View Full Version : Ayers Rock helicopter crash
John Eacott
17th Jan 2018, 11:07
Helicopter crashes near Ayers Rock (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-17/helicopter-crashes-near-uluru-with-four-people-on-board/9337446)
Emergency crews in Central Australia are responding to a helicopter crash near Yulara, close to Uluru.
The Health Department said four people were on board when the helicopter crashed at 6:30pm about 1.5km west of the tourist hub.
Three people are expected to be transferred to hospital and at least one has a suspected spinal injury.
A police spokeswoman told the ABC that no one was trapped in the wreckage and that one passenger was seriously injured.
The extent of the injuries to the other passengers is not yet known.
"It's a remote area that's not easy to get to," the spokeswoman said.
The emergency operation is likely to continue into the night, she said.
Medical clinic staff from Yulara are assisting at the scene, and the Royal Flying Doctor Service is on its way.
The Australian Transport Safety Bureau has been notified of the incident, police said.
blakmax
18th Jan 2018, 00:40
Crash happened 1830 local time. Pilot and one passenger with spinal injuries. Scenic flight around Uluru (Ayers Rock) in Northern Territory.
Helicopter crashes near Uluru with four people on board - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-17/helicopter-crashes-near-uluru-with-four-people-on-board/9337446)
Blakmax
John Eacott
18th Jan 2018, 04:46
Update:
Uluru helicopter crash leaves two serious (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/breaking-news/uluru-helicopter-crash-leaves-two-serious/news-story/e68726927d15cb50cf58ff3d55ef3c00)
A helicopter on a scenic flight lost rotor power and was forced into an emergency landing near Uluru, seriously injuring the pilot and one of three passengers.
The single-engine Robinson R44 came down hard in scrubland shortly after taking off on a sunset tour about 6pm on Wednesday at a remote site 1.5km west of Yulara and 800 metres into scrubland from the helipad.
"During climb, the pilot received a low rotor speed warning, entered an autorotation and conducted a forced landing on a sand dune," the Australian Transport Safety Bureau, which is investigating, said in a statement on Thursday.
"The helicopter subsequently rolled, resulting in serious injuries to the pilot and one passenger."
The 32-year-old pilot and a 32-year-old male passenger were airlifted to the Royal Adelaide Hospital where they both remained in a serious but stable condition with spinal and other injuries.
The other passengers, a 46-year-old woman and 35-year-old man, were treated for less serious injuries in the Alice Springs Hospital.
All three passengers are Australians.
Professional Helicopter Services, which operated the flight, said despite the pilot's best efforts to put down safely, the chopper slid down the dune and ended up on its side.
"Our immediate priority is for the welfare of our passengers and our pilot," the company said in a statement.
"Our local team worked closely with authorities to secure their rescue in difficult terrain and we are very proud of the way they handled what was a difficult and distressing situation."
The company said it had been running tourist operations at Uluru for 27 years and pledged to co-operate fully with investigations into the incident.
"The tourist operating community here is a tight-knit one and we are all in shock at what has occurred," a spokesman said.
"Our thoughts and prayers go out to the passengers involved in this incident and, of course, the pilot who is both our colleague and friend."
Northern Territory Police established a crime scene at the crash site as they waited for ATSB investigators to arrive.
The ATSB said it would interview the pilot and witnesses and review all available evidence as part of its inquiries.
MJA Chaser
18th Jan 2018, 05:05
https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/26678612_1780755931972236_4300469770113612436_o.jpg?oh=c2473 b5fe62cbde077039a57d672e57c&oe=5AE941AA
https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/26757218_1780755928638903_2387562429796984102_o.jpg?oh=97369 8bb75943a5f19ba20c0f4f3dc42&oe=5ADCD0B5
Some photos courtesy of the local TV network
"During climb, the pilot received a low rotor speed warning, entered an autorotation and conducted a forced landing on a sand dune," the Australian Transport Safety Bureau, which is investigating, said in a statement on Thursday. Be interesting to see what the final investigation shows - mechanical issues or handling issues.
At least they are all alive:ok:
if only they had had a second engine.......:E
mickjoebill
18th Jan 2018, 09:50
http://orbicair.com/images/F43214264.jpg
It is heartening to see a fall in the incidences of post crash fires in R44s.
Naturally, by strengthening the weakest link the next weakest link becomes more apparent.
Do the half height, potentially back breaking front seat backs need a rethink?
Mjb
Bell_ringer
18th Jan 2018, 11:20
Do the half height, potentially back breaking front seat backs need a rethink?
Not to mention those gps devices mounted just above the pilots feet - seems a great way to lose a leg.
The Nr Fairy
18th Jan 2018, 11:43
Do the half height, potentially back breaking front seat backs need a rethink
Depends how familiar you are with the under-seat construction. If you are great, if not then the structure below all seats is designed to collapse.
Not to mention those gps devices mounted just above the pilots feet - seems a great way to lose a leg.
How are they mounted? The only two ways I've seen GPS mounted in R22 or R44 is on top of the binnacle, out of the way of legs, or suction mounts on the windscreen, which would give way before a leg.
gulliBell
18th Jan 2018, 12:17
Curious choice of landing spot, looks like open flat space only 20 meters away from the sand dune. Two things to celebrate...everybody survived, and the demise of another R-whatever-it-is. No way they going to rebuild that wreck, might as well dig a hole where it lays and bury it.
Do the half height, potentially back breaking front seat backs need a rethink?please tell me that isn't a metal bar positioned just below where a lumbar support should be in a real seat.
Radgirl
18th Jan 2018, 13:11
OK shock horror brigade, lets have some evidence. Lets see some hyper extension thoracic spine injuries from 44s. I am not aware of any.
The normal forces are downwards into the various collapsible sections (cushion, luggage compartment, skin, skids) or deceleration (ie spinal flexion) or lateral shears from rolling. How often do you get an accelerational force so you extend backwards over the top of the seat???
Dont worry I am sure there are other shock horror items you can identify. Yes it is made down to a price and needs to be treated with care, but without Frank Robinson most of us could never have afforded to learn....
gulliBell
18th Jan 2018, 13:34
The seats in many helicopters are not comfortable or ergonomic. $40,000 USD+ to replace a crew seat in a 412 yet the seat in my $40,000 KIA is infinitely more comfortable, and probably more crash worthy.
Looking closer at the picture, I realise the bar is behind the two front seats - must get new glasses:ok:
but without Frank Robinson most of us could never have afforded to learn.... and a lot of people would still be alive.............
Radgirl
18th Jan 2018, 17:13
And without Bell or MD or Airbus more people would also still be alive Crab.
There is a book we use in medical school called 'how to lie with statistics'. The statistic I like is the fact that helicopters are the only form of transport that have saved more lives than they have cost, and obviously in no small part down to you and your colleagues. We can argue this all night, but there would be even less of an industry with no Robinsons. And more accidents are due to the driver than the hardware, but this isnt really the discussion to have when people have been injured and the cause is unknown. I just get fed up with the same old same old on every thread.
It's a single-engined piston that lost power in the climb, despite many people here saying how great and reliable they are.
It was carrying fare-paying passengers and it crashed - at least this one didn't kill any.
Bell, MD and Airbus all make helicopters that have saved many thousands of lives - Robinson doesn't.
Robbies clearly aren't the only type of helicopter that crashes but they are often the weapon of choice for low-cost commercial operations so being more crashworthy would be a good thing.
Thomas coupling
18th Jan 2018, 18:46
Look like 1970's citroen 2 cv seats to me.
Mind when you buy the Lada of the skies you get Lada value.
Good riddance to another death trap of a helicopter.
One could argue that if the same happened again and they were in a properly thought out and designed helo - no-one would have been badly injured.
Lonewolf_50
18th Jan 2018, 19:57
Does this really need to turn into another Robbie bashing thread? (I've never flown a Robbie, but a couple of good friends have). It would be nice to avoid that hobby this time around. Glad to see no fatalities, those pictures give me chills.
Bell_ringer
18th Jan 2018, 20:28
How are they mounted? The only two ways I've seen GPS mounted in R22 or R44 is on top of the binnacle, out of the way of legs, or suction mounts on the windscreen, which would give way before a leg.
Look again. Standard options available with a large gps mount above the pilot's legs.
JBL99
18th Jan 2018, 20:39
I just get fed up with the same old same old on every thread.
Couldn't agree more! Let's have another go at Frank Robinson!
Someone once told me a quote "those that know little, same the same thing often" I've used that in all sorts of situations.
Let's see what the reports says, and avoid the tiresome Robbie bashing, We all know those that will bash them, and we know your opinions of them, so please give those of us that have learnt on them, a break!
SuperF
18th Jan 2018, 20:53
I "love" the idea that the crumple zone for the front seat is onto the lower legs and feet of the rear pax! Hopefully the rear pax doesn't jam something hard and sharp down under the front seats.
I have sat in a 44, in a hangar, and was surprised at how little room they had in the rear.
gulliBell
18th Jan 2018, 21:53
The only time a Robinson helicopter brought a smile to my face - apart from all the times when they meet their untimely demise - is watching PigmanTV "Aporkalypse Next" videos on YouTube. I don't know how that thing gets in the air and stays there with all those 250+ lb people on board, cameras, guns and ammo in the Texas heat.
homonculus
18th Jan 2018, 23:57
Sorry SuperF but you too are having a swipe that is not based on fact. The rear seats footwell do not go under the front seat or its crumple zone. You can crumple the front seat without and infringement of the rear seatwell.
As Radgirl says, same old same old. Nobody is claiming they are the best (except the seats are far more comfortable than a 206 !!!) but the silly comments just get repeated.
tartare
19th Jan 2018, 04:07
Hooo-eeeh.
Just been watchin' me some Aporkolypse videos on the Internet.
Good ole boys, big-guns an heelocopters!
Loving it...!!!
omeone once told me a quote "those that know little, same the same thing often" I've used that in all sorts of situations.
just for perspective, I have flown a Robinson, I have a type rating on my licence for it and I have crashed in one - does that make me eligible to comment?
mickjoebill
19th Jan 2018, 12:46
There are headrests in cars to mitigate whiplash and also offer some protection for the front passengers from impacts from behind, such as the head of a unrestrained rear seat passengers
Not all impacts are solely vertical.
A forward component will induce whiplash where the rebound movement is not absorbed by a headrest (as it is in a motor vehicle)
I’m very aware of crash forces involved ect ect and have a few hundred hours in rear seat of R44 and a decent knowledge of engineering of aircraft frames.
Seems doable to design a head rest that can be integrated into existing seat or as a bolt in replacement.
Is that a “silly” idea ?
Mjb
The Nr Fairy
19th Jan 2018, 14:48
Look again. Standard options available with a large gps mount above the pilot's legs.
I did say "the two only ways I've seen", wasn't aware of that one.
please tell me that isn't a metal bar positioned just below where a lumbar support should be in a real seat.
There is a bar towards the top of the seats. From memory, roughly where the lumbar region would be it's not a bar but sheet metal formed into the rear of the seat "crumple zone" - http://www.heliair.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Robinson-R44-Cadet-New-Rear-Baggage-Space.jpg for a little more detail.
SuperF
20th Jan 2018, 06:08
Sorry SuperF but you too are having a swipe that is not based on fact. The rear seats footwell do not go under the front seat or its crumple zone. You can crumple the front seat without and infringement of the rear seatwell.
As Radgirl says, same old same old. Nobody is claiming they are the best (except the seats are far more comfortable than a 206 !!!) but the silly comments just get repeated.
Not having a go, really did think that when I got into it my feet poked under the front seats.
Look like 1970's citroen 2 cv seats to me.
Mind when you buy the Lada of the skies you get Lada value.
Good riddance to another death trap of a helicopter.
One could argue that if the same happened again and they were in a properly thought out and designed helo - no-one would have been badly injured.
http://aircraftownershipsolutions.com/files_uploaded/32f9fe1d856db84ac9c8a2a8bba36536.jpg
Seat height is very similar to those installed in Piper Cherokee 140’s....in the 1960’s.
You’d only hope they’d come up with something better by now.
But weight = money in aviation.
Especially helicopters.
gulliBell
20th Jan 2018, 06:36
Makes me fidget just looking at the photo...not a place I want to be. Although conceded, shanking hogs out of one with an automatic AR-15 would be tempting.
cattletruck
20th Jan 2018, 10:01
Methinks the injuries would be a result of not landing with both skids flat on that dune which didn't allow the skids to splay absorbing most of the energy. Rolling over upside down wouldn't help the spine either. Remember, Alice Springs area is +40C (if not near 50C with the current heatwave) this time of year.
No way they going to rebuild that wreck
Don't underestimate the ability of PHS engineers....
The good thing is there was no post crash fire which was once normal with hard landings on that type. Wishing those injured a speedy recovery.
heliduck
20th Jan 2018, 12:08
Makes me fidget just looking at the photo...not a place I want to be. Although conceded, shanking hogs out of one with an automatic AR-15 would be tempting.
36000 ferals have met their demise from marksmen & myself in an R44, great machines for the job. Great job for the first few years, but the more you do it the less you want to do it. I still want the ferals eradicated due to the damage they cause, I’m just glad it’s someone else doing it now.