Concorde Designing the Dream Programme

[cyclic35]

Freeview Channel 5 Monday 4th December at 21:00.
Might be worth a look.

[Wander00]

It will be interesting to see if Marshalls get a mention, having designed the nose and visor for all but the first prototype (a bit of tautology there, but you know what I mean), and built at least some ( I worked on nos 2 & 3 numbered I think, 002 and 003 - it was a long time ago

[cyclic35]

Have just discovered the programme is in two parts.
Hope it is not a repeat of three already shown.

[spekesoftly]

It's flagged as "New" on various TV guides, so seemingly not a repeat.

[Lyneham Lad]

Let's hope that the programme is more informative than Channel 5's website listing! (http://www.channel5.com/show/concorde/)

[spekesoftly]

From the Radio Times online:-

In service from 1976 to 2003, there was something so 1980s about the world’s first supersonic passenger plane. In its heyday, people would stop and point when Concorde soared overhead, maybe wondering if Joan Collins were on board, swigging vintage champagne.

Even if you're not into aviation history, this is an intriguing story of barrier-breaking and international one-upmanship. Over tea and biscuits, engineer Ted Talbot shows us his diagrams from the early 60s, but the project didn't get off the ground until a financial "entente concordiale" with France. Old newsreel footage bills the aircraft as a glimpse into the future. Ironically, its paper-dart design still looks futuristic now.

Summary

First of a two-part documentary in which aircraft designers, pilots and passengers tell the story of how the Anglo-French Concorde saw off competition from the Americans and Soviets to become the world's first supersonic passenger airliner. Michael Heseltine describes how the Americans made it impossible for Concorde to be sold to any other airlines other than the national carriers of Britain and France, and even went so far as to try and ban it from the route it had been designed for - London to New York.

Summary

Part two of two. A look at British Airways's attempts in the early 1980s to make the aircraft profitable after finding out Concorde was losing tens of millions a year, sacking those who were in charge and replacing them with two pilots. Former cabin crew explain the level of service their customers expected and how things could sometimes get out of hand with the free-flowing wine and champagne.

[Wander00]

aah is that going to be the "Mach 2 Club" rather than the "Mile High Club"?.......

[RetiredBA/BY]

A really excellent programme, first class, featuring some very rare footage!

Brought back some wonderful memories of this fantastically brilliant aircraft.

[cyclic35]

A really excellent programme, first class, featuring some very rare footage!

Brought back some wonderful memories of this fantastically brilliant aircraft.

Thank you for the report BA/BY. Pleased you found it interesting.
Hope others will find the same.

[RedhillPhil]

The commentator stated a couple of times that Concorde was the only aircraft that could "supercruise". My understanding is that "supercruise" refers to travelling at M1+ without re-heat. I thought that Lightnings could do that too.
Is that right?

[TURIN]

I see one of Pprunes very own M2chaps was in evidence.

Nice programme and good to see Mr Talbot still going strong. His book, Concorde, A Designer's Life is well worth picking up. :ok:

[KiloB]

The commentator stated a couple of times that Concorde was the only aircraft that could "supercruise". My understanding is that "supercruise" refers to travelling at M1+ without re-heat. I thought that Lightnings could do that too.
Is that right?

Correct, but later the commentator qualified his comment with the clarification that he was referring to a supercruise speed of M2.0. This was the level of ability that is still unchallenged.

[Wander00]

SWMBO totally mystified by my absorbtion in the TV programme and the occasional lump in my throat. For my part, working on the nose and visor of two aircraft still one of the highlights in what to my good fortune has been an interesting life. As the man said, could still have been making money. What the programme did make clear, and what was clear even at my minor level at the time was the technological advance(s) the project represented. I am very proud of my tiny contribution.

[RedhillPhil]

Correct, but later the commentator qualified his comment with the clarification that he was referring to a supercruise speed of M2.0. This was the level of ability that is still unchallenged.


Ah, right.
Thankyou.

[Lyneham Lad]

Still trying to get my head around the quote that 64% of the thrust came from the way the air intake system was configured...

[Molemot]

Back before BA got ETOPS clearance for the 777, they were running them from London to Paris. I was airside at TN4 when one of these came in...the very latest thing in the skies. As the passengers (mostly Americans) made their way to Immigration, they got on the travelator...which took them past the stand where Concorde sat. Things went crazy... out came the cameras and phones and they started walking backwards on the travelator, in their efforts to record their encounter with a design done by slide rule and blokes in sports jackets with leather elbows, thirty years before ....

[Rigga]

I had a flight in one for my 40th birthday! 3 hours around UK.

[kaitakbowler]

In conversation with a member of BA ground staff at Dulles, he told me that 3 things bought the airport to a standstill :-

Concorde.

Harrier.

The Reds.

Made us (SWMBO and I) quite proud.

[Wander00]

Kaitak - and rightly so, them and you

[Buster15]

Still trying to get my head around the quote that 64% of the thrust came from the way the air intake system was configured...

Yet another really clever part of the whole design. You have to slow the air down so they used con/di intake doors or ramps. Obviously the faster you fly the bigger the impact of bernoulli effect. Just as clever was the use of the exhaust nozzle constantly moving to keep the LP Compressor at its optimum speed (NL root theta) as well as using the thrust reverser buckets to utilise the exhaust pressure recovery. That is why the aircraft could cruise @ Mach 2 without reheat. We always think that later generations are more clever but clearly without any computers they were seriously brilliant.

[tdracer]

Still trying to get my head around the quote that 64% of the thrust came from the way the air intake system was configured...
Just to add a bit to what Buster wrote - that's the case for pretty much any aircraft designed to cruise supersonic - you get most of the thrust from the pressure distribution over the inlet and exhaust. The engine is mainly there to create and maintain the airflow, it's direct contribution to the net thrust is secondary. The SR-71 was another example - IIRC something like 85-90% of the thrust at Mach 3 was from the inlet and exhaust.

[Lyneham Lad]

Yet another really clever part of the whole design. You have to slow the air down so they used con/di intake doors or ramps. Obviously the faster you fly the bigger the impact of bernoulli effect. Just as clever was the use of the exhaust nozzle constantly moving to keep the LP Compressor at its optimum speed (NL root theta) as well as using the thrust reverser buckets to utilise the exhaust pressure recovery. That is why the aircraft could cruise @ Mach 2 without reheat. We always think that later generations are more clever but clearly without any computers they were seriously brilliant.

Thank you Buster & tdracer for the explanations. Alles klar jetzt ;)

[cyclic35]

The second part shown this evening, 11th Dec, had many revealing anecdotes. To see the factors contributing to the fatal crash, was quite shocking. What a tragic loss.

[Lyneham Lad]

On Flight Global:-
ANALYSIS: Fifty years since the iconic Concorde's roll-out (https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/analysis-fifty-years-since-the-iconic-concordes-ro-443623/?cmpid=NLC|FGFG|FGFIN-2017-1212-GLOB&sfid=70120000000taAh)

Snip:-
Half a century ago this week, a dart-like airliner that promised to revolutionise the air-transport industry broke cover in Toulouse.

And the state-of-the-art machine that emerged would henceforth be referred to universally with the French spelling of its name – Concorde. Although it would not go on to the revolutionise the industry – that task fell to the its peer, the Boeing 747 –the Anglo-French supersonic transport captivated the public’s imagination throughout the world, thanks to its aesthetic design and eye-watering performance. Its beauty, combined with a passenger clientele that usually comprised business leaders, politicians and showbiz types, created a mystic-like image among the general public.