CAE PARC are advertising for EK crew

[capster]

Interesting.
https://caeparcaviation.com/jobs/20985-b777-rated-and-nonrated-first-officers/

[falconeasydriver]

Merely reflecting how desperate I imagine things are getting regarding recruitment, my 380 Cpt Buddy has averaged 107 hrs for the last 8 months or so.

[Eau de Boeing]

Only 107 hours? Lazy pilot......

[TransitCheck]

They have also recently been added to pilotcredentials.com

[felixthecat]

Why would someone apply through PARC when they can apply directly? Surely PARC take a cut of the candidates salary for the time they are in EK.

[nolimitholdem]

I did chuckle when this popped up in my Inbox.

We are now recruiting for the following roles:

Rated & NTR A380 First Officers
Rated & NTR B777 First Officers
Rated & NTR B777 Captains

Hmmm...does this mean they're taking B777 DEC?

[A21N]

Hmmm...does this mean they're taking B777 DEC?

Yes, that is correct.

[sealear]

Must be desperate. Not surprising they need 800+ FOs this year?

[bringbackthe80s]

I know it’s not popular but the only way they can get a significant amount of people is by taking DEC on all fleets, with an ad-hoc program (not failing left and right).
It’s not fair to the current FOs but I don’t see many other options.

[fliion]

I know it’s not popular but the only way they can get a significant amount of people is by taking DEC on all fleets, with an ad-hoc program (not failing left and right).
It’s not fair to the current FOs but I don’t see many other options.

There are no words......

[Callone]

There are no words......

The last Airbus DEC we hired are all operating as FO on 380.

[6000PIC]

Speaking for myself , but probably hundreds of other pilots , I wouldn`t give EK the time of day considering the amount they pay and the conditions of employment. Double it , and we`ll talk.

[TheGreenDragon]

The last Airbus DEC we hired are all operating as FO on 380.

Yep, & One of them was from Cathay Dragon. He could have joined DEC on the B777 anytime in the last 4-5 years. Screwed over right royally.

Isn’t it true that the ex A330 skippers on the A380 have to do a full command course again before they become A380 PIC?

[bringbackthe80s]

There are no words......

Yeah yeah sure. Leave the situation as it is then, that’ll sort it. Not really a problem for me

[LHR Rain]

Yep the airline will screw the FOs again. Tells a prospective applicant what kind of company they are willing to join. Buyer Beware!
I know we have heard the same ole lines from the same ole Comany Men that the airline has always hired DECs but with upgrade times so long and the FOs getting screwed at every turn why hire DECs? In the past they told us the FOs didn't have enough flying time or enough time with the company but now that is definitely not the case.
If the airline paid a decent salary and of course treated us decently the Muppets would not be in a position to hire DECs. They being the company they are would always hire DECs but that says what kind of airline they are.
Buyer Beware!

[harry the cod]

So, here's the scene.

In the Red corner is pilot A. Pilot A is already employed by this Company. He is a known quantity. He was previously a senior trainer on the 330/340 fleet who left EK over ten years ago. During his tenure away from EK he'd been an EASA qualified TRE on the A319/320 and came back to EK as a DEC onto the A320 private jet. Shortly after rejoining, he was informed that there wasn't really enough work to justify keeping him solely on that fleet so he'd have to fly the 330 too. Fine, not really an issue. However, a year or so later when the last 330 retired he was moved over to the 380, but because of some daft and inflexible policy restriction, right seat. Rather magnanimously EK declared he could keep rank, privileges and pay! (sarcasm) That situation, you could argue, may be acceptable for a short time filler. That he's now required to undergo a full Command course, including tech test, psychology evaluation, interview board, two day CRM, full ground school and all the simulator and line training assessments, simply beggars belief. And if that's not ridiculous enough, the fact that he's currently a trainer, examining both Captains and F/O's and signing of their licences every day, merely highlights what a debacle this over complicated and under thought upgrade policy has become. Thank god he's over 35!!!

In the blue corner, Captain B. Captain B is about to join us as a DEC from some slightly dodgy outfit with a few aircraft. Although he will have a 3 day interview and selection process with simulator, he's a lesser known quantity than Captain A. He will also NOT be required to do a separate Command interview. He will NOT be required to take a technical exam on the aircraft systems. He will NOT be required to do a separate two day CRM command course. In fact, he will not be required to undertake a whole host of checks and assessments that pilot A has done and will have to.

Given the choice, which one would any sensible person, with even half an ounce of common sense choose? We've just lost one Deputy on the Boeing and may be about to lose another. That's after losing the DSVP last year due to moral and integrity contradictions with executive management. The SVP left for more personal reasons.

If our EVP's intent is to encourage and support policies such as this, the long term future of this Company can not be viewed as a positive one.

Harry

Edited to add;

bringbackthe80s. I'm sure that fliion's comments were more in aghast than agreement, at least that's how I read it.

[BANANASBANANAS]

So, here's the scene.

In the Red corner is pilot A. Pilot A is already employed by this Company. He is a known quantity. He was previously a senior trainer on the 330/340 fleet who left EK over ten years ago. During his tenure away from EK he'd been an EASA qualified TRE on the A319/320 and came back to EK as a DEC onto the A320 private jet. Shortly after rejoining, he was informed that there wasn't really enough work to justify keeping him solely on that fleet so he'd have to fly the 330 too. Fine, not really an issue. However, a year or so later when the last 330 retired he was moved over to the 380, but because of some daft and inflexible policy restriction, right seat. Rather magnanimously EK declared he could keep rank, privileges and pay! (sarcasm) That situation, you could argue, may be acceptable for a short time filler. That he's now required to undergo a full Command course, including tech test, psychology evaluation, interview board, two day CRM, full ground school and all the simulator and line training assessments, simply beggars belief. And if that's not ridiculous enough, the fact that he's currently a trainer, examining both Captains and F/O's and signing of their licences every day, merely highlights what a debacle this over complicated and under thought upgrade policy has become. Thank god he's over 35!!!

In the blue corner, Captain B. Captain B is about to join us as a DEC from some slightly dodgy outfit with a few aircraft. Although he will have a 3 day interview and selection process with simulator, he's a lesser known quantity than Captain A. He will also NOT be required to do a separate Command interview. He will NOT be required to take a technical exam on the aircraft systems. He will NOT be required to do a separate two day CRM command course. In fact, he will not be required to undertake a whole host of checks and assessments that pilot A has done and will have to.

Given the choice, which one would any sensible person, with even half an ounce of common sense choose? We've just lost one Deputy on the Boeing and may be about to lose another. That's after losing the DSVP last year due to moral and integrity contradictions with executive management. The SVP left for more personal reasons.

If our EVP's intent is to encourage and support policies such as this, the long term future of this Company can not be viewed as a positive one.

Harry

Edited to add;

bringbackthe80s. I'm sure that fliion's comments were more in aghast than agreement, at least that's how I read it.

I don't agree with all your posts Harry but credit where it's due. Top post!

[Callone]

I believe we must be the only operator on planet with Deputy Chief Pilot and former Technical Pilot both operating as First Officer.
But we are hiring DEC, it must be a joke.

[Payscale]

No, not really. I know of a reputable national carrier with an impeccable safety record, that at one time had 3 chief pilot who were all FOs. Its all about how you perceive FOs.

[SOPS]

Excellent post, Harry. The wheels have really come off!!!

[nolimitholdem]

I clearly recall the hiring of DEC's from the likes of Ryanair. Zero longhaul experience, zero widebody experience, zero EK experience, some really, uh, interesting, ways of flying machines a tad larger than they were used to, yet many in the right seat were passed over so they could babysit the newbie captains. By only the luck of timing I was fortunate to avoid being terribly disadvantaged, but it was painful to see far more qualified FO's getting delayed by these...folks.

This was at least 10 years ago. Suddenly everyone is aghast?

As donpizmeov is so fond of telling everyone, you knew what you signed on for, don't complain now. And if you didn't know, it's your fault. Right, don?

[fliion]

So, here's the scene.

In the Red corner is pilot A. Pilot A is already employed by this Company. He is a known quantity. He was previously a senior trainer on the 330/340 fleet who left EK over ten years ago. During his tenure away from EK he'd been an EASA qualified TRE on the A319/320 and came back to EK as a DEC onto the A320 private jet. Shortly after rejoining, he was informed that there wasn't really enough work to justify keeping him solely on that fleet so he'd have to fly the 330 too. Fine, not really an issue. However, a year or so later when the last 330 retired he was moved over to the 380, but because of some daft and inflexible policy restriction, right seat. Rather magnanimously EK declared he could keep rank, privileges and pay! (sarcasm) That situation, you could argue, may be acceptable for a short time filler. That he's now required to undergo a full Command course, including tech test, psychology evaluation, interview board, two day CRM, full ground school and all the simulator and line training assessments, simply beggars belief. And if that's not ridiculous enough, the fact that he's currently a trainer, examining both Captains and F/O's and signing of their licences every day, merely highlights what a debacle this over complicated and under thought upgrade policy has become. Thank god he's over 35!!!

In the blue corner, Captain B. Captain B is about to join us as a DEC from some slightly dodgy outfit with a few aircraft. Although he will have a 3 day interview and selection process with simulator, he's a lesser known quantity than Captain A. He will also NOT be required to do a separate Command interview. He will NOT be required to take a technical exam on the aircraft systems. He will NOT be required to do a separate two day CRM command course. In fact, he will not be required to undertake a whole host of checks and assessments that pilot A has done and will have to.

Given the choice, which one would any sensible person, with even half an ounce of common sense choose? We've just lost one Deputy on the Boeing and may be about to lose another. That's after losing the DSVP last year due to moral and integrity contradictions with executive management. The SVP left for more personal reasons.

If our EVP's intent is to encourage and support policies such as this, the long term future of this Company can not be viewed as a positive one.

Harry

Edited to add;

bringbackthe80s. I'm sure that fliion's comments were more in aghast than agreement, at least that's how I read it.

Correct Harry - aghast covers it 👍

[olster]

When I was there, I rapidly got to realise the ‘Alice in Wonderland’ approach to reality that was Emirates Airlines. Common sense disappeared. I was at a meeting whereby it was declared that turbo prop pilots were the holy grail answer to recruitment. Dissenting voices were glossed over and ignored. Not that turbo prop pilots are not skilled at what they do - far from it. However it was / is a mighty big leap to wide body global ops. The aviation version of political correctness is to imply that tp pilots are ‘real’ pilots and the rest of us are just button pushers. We all know that is an over simplification. Manifestly Harry is right. However, once again common sense leaves the room. Or how about an A380 SFE who has never flown an Airbus for real? And not reticent about criticising senior A380 captains. A bit like a first aider checking a consultant surgeon. I was constantly amazed at the juxtaposition between the perceived glamour external to ek and the internal realty. You couldn’t make it up.

[donpizmeov]

Harold pilot A did some of my command training 15yrs ago. What a gent. What a waste of talent.

Sounds about right nolimit. FOs have been bypassed by DECs for a few decades. It ain't right but it ain't new.

[Capn Rex Havoc]

HTC - Pilot C - the Amsterdam offload - Demoted and after 6 months as FO, also told he has to to the complete command selection and command course again.
:ugh:

[donpizmeov]

Pilot C does has a dodgy haircut. The treatment he has received typifies the way this place is run. A travesty.

[cerbus]

Harry, you’re just now coming to the conclusion that the long term prospects for Emirates are not positive? This operation and the treatment of its pilots have been off the rails for years but I’m glad you see what so many of us have been whinging about. We all know the only thing we can do is leave and that is why so many pilots are indeed leaving.
Why doesn’t the pilot in the Red corner you described just leave and go to a better airline? He’s been shafted beyond belief. I know you are not his representative (that would be illegal mate) but there’s only so much a human can take.

[globalexpat]

Correct Harry - aghast covers it 👍

Fake news .DEC’s are required to undergo the full screening , psychological assessment , command training & type technical course. Unless there has been a change in the policy recently.