tattoos and pilot training

[david_]

Hi all.

Im in the process of doing my PPL and i will go on to do my full CPL later on but i was wondering,
I want to get a tattoo, only a small one on the underside of my wrist (no larger than 5cm by 5cm). will this affect my chances of getting with an airline in the future?

[Dan Winterland]

Same with our company. Visible tats are a big no no. You will not get employed if it's visible at the interview. And as the company does it's own medicals, you wouldn't get away with hiding it. Anything that's covered by a short sleeve shirt is OK.

Don't do it.

[Thud105]

I was in the UK a while back and was listening to a very well-spoken etiquette expert on the radio. When asked his opinion on tattoos he didn't hesitate. In an accent that could cut glass he replied "I view them in much the same light as I do graffiti on the wall of a public lavatory." I formed the opinion that - on balance - he didn't approve. And nor do I. David, please try and remember that you will not be interviewed by a hip young guy who likes your 'tatt', but a grumpy old bastard like me.

[vctenderness]

Just wondering why this is under the Cabin Crew heading?

[maggot]

Cover up paste, long sleeves or maybe a band aid for an interview
CBFd, personally.

[beamer]

I have seen just a couple of pilots with tattoos in forty plus years of flying. I guess its no big deal in itself but the professional pilot community is in general, a very conservative one. My advice would be not to bother and concentrate on your flying.

[B2N2]

It all has to do with perception in the public eye.
You see this in advertising on TV every single day.
People in uniform tend to be seen as trustworthy and reliable, such as doctors. They wear a uniform for their profession.
Anything that will conflict with that image in the public eye will get noticed.
For a career pilot these are simple things such as:
-Wearing sunglasses in the terminal
-Wearing earbuds while in uniform in oublic
-Foul language while in uniform
-Complaining about your company while in public
-Talking about boozing it up while in public
- Tattoos

I’ve met many pilots that sported tattoos while off duty, none of them showed in uniform.
I have a tattoo myself so it’s not like I’m against tattoos.
Besides your wrist is one of the most painful places.
As far as perception goes, who would you trust more?

https://secure.i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01804/kennedy_1804441b.jpg

http://www.nationalcrimesyndicate.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/JosephValachiSwears-Hilo.jpg

[B2N2]

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First guy is an undercover cop and the second guy is a Mafia boss testifying.
Its all about perception.
I wouldn’t hire you if you had a visible tattoo.

[BluSdUp]

Sailors, Bikers and Criminals has tattoos.
I have met one pilot that had an anchor with a heart on it, he is now in SAS. Never rolled up his sleeves!
What was his former profession?

PS
I have met more Criminal pilots then visible tattooed ones!
You figure it out!

[Chris Martyr]

Don't do it.

Dan's right !
Read no further .

[Wannabe Flyer]

If you want a tattoo just get it down on your ass..... All the joy less pain & guaranteed not to be seen by a grumpy old chap interviewing you

[Contact Approach]

I have no idea why anyone would want a tattoo in the first place.

[Piltdown Man]

... & guaranteed not to be seen by a grumpy old chap interviewing you

Really? This is the cabin crew forum.

PM

[Denti]

Guess it depends in which airline. In my last interview i was interviewed by a 22 year FO and 30 something cabin manager, applying as a captain. The rules still state that tattoos shouldn‘t be visible, but wearing a long sleeved shirt is fine, and anything that is covered by that. I have met quite a few tattoed pilots, including those wearing them pretty much on the full alrea covered by the usual long sleeved uniform. But then, i guess that some areas of the world are not as conservative as others.

I was once working in an airline that was in the process of changing its uniform and appearance manual to allow visible tattoos everywhere except on the face, following a marketing campaign with a heavily tattoed girl. The airline in question is now gone, but not really as a result of that campaign (which was, at least in its intended market, rather well received) but rather continued bad management over more than 10 year.

[parkfell]

Ex military (NCOs) may well have tattoos on their arms, but not visible when wearing long sleeved shirts.
Part of the culture whilst in the Services, and further more they make perfectly fine civilian pilots.

That is a different situation from that of the OP, and what is proposed.
What is in your psychi which has a need for a tattoo on your wrist?
On seconds thoughts don't answer that Q; probably best discussed with a trick cyclist.

[AviatorDave]

I have no idea why anyone would want a tattoo in the first place.

:ok:

Absolutely out of the question, except you want to associate yourself with bikers, criminals or the like. No place for this in commercial aviation.

[Planemike]

I have no idea why anyone would want a tattoo in the first place.

I have no idea either, but we live in a society where we are permitted freedom of choice and freedom of expression.
Not sure that it makes too much difference as for the most part the paying punters (SLF) do not come into close
contact with the flight crew.
Errrr....why are we talking about flight crew in a cabin crew thread??

[uncle dickie]

Diverging slightly towards Cabin Crew ~ I believe that no tattoos anywhere on the body are allowed if employed in the sandpit.

[cargosales]

To be fair to the OP, he's asked a genuine question and doesn't deserve knocking for wanting a tattoo. I don't have any but my OH does and it's quite nice actually. Just not visible under most circumstances. The bottom line is that it's the employers choice about how their staff look, dress and how they present the company to their customers... and that can, and should IMNSHO, include visible tattoos. And the higher the bar, the more high-profile the job then the higher those standards will be.

Years ago we did an interview with a potential employee. We were incredibly relaxed in our dress code (when customer-facing the normal get-up was clean jeans, trainers and the obligatory aircraft t-shirt). But when faced by a foul-mouthed person with unwashed, rancid looking, multi-coloured hair, facial piercings and visible tattoos, our instinctive reaction was "No, we don't want this person anywhere near our customers because those customers will run a mile". So we didn't employ her. Brutal, maybe. Simple, yes.

Just my 2p worth

CS

[Father Dick Byrne]

Notwithstanding that this thread may be in the wrong place, because it relates to CPL training... May I offer some thoughts, as a recruiter:

It's hard enough now to find good candidates. Standards are lower than ever before and heading south.

Give me a hundred competent ex-NCO-aircrew candidates inked from torso to toe bar hands, face, and neck, and they’ll do very well. Public acceptance generally (and probably unlawfully) disbars the areas of the body mentioned.

I can comfortably accept a little self-expression when competence and professional standards are the upside.

I am also a fan of good tattoos. At their best, they can be amazingly artistic, deeply resonant, hugely significant, and seriously affirming. I often chat to people about their visible tattoos, and have never had a disappointing conversation (that said, I wouldn't enquire about ACAB across the knuckles). My last such conversation, with a young man serving me in a mobile phone store, led to my hearing a deeply touching story of father and son, war and service, and loss. I was left with a profound respect for the young man concerned. To those expressing a contrary view above, I recommend a much more open-minded approach to life in 2018.

Regarding cargosales’ post above, I’m not sure that the tattoos defined the outcome. I’ve flown with eminent single-seat FJ QFIs and QWIs with tattoos, who would have sailed through your processes, I’ve no doubt. That’s not to say they’re the crème de la crème but I hope you get my point.

So, if you’re in front of me, and inked, but your ink is not visible in business attire, you have nothing to fear. For the OP, you may wish to revise the location you have in mind for your own artwork.

Finally, I don't recruit for a sandpit airline; if you want to play in their sandpit, you play by their own daft rules. I wouldn't do that. The money is nothing like worth the misery, and I enjoy respecting my colleagues and employer too much.

[At ease]

Not only acknowledging the criminal and biker lifestyle, but putting money into their pockets via their ownership of tattoo parlours.

Does any sensible, responsible person want to see these type of people obtain enrichment via a process that, in any case, displays the wearer of a tattoo as potentially demonstrating a measure of psychological insecurity("toned down" somewhat from a more "pointed" observation)?

A "lose lose" situation if ever there was one.

I won't even touch on Leviticus.

[PA28161]

If they're visible then I guess it's not appropriate to be seen doing a responsible/professional job; pilot, doctor, lawyer et al. Just look at that BBC video shot of David Beckham in St Georges's chapel (at the royal wedding) last Saturday, he comes across as a thug dressed in formal clothing chewing gum. I personally do not like tattoos, I cannot understand why people wish to permanently mark and disfigure their bodies; but that's just me. I know many airline pilots who have discreet one's but well hidden from public view. Act in haste repent at leisure comes to mind.

[76fan]

Not just you PA. I cannot understand the wish for tattoos (or piercings), especially on women. If good looking why do they disfigure themselves and if ugly why do they want to draw attention to themselves?

[Father Dick Byrne]

...and that post perfectly epitomises the bigotry in this thread.

Fek me, there are some eejits about.

[Tray Surfer]

I still don't understand why this is in the Cabin Crew forum...

Things which are related to CC often get deleted after not very long run in this forum, yet this is not related to CC and is still here...

Can the mods not move it to a pilot forum instead?

[_sh]

As a dispatcher I come across a lot of pilots at work and I have to say I’m surprised by the number of pilots with tattoos that I’ve seen. More notably one right behind a young FO’s ear and one wrapping around another’s wrist. Admittedly they were flying for the same airline (not exactly the most professional one at that) so maybe they just have more laxed restrictions on such things. I am soon to start my flight training and do intend to get a tattoo in a coverable position.

I must add that the bigotry in this thread has really surprised me. In such a modern time it’s shocking to see such intolerance to something many consider very beautiful pieces of art. I hope the industry can move along with the times so to speak and realise that tattoos aren’t just for those who break the law.

[Sholayo]

I must add that the bigotry in this thread has really surprised me. In such a modern time it’s shocking to see such intolerance to something many consider very beautiful pieces of art. I hope the industry can move along with the times so to speak and realise that tattoos aren’t just for those who break the law.

Considering the stakes I do not think it is good idea to get a tatoo if it may potentailly rule out 20% of positions available.
Bigotry? It's your body and your career. It is not about what me, you and other people on the forum think. It is about what HR may think.

&

[_sh]

Considering the stakes I do not think it is good idea to get a tatoo if it may potentailly rule out 20% of positions available.
Bigotry? It's your body and your career. It is not about what me, you and other people on the forum think. It is about what HR may think.

&

Yes I agree that it is down to the individual and it is obviously then down to what HR think of it. I’m not implying people should make their mind up based on what some people in a forum are saying. But for those who do look to these threads for advice, seeing someone completely dismissing all tattoos as disgusting pieces of criminal and biker wear isn’t very helpful.

[Alsacienne]

Advice has been offered .... don't do it. Now it's up to the OP to decide how important his flying career is to him. And of course if airlines have policies on tattoos, this should be seriously borne in mind before committing to what is generally there for a lifetime ... art form or not.

[SFI145]

Why is this posted in the Cabin Crew forum? Don't we have moderators any more?

[Ebbie 2003]

If you haven't got it, don't get it.

If you have to be one of the herd get a semi-permanent one.

You get it, it will trip you up one day.

There is no balancingoption - no one is ever going to hire you in a professional position because you HAVE a tattoo

[_sh]

no one is ever going to hire you in a professional position because you HAVE a tattoo

I just can’t agree with this. I’ve seen, first hand, so many pilots with visible tattoos on the job that this statement just isn’t true.

[givemewings]

believe that no tattoos anywhere on the body are allowed if employed in the sandpit.

not true. Some airlines have stricter rules than others, and they differ between cabin crew and flight crew. But you absolutely can have tattoos with several of the major ME carriers, so long as it's not visible in uniform.

Of course some get their tattoos AFTER joining (but still in a place normally covered by the uniform)

Qatar I think is the only one that doesn't like the tattoos, but again I think this is only for CC and on a case by case basis (they must submit a photo of the tattoo and mark on a diagram where it is located) Not sure what QR does about pilots

[Salou1989]

<div style="text-align:left;">Nice</div>

[a.alexeev.p]

Hi all.

Im in the process of doing my PPL and i will go on to do my full CPL later on but i was wondering,
I want to get a tattoo, only a small one on the underside of my wrist (no larger than 5cm by 5cm). will this affect my chances of getting with an airline in the future?
For some airlines especially in the Middle East definitely yes. Even lazer removal does not help if scars are left :(

[Chris Martyr]

Wowee,,,,,,,,,doesn't take long for threads to get fiery on here sometimes duzzit...? :O
Accusations of intolerance , bigotry , cries of appeal to the moderators . Come along now guys . David , our OP puts a simple and straightforward question ! He's currently undergoing PPL training and has asked if having a small tattoo will jeopardise his recruitment prospects if he applies to the airlines . He could well apply as c/crew as a stop-gap while he completes his CPL training , so this post is as relevant here as it would be on any other area of the forum.
Is it a good idea ? Well , if it's about 2" x 2",,,,,, [sorry , don't like metric],,,,,he probably will get away with it . I'm not saying he definitely will ,,,but he probably will.
Would I have a tattoo ? Definitely no ! But if people opt for a small personal one which isn't likely to get the net-curtains twitching and doesn't encroach on bad taste [ and won't be seen at a job interview],, then that doesn't make them a bad person does it .
Good luck with the PPL training David and also with the CPL bit . Personally , I would raid the 'tattoo budget' and add it onto the flying budget . But that's just me..
Look at it this way David , if a certain bloke called Beckham had put his tattoo budget somewhere else , then he wouldn't look such a twerp would he ?..:O

[radar101]

I just can’t agree with this. I’ve seen, first hand, so many pilots with visible tattoos on the job that this statement just isn’t true.

Read it again Sh, He is making the point that although visible tattoos may preclude you from getting a post, there is no balancing case of HAVING a tattoo being likely to swing a job your way.

[Ivan aromer]

Perhaps its a generational thing, bit as people age, what seems a good idea in your teens/twenties does become a real eysore when the belly flows over the belt and when old and wrinkly eugh!
If asked whether I like to see CC with tattoos, my response would be an emphatic NO

[ShotOne]

Yes, tattoos are more widely accepted than before and I have no personal dislike. But in the context of the OP's question, the answer is still a definite "NO". Some airlines and interviewers WILL view them negatively so it could well harm your prospects at some point. In my 29 year career I've only come across one fellow pilot with a visible tattoo.

[dook]

…..then he wouldn't look such a twerp would he ?..https://www.pprune.org/images/smilies/embarass.gif

He looks worse than that !!

[flash8]

I once saw a Tattoo on the backside of a BMed flight attendant back at the Marriot in Tbilisi? Female I hasten to add... Does that count?

[M-ONGO]

I once saw a Tattoo on the backside of a BMed flight attendant back at the Marriot in Tbilisi? Female I hasten to add... Does that count?

Hmm. Wasn’t a tweety pie by any chance? If so, I’ve met that hostie too.

[ph-sbe]

Hmm. Wasn’t a tweety pie by any chance? If so, I’ve met that hostie too.

Funny how you can recognize each other's one night stands by their tramp stamps :)

[Reverserbucket]

All the unseasonably warm weather in the UK has resulted in flight crew walking around airports without jackets lately. I was behind a BA SFO at LHR just out of T5 crew report recently whose 'sweetheart' tattoo on his right shoulder blade was clearly visible through his uniform shirt. Used to know a guy who had 'Born to fly' emblazoned across his shoulders contained by a huge pair of angel wings - think he ended up at RYR and again, probably not well concealed by a thin white shirt. Also know some EK guys that have discreet, small tats on upper arms although personally not my cup of tea. Did that tweety-pie hostie ever work for bmi btw?

[M-ONGO]

All the unseasonably warm weather in the UK has resulted in flight crew walking around airports without jackets lately. I was behind a BA SFO at LHR just out of T5 crew report recently whose 'sweetheart' tattoo on his right shoulder blade was clearly visible through his uniform shirt. Used to know a guy who had 'Born to fly' emblazoned across his shoulders contained by a huge pair of angel wings - think he ended up at RYR and again, probably not well concealed by a thin white shirt. Also know some EK guys that have discreet, small tats on upper arms although personally not my cup of tea. Did that tweety-pie hostie ever work for bmi btw?

She did. BMed, BMI then BA. Blonde, not very tall, lived very close to LHR.

[pilotmike]

Hmm. Wasn’t a tweety pie by any chance? If so, I’ve met that hostie too.
A little bird having lots of fun?

[Pequena_Inquieta]

Not sure what QR does about pilots
There are QR pilots with tattoos. As far as I know, CC are not allowed to have any tattoos, visible in uniform or not. Different treatment.

[Pookerz]

I think getting a tattoo is a personal choice.

With that said, some professions have rules regarding visible tattoos, so there is another choice to make:

Visible tattoo vs. possible career.

Or get the best of both worlds: Get a tattoo where it can't be seen even with short sleeves and enjoy a career you want.

[Driver airframe]

Why bother getting a tattoo when you can buy very realistic fake arm sleeve tattoos very cheaply on line . They are nylon and look super real . If you really want to look a total idiot you can also buy clip a on man bun . They also stick onto a bald head . Good luck with your interview .

[olympus]

I've posted this before on a similar thread...

I used to fly with a first officer who had a smallish, visible and rather faded tattoo. He always regretted getting it and referred to it as '...my mark of stupidity'.

[Tray Surfer]

I still don't understand why this is in the Cabin Crew forum...?

If it had of been cabin crew posting something in the wrong forum, it would have been moved. So why can't this be moved to a pilot related forum?