Captain’s expectations of a new FO.

[CloudMedic]

It would be great to hear from training/line captains and what your expectations of a brand new FO with zero hours would be. What subjects would you quiz them on? Also great to hear from FOs and their experiences of being challenged on different subjects. Thanks!

[Four Turbo]

Easy. I expect him/her to listen to me - even if I am an old dodderer. I have learnt a lot in fifty years and the broad yellow streak up my back has served me well!

[GlenQuagmire]

pretty much nothing. I get them to fly the first 10 - 20 sectors and get used to the environment. Nobody flies well when they are being grilled for a load of pointless questions that the other bloke already knows the answer to. Everyone knows how to fly - they have a licence - so I let them do the bit they already know how to do. All the other crap can come later..

[GlenQuagmire]

and I don't particularly quiz them on anything. We just work through anything that comes up. After a while, most things do!

[dmcna]

Predictability

[Superpilot]

Not a trainer.

It takes time for conceptual knowledge to build up in such a way that you are capable of digesting what is written in the manuals. Without a year or two of experience most things you read in the manuals mean nothing. Heck, even those with 10 years of commercial flying experience are sometimes none the wiser about some topics because the rules change so quickly!

[Skyjob]

SOP's a re a foundation on which can be built.
Initially experience is gained following SOP's to the letter, this is what initially is taught in line training and acts as the best foundation for flying when released from training.
It then takes years of experience, learning from different highly experienced motivated captains to learn good airmanship and variations to SOP if required in the interest of safety.
SOP's cover 99.99% scenarios, some however fall outside them, these are learnt by flying and being presented with them the flight line.
There is not always a right and wrong in things either, but only one method is taught initially, to keep you and your colleagues and passengers safe.

[tubby linton]

Prepare for each flight carefully Read the briefs for each airfield and all of its alternates,. Look at the route. The teaching of geography seems to have declined in the last two decades, so learn where the high ground is and also a bit about the political background of where you are flying over, and why the most obvious alternate may be completetely unusable.
The CIA Factbook is an excellent resource.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/

[FlightDetent]

Do not come with a calculator to add fuel figures on the OFP.

Brief one’s self beforehand for the airport we would go to.

Know how to handle EFB on the iPad efficiently.

Aspire, show commitment and eagerness.

[EDDT]

Do not forget OM-C.
Contingency Procedures especially. They differ in some countries.

[donpizmeov]

Know how to say the following:
1. That was a great landing captain;
2. Can I buy you a beer captain?;
3. I will take the ugly one captain.

It is a shame you will miss out on the fun real flying can give .But it seems direct to the RHS of a mini jet is the way things are done these days .
​​​​​​.Learn as much about the aircraft you are flying as you can. When you fly with a good captain learn from them . The way they do something, the way they think, ask them questions on how they made the decision they made, observe the way they talk/communicate with crew and company, the way they lead. When you fly with the not so good captain (and you will), use the phrase "OIC" when they try and teach you garbage, and think back to what the good captain taught you .
Try and refrain from starting an instagram persona being a gym/monk/ginger etc pilot . Do the job because you enjoy it, not to try and make people think you are less insecure than what we probably are . Have real friends not followers .
Be truthful when you don't know something . No-one knows everything, if asked something you don't know, admit it and ask questions to learn . Be truthful to yourself when you have a bad day at work: thump the landing in, give whip lash to crew and pax when using the brakes, make a cluster of a PA or radio call. Reflect on it trying to improve .
Don't become a FMC junky .be able to work out your own descent profile rather using speed brakes to keep the vert deviation at 0 . Know how much fuel your aeroplane burns in the cruise and in the hold and use the FMC to back up your calculations. Know how much fuel your flight plan will have you landing with. By this I mean in Kilos or pounds, rather than saying I have 20 min extra. By knowing this you can pick a fuel problem earlier, and before you get the EICAS or ECAM .and make a better decision on how much fuel will be required.
But most all, try your best, and enjoy your flying .

[JPJP]

It would be great to hear from training/line captains and what your expectations of a brand new FO with zero hours would be. What subjects would you quiz them on? Also great to hear from FOs and their experiences of being challenged on different subjects. Thanks!

Expectations ? Don’t use a website on the internet to figure out what’s expected of you ;)

[Capn Bloggs]

Don’t use a website on the internet to figure out what’s expected of you https://www.pprune.org/images/smilies/wink2.gif
As amply demonstrated by the excellent answers above, Cloudmedic has done himself a big favour asking his question here.

[Martin_123]

in my company they give you a training record which lists all the topics you should know and will be quizzed about during your line training. There is a supplement there that lists all the relevant chapters in OM-A/B/C/D that one can cover to prepare. Basically in order to be released for line check you have to have all topics marked with sufficient grades from your line training captains. Generally the way it works is - you take off, establish a cruise and if the workload is low, the cpt simply asks which topics have you prepared and are ready to discuss. So basically you prepare at your own pace

But the theory questions really don't begin until you are some 10 sectors in and somewhat comfortable with whats going on. Until then really don't fall behind the plane really and don't plant it into the ground

[Enoughofthis]

I wish 411A was still around to add his thoughts on this topic:eek:

[Deano777]

You can't expect anyone to show up early for report let alone new first officers, nobody has a right to dictate this to any member of the crew. All I would expect is a good knowledge of SOPs and be open to a little bit of advice. The only person responsible for one's training and development is the first officer himself. Everything else will grow with experience.

[Tee Emm]

Don't turn up smelling of beer and boasting that you were on the turps the night before. Then repeat the same boast a few days later. These cool dudes are in every airline and need an instant put down by the captain. They are potential alcoholics and a potential danger in the future unless stopped in their tracks early in their employment

[beamer]

I used to tell brand new First Officers/Second Officers - 'if in doubt, ask....and never under-estimate my ability to make mistakes..' !

[Sallytraffic]

All about the attitude for me, some stink, some are great. Can be flying with a day 1 cadet and have an easier day than a guy with a few thousand hours all dependant on the attitude.
The ability to speak and understand English also helps however is sadly becoming more and more of an issue as the barrel is well and truly scraped.

[wiggy]

Turn up on time for the brief with the mobile stowed and on silent..
Know the SOPSs.
Don't assume that Flight School/ATO has taught you everything you'll ever need to know about flying ....it's just the beginning etc, etc..
The fact that the the old git or gitess in the LHS went through Flying college or the Milittary in the days of chalk and talk, analogue instruments...and worse still knows nothing about "Love Island" does not mean they are clueless.
And despite the above caveats....do speak up if you think something going wrong or you see something going on you don't understand.
To my mind it is simply a question of balance and mutual respect.

[parabellum]

One of the most important things to try and remember about the Ops Manual, A,B,C or D, is that it is not necessary to commit large sections to memory, only to know, with a degree of certainty, where to find the answers to questions that may arise. Notwithstanding that you are expected to have a sound knowledge of the emergency checklists that require immediate actions, the 'boxed items' as some operators name them.

[LHRPony]

Don’t be arrogant, don’t allow yourself to become lazy.
Everyday try to do something better than yesterday.
Accept and embrace you don’t know it all and never will.
when you get 1000 hrs read this again, when you get your third stripe read this again.
Remember you can have a great day out AND do it the right way.
When you have a tough day, look at the sun rise/set, the beautiful views. The fact you get to play with such a machine and forget about company politics and remember why you put so much effort into becoming a pilot in the first place.

[Martin_123]

.. with the mobile stowed and on silent..

my phone is on and loud for a very simple reason - captains phone can sometimes go out of reception when the Ops are calling with important info. Happens once every week or so.

[richardthethird]

Don hit the nail on the head - why on Earth do the newbies feel the need to start an Instagram feed. You are not the first, and not the last. We all had to train like you did. You enjoy your job - great. Don’t rub your friend’s nose in it, they might not be so lucky. You do not want your mates and colleagues to think you are a bell end. They will be talking about you, for all the wrong reasons!

[richardthethird]

Valid point.... all seats, take note! Step away from the smart phone / instagram!

[Globally Challenged]

Don hit the nail on the head - why on Earth do the newbies feel the need to start an Instagram feed. You are not the first, and not the last. We all had to train like you did. You enjoy your job - great. Don’t rub your friend’s nose in it, they might not be so lucky. You do not want your mates and colleagues to think you are a bell end. They will be talking about you, for all the wrong reasons!

Superb post.

[VinRouge]

Don hit the nail on the head - why on Earth do the newbies feel the need to start an Instagram feed. You are not the first, and not the last. We all had to train like you did. You enjoy your job - great. Don’t rub your friend’s nose in it, they might not be so lucky. You do not want your mates and colleagues to think you are a bell end. They will be talking about you, for all the wrong reasons!

Should have worked harder at school.

[BluSdUp]

Not a trainer, so two questions:
1. Is the airport open?
2. Do they have gas?

[Mach E Avelli]

Don’t confuse good CRM with a p!ssing contest. One of the most irritating F/Os I flew with was so keen to impress me with how far ahead of the aeroplane he was, he would flip over the takeoff card and enter all the landing data before we passed 10000 feet in the climb on a three hour sector. He would be into that FMS to enter a visual circuit before he even knew what approach I intended. During taxy in he would set up the cockpit for the next crew or even the next morning after an overnight. Too bad if the schedule changed!

The old sailing ship masters had it easy. No one else could navigate, so the crew had to toe the line. There was little insubordination or challenging of decisions if the reward was the cat o’ nine tails. Very little mutiny, considering how harsh it was then. Probably because this usually resulted in being keel hauled or strung up from the yardarm.
If only CRM could somehow embrace this ethos....

[Dan Winterland]

Know your SOP's

I see plenty of new FOs who have learned the SOPs parrot fashion without fully understanding the reason for them. Personally, I would prefer more fundamental skills such as being able to land the aircraft.

[akindofmagic]

Oh, and show up minimum 20 mins before report having pre-read the stuff for the day.

I assume that you take this extra 20 minutes into account for the purpose of FTL calculations in that case?

If the allotted time for checking the flight plans, briefing etc. is insufficient then we take our time, leave late and that's the company's problem. I don't expect the FOs to be there until they're rostered to be there.

[Chesty Morgan]

Why would you be stressed about being late if you’re on time?

[Chesty Morgan]

Well that’s a very specific case of poor crew transport/parking whereby you need to plan on a 20 minute delay. Different to regularly and intentionally turning up 20 minutes early which is completely unnecessary and may quite often impinge on minimum rest. It ain’t clever or particularly professional.

I do understand your need to label turning up on time as militant but it quite simply isn’t.

I bet you’re one of those people who also turns up early for a delayed report...

[rock-the-boat]

I think that all the captain or the instructor is looking for, is a guy that, in spite of having concluded a purchase transaction with an ATO, a transaction not dissimilar from buying a burger from McDonalds, who is still able to get excited about the toy included in the happy meal and does not think it is his inalienable right to receive one

[PPRuNeUser0178]

Turning up habitually early is a no no. When I walk into a crew room and find my FO at the briefing table with all 4 OFPS printed out and sections of the NOTAMS/WX all highlighted for
me at report time I now know that the FO
is not compliant with the FTL scheme in a company where pilot fatigue is a major issue. Unfortunately said FO’s think this is how to get along in said airline due to the culture. No. Try to think for yourself. If there isn’t enough time provided we take the time required and to hell with the schedule. Turning up early covers over the problems.

[Chesty Morgan]

In this career and my previous career I personally considered it professional to be sharp and be prepared.
Which is achievable even if you turn up on time.

No I wouldn't compromise appropriate rest for the sake of being prompt, the two aren't mutually exclusive.
So you don’t turn up early if you’re on minimum rest?

[zero/zero]

Slowly getting the impression that Chesty Morgan is the argumentative type who’s always right... must be a delight to fly with 🙄

[Chesty Morgan]

I’ve never worked out how writing something on a forum equates to how well you do a job.

Nor or do I understand how asking a question equates to always being right.

[PENKO]

Lot's of inflated opinion here.
Get used to it, my dear young FO! This is how it will be for the coming 4000 hours:
Captain A wants X, captain B says he's all about Y but does Z, captain C let's you do your thing, captain D will give you a bullocking for doing X and so on.

In the mean time you learn every day.

[GlenQuagmire]

To the OP..

You have pushed the button on every ego maniac on prune. Brilliant..just brilliant!

like a ninja, one post and he’s gone

keep at it fella.

[flash8]

like a ninja, one post and he’s gone
You mean one post before resuming his/her normal PPruNe identity :)

[4runner]

You can't expect anyone to show up early for report let alone new first officers, nobody has a right to dictate this to any member of the crew. All I would expect is a good knowledge of SOPs and be open to a little bit of advice. The only person responsible for one's training and development is the first officer himself. Everything else will grow with experience.

rights? Dictate? The Captain can dictate whatever he or she wants. It’s the FO’s job to follow instructions, especially under training. It’s not a democracy. If someone shows up more worries about their rights and being dictated to, perhaps they should join A volleyball team.

[4runner]

Don’t be arrogant, don’t allow yourself to become lazy.
Everyday try to do something better than yesterday.
Accept and embrace you don’t know it all and never will.
when you get 1000 hrs read this again, when you get your third stripe read this again.
Remember you can have a great day out AND do it the right way.
When you have a tough day, look at the sun rise/set, the beautiful views. The fact you get to play with such a machine and forget about company politics and remember why you put so much effort into becoming a pilot in the first place.

well put Skipper.

[Deano777]

4runner, sorry but no, the captain cannot dictate to anyone or any member of his crew to turn up early for report, he/she isn't their "captain" until they report for duty. If I was a first officer and a captain told me to turn up early for report I'd tell them where to go, luckily I don't have that issue anymore. I grow rather tired of hearing SSCMs telling their colleagues to "turn up early". You sound like the type of captain every first officer dreads seeing on their roster. Good for you.

[zero/zero]

4runner, sorry but no, the captain cannot dictate to anyone or any member of his crew to turn up early for report, he/she isn't their "captain" until they report for duty. If I was a first officer and a captain told me to turn up early for report I'd tell them where to go, luckily I don't have that issue anymore. I grow rather tired of hearing SSCMs telling their colleagues to "turn up early". You sound like the type of captain every first officer dreads seeing on their roster. Good for you.

Seconded. I must have been asleep at the bit during CRM training where they tell you it isn’t a democracy and to go and join a volleyball team if you don’t like it

[Fly26]

Not to say ‘sorry I got lost trying to find the crewroom’

[dirk85]

I had this one Captain miffed at me for not showing up 15 min earlier to print the flight package. He didn't even say hello. I was still at least 5 min earlier than check in, mind you, and was as usual on minimum rest.
He didn't have time to finish his sentence that I was out, to get a coffee, just to return 7 seconds before official check-in time.
It was not the most entertaining duty of my career but hey, if that's how some people want to play it, be my guest.

[Vessbot]

4runner, sorry but no, the captain cannot dictate to anyone or any member of his crew to turn up early for report, he/she isn't their "captain" until they report for duty.

True; and, moreover, even after report it's still severely incorrect that the captain can dictate whatever he wants. I'm puzzled that anyone would say that.

[Jwscud]

Not to say ‘sorry I got lost trying to find the crewroom’

All too common when working out of base with Ryanair. Trying to take the third turn past the secret chalk mark then being stopped by security because the code for the door in the brief was three months out of date was par for the course.

[White Knight]

Don't use coloured highlighters on the OFP or Notam package!!! Other than that be willing to engage, discuss and learn:ok:

[4engines4longhaul]

Don't use coloured highlighters on the OFP or Notam package!!! Other than that be willing to engage, discuss and learn:ok:
love that comment White Knight

[Fly26]

Yes jwscud your quite right! In Shannon when out of base on early’s I always had to turn up 20mins earlier than normal at one of the departure gates to exit airside to the crewroom as I never quite knew when the security guard would do his/her rounds to let me out.....always left standing pressed up against the glass waiting like an exhibit in the zoo!





All too common when working out of base with Ryanair. Trying to take the third turn past the secret chalk mark then being stopped by security because the code for the door in the brief was three months out of date was par for the course.

[TPE Flyer]

You know how as an F/O you hate being told how to operate the aircraft by the Captain all the time.
Well Captains hate the same thing.
So instead of instead of trying to prove how good you are by quoting chapter and verse to the Captain, how about ask why he uses the technique he uses sometimes.
You will learn one of 2 things.
​​​​​​​Either an alternative way of operating the aircraft, Or a way NEVER to operate the aircraft.

[Vessbot]

You know how as an F/O you hate being told how to operate the aircraft by the Captain all the time.
Well Captains hate the same thing.
So instead of instead of trying to prove how good you are by quoting chapter and verse to the Captain, how about ask why he uses the technique he uses sometimes.
You will learn one of 2 things.
Either an alternative way of operating the aircraft, Or a way NEVER to operate the aircraft.

Disagree, if the Captain is doing something against a chapter and verse (which sounds like a matter of procedure, and not technique), he needs to cut it out. It is the FO's job to point out the error and put a stop to it. Additionally, the Captain should stop justifying his behavior by attributing the conflict to the FO's motivations (trying to look good) and take responsibility for himself.

[TPE Flyer]

Disagree, if the Captain is doing something against a chapter and verse (which sounds like a matter of procedure, and not technique), he needs to cut it out. It is the FO's job to point out the error and put a stop to it. Additionally, the Captain should stop justifying his behavior by attributing the conflict to the FO's motivations (trying to look good) and take responsibility for himself.

Ever heard the phrase, "1more than 1 way to skin a cat"? There are plenty of ways to operate the aircraft within the framework of a companies Policies and SOP's.
As an F/O, not surprisingly you have clearly missed the point. The "technique" you were taught by a training Captain, might not be the "technique" I was taught by my training Captain.
The naivety of your statement clearly emphasises my point. No 2 pilots operate the aircraft exactly the same way every time.
What descent profile do you use? What about below 10,000ft? When cleared for an ILS, do you are arm the APPR immediately or wait until you are within the capture region of the ILS (as per manufacturer's guidance)? At what altitude do you take gear on an ILS? Do you activate approach phrase everytime, of do you let the plane activate it by itself when it over fly's the psuedo waypoint?
Every question just asked is open to technique or personal judgement based on circumstances. YOUR way is not the ONLY way.
When your a Captain being hassled over trivial crap by the F/O all day you might understand.

[Vessbot]

Ever heard the phrase, "1more than 1 way to skin a cat"? There are plenty of ways to operate the aircraft within the framework of a companies Policies and SOP's.
As an F/O, not surprisingly you have clearly missed the point. The "technique" you were taught by a training Captain, might not be the "technique" I was taught by my training Captain.
The naivety of your statement clearly emphasises my point. No 2 pilots operate the aircraft exactly the same way every time.
What descent profile do you use? What about below 10,000ft? When cleared for an ILS, do you are arm the APPR immediately or wait until you are within the capture region of the ILS (as per manufacturer's guidance)? At what altitude do you take gear on an ILS? Do you activate approach phrase everytime, of do you let the plane activate it by itself when it over fly's the psuedo waypoint?
Every question just asked is open to technique or personal judgement based on circumstances. YOUR way is not the ONLY way.
When your a Captain being hassled over trivial crap by the F/O all day you might understand.

Are all of these questions spelled out in "chapter and verse?" If not, then they're technique, not procedure; they're also not what I'm talking about, which is procedure spelled out in black and white with no discretion left to the pilots. Maybe you were originally thinking of technique and misspoke with the "chapter and verse" quip, and if so then I agree with you on your examples; but it immediately reminded me of the squishy justifications that pilots will come up with to justify anything. Give them an inch in discretion and they'll take a mile. Makes me think of every flight with DGAF Captains who force me to either fight it out over small issue after small issue to stay within the SOPs, or ignore them and thereby let them get the camel's nose under the tent for later violations of more significant issues. And either way, it's tiring!

[TPE Flyer]

Are all of these questions spelled out in "chapter and verse?" If not, then they're technique, not procedure; they're also not what I'm talking about, which is procedure spelled out in black and white with no discretion left to the pilots. Maybe you were originally thinking of technique and misspoke with the "chapter and verse" quip, and if so then I agree with you on your examples; but it immediately reminded me of the squishy justifications that pilots will come up with to justify anything. Give them an inch in discretion and they'll take a mile.

Exactly, except I find a lot of F/O's these days just take the mile.
And I am not talking about Black and White Procedure either. Read my previous post, everyone of those examples can be flown with different techniques within the framework of SOP.

In any event, you will understand my point when you become a Captain and realise there is more to operating an aircraft than nice landings, selfies and trying to unlock the pants of every flight attandant.

[piratepete]

TPE.All Training Captains on the planet Earth SHOULD be teaching the same/identical methods to operate their jet based upon the written information contained within the FCOMs (what we do) and the FCTM (how we do it).After doing this training stuff since 1990 it depresses me each time I come across pilots who have been trained to operate Boeings and Airbus using some TCs personal methods.Follow the FCTM!!
In the various situations highlighted above there is often room to make variations from the method stated in the FCTM.This does not mean a pilot is not following SOP at all.We cant be that rigid.The statement "what descent profile do u use" is quite a flippant statement.There is ONE profile and it is in the FCTM.When outside factors take u outside this profile then adjust.......

[pineteam]

I would expect a new FO to enjoy the flight as much as I do. Not to hesitate to fly the aircraft manually when convenient to build his confidence on the machine, to share his experience and to ask questions; I would be more than happy to answer and if I don't know we would check in the books together or ask on PPRuNe xD. I expect him to be relax but to be assertive and call my attention in case I'm doing something unsafe or stupid. I believe we can always learn from our colleagues regardless of their experience. But I also expect him to comply with the SOP and not to break my nuts when I'm flying unless it's unprofessional or safety related obviously. I always let the FOs fly the way they want, so I expect the same treat.:}
I expect him to be respectful and a good professional also. What grinds my gears for example is when I'm PF and I go to the toilet, as soon as I close the door, I can hear the engines spooling up... Cause he wants to go home early so he accelerates without telling me to gain 3 min of flight time and burn 100 kg extra fuel when we are 25 min ahead of schedule... Well done.:}

[TPE Flyer]

. I expect him to be relax but to be assertive and call my attention in case I'm doing something unsafe or stupid. I believe we can always learn from our colleagues regardless of their experience. But I also expect him to comply with the SOP and not to break my nuts when I'm flying unless it's unprofessional or safety related obviously. I always let the FOs fly the way they want, so I expect the same.

​​​​​​exactly, "unless it is unprofessional or saftey related."

I don't need to be told that the trigger for brake fans is 100 degrees when I ask you to put them on at 80 degrees because I have a 3km taxi ahead of me at MTOW. Thats called situational awareness.

I don't need a lecture because I am using and have briefed NAPD 1 for strategic reasons when the SOP says 1000/1000. Thats called Command Jugdement.

I shouldn't have to repeat myself when I say don't change the cruise speed while we are bumping a long in TB at out OPT ALT (which happens to be pur REC MAX) with a very small margin to MMO. Thats called safety.

​​​​​​

[Chesty Morgan]

What you mean to say is use airmanship. Which is learnt from experience and not taught in the sim or a classroom.

[pineteam]

Funny enough, some guys have good airmanship since day 1 and some will never get it! I'm with you TPE Flyer. I think the attitude plays a big role. Many times some Fos will make annoying inputs when I'm PF like: '' Do you want me to request heading to the right? '' For an isolated CB clearly visible in day time 100nm ahead... Like dude! If I want a heading I will ask you! and we are still so far out so what's the stress?! I'm PF, I'm not blind and I have no intention to scare my passengers so in due time I will request deviation. Or some guys will request descend when I'm PF just because they see the TOD arrow like 10 miles ahead... Like WTF? What about asking me first? It would never come to my mind to do such a thing especially as a Fo. Some of them they just don't get the concept. Many many times, Fos do stuffs that I'm thinking in my head: '' Jeez, I would never have done such a thing as a Fo!'' I have been on the left for 1 year and 3 months, and I can count in one hand maybe 2 at best, the time I have given a gentle verbal input to the Fos and it was purely because it would have triggered a QAR ( for instance they keep max reverse below 70kt IAS, at 45 kt it triggers a red QAR.) or we would not have been stabilized. But yet, some Fos, will give me like 10 inputs or annoying suggestions during one sector... And to be clear I'm not saying it's an FO thing, they are a minority in fact. I had the same, actually much more issues being on the right with douchebag on the left treating me like the third AP, spoon feeding me all the time during the approach and stressing like hell due weather... I guess some of them don't trust me or get those bad habits from those unconfident captains.. Lol:}

[jagema]

I don't need to be told that the trigger for brake fans is 100 degrees when I ask you to put them on at 80 degrees because I have a 3km taxi ahead of me at MTOW. Thats called situational awareness.

I don't need a lecture because I am using and have briefed NAPD 1 for strategic reasons when the SOP says 1000/1000. Thats called Command Jugdement.
​​​​​​

Gee, you must be so fun to fly with.
As a matter of fact, yes, you need to be told these things. This is literally the FO's job description. Now the FO might not recognise why you might be doing them, they do know when or how these things need to be done. Accept that sometimes flight crew aren't on the same page, you might need to explain the reasoning behind your actions, and carry on. For your FO to tell you the things that you might not know which might endager safety, you need to accept that you will sometimes, most times, receive comments on things that you do know. It is part of the job. But approaching an FO's remarks with the mentality of "I don't need to be told this" or "lectured on that" destroys CRM in the flight deck. You want your FO's to speak up and be critical, and not be known as that Captain whose FO's just sit there and look nice.
Safe flying

[Murtoman]

Gee, you must be so fun to fly with.
As a matter of fact, yes, you need to be told these things. This is literally the FO's job description. Now the FO might not recognise why you might be doing them, they do know when or how these things need to be done. Accept that sometimes flight crew aren't on the same page, you might need to explain the reasoning behind your actions, and carry on. For your FO to tell you the things that you might not know which might endager safety, you need to accept that you will sometimes, most times, receive comments on things that you do know. It is part of the job. But approaching an FO's remarks with the mentality of "I don't need to be told this" or "lectured on that" destroys CRM in the flight deck. You want your FO's to speak up and be critical, and not be known as that Captain whose FO's just sit there and look nice.
Safe flying

+1

Sometimes it baffles me how hard can it be to give a simple explanation of doing something nonstandard.
Take this example of the brake fans. If you as a captain know that you will be needing brake fans for a 3km taxi at MTOW, why not mention it when a non-standard item is asked for? It would literally take seconds of effort. I would be surprised if any F/O at this point would question the judgement. He might learn a great lesson there too, with little to no effort needed from the LHS.

-M

[Information Unicorn]

Gee, you must be so fun to fly with.
As a matter of fact, yes, you need to be told these things. This is literally the FO's job description. Now the FO might not recognise why you might be doing them, they do know when or how these things need to be done. Accept that sometimes flight crew aren't on the same page, you might need to explain the reasoning behind your actions, and carry on. For your FO to tell you the things that you might not know which might endager safety, you need to accept that you will sometimes, most times, receive comments on things that you do know. It is part of the job. But approaching an FO's remarks with the mentality of "I don't need to be told this" or "lectured on that" destroys CRM in the flight deck. You want your FO's to speak up and be critical, and not be known as that Captain whose FO's just sit there and look nice.
Safe flying

What he/she said. 100%.

Ever heard of the phrase “sharing the mental model”?

[Information Unicorn]

Turning up habitually early is a no no. When I walk into a crew room and find my FO at the briefing table with all 4 OFPS printed out and sections of the NOTAMS/WX all highlighted for
me at report time I now know that the FO
is not compliant with the FTL scheme in a company where pilot fatigue is a major issue. Unfortunately said FO’s think this is how to get along in said airline due to the culture. No. Try to think for yourself. If there isn’t enough time provided we take the time required and to hell with the schedule. Turning up early covers over the problems.

Rubbish. You don’t know that at all. It could be for many reasons*, maybe worth asking them to find out, start off with some CRM?

* flying with a Captain that “hogs” the flight plans, doesn’t involve the FO, and is close to retirement (although in that case the FO is a little stuck between doing his job and having a bearable day)

* having had plenty of rest, traffic was light, no queue at security and arrived 20 mins early. Are they going to wait for you to turn up to start? Of course not

* being someone who has been burned before with 56 pages of FCO NOTAMS... 😂

* just someone who wants to be (note - doesn’t HAVE to be) early and prepared. Maybe it was not min rest from last nights late ALC, for the first time in ages

* etc.

[Meester proach]

“ find my FO ...” says it all.

whats he supposed to do , wait outside until report time to fit your cynical and jobsworth view of the role.

i pity the poor bugger that gets four sectors with that attitude

[Daddy Fantastic]

Who gives a toss what a captains expectations of a new FO are anyway? Two individuals just need to do their own jobs professionally and objectively.

[FlightDetent]

Funny enough, some guys have good airmanship since day 1 and some will never get it! I'm with you TPE Flyer. I think the attitude plays a big role. Many times some Fos will make annoying inputs when I'm PF like: '' Do you want me to request heading to the right? '' For an isolated CB clearly visible in day time 100nm ahead... Like dude! If I want a heading I will ask you! and we are still so far out so what's the stress?! I'm PF, I'm not blind and I have no intention to scare my passengers so in due time I will request deviation. Or some guys will request descend when I'm PF just because they see the TOD arrow like 10 miles ahead... Like WTF? What about asking me first? It would never come to my mind to do such a thing especially as a Fo. Some of them they just don't get the concept. Many many times, Fos do stuffs that I'm thinking in my head: '' Jeez, I would never have done such a thing as a Fo!'' I have been on the left for 1 year and 3 months, and I can count in one hand maybe 2 at best, the time I have given a gentle verbal input to the Fos and it was purely because it would have triggered a QAR ( for instance they keep max reverse below 70kt IAS, at 45 kt it triggers a red QAR.) or we would not have been stabilized. But yet, some Fos, will give me like 10 inputs or annoying suggestions during one sector... And to be clear I'm not saying it's an FO thing, they are a minority in fact. I had the same, actually much more issues being on the right with douchebag on the left treating me like the third AP, spoon feeding me all the time during the approach and stressing like hell due weather... I guess some of them don't trust me or get those bad habits from those unconfident captains.. Lol:} Store this gem, pinteam. You will be so ashamed to read it in one year's time, and so amused in 5. Where TPE Flyer gets it right, and he does, you got it all upside down.

Come on. man. They trying to prove themselves in your eyes. Being pro-active. Showing they think ahead. Being assistive to relieve you of the mundane task of flying, so that you can focus on being the Master. You are their natural role-model, having made it to LHS so quick especially. Are they overdoing it - most likely yes! Your choice of language leaves enormous room for character development.:D

[ford cortina]

Have a bloody Torch, not your phone.
we are professionals after all

[CloudMedic]

After several years since posting this original question, it’s been great fun re-reading the replies. It’s clear 99% of the replies came from legends who were keen for a naive NTL FO to succeed and I thank you for the advice. I have to say the best advice came from JPJP who demonstrated the type of pilot I did not wish to become and pleased to say I haven’t.

[Greenlights]

​​​​​​

I don't need to be told that the trigger for brake fans is 100 degrees when I ask you to put them on at 80 degrees because I have a 3km taxi ahead of me at MTOW. Thats called situational awareness.

I don't need a lecture because I am using and have briefed NAPD 1 for strategic reasons when the SOP says 1000/1000. Thats called Command Jugdement.

I shouldn't have to repeat myself when I say don't change the cruise speed while we are bumping a long in TB at out OPT ALT (which happens to be pur REC MAX) with a very small margin to MMO. Thats called safety.

​​​​​​

so basically you don't need to communicate anything you do, because the FO has to read your mind.
communication is basic skills.

[Oasis]

Have a bloody Torch, not your phone.
we are professionals after all

boomer!

[OutsideCAS]

Have a bloody Torch, not your phone.

If it does the same job, who cares. :rolleyes:​​​​​​​

[Chesty Morgan]

It doesn't!

[OutsideCAS]

It doesn't!

Mine does. It illuminates dark areas. I guess what you have might not be a torch.

[Chesty Morgan]

Mine does. It illuminates dark areas. I guess what you have might not be a torch.
Can it illuminate the top of the fin?!

I've never seen a 'phone torch thats powerful enough for anything more than a few feet away🙄

[Capn Bloggs]

@OutsideCAS you're kidding yourself if you think a phone "torch" can replace a proper torch.

[OutsideCAS]

No I'm not. Mine works just fine. Its not a huge number of lumens (about 50) and is like most cheap and small torches. Perhaps your both in need of a eye test? :E.

[Chesty Morgan]

Doesn't matter how good or bad your eyesight is if what you're trying to see in the dark is still...in the dark.

[VariablePitchP]

No I'm not. Mine works just fine. Its not a huge number of lumens (about 50) and is like most cheap and small torches. Perhaps your both in need of a eye test? :E.

Cheap and small torches which are crap… are still crap :8

You look a melon as well doing it, doesn’t light up the wings at all as the throw of the light is so wide and you’re more or less holding it onto the wheels just to give the illusion of doing a walk around.

We’ve all done it, flat torch battery etc, doesn’t make it any less stupid.

My torch was about £15 online, 2x1000 lumen LEDs, nearly 100x brighter than your phone. For £15… Why would you ever not want the plane lit up like it’s daylight?..

[Black Pudding]

Outpost response is a perfect example of everything a Captain does not want from a FO.

[nightfright]

Do not come with a calculator to add fuel figures on the OFP.

Brief one’s self beforehand for the airport we would go to.

Know how to handle EFB on the iPad efficiently.

Aspire, show commitment and eagerness.

Why does the use of calculator affect you. If you can use the scratch pad to write a frequency or taxi instructions, then why cannot a FO be able to use a calculator? Better to use a calculator then get it wrong. Drop the ego

[Oasis]

Fo takes the fat one

[3Greens]

Fo takes the fat one
and this wins pprune


just don’t be the Fo you wouldn’t want to fly with when you’re in the LHS.