Airborne Aviation at Camden

[OhSpareMe]

Passed through Camden a few days ago and was advised they are no longer in the game. So what happened?

[LeadSled]

Passed through Camden a few days ago and was advised they are no longer in the game. So what happened?
Closed up shop some weeks ago.
I am told quite a few people owed money, i hope nobody paid for flying in advance.
Tootle pip!!

[MickF85]

The planes and Peter have gone to Altocap, not sure where most of the other instructors have gone.

[cowl flaps]

I am told quite a few people owed money, i hope nobody paid for flying in advance.
I suppose some people pay in advance, as in when they take out a loan for a PPL, CPL etc,- but why hasn't anybody
ever introduced an Escrow system, so that if the flying school goes balls up, you get the balance of your money back in your hand ?

[Squawk7700]

Because the discount that they would be offering is because they hold the money. If it's sitting in Escrow, then the third party sits on the interest, so no discount from the provider. The student may as well be PAYG and there's nothing to say the escrow mob won't do a dodgy either, plus they will charge fees. Everyone wants their piece of the pie!

[cowl flaps]

Is there such a thing as registered / approved Escrow people ?
If so, they would make available their terms & conditions including their rates etc.
I was just thinking it could mitigate any anguish if someone goes broke. But you're right in that
PAYG is safer. Even if you took out a loan and put it in an account and linked it to a debit card.
Then the bank is charging you interest on the loan,- and using your money on the short term money market too.:)

[gerry111]

I realise that the Australian banking system has become pretty dodgy, in recent years. So what's happened to trust accounts that could once protect mug punters?

[Squawk7700]

You could draw down on a loan as required and keep the interest low. There are ways and means..

[cowl flaps]

You could draw down on a loan as required and keep the interest low. There are ways and means..
Is that similar to a line of credit ?

[Squawk7700]

Yes it is. Depends on your generation as to what you might call it.

[OzFerret]

I flew with Airborne Aviation.
I paid on the day.
The last time I flew with them, I noted people seemed despondent.
I spoke with Peter after AA was gone. He said that an increase in fixed costs had exceeded the ability of AA to continue to trade. (Or words to that effect.)
They had been there a long time.

They had a run of bad maintenance luck (Wheels damaged on runway lights, etc) which had a number of aircraft offline.

Flying schools have a lot of capital tied up, and I think the margins could be quite thin.
I believe the AA owned aircraft have been sold.

I am sorry they went. :'-(

OzFerret

[David Searson]

Does anyone know what happened to all the assets of Airborne Aviation?
They had my Pilots Log Book, and I am trying to find how to get it back.
Maybe there's some receivers or such legal firm involved?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[mates rates]

Never leave YOUR logbook with any flying school.It is your record of flying and should be stamped as a correct record and kept in your possession.

[LexAir]

Quite right; it is not a legal requirement to leave your Log Book at the flying school, notwithstanding what the school may tell you.

[Capt Fathom]

That's all well and good in hindsight.

But when you arrive for your first lesson, a logbook is probably the last thing on your mind.
The flying school sells you one and says they'll look after it until you learn how to fill it in. Sounds like a plan.

So it stays with the school.

For our poster David looking for his logbook, perhaps Altocap maybe worth calling.

[David Searson]

Yeah, I realise my stupidity and misplaced faith in hindsight -- they has a whole bookcase full of logbooks, so it seemed at the time to be the "normal" thing to do.

I visited Altocap a couple months ago and left my details in case they knew anything, but have not heard back.
The guy I spoke to there also mentioned that Airborne Aviation was in receivership, but he did not know the legal firm to contact.
He also seemed to think that Peter's widow might know something about that, but I don't know how to contact her.

Thanks to mates_rates, LexAir, and Capt_Fathom - you are all correct - it was a dumb thing to do, but I cannot believe that the logbooks have been trashed.
It is just surprising that I have not heard anything by mail, by phone, or by email (all of which were in the logbook)

My daughter is in the same boat. We took lessons at the same time, although I had a decade or more records in mine.

[Clare Prop]

It's often easier to keep the logbook at the school so that it is filled in at the end of each lesson rather than the student leaving it at home and then work to do to fill it all in approaching flight test. Also if CASA do an audit they need to see them. There is nothing sinister about it, the student can collect it at any time.
It IS your property so no liquidators should be throwing them out. The name and address should be in each one so they can return it to the owner. Not unusual to hear of them going into skips along with student files though.

[David Searson]

Thanks for making me feel less stupid for leaving the logbook on site.
At the same time, the idea of log books being sent to land fill makes me feel sick.

Does anyone have a hint how I would find who the liquidators are for Airborne Aviation?

[tossbag]

Not unusual to hear of them going into skips along with student files though.

I reckon if I saw anyone throwing logbooks in a skip I'd kick them in the balls.

[Capt Fathom]

I reckon if I saw anyone throwing logbooks in a skip I'd kick them in the balls.

Yep. That’ll work! :rolleyes:

[Styx75]

Also if CASA do an audit they need to see them.

We've survived the last 3 audits without CASA asking for logbooks. I had prepared the whole "We keep our training files, students keep their records; request the logbook from the student if you want it"... But the auditors have never asked about or for the logbooks.

I use it as a marketing gimmick to new students now: "don't trust a school that wants to keep your logbook, there's probably a reason they need that student lock in". It's sometimes the little things that set you apart...

[kbca]

Does anyone have a hint how I would find who the liquidators are for Airborne Aviation?

Looks like the liquidation was wrapped up early 2020. If its gone you may be able to do a stat dec and add opening hours into a new logbook. Previous medical or test info sent to CASA should give you a guide of roughly where your hours were at. Have had students which have had to do this previously with lost logbooks - long time ago now so not sure if it is still the procedure.

Liquidators details: - wont let me post a URL so you can find it on "ASIC Published notices"

Deed Administrator
Address
Amos Insolvency
Locked Bag 5007
NARELLAN NSW 2567
Contact person
Contact number 02 4626 8522
Facsimile 02 4627 2146
Email

[David Searson]

@kbca -- Thanks so much for this information, and for the advice.
I will see what I can find from the liquidators, and follow up on the stat dec

publishednotices.asic.gov.au/browsesearch-notices?appointment=All&companynameoracn=Airborne%20Aviation&noticestate=All&archvd=0

[kbca]

How did you go with the logbood David?
I'm curious to see if the administrators held these or turfed them...