PTL - Navy orders 7th "Astute" - HMS Agincourt

[Heathrow Harry]

At last!!!!

Royal Navy nuclear submarines to get £2.5bn boost - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-44102308)

The defence secretary is expected to announce a £2.5bn investment in the UK's nuclear submarine programme.Under the plans, an Astute hunter-killer submarine will be built costing £1.5bn, and £960m will go towards completing a fleet of four nuclear-armed Dreadnought submarines.Gavin Williamson will say it is part of a commitment to secure the UK "from intensifying threats".

The Ministry of Defence says the deal will help to sustain thousands of jobs.

Mr Williamson will announce the plans during a visit to defence giant BAE Systems' shipyard in Barrow-in-Furness in Cumbria.He will say the Astute submarine - which will complete the Royal Navy's seven-strong fleet of hunter-killer attack subs - will be called Agincourt.The deal with BAE will also help with the second phase of construction for the UK's Dreadnought submarines.

While at the factory, Mr Williamson will unveil a plaque and officially open a new £100m sub-construction building which will be used to outfit and test the submarines.He will say: "This multibillion-pound investment in our nuclear submarines shows our unwavering commitment to keeping the UK safe and secure from intensifying threats."Agincourt will complete the Royal Navy's seven-strong fleet of hunter-killer attack subs, the most powerful to ever enter British service, whilst our nuclear deterrent is the ultimate defence against the most extreme dangers we could possibly face."He will also stress the importance of the boost for Barrow - "the heart of sub-building in this country"."Today's news supports 8,000 BAE Systems' submarine jobs, as well as thousands more in the supply chain, protecting prosperity and providing opportunity right across the country," Mr Williamson will say.

[dead_pan]

Do we really need 7 hunter-killer subs, ahead of all the other pressing needs of our armed forces?

As for it's name - FFS...

[Heathrow Harry]

Yes - I think we do - they're the must effective ships we have and any reasonable analysis would suggest a force of 10 would be minumum

If only half are ready for action that gives us 3-4 available - to protect the SSBN's, the new carrier, and track any Russian nasties

And then if you want to fire missiles at Syria and defend the Falklands................ we're a bit short...........

[falcon900]

The hunter killers might be our only way of projecting non nuclear force once the GR4s are retired, and are probably a much safer way to do it that putting aircraft in harms way.
Whilst I am not privy to operational details, I understand that the SSBNs travel alone, and rely totally on stealth for protection

[PPRuNeUser0139]

As for it's name - FFS...
I quite agree.. At a time when we should be looking to build joint military ventures with the navy of our closest neighbours, it seems particularly inappropriate.
I wonder if the Mail ran a contest to find a name? (getting that one in before K n C rolls up)

[Heathrow Harry]

Was going to be AJAX I believe ...

Five ships of the Royal Navy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Navy) have been called HMS Agincourt, named after the Battle of Agincourt (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Agincourt) of 1415, and construction of another was started but not completed.

HMS Agincourt (1796) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt_(1796)) was a 64-gun third-rate (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third-rate) ship of the line (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_the_line) bought from the East India Company (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honourable_East_India_Company), where she had been named Earl Talbot, in 1796. She became a prison ship (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_ship) in 1812 and was renamed HMS Bristol. She was sold in 1814.
HMS Agincourt (1817) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt_(1817)) was a 74-gun third-rate launched in 1817. She was used for harbour service from 1848, was renamed HMS Vigo in 1865 and was sold in 1884.
HMS Agincourt (1865) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt_(1865)) was a Minotaur-class (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minotaur-class_ironclad) ironclad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ironclad) frigate (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frigate) launched in 1865. She was renamed HMS Boscawen and used for harbour service from 1904, was renamed HMS Ganges II in 1906, became a coal hulk named C109 in 1908 and was broken up in 1960.
HMS Agincourt was to have been a Queen Elizabeth-class battleship (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth-class_battleship). She was ordered in 1914, but cancelled that year.
HMS Agincourt (1913) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt_(1913)) was a battleship originally built for Brazil (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazil) as Rio de Janeiro and launched in 1913. She was sold to Turkey (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkey) as Sultan Osman, but was taken over by the Royal Navy before delivery, on the outbreak of the First World War (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_World_War). She was present at the Battle of Jutland (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Jutland) and was sold in 1922.
HMS Agincourt (D86) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt_(D86)) was a Battle-class (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle-class_destroyer) destroyer (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destroyer) launched in 1945. She was converted to a radar picket in 1959 and scrapped in 1974.
HMS Agincourt will be the name of the seventh Astute-Class (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Ajax_(S125)) hunter-killer submarine.[1] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Agincourt#cite_note-1)

[Bing]

Does anyone really think the French care? The USN have plenty of ships named after battles in the War of Independence and I'm unaware of anyone in the UK giving a monkeys.

[Frostchamber]

The Astutes really are the aces in the UK's conventional pack IMHO and ideally we'd certainly have more. But with the 7th having been in doubt at times this is still good news. Although as people have said we could really do with 10 or 12, and could certainly use an eighth, if realistically that's unattainable in the current funding climate (or even any new funding climate after the current review) the key thing is first must be to invest fully in the 7 we will have, including addressing manpower issues, so that we can use them to their full potential and maximise availability. The fact that they should never need refuelling should also help with that.

[Fortissimo]

Not sure why submarines should be a topic on a military aviation chat site but, while we are discussing HMS Agincourt, is it reasonable to assume it will be fitted with a Longbow radar?

[Heathrow Harry]

I think it's really good news - if there is a delay/cut in the SSBN programme this keeps the line and skills ticking over so we can always add more later if we need to - it pushes the line closure out another 4 years really

[NutLoose]

I quite agree.. At a time when we should be looking to build joint military ventures with the navy of our closest neighbours, it seems particularly inappropriate.
I wonder if the Mail ran a contest to find a name? (getting that one in before K n C rolls up)

It's a bit late in the day worrying about calling it the Agincourt and upsetting the neighbours when the last and still partially active class of submarine is called Trafalgar.

[Heathrow Harry]

:):):)

that occurred to me as well.................

[pasta]

Apparently some French people were distinctly unimpressed with the first Eurostar terminal being in Waterloo station. I also heard a rumour that the last ever train to Paris from that terminal left at 18:15...

[Wokkafans]

Apparently some French people were distinctly unimpressed with the first Eurostar terminal being in Waterloo station. I also heard a rumour that the last ever train to Paris from that terminal left at 18:15...

Perhaps it was three minute late as it looks to have been scheduled for 18:12.

https://www.eurostar.com/uk-en/about-eurostar/press-office/press-releases/2007/eurostar-says-goodbye-waterloo-international

[Cazalet33]

One trusts that the Frogs will respond by naming their next bateau 'Hastings'. Or perhaps 'Dunkerque'.

Then we could re-respond by naming that V-boat with the drunken officers (and the ever so slightly slutty one) 'Vichy'.

D'you think the Germans might get a bit pissed off if we named our next Destroyer 'Dresden'? Just a thought.

[Bing]

One trusts that the Frogs will respond by naming their next bateau 'Hastings'. Or perhaps 'Dunkerque'.

Then we could re-respond by naming that V-boat with the drunken officers (and the ever so slightly slutty one) 'Vichy'.

D'you think the Germans might get a bit pissed off if we named our next Destroyer 'Dresden'? Just a thought.

I mean if you're looking to get offended they appear to have named a lot of the ships in their current fleet after Admirals and Pirates who fought against the British, e.g. Forbin, Jean Bart, and Surcouf. It's as if they don't care what we think.

[FODPlod]

I mean if you're looking to get offended they appear to have named a lot of the ships in their current fleet after Admirals and Pirates who fought against the British, e.g. Forbin, Jean Bart, and Surcouf. It's as if they don't care what we think.
Whereas the largest capital ship in the French fleet is named after an embarrassingly grateful Anglophile who couldn't stop praising the UK for hosting him in his country's darkest hour and facilitating its liberation from Nazi occupation. :*

[Heathrow Harry]

Non, non , non. non............

[West Coast]

Not sure why submarines should be a topic on a military aviation chat site but, while we are discussing HMS Agincourt, is it reasonable to assume it will be fitted with a Longbow radar?

it'll likely carry cruise missiles, therefore there’s aviation content.

[TBM-Legend]

...new subs = new targets for new P-8's therefore military aviation qualified!

[peterperfect]

Agincourt's ship's crest clearly needs a two-fingered salute embedded in there somewhere !

PS Whilst some people might get all PC about a name of a battle and irreversible history, don't forget that HMS Victory is one of the most popular tourist attractions on the south coast; for French visitors....

The USN has a whole class of Cruisers currently named after battles. Some against foreign powers who are now allies, others from the American Civil War.
Hue City, San Jacinto, Ticonderoga, Chosin, Gettysburg, Princeton (the Revolutionary War vs the British !) the list goes on.

[glad rag]

"Does anyone really think the French care?"

Yes it will rile them no end. For no good purpose.

Apart from that it's very good news well apart from finding the crew....

[Out Of Trim]

Maybe time to reinstate the "Press Gang!" :}

[ValMORNA]

Maybe time to reinstate the "Press Gang!" :}

aka National Service (18-25 with no exemptions, all genders included)

[glad rag]

aka National Service (18-25 with no exemptions, all genders included)

shouldn't take them too long to teach kettle operation either :rolleyes:

[langleybaston]

Agincourt's ship's crest clearly needs a two-fingered salute embedded in there somewhere !

Priceless, well said that man!

[ShotOne]

+1: Brilliant, in fact doubly brilliant; not only the most deadly and least vulnerable vessels, but great choice of name. I can't imagine the French care two hoots about it but who cares? I don't recall them asking how we felt before naming a helicopter cruiser after their witch who fought against us.

[TBM-Legend]

Boat's motto......"We Won"

[langleybaston]

or perhaps We Win?

[shotleylad]

Best bit of kit we have and great name.

[glad rag]

It's a bit late in the day worrying about calling it the Agincourt and upsetting the neighbours when the last and still partially active class of submarine is called Trafalgar.

And what nations MPA have been keeping out strategic deterrent "safe" for some considerable time?

You know, with all the french bashing that goes on here, you may be led to believe that they are actually be "better"....

[Rhino power]

And what nations MPA have been keeping out strategic deterrent "safe" for some considerable time?

You know, with all the french bashing that goes on here, you may be led to believe that they are actually be "better"....

Any chance we could have that again in a language that makes sense?

-RP