Edinburgh Airport (Biz and G/A)

[helipixman]

What on earth is going on at the Edinburgh Airport ?

An airport that used to have three runways... now down to just one. A runway was recently closed and after a fence was put across it, and is now an overspill for customer parking. This is meant to be the Airport serving the capital city of Scotland and I would like to think attract business.

Now to my main point all Business aircraft are required to re-position away from Edinburgh as overnight parking is not allowed. Most are going to Glasgow (lucky them with this extra revenue). Why would anyone want to come to Edinburgh where it seems businessmen with their own aircraft do not seem that welcome. Most of them can probably afford the extra expense of the re-positioning etc but what is Edinburgh Airport up to ? There is not a dedicated G/A area so obviously trying to drive Businessmen and G/A traffic away

Helipixman.

[Cazalet33]

It's not a runway with a shopping centre.

It's a shopping centre with a runway.

[helipixman]

Oh forgot to mention about the plans for a Business park and housing etc between the terminals and Gogar roundabout ! Give the new home owners a couple of months after moving in and I guess they will be complaining about aircraft noise. Its not that great a shopping centre either last time I flew out of there I could'nt get a seat at the only restaurant unless I wanted some raw fish at another bar.

Helipixman

[Musket90]

Perhaps there's more revenue from commercial passengers spending in the shops and car parking. Sounds like they have run out of overnight parking space for anything other than based commercial airlines. Not unusual for fast growing airports.

[helipixman]

Agree its all about revenue from airline traffic, they drove out flying schools many years ago, now its the turn of GA. As to its rapid growth they regularly have problems with gate allocations in the mornings. With so many long haul flights arriving... 3 x United 1 x American, 1 x Delta, 1x Air Canada Rouge, 1 x Qatar (some mornings), 1 x Etihad and soon to be 1 x Emirates aircraft have in the past had to wait for an available gate. Who wants to travel for hours on long haul and then have to wait for a gate ? There are only so many at Edinburgh able to handle jets of the larger type. Its the ramp area that also needs expansion to cope.

Helipixman

[Romaro]

I would hope the FBO up there (Signature) is lobbying like crazy for a resolution, likewise with the BBGA, BACA, EBAA and other representatie bodies to directly communicate with EDI authorities and assess future resolutions/options for GA/Business Aviation. Suspect that probably isn't happening.

[jimjim1]

Well, air passenger traffic wise at the airport anyway.


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/769x450/gla_vs_edin_18e5d190e417236a3ddfb644b2569164b0de08aa.png

Here are some figures. sorry pprune doesn't allow decent formatting with reasonable effort, but if you paste it into word it might look OK. [Now fixed above with chart, it was NOT a REASONABLE amount of effort].

If memory serves me correctly Edin was even further behind earlier.

Thousands of passengers per year.
Year 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015
Edinburgh 8,449 8,607 9,037 8,992 9,043 8,594 9,384 9,194 9,775 10,159 11,113
Glasgow 8,775 8,820 8,726 8,135 7,213 6,522 6,858 7,150 7,358 7,709 8,710

Or get it from the horses mouth.

https://www.transport.gov.scot/publication/scottish-transport-statistics-no-35-2016-edition/sct01171871341-11/
About 6 screens down.

Also [1]
2017 Edin 13,432,485
Glw 9,902,239

I guess they don't have room for GA and that millions of Costa or Klosters bound Edinburgherers are more profitable.

It's very annoying if you live further west and try to get a Furrin holiday grrrrrrrr!

[1] http://www.thenational.scot/news/15823234.Edinburgh_and_Glasgow_airports_report_record_passen ger_numbers/

[jimjim1]

More fun with Excel, getting v rusty.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gmforum.com-vbulletin/708x303/edin_vs_glw2_87cdb582bfb6231b2332ed9783dbf06a9df22fa8.png

Year Edin Pass. Glw Pass.

1985 1,578,000

1986 1,651,000

1987 1,852,000

1988 2,080,000

1989 2,369,000

1990 2,495,000

1991 2,343,000

1992 2,539,000

1993 2,721,000

1994 3,001,000

1995 3,280,000

1996 3,810,000

1997 4,214,919 6,117,006

1998 4,588,507 6,566,927

1999 5,119,258 6,813,955

2000 5,519,372 6,965,500

2001 6,067,333 7,292,327

2002 6,930,649 7,803,627

2003 7,481,454 8,129,713

2004 8,017,547 8,575,039

2005 8,456,739 8,792,915

2006 8,611,345 8,848,755

2007 9,047,558 8,795,653

2008 9,006,702 8,178,891

2009 9,049,355 7,225,021

2010 8,596,715 6,548,865

2011 9,385,245 6,880,217

2012 9,195,061 7,157,859

2013 9,775,443 7,363,764

2014 10,160,004 7,715,988

2015 11,114,587 8,714,307

2016 12,348,425 9,327,193

2017 13,410,256 9,902,239

From -
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edinburgh_Airport#Passenger_Numbers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glasgow_Airport#Annual_traffic_data

[smallfry]

Having been there last week, Its a mess for BizJets. The security was a fiasco and the jobsworths unbelievable.

[Empty Cruise]

The runway that was 'recently' closed (had been closed by NOTAM for quite some time) was not a parallel runway and would not have increased capacity had it been re-instated. In fact, had it not been partially used for aircraft parking, the overnight issue would have reared its head sooner.

The person owning their own bizjet aircraft will likely not be bothered too much by having the crew do 2x 25min positioning - again, if you have to ask how much they cost to run, you can't afford it in the first place!

For us - sure, a nuisance, but nothing worse than at so many other airports around the world...

[His dudeness]

The runway that was 'recently' closed (had been closed by NOTAM for quite some time) was not a parallel runway and would not have increased capacity had it been re-instated. In fact, had it not been partially used for aircraft parking, the overnight issue would have reared its head sooner.

The person owning their own bizjet aircraft will likely not be bothered too much by having the crew do 2x 25min positioning - again, if you have to ask how much they cost to run, you can't afford it in the first place!

For us - sure, a nuisance, but nothing worse than at so many other airports around the world...

Well, my employers are thinkers and of the calculating sort. Make it unattractive enough and they will stop owning a bizjet.

This always seems to follow the same rules, first its one or two airports and all of a sudden its quite a lot of em employing "measures"... thinking back to the introduction of airport slots, A-CDM, Eurocontrol flow control measures etcetc.

[HyFlyer]

........., if you have to ask how much they cost to run, you can't afford it in the first place!

I hear this regularly, It's idiotic. heck it's as dumb as saying an aircraft at FL410 can afford to plunge 20,000ft as it still won't hit the ground. It shows no understanding at all about what business is about.

Running aircraft about empty is a waste of resources and as the public perceives it a huge negative of this industry, so calling for move of it is super dumb.

Ga/Biz Av need fair and reasonable access to all airports...it's as simple as that.







.

[air pig]

The runway that was 'recently' closed (had been closed by NOTAM for quite some time) was not a parallel runway and would not have increased capacity had it been re-instated. In fact, had it not been partially used for aircraft parking, the overnight issue would have reared its head sooner.

The person owning their own bizjet aircraft will likely not be bothered too much by having the crew do 2x 25min positioning - again, if you have to ask how much they cost to run, you can't afford it in the first place!

For us - sure, a nuisance, but nothing worse than at so many other airports around the world...

Just wait until it's an air ambulance doing a repatriation with a critical care patient and a crew pushing their duty day to get the patient home and they come out with you can't park here overnight. That's going to go down well in the press.

[733driver]

The runway that was 'recently' closed (had been closed by NOTAM for quite some time) was not a parallel runway and would not have increased capacity had it been re-instated. In fact, had it not been partially used for aircraft parking, the overnight issue would have reared its head sooner.

The person owning their own bizjet aircraft will likely not be bothered too much by having the crew do 2x 25min positioning - again, if you have to ask how much they cost to run, you can't afford it in the first place!

For us - sure, a nuisance, but nothing worse than at so many other airports around the world...

What an unfortunate and totally untrue statement. The additional cost of having to ferry an aircraft out and back in just for parking is very significant, adds no value and rich people are generally very cost/value conscious. Yes, they will spend huge amounts but only if they get something valuable in return. And what about the environmental impact of burning all that fuel totally unnecessarily? Yes, private aviation is wasteful to begin with but let's not accept it being forced to be made even more wasteful. Yes, there are some other airports which are as bad but that should never be a reason to accept these things a normal. They are not and should not be.

To think that rich people don't inquire about the cost of anything or if they do then it means they aren't really rich is ridiculous.

On a somewhat related not, I also am shocked at the treatment private aviation customers receive from security staff at an increasing number of UK airports. Idiotic rules, enforced to the letter, often in a less than friendly fashion and not a bit of common sense applied.

[moonym20]

I've had two lead pax over recent years vow never to return through EDI specifically down to the ridiculous security checks they have to go through.

On one occasion, when arriving at the FBO their bags were taken immediately to be screened as hold bags - even given baggage tags. When one pax needed an item from their bag prior to going airside this crated a huge drama with security because the bags were now 'quarantined'. This same occasion the lead pax had their (expensive) lighter confiscated before being allowed to pass through to airside. The FBO were obliged to provide boarding passes for each pax, which had to be checked by security... (do they still do this??).

The other lead pax in question refused to come through EDI again because of the same farcical procedure to gain access to their own aircraft. All this takes place in the dedicated GA area of the airport - so it is not like you are mixing with any airline traffic.

Both visits took place a few years ago now, I found it farcical they way the show is run there. I sympathise with Signature for having to put up with such BS from security while also getting it in the neck from very disgruntled pax.

When we passed through as crew the very surly security 'official' pointed to a security camera in the corner and said that was directly linked to the DFT and everyone was being 'watched' hence the strict implementation of security :rolleyes:

round and round we go....... :ugh: