View Full Version : On carrying animals
Okihara
6th Sep 2018, 09:36
A few thoughts regarding CAR 256A:
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/500x240/screen_shot_2018_09_06_at_19_19_48_4960d4e2fabf597d991ab16fa 15106ec1d6c385f.png
1. Where else is it not?
2. Without this provision, you would have been allowed to carry people in cages.
3. (this one is serious): In a single engine aircraft, would you be allowed to place the container carrying your dog on a control seat (similarly to cargo)?
According to:(5) A container in which an animal is kept must not be in the passenger cabin of an aircraft.
I'd say not.But what is the "passenger cabin" of a Warrior? I would still understand that it is fine to have the container on a control seat but not on the rear seats.
Or does Rex have to travel in the baggage compartment?
Carriage of animals (1) Subject to subregulation (8), the operator of an aircraft may permit a live animal to be in the aircraft only if:
(a) the animal is in a container and is carried in accordance with this regulation; or
(b) the animal is carried with the written permission of CASA and in accordance with any conditions specified in the permission
I have a permit from CASA to carry my Kelpie in the Auster. She travels on the back seat sitting on absorbent bedding over canvas and secured to seat belt with a full harness. Her lead is hitched to the airframe as added insurance against her getting free or moving about in turbulence.
Kaz
Sunfish
6th Sep 2018, 09:55
does your kelpie have an asic and is she a better pilot than you?
Okihara
6th Sep 2018, 10:00
Carriage of animals (1) Subject to subregulation (8), the operator of an aircraft may permit a live animal to be in the aircraft only if:
(a) the animal is in a container and is carried in accordance with this regulation; or
(b) the animal is carried with the written permission of CASA and in accordance with any conditions specified in the permission
I have a permit from CASA to carry my Kelpie in the Auster. She travels on the back seat sitting on absorbent bedding over canvas and secured to seat belt with a full harness. Her lead is hitched to the airframe as added insurance against her getting free or moving about in turbulence.
Kaz
Aussie Kelpies are awesome!
You're in the (b) case which required you to ask CASA for a written permission. But if you were to go the (a) way, ie. without asking CASA?
Duck Pilot
6th Sep 2018, 10:09
What about comfort pigs???
I know the new Patt 91 reg in relation to the carriage of animals has generated a lot of debate from the upper end of town, not sure what the final reg will look like.
The verbiage in the CAR wasn’t written by anyone in CASA, someone else down the road wrote it.
Mach E Avelli
6th Sep 2018, 10:20
No self respecting kelpie will adversely affect its mode of transport. Kelpies LOVE travel by any motorised means. Mine will sit on the motorbike all day, or sail with me for a week, and she never gets in the way.
So CAR 256A (8) covers it - bugger asking CASA if it is only the dog and owner/pilot on board. Can you see the average cocky doing a stock or windmill inspection in his Drifter with his dog asking for written permission?. CASA would probably insist that the dog wear a hi vis vest, a hard hat and steel capped paw covers.
Forgiveness is often easier to seek than permission.
My only concern carrying well trained dogs in light sircraft would be the noise which could be a bit much for their sensitive hearing.
Sunfish
6th Sep 2018, 10:33
i remember Reg Ansetts labrador in the jet Ranger!
nonsense
6th Sep 2018, 12:55
does your kelpie have an asic and is she a better pilot than you?
She's a kelpie, not a border collie!
Tankengine
7th Sep 2018, 04:35
Golden retrievers do NOT like barrel rolls! ;)
mostlytossas
7th Sep 2018, 06:37
I know an aircraft owner of a twin that regularly takes his Blue Heeler flying with him. Sits up in the co pilots seat quite happily. Only barks when the engine is cranking over?
Once running happy to take in the scenery.
mostlytossas (https://www.pprune.org/members/201300-mostlytossas) …
If it was my Bluey she'd be wanting to get out to bite the tyres. Fifth one I've had and they've ALL done that. :p
Ascend Charlie
7th Sep 2018, 07:09
My boss even had a ramp built so his arthritic dog could walk up into the cabin. It had an absorbent mat to sit on, but still managed to get his bodily fluids around it into the carpets. Pull them out, wash and dry them, put them back for the next time. Luckily the dog pined for the fjords and became an ex-dog.
does your kelpie have an asic and is she a better pilot than you?
No ASIC but for many years her predecessor had her own AAAA membership card. She is a back-seat flyer so offers advice but doesn’t get to manipulate the controls.
I have a pair of Mutt Muffs for her but she manages to remove them so I am experimenting with other ways to protect her hearing.
The permit was a one-off thing that cost me $150 and worth it to avoid hassles from officious individuals complaining about a dog airside.
kaz
Bankstown Boy
8th Sep 2018, 03:01
She's a kelpie, not a border collie!
Had a Border Collie who just loved flying, one of his favourite things. Absolutely, positively refused to countenance ear protectors or any such stuff that could interfere with (in his opinion) his magnificent fur coat. He was prepared to wear a spare hi-vis vest when required (Hi Gold Coast and Kalgoorlie airports). He spend the better part of 10 years in and out of aircraft and he could still hear a bunny rabbit coming out of the briar patch from over 150 feet away that was hidden from sight.
That dog could recognise certain airports from a 1000 feet on finals and tended to be little unimpressed if the destination was not to his liking. Rural locales and beaches were on the approved list whilst large cities were generally unwelcome in his world.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/512x384/img_0032_1__c294f02f15d33671ecf3526a6ac28f605ed81782.jpg
Obviously on the ground here, so no need to keep him locked in the cage.
Good times!
cirrus32
8th Sep 2018, 08:28
No ASIC but for many years her predecessor had her own AAAA membership card. She is a back-seat flyer so offers advice but doesn’t get to manipulate the controls.
I have a pair of Mutt Muffs for her but she manages to remove them so I am experimenting with other ways to protect her hearing.
The permit was a one-off thing that cost me $150 and worth it to avoid hassles from officious individuals complaining about a dog airside.
kaz
Hmm...The permit for my dog cost $160 and is only valid for 12 months.... The dog is not going to shrink and the 172 isn't going to get bigger, so I guess it's just another revenue raising exercise.
witwiw
8th Sep 2018, 09:31
Reminds me of the time, some 40 odd years ago, that a C180 operator wanted to take a pony to King Island (where he lived) for his daughter. Got the pony in backwards with its head adjacent to the pilot but the animal was arcing up a bit so he opened the window and let the animal stick its head out.
Took off on Rwy 35 so from where I stood I couldn't see if the window was still open/horses head outside but it certainly was as the aircraft taxied past the tower to the amusement of many. And that was in the day when DCA had a presence at MB.
Okihara
8th Sep 2018, 22:16
Took off on Rwy 35 so from where I stood I couldn't see if the window was still open/horses head outside but it certainly was as the aircraft taxied past the tower to the amusement of many. And that was in the day when DCA had a presence at MB.
Priceless, multi-crew operation.
To those who obtained a permit from CASA, what are specifically the conditions set therein? One mentioned
She travels on the back seat sitting on absorbent bedding over canvas and secured to seat belt with a full harness. Her lead is hitched to the airframe as added insurance against her getting free or moving about in turbulence.
Are they all similar in spirit?
It seems that back when CASA wasn't being CASA, one could carry dinosaurs onboard quite carefree.
cirrus32
9th Sep 2018, 09:23
Yes, my permit is for the dog sitting on an absorbant pad plus a harness connected through the rear seat belt. He enjoys flying, just disappointed he can't stick his head out the window.
Okihara
10th Sep 2018, 02:50
Thanks for all the replies. I like it that the law does not discriminate on animals themselves. I'm worried that my wallaby won't get to see much of the Melbourne city orbit though.
Ixixly
10th Sep 2018, 03:04
Thanks for all the replies. I like it that the law does not discriminate on animals themselves. I'm worried that my wallaby won't get to see much of the Melbourne city orbit though.
Gosh, your wallaby must be hopping mad about that one! :D
Okihara
10th Sep 2018, 07:35
Gosh, your wallaby must be hopping mad about that one! :D
I'll post pictures :)
Ascend Charlie
10th Sep 2018, 18:50
I suppose the wallaby only likes the short hops?
Dan_Brown
12th Sep 2018, 09:07
Lot of animals being carried by the Low Cost Carriers in Europe these days. Not all that well behaved from all accounts.
Duck Pilot
12th Sep 2018, 09:29
There has and still are lots of aeroplanes flying around the world right now with a few wallabies plastered on the outside, with the biggest wallaby on both sides of the vertical fin.
It’s amazing, wallabies are both red - the babies and then they turn white when they get bigger when they learn to jump onto the vertical fin and somehow get stuck up there.