircraft travel was it through the USA or did it fly the eastern routes?

[chevvron]

Via El Adem.

[WilliumMate]

Late 70s. Routed:

Brize-Bahrain-Colombo-Perth-Sydney on a VC10.

[Warmtoast]

Hello All

In the 1960's &70's if an RAF Jet was going to fly to Australia or Gan from the UK, which way did the aircraft travel was it through the USA or did it fly the eastern routes?

In the early 1960's UK to Australia would have been: Lyneham - El Adem - Khormaksar - Gan - Changi - Darwin - and then down south to Maralinga or Edinburgh Field (Adelaide) or wherever.

[Herod]

Mid seventies, Hercules routed Lyneham, Akrotiri, Masirah, Gan, Tengah. then onward. I've operated Tengah-Townsville. Turning left at Tengah, Hong Kong would be next.

[ian16th]

In the early 60's when CENTO was alive, we sometimes staged through Karachi to Gan.

[GLIDER 90]

Thanks all.

[Fitter2]

Back in the days when we had RAF airfields in the Med, Middle East, Maldives & Singapore, then Eastwards was the obvious route (apart from the consideration of the shortest leg crossing the Pacific being much longer than any leg going Eastbound.

As.an aside, after leaving the RAF one work trip involved going to Thailand with a stop on the way in Arkansas. The secretary booking the tickets was working out the best way from the USA to the Far East via Europe or Africa until I pointed out that the left hand side of her map actually was also the right hand side. As a bonus, it meant I also spent a long weekend on the way with an old friend in Palmdale, CA with a few hours gliding in the Mojave desert and a guided trip round some of the off-limits parts of NASA Dryden (now Neil Armstrong Research Centre/Edwards AFB).

[Postfade]

I lived in quarters above the main aircraft park at Changi, the western dispersal in the early 1960's and watched the UK endless Transport Command Britannias and Comets plying from the UK. As previously stated the standard route was from Lyneham to El Adem, then onto Khormaksar, where the 99 Sdqn and 511 Sqdn crews 'overnighted'. Their aircraft however were immediately continued onward by another crew, travelling to Gan and to Changi. Sometimes these then went onto Kai Tak or perhaps to Darwin and Edinburgh Field, if servicing the Woomera range.This 'slipping' of crews wasn't initially carried out by the 216 Sqdn Comet crews, but they often went to Kai Tak to pickup 'Casevacs' for ferrying back to UK hospitals.
When the Comet C4's took over from the Comet C2's in mid 1962, the 216 Sqdn crews also soon adopted 'slipping' as well. Overnighting didn't seem to only take place at Khormaksar though and depending on other factors crews could stop off and change aircraft at Gan or El Adem.
Here's a Britannia arriving:
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/600x385/62_07_britannia_639_just_arrived_ntsn_600px_0686e2c67a393d20 62cc5d7e175a04d35a30cf12.jpg
Flight 6377 Britannia XL639 ‘Atria’ from Lyneham at Changi at 1120 on 15th July 1962 as the ground crew move towards the aircraft with the steps, auxiliary power unit and air-conditioning. The 511 Sqdn crew, under Flt.Lt.C. Brown, an Australian exchange pilot had left Lyneham on the 12th July as Flight 6376 in Britannia XM491 routing to El Adem and Khormaksar where they overnighted. They left for Gan and on to Changi now in XL639 as Flight 6377. Their aircraft was carrying both passengers and freight, the latter of which was unloaded into Royal Navy trucks using the large lift called a 'Britannia Freight Loading Platform' and a crane. The presence of a fire engine indicated it was probably carrying ammunition or missiles. The same crew were to leave Changi heading home as Flight 6378 on the 20th in XM497 and swopping to XM490 at Khormaksar as Flight 6379, arriving back at Lyneham on the 22nd.
Here's a Comet C4:
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/600x399/62_07_comet_4_xr399_2_nt1n_600px_e5e38db7550487cbd94d38918da 00f6959f8914a.jpg
The last of the gorgeous Comet C4’s delivered to 216 Squadron, XR399 basks in the sun in June 1962. XR399 had left Lyneham on the 11th June, piloted by Flt. Lt. D. Draper, routing to El Adem and Khormaksar. On the 12th it left Khormaksar for Gan and Changi. Then going on to Darwin and Edinburgh Field and returning on the 16th, when this was taken. On the 17th it departed with Flt.Lt. Senior going to Gan, Khormaksar on the 18th, then Khormaksar to Karachi on the 19th. Karachi to Nicosia on the 20th and back to Lyneham on the 21st.
On the 27th Nov ‘62, captained by Flt.Lt. T. Clarke, XR399 hit the lead-in approach lights whilst landing at Gan. Tony Birchenough, a member of the crew sent to repair it remembered: “The flaps were knackered, with cartoon-like outlines of the approach lights embedded in the inner sets, the outer pair having badly kinked trailing edges. Apart from that and some minor damage to the fuselage skin, repaired by a party from the MU at Singapore, and damaged tyres, there was no further damage. We changed the badly damaged flaps, roughly straightened out the outer pair with the approval of the DH structures engineer and a week later, after new wheels had been fitted and a satisfactory air test had been carried out, we came home”. He adds: “ It was also rumoured at the time that it was not the Captain landing at Gan, but an onboard high-ranking officer, although naturally this was never confirmed.”
(Comet XR399 landing incident at Gan by Tony Birchenough - Halton 81st Entry (http://www.81st-entry.co.uk/journals/articles/journal-15-article3.html))

None Transport Command aircraft could choose different routes, here's a Vulcan that preferred Nairobi to Khormaksar:
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/600x395/62_09_vulcan_xh476_taxies_out_nt3_600px_cd6daae35fa3ae0f75c9 6146813c3170c3c2f7d5.jpg
Vulcan B1A XH476 piloted by Flt.Lt. J.C.Williams and his crew from 44 Squadron at Waddington taxi out for what they booked as a ‘practice demonstration scramble and display’ in the cool of the late afternoon of September 13th, although they were airborne for a total of 7 minutes only. They gave a rather longer display two days later at the Airshow on the 15th. The aircraft had left the UK on Sept 9th and arrived at Changi on the 12th via El Adem, Nairobi and Gan and apart from Pilot Flt.Lt. Williams the crew was Co-pilot Flt.Lt. G.W.Rippin, Navigator Radar Flt.Lt. G.B.Walker, Navigator Plotter Flt.Lt. J.F.Scofield and Air Electronics Op Flt.Lt. A.R.Yapp. The crew chief Chief Technician C.E. Pratt and technician Cpl. A.J. Riley were also onboard during the flights out and back so it was quite cramped in there.
The 20 Squadron Hunters were flown to Singapore in small groups and the first flight planned for seven stops from the MU at St Athan. Going to Luqa (Malta), Nicosia (Cyprus), Tehran, Karachi, Delhi, Calcutta and Bangkok to get to Tengah. The aimed at 4 days with 18 flying hours but in fact it took them 19 days, proving that flying in the Indian Monsoon season wasn't straight forward.

Here's a couple of later 20 Sqdn Hunter arrivals:
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/600x400/62_07_2_hunters_2_nt1n_600px_a7079dd7d9c2bb461f6565ec2f4a18a 21f022409.jpg
It's a long way to fly a jet fighter to Singapore and the ferry pilots of these two Hunters, XG272 and XG293 for 20 Sqdn. are seen telling the stories to the ground crews at Changi after their long flight in July 1962. Still in the full markings of 43 Sqdn, these were additional aircraft for 20 Sqdn at Tengah, which had reformed in the UK and and had started flying out to the Far East batches of their newly converted FGA9 Hunters directly from the MU at St Athan, beginning in mid-1961. These FGA9’s were F6’s, with quite a lot of mods, such as pylons for large 230-gallon fuel tanks inboard and 100-gallon tanks outboard, rails for mounting 3inch high-explosive rockets, a braking parachute, Marconi AD722 radio-compass, extended oxygen capacity and air-conditioning. The Hunters with their long-range tanks had a range of about 1,500 miles and the aircraft routed Malta (Luqa), Cyprus (Nicosia), Tehran, Karachi, Delhi, Calcutta and Bangkok to Singapore. Such deliveries by air required that some of the airfields used were 'civilian' and the Hunters Avpin starters had to be supplied with the highly flammable fuel by BOAC personnel. However by 6th November 1961 ten of the FGA9’s and a T7 were all in Singapore, giving the squadron a full complement plus two spares. These two new aircraft were also initially kept as spares, going into storage before being rotated to into service.

Many more Changi pics at david taylor images (http://www.davidtaylorimages.co.uk) under 'aviation'

David

[ian16th]

David,
Thanks for your post and pics.

Interesting, and new to me, the 230 gal tanks on the Hunters.

In 1957-8, Hunters transiting UK to Luqa all stopped at Istres/Orange.

[ICM]

Whilst Eastabout was certainly the primary routing in the years concerned, it's worth mentioning that in the mid/late 60s we had set up the staging posts across North America and the Pacific that provided a Westabout option, and it was exercised annually for some time - Exercise Travelling Causeway is the name I recall.

[ian16th]

Whilst Eastabout was certainly the primary routing in the years concerned, it's worth mentioning that in the mid/late 60s we had set up the staging posts across North America and the Pacific that provided a Westabout option, and it was exercised annually for some time - Exercise Travelling Causeway is the name I recall.

In 1957 there was a Transport Command detachment at Honolulu, operating what was in effect a Staging Post.

[ICM]

Ian, that news surprised me, given the nature of the Transport Force at the time. But a bit of checking around confirms that a network as far as Hickam (Honolulu) was in place by September 1957 for support of the Op Grapple nuclear tests on Christmas Island, and it appears that 216 Sqn's Comet 2 aircraft established a regular service along the route.

[Postfade]

Not all aircraft flew out or back from the UK to the Far East, the choppers like Belvederes of 66 Sqdn and the Whirlwinds obviously didn't, coming in packing cases by sea.
Here's a Canberra T4 about to be retired from 75 Sqdn RNZAF, which was disbanding at Tengah:
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/600x400/61_10_75_sq_canberra_t4_nsts_600px_763a4cb723397203deb3fdb86 09450b27d58ca3f.jpg
The Canberras of 75 Sqdn RNZAF ceased operations in January 1962, so this Canberra WD963 was on probably one of the last flights. WD963 joined 45 Sqdn and was also used by the other Canberra squadron at Tengah, No 81.
It was only a few months later that WD963 left the Far East and was ferried back to the UK starting 30th May ‘62 by Flt.Lt. J.Walker with M.Nav. T. Gostelow going Tengah, Dum Dum, Karachi, Tehran, Nicosia, Luqa, Orange to Lyneham. That crew picked up replacement T4 WH706 on 8th June, an aircraft that had already previously had a long spell with 45 Sqdn at Tengah. On this return flight the Canberra provided navigational assistance to a Meteor F8 ferrying to Seletar to become a target-tug.The Meteor however made it a flight that went ‘round the houses’ a bit passing through Marseilles, Pisa, Luqa, El Adem, Nicosia, Diyabikia, Tehran, Sharjah, Karachi, Jodhpur, Delhi, Calcutta, Mingaladon and Butterworth. So the ‘navigator’ did have to work pretty hard. Eventually though WD963 came back to join the PR 81 Sqdn at Tengah on 8th Feb ‘63. It lasted sometime but the crew abandoned her when both engines failed over the sea, two miles south of Tengah on 29 June 1967.

As mentioned the Meteors coming to the Towed Target Flight came with a helping Canberra where possible...good to have a proper navigator on hand.
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/600x400/62_07_meteor_tt20_wm230_lands_ntsn1_600px_8a92eabaf69969090a b353cb8983131fac8c5789.jpg
Meteor TT20 WM230 about to land on runway 20 at Changi in early August 1962. The Meteor pilot was getting some practice in just days before the Flight moved to occupy the area beside the runway and maintenance hangars, and they used the nearest white hut visible in this photo as their unit base. Originally part of the Seletar Station Flight, they had become the Towed Target Flight before their move to Changi in mid-1963 and then sometime later they were renamed 1574 Target Facilities Flight. The ML Aviation G-Type winch fitted carried a 6,000ft towing cable, operated by the rear seat crew member, who was often a co-opted ground crew member.

Regarding the Westerly route, the first I saw doing this was a Britannia on a proving flight:
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/600x400/61_09_britannia_xm497_nsts600px_9a5fcc4716d60ea16c027bd12f1e edefc17bbc17.jpg
Britannia XM497 'Schedar' seen at Changi in September 1961 on it's round the world proving flight. Sqdn Ldr Wickes of 511 Sqdn, piloting 'Special Flight 6389' and returned to Lyneham on 9th October 1961 having covered 33,000 miles in 15 days. Landing at Gibraltar, Ascension Island, Waterkloof (Pretoria), Mauritius, Cocos Island, Changi, Guam and Midway, Fairbanks (Alaska), Thule (Greenland) then back to Lyneham. It is parked here beside a visiting USAF C-124 Globemaster.
Ahh...I can still remember the 'paraffin smell' of a starting Britannia, wafting up the hill to the quarters behind where I lived with my folks!

The Royal New Zealand Air Force serviced their Air Force and Army detachments using some olde Hastings but mainly with 3 ex-commercial DC-6's. These also did runs to the UK and after initially trying the normal Transport Command route via Gan, they opted for the Westerly way through the US. This made sense as the yanks could better look after the DC-6's:
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/600x398/62_07_dc6_nz3632_gets_an_engine_change_nts_600px_1ba4981f74a d1cd140bde4b07fb25c9284a27fad.jpg
DC-6B NZ3632 from 40 Squadron Royal New Zealand Air Force suffered multiple engine problems in July '62 and is seen here requiring an engine change in the Servicing Bay at Changi. NZ3632 joined the RNZAF in May 1961 and the log book of Squadron Leader Gerrard Brown, of No. 40 Squadron during the period between 1962 and 1963 included the following details:
"On the 5th August ‘62 NZ3632 set out for the UK, the ‘Westerly Route’ via the US. Routing was Nadi in Fiji, Canton Island, Hickham AFB in Honolulu, Travis AFB near San Francisco, McGuire AFB near New York, Harmon AFB in Newfoundland and on the 12th August into the USAF transport base at Mildenhall in the UK. The return from Mildenhall starting 23rd August and went via Keflavik, Harmon, McGuire, Travis, Hickham, Canton Island and Nadi and on the 31st August back to Whenuapai. A different route to Changi started on 29th Nov ‘62 going to Melbourne, Perth, Cocos Island to Changi. Back the usual way though via Darwin and Brisbane arriving Whenuapai 6th Dec." In March 1963 Sqdn.Ldr. Brown again took NZ3632 to Mildenhall, but they tried a different routing to get across the Atlantic. On 14th Mar it left Whenuapai, routing initially as before via Nadi, Canton Island, Hickham AFB to Travis AFB, San Francisco. It then headed further south to Charleston AFB, South Carolina and next Kindley AFB, Bermuda and on 21st Mar over the Atlantic to the Portugese airfield at Lajes in the Azores and then direct to Mildenhall. On 1st April NZ3632 set off the same return route Mildenhall - Lajes, but then to McGuire AFB, New Jersey, Scott AFB, Illinois before Travis AFB, Hickham AFB, Canton Island and on 10th April finally Nadi - Whenuapai."

Many more photos from the Far East at: david taylor images | closely observed planes - Singapore early 1960's (http://www.davidtaylorimages.co.uk/-/galleries/closely-observed-planes-my-early-1960s-aircraft-/closely-observed-planes-singapore-early-1960s)

David

[brakedwell]

A lot of us have many happy memories of the Changi Slip. By 1966 the routing to Singapore went via Akrotiri - Bahrain and Gan.

[Postfade]

After Khormaksar was lost, where was did the slipping crews usually overnight and change aircraft...Akrotiri I guess? Did VC-10's managed less stops than the Brits and Comets needed?

I've mentioned the 20 Sqdn Hunters deliveries problems in 1961. The Javelins of 60 Sqdn also had fun getting to Singapore around the same time.
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/600x422/62_09_javelin_xh787_taxies_past_n2ts_600px_ad05518a88488d93e 98c940f882171b81990c078.jpg

They also flew in small groups and staged through about 15 places and took anything between 10 and 20 days to get to Tengah. Alas two were lost, one at Malta whilst refuelling and another downed in Pakistan with the loss of the pilot.
When the Confrontation got underway 60 Sqdn was sorely stretched and 64 Sqdn came to it's aid, moving 4 of it's aircraft that had been in India for Exercise Shiksha on to Tengah to join 60 Sqdn. in Nov '63.
Soon more were needed and these, like the 64 Sqdn aircraft, were FAW9R's, fitted with an outrageously long refuelling probe out front. They used both in-flight refuelling and staging posts and stopped off at El Adem , Muharraq, Tehran, Karachi, Gan and Butterworth, Getting to Tengah took eight days after leaving the UK and the flight was spread out leaving the UK over 3 separate days. After awhile more Javelins came with the move of a flight from 64 Sqdn to the Far East.
The loss of the Valiant tankers was a blow to fast-jet travel to the Far East and from late 1964 to mid '66 the Javelins had to be crated and shipped out.

By the time 74 Sqdn was tasked with getting it's Lightning F6's to Tengah in June 1967, the RAF was back up to speed with Victor tankers. 13 Lightnings went and were serviced by 17 Victor tankers and they staged through Akrotiri, Cyprus, Masirah, Oman and Gan.

The details given of the later deployment of 11 Sqdn Lightning F6's, in the excellent book 'Lightning Up' by AVM Alan White, include the fact that the deployment would require about 228 separate refuelling contacts and use about 400 Victor air and ground crew. The Lightnings flew for 9 hours at a stretch and some countries, like France wouldn't entertain refuelling in flight over them so the planned 3 hops of Muharraq, Bahrain and Gan had to change to Nice, Malta and Cyprus and Tehran before Bahrain.
The tankers flew with the Lightnings, bringing the fighters speed down to an uncomfortable Mach 0.8 and approaching Gan and again leaving it, the Lightnings flew with 'their probes in the Victors baskets'...effectively pulling continuous fuel from the tanker as they were too far to divert on internal fuel.

David
david taylor images (http://www.davidtaylorimages.co.uk) ....under 'Aviation'...lots of Singapore pics from the early '60's.

[brakedwell]

After Khormaksar was lost, where was did the slipping crews usually overnight and change aircraft...Akrotiri I guess? Did VC-10's managed less stops than the Brits and Comets needed?


Britannia crews slipped in Akrotire and Bahrain eastbound and Gan, Bahrain, Akrotiri westbound. In the late sixties we started slipping in Gan eastbound. The VC10 crews slipped in Bahrain eastbound and Gan, Akrotiri westbound. The Comets were a very rare sight on the Singapore route.

[mikemmb]

Trying to rack my brain to figure out my RAF service travels and need some help to fill in the holes!
In the spring of 1969 my “new” wife and I flew out to Akrotiri for a 3 year honeymoon! We flew in a Britannia but I cannot remember which airfield we flew from and if we had an intermediate stop. My guess would be a direct flight from Lyneham, but does anyone know what the normal route was in those days?

I remember we arrived to be greeted by Aker Bilk and his band completely legless in the bar waiting to board the return flight!

[brakedwell]

Yes, it would have been a direct flight from Lyneham. If it was returning back to Lyneham it would have most likely been what we used to call the East Med, which was a full passenger flight.

[mikemmb]

Yes, it would have been a direct flight from Lyneham. If it was returning back to Lyneham it would have most likely been what we used to call the East Med, which was a full passenger flight.

Thanks for that speedy reply, so my old brain cells were lining up in the right order!

[WHBM]

Were these Britannia flights by RAF aircraft or civilian charters ? Recall that British Eagle, up to them going under shortly before Christmas 1968, still had a large Britannia fleet, which spent a lot of their time on military work.

[brakedwell]

I was on Britannias from 1966 to 1974 and I cannot remember seeing any Civil Brits operating trooping flights out of Lyneham and Brize Norton.

[Peter47]

I seem to remember around 1966 (but as a young child can't remember the exat date) that returning back from Aden we stopped off at Luqa, Malta in a Brittania on our way to Lyneham. I suspect that a Britannia wouldn't have had the range to fly non stop.

[deltahotel]

In Jul 57 my Dad set off to join his Canberra squadron in Edinburgh as part of OpGrapple. Comet Lyneham - El Adem - Bahrain - Katunayake - Changi and then Hastings Changi - Labuan - Darwin - Edinburgh. 5 days, 30 hrs flying. On the way back he was in his Canberra so that doesn’t count!

[dduxbury310]

Just a small point, but in the 4th and last post of 14th September 2018, the RNZAF DC-6 pictured was just that, and definitely not an example of the stretched DC-6B. It is sometimes possible to confirm the true identity of the much earlier DC-6 models with the original short fuselages by counting the passenger windows in the forward fuselage, plus other small clues. The original series of DC-6s, introduced into passenger service as the first mass-produced pressurised airliner in 1946, were fitted out with P&W R-2800 CA-15 series engines (with reversing propellers) although the original Curtiss electric props had been replaced by HS Hydromatics by the time this photograph was taken. The early DC-6s such as this one, suffered from quite a few technical issues from 1946 onwards (specifically electrical and fuel systems), which resulted in some spectacular accidents, but were corrected in later models, particularly after the famous (and longer) DC-6B came into service about 1952. There was also the specialised DC-6A freight model which pioneered the same longer fuselage as used by the later DC-6B. Amazingly, the surviving three RNZAF aircraft survived, under civil registrations for many years after they were sold "out of service", and retained their original mark of engine, unlike most of their brethren which received later versions of the P&W engines, and with flashier cowlings to boot. The trio of DC-6s which were taken over from the RNZAF by TEAL in 1961 (the fourth was destroyed in a fatal accident in California in 1953) were originally built for SAS in 1948/49, but were not required so were passed on to the fairly short-lived BCPA (British Commonwealth Pacific Airlines), and served with that airline until it was disestablished and split up between the three partners (British, Australian, and NZ governments), the latter taking over the three aircraft as their part of the settlement, employing them on cross-Tasman as well as other services in the South Pacific.

Painfully aware of and therefore keen to head off any questions regarding my statements about "first mass-produced pressurised airliner" above, I have to admit there were earlier contenders, prototypes and projects, with the Boeing Stratoliner being probably the first such, but only 12 were built, and their cruising altitude was nothing spectacular. The Curtiss CW-20 prototype of 1940/41 was intended to be pressurised for passenger services, but instead went into production for the military in 1942 as the C-46 Commando, and no pressurisation. Likewise, the prototype DC-4 (put into production as C-54 Skymaster for the US Army in 1942) had also been intended for pressurisation. I think there were other such projects underway in the UK, Germany, etc. along these lines, also thwarted by outbreak of the war.