Cathay shuts down roadshow.

[Avinthenews]

Longreach aviation roadshow cancelled due to legal advice!

One day before the event ffs

http://www.longreachchina.com/roadshows/hkg-registration/

[Trafalgar]

Repost from another thread:

This is the sort of nefarious behaviour that I love to see being committed by CX management. They think they are being 'clever', but all they do is help reinforce what a corrupted, venal and ultimately doomed group of losers they really are. In a proper first world environment (hello HK Govt, you are anything but), this sort of bs could not happen. The only way CX can function is in this third world polluted hellhole where the rule of law is a joke at best. That is why the only threat to conditions is being made against HK pilots, and not those on bases. HK is the only place their tactics have a hope of working without transgressing every labour law worth the name. In any event, Longreach will use this to their advantage, as a gentle reminder to all who they speak to of the facts of life in HK , which will only help their case of attracting many more CX/KA pilots. No matter what tactics CX employs, their panic is evident, and the exodus begins. This has just shown how panicked they really are. Anna and Rupert have made yet another strategic blunder.

[Frogman1484]

Cathay has just blinked, they are panicking that the senior pilots do leave en mass. The do not have the training capacity to train and they know they will park jets if we leave. This also tells you that they cannot give you a sign or get fired letter, as they cannot afford to lose their crews.
It would be interesting to find out what legal action they threatened Longreach with.


Longreach aviation roadshow cancelled due to legal advice!

One day before the event ffs

http://www.longreachchina.com/roadshows/hkg-registration/

[Shep69]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdCOZBLAcuQ

[Average Fool]

Brilliant move. TTW at its very best.

Im thinking this strategery came from the cunning fuel hedge team.

I can't wait to see what's next.

[BlankBox]

https://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/838567h23.jpg

...compliments SCMP... appropriate ... :p

[Apple Tree Yard]

Don't know whether to laugh or cry. Does CX management seriously think this will be a POSITIVE for them? All it does is reinforce in everyone's mind what a malicious group they work for. Another impetus to make the break and find a better company to dedicate a career towards. A better confirmation of the resignation rate spiraling out of control I would be challenged to find. And Anna, have you not heard of the INTERNET? You know, the medium that Longreach can happily correspond all day every day with your pilots. Unbelievable. Reminds me of the buggy whip salesmen when the car started to appear... :ooh:

[Apple Tree Yard]

I up vote Dan's comment. AOA, there is NO need to negotiate anything, especially not concessions. Let them cut, and see how that only accelerates the exodus from CX. I'm ok with that. Don't play the game by their rules.

[Air Profit]

Agreed. Anna, go ahead and try cutting my housing and pension. You WILL be having another resignation on your Training Managers desk. I'm not staying in HK without the package I was lured to HK on. Anything less and i'm gone. Not a bluff, not negotiable. I've already made up my mind. Just waiting for you to jump off that cliff once and for all. The fact that nowhere in any of your rhetoric is there mention of YOU and your fellow managers taking the first cuts says everything about your integrity that needs saying. I have to wonder what it is like being someone without morals, conscience or integrity? All I see are the results. As for the Longreach issue: you people are pathetic, and your panic is evident, and palpable.

[Some How I'm Tired]

I think that the Managing Director of Longreach was probably threatened with termination for 'acting against the best interests of CX'. He is a CX pilot.

[Air Profit]

I don't understand. CX has be 'best' package in the industry, so why would it matter if a recruitment company had a road show? Surely CX is happy to have their package stand on it's merits. sarc

[goathead]

Would he let that be worrying him?
With several hundred +++ And the the fact the event was over subscribed surely he would be would be thinking about the big picture here.....

And as for the BA and Qantas roadshows are they off now as well?

[Air Profit]

Just another sign of abject panic. Same as with the "Drinks for 'Cargo' Pilots". Same as with the meet and greet for Trainers. It all clearly demonstrates that our management are crap@ing themselves. They thought they would have a go, and now it has triggered an armageddon in their crew retention numbers. The floodgates have just cracked open and nothing will stop the exodus. Too many CX crew have concluded that there is NO hope of a career in HK. They are making plans to secure a seniority number elsewhere. Nice one Anna.

[arse]

Emirates also considering a roadshow to HK. Not a good option for all, but certainly would be for some. Right time, right place, right move.

[hyg]

I think that the Managing Director of Longreach was probably threatened with termination for 'acting against the best interests of CX'. He is a CX pilot.


I have a feeling it has something to do with work visa like that Hidden Agenda case few mths ago.... Rmb few months ago, Hidden Agenda - a mini concert hosting company, was shut down because the gov claimed they were hosting concerts - commercial events, in non-approved location which was against the use of building and the performers have no valid work visa and were subsequently arrested by immigration?

[Trafalgar]

That will be easy to get around (although personally I suspect CX has a hand in this). Just hire some HK residents to manage the event. Sorted.

[hyg]

That will be easy to get around (although personally I suspect CX has a hand in this). Just hire some HK residents to manage the event. Sorted.

Certainly agree with the part in red, they were probably the one who called Immi.....

It can be dealt with easily but probably not when it gets shut down at the last minute, the person who speaks on stage will just likely to be similar to a performer, someone who needs a work visa to be safe as this event is kinda 'business' related, and how fast the hk gov can do things when it comes to last minute stuff is something you and I both know;)

[Who stole my meds]

Have the roadshow in Macau.
It's only an hour ferry ride away. Wouldn't be that inconvenient would it??

[The FUB]

To quote from the CX DFO

"If you're only here for the benefits, there are better places to be."

As you desperately want the expensive, greedy pilots to leave.

If you want us to go so badly, why cancel the Longreach Roadshow?

[Air Profit]

The pathetic, and very telling part of that quote from Anna is that SHE is here for the pay and benefits, she just doesn't want anyone else to have the same. Hypocrite of the highest order. :yuk:

[GMEDX]

The benefits are essential. If it weren't for the housing, medical and education benefits it would be impossible to stay here. Cut any of those and we all need to recalculate. A 10% cut might be manageable if there were genuine reasons for it but the manner in which it is being imposed and so poorly managed will cause far more to leave than if it were done in a mature and collaborative way.

[Loopdeloop]

If CX had anything to do with this then it's laughable. You can't force people to stay but you can persuade them, although at present they seem more hellbent on persuading pilots to leave!

Perhaps they need reacquainting with the story of The North Wind and The Sun to fill a gap in their education.

[Frogman1484]

Just heard that CX is definitely behind the legal threat.
That was really dumb of them as it shows their fear of losing pilots to the chinese carriers.

[BusyB]

How can you make a legal threat against a company advertising job vacancies? Surely this is a joke.

[hyg]

How can you make a legal threat against a company advertising job vacancies? Surely this is a joke.

probably just call immigration about someone hosting a business event at an inappropriate venue without valid visa

[raven11]

So the agency will get the appropriate visas and hold the roadshow next month, or alternatively they will hold it in Macau.

They can always host a live event on the internet...

[VR-HFX]

I recently had a long conversation with an ex MD of this outfit and he was basically non-plussed that AT was appointed. Poor Rupert was handed a turd sandwich but after his CNCo experience he should know what a ship on the reef means. As MD, he has a small window in which to act. My guess is that he will do nothing, but if he is reading this, I say “Rupert...do what you’re instincts tell you”. Not what Barnaby, Chris et al are saying.

[raven11]

SCMP: Meetings to poach Cathay pilots cancelled after legal warning

Meetings to tempt Cathay Pacific pilots to switch jobs cancelled after legal warning | South China Morning Post (http://m.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/economy/article/2116757/meetings-tempt-cathay-pacific-pilots-switch-jobs-cancelled)

[betpump5]

But the important thing is that DS and the GC are still talking and playing happy families. Way to go Boys. Never mind that a guy has been dismissed on some Mickey Mouse charge and a roadshow shut down.

[Metro man]

I heard it was something to do with operating an employment agency without a licence.

[Oval3Holer]

What about employing pilots without a work permit? CX has been reported to the appropriate government agencies and they do nothing.

[betpump5]

Oval, are you insinuating that Cathay abides by the rules when it suits them and throws caution to the wind when it doesn't? Slander!

[Starbear]

Oval, are you insinuating that Cathay abides by the rules when it suits them and throws caution to the wind when it doesn't? Slander!

The following is lifted from comments section today's SCMP article about the roadshow being cancelled:

My red bolding, otherwise verbatim. I really could not be bothered to register to point out the irony in posting such a comment in an article about Cathay Pacific. Or to highlight its numerous court appearances on dubious corporate tactics and disregard for employment law in many countries.

"I.m._Wong 9 hours 24 min ago

Longreach Aviation, an AUSTRALIA- and Hong Kong-based company hiring for....
I am in no doubt the company is wholly run and operated by Australians. What do you expect from the descendants of the penal colonialists? Decency and honourable business dealings?"

But then again the same dipsh*t posted this as well:

"I.m._Wong 1 hour 47 sec ago

Cathay pays the bill sending their new recruits to be trained a good pilot in Australia's flying schools (now an expanding Aussie industry). When fully qualified, the stealthy Aussie come and steal the newly qualified CX pilot.
Meaning HK passengers are paying the devious Aussies twice over for the same goods, and their training schools have endless supply of HK new trainees.
Shameless!"


He could even be posting on here.

[BlunderBus]

This really needs no discussion ...to all interested parties the facts surely speak for themselves.
If you intend to reside and work in Hong Kong this is a perfect example of how your rights as human beings will be treated. It's undeniable.

[humbleppl]

The benefits are essential. If it weren't for the housing, medical and education benefits it would be impossible to stay here. Cut any of those and we all need to recalculate. A 10% cut might be manageable if there were genuine reasons for it but the manner in which it is being imposed and so poorly managed will cause far more to leave than if it were done in a mature and collaborative way.

Pay cuts for front line staff (in this case well trained and experienced pilots; one reason why we passengers fly CX/ KA) because the management placed the wrong fuel and currency bets? Guys, get out as long as you can. If no serious management change is coming immediately, this was it for CX/ KA.

Buy the way: The loss of pilots (be it 10, 20 or 200) is one thing. But how on earth will they attract good replacement? They won't. No bus drivers, you walk. Or take a different bus!

[Oval3Holer]

Stealthy Aussie descendants of penal colonists! Love it! What a phrase!

[Air Profit]

Blunderbus. Correct on all counts. A striking example of the disdain for fair play that CX management have, and how you can translate that same attitude as to how they treat their employees. They could not have helped give many of us the impetus to leave CX if they had tried. Another own goal. "Time to Win".

[azhkman]

I like the idea of running it in Macau. Perhaps those interested in joining the event can pitch in and charter a CX plane from HKG to MFM to attend if the numbers are high enough.

[Who stole my meds]

It'd be even better if RWY 16 is in use.
Make the 20 min trip all the more worthwhile :)

[Rated De]

"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." -Gandhi



As O'Leary on bended knee is learning..

O'Leary had accused pilots of being “precious about themselves” and “full of their own self-importance”, adding: “I would challenge any pilot to explain how this is a difficult job or how it is they are overworked, or how anybody who by law can’t fly more than 18 hours a week could possibly be suffering from fatigue.”


It is only a few years ago, Joyce told Qantas pilots they were kamikazes..
his PR witch Wirth stating they wanted first class travel and massages during the 2011 dispute....

It is the IR model;denigration and derision.

Longreach are doing what professional bodies do; control supply.

Sadly to airline management with embedded adversarial IR models to them as hammers, every problem is a nail..

:ok:

This is a structural shortage not cyclical.

[Frogman1484]

Heard that since the article appeared in the SCMP, more Chinese airlines want to present their packages at the next roadshow. They can all smell blood in the water.

[Cpt. Underpants]

I've received an offer from a 777 operator in China (for type rated captains) of $348000 USD net per year. Guaranteed 10 consecutive days off per month, guaranteed biz to any destination they fly to as a commuter.

Put that one in your pipe and smoke it, Anna.

[Freehills]

As my kids would say - "Don't let the doorknob hitya where the good lord splitya"

Good luck Cpt U & safe travels

[Arfur Dent]

If it seems too good to be true……….
That's a hell of a lot of money. Do they fly to Europe?

[Cpt. Underpants]

Yes they do. I’m NAM, so it fits the bill for me!

[Frogman1484]

Can you pm the company’s name.

I've received an offer from a 777 operator in China (for type rated captains) of $348000 USD net per year. Guaranteed 10 consecutive days off per month, guaranteed biz to any destination they fly to as a commuter.

Put that one in your pipe and smoke it, Anna.

[arse]

No harm in posting the airline and contact here.
Assuming tax free?
The airline would allow assessment of their network for commuting.

[goathead]

Whats the most amusing thing here
Is all the info floating around on private channels away from forums etc but in the real world about how much interest their is and how many blokes ( no offence , just haven’t seen any sheilas taking interest ) are keen
It’s mindblowing I’m completely gobsmacked

[ANTIPHOLUS]

Yes every man and his dog has received this email. The devil, of course is in the detail. It says possibly up to that sum. It’s also the HNA Group. Well known for keeping their promises.

[goathead]

Not only HNA

[ANTIPHOLUS]

Hear he. Hear ye.

[Cpt. Underpants]

Suparna Airlines (formerly Yangtze River Airlines) B777 TR, B744 NTR, B787
China Southern
B777 TR
HNA of course B777 TR B787 NTR
Additionally, $12000 USD annual loyalty bonus
And $3000 USD for each referral successfully recruited.
www.smile-aviation.com

[arse]

Emirates will also consider DEC 777 TR pilots. Might suit some, but not all. As a result of the current situation, they are also considering a roadshow.

[Trafalgar]

Good friend in EK. He said that their management are panicking as well. Effectively have 'parked' almost 40 aircraft by virtue of lower than optimal daily utilisation. All of a sudden, they are very keen to keep and nurture their pilots. I wonder if that sentiment will catch on here?

[Fly747]

Yes. EK made a big fuss about receiving their 100th 380 but are very secretive about how many they can effectively operate.

[Fly747]

And to get back to the topic; this has all been such good advertising for Longreach too!

[BizJetJockey]

It begs the question...Do Longreach even need to carry out a roadshow?!:}

[Dan Winterland]

Perhaps not now!

[bringbackthe80s]

Guys guys guys there’ s the elephant in the room here..they are ALL mainland China companies.

[kahaha]

Exactly. So you resign from CX , do 6 months of " training" with CS. By the time this is completed you need to renew your meds. Ah ha, Dr Xi says : we detect abnormal blood flow in yer neck ultrasound. Not like 21 yr old china airforce boy. We now take away medical. You go to office. Bye bye .

Better the CX devil you know , even if she wears Prada;)

[Trafalgar]

Kahaha. Post #3. Management Troll. Ignore.

[ANTIPHOLUS]

He's correct though; the list of things you can be invalided out for is endless..Had any moles removed after a lifetime in tropical climes ? Cannot.. Gall bladder removed? Cannot. Occasional extra heartbeat when you're knackered, slightly high BP ? Cannot. Varicous veins. Cannot.
I'm sure you get the général idea. In fact the only area that you might get some médical leeway is eyesight, as they're all frigging blind.
Of course our mainland cousins are positive paragons of health, their bodies are temples..
That bonus somebody alluded too. Been sick more than a few days have we ? Cannot. Not complied fully with SOP's (as monitored by FDAP and your copilots). Cannot.
So overall, caveat emptor..And no, I'm very far from a management troll. Just a pragmatist. And PRC is very far from the answer..just look at the turnover over the road..and they're obliged to comply with quasi décent legislation.
Traf, with your agitated state old son, you can forget it...
The girl wearing Prada is sadly one of the best gigs left out there, and unfortunately they know it.

[bringbackthe80s]

Don’t know about trolling or not, but one thing is for sure, there’s a lot of talking the talk and very little walking the walk going on.
If you’ re 5/10 yrs from retirement maybe, but how many left to a mainland company?
Don’t worry though, it’s the same where I am, loads of ideas not as much action

[mngmt mole]

Uh, no. In fact there is a lot of 'walking' happening. Many more than usual, and about to be followed by hundreds more. Watch this space.

[Dilbert68]

I truly believe that people are planning on leaving, I have been at this airline a long time. Junior crew who have some right seat time have finally woken up to the fact that HK is too expensive to live in with the package on offer unless you have roomates. Might be fun for awhile but that gets old very quickly.
Senior Captains have a number of very attractive offers, big $$$ and numerous scheduling options. How would you like to be based in your home country? Month on month off? Tax free? It's all available and these companies are desperate for experienced pilots.
I have an interview/medical next month. This will be my last Xmas working for the Swire sociopaths.

Housing was the only carrot keeping me around, there is absolutely no reason to stay without it. I can make more money elsewhere and I have had all I can take of the hostile and toxic culture here.

[Air Profit]

It's taken a long time, but the 'aura' surrounding the fabled CX job has finally been broken. It's now just another crappy Asian airline. In fact, worse than most, as is evident by the packages being offered by other Asian airlines that are in nearly every case better, and provide a better lifestyle. Never mind the fact that many airlines in our home countries are also very short of pilots and are hiring hundreds of pilots annually. Who in their right mind would risk staying at CX with such a proven bunch of management liars and bullies? Don't risk losing your chance to either join a home airline or obtain a much better expat job. Either way, both choices now provide you being able to live comfortably at home with your families. CX is toast. Well done Anna and Rupert. You can kiss all of our ass*s as you see them walking out of the CX door.

(oh, and Dilbert, you can certainly believe many are leaving. An informal poll of any group of CX pilots will be hard to find one who is planning on staying)

[Oval3Holer]

They're returning 777s to the lessors and deferring deliveries. They WANT us to leave!

[Trafalgar]

Happy to oblige them. This stopped being a career airline 10 years ago. Better options just about everywhere now.

[Staggers]

Not to mention if one takes their predictions at face value the future looks as bleak as Monarch.

If they are telling the truth why would you stay and if they aren’t why would you stay?

[Trafalgar]

Haha. Staggers...that is a brilliant insight. Nails it.

[Gnadenburg]

Yes the grass may not be greener but if you work for the "group" it's very foolish not to reassess even if by contingency only.

If you have an asset base, some jobs actually present a lot better when you are forced to take a look by management behaving badly.

Dragonair pilot's long stalemated CC campaign came to an end when pilots told to show their feet. It happened quickly surprising the GMO who was himself told to show his feet. And similar patterns seem to be appearing now with CX colleagues.

[Sea Eggs]

Exactly. So you resign from CX , do 6 months of " training" with CS. By the time this is completed you need to renew your meds. Ah ha, Dr Xi says : we detect abnormal blood flow in yer neck ultrasound. Not like 21 yr old china airforce boy. We now take away medical. You go to office. Bye bye .

Better the CX devil you know , even if she wears Prada;)

I heard the system has changed recently. They are no longer testing to see if you are astronaut material. It's more like regular Cat. 1

[DDDOF]

Wouldn't you have yourself Insured to the hilt for loss of license etc. if flying for a Airline in China so if you they pull you offline for a minuscule medical issue financially you'd be covered?

[bringbackthe80s]

No you would not. You are only covered if you do not pass the medical in the country where the insurance is registered.

[Frogman1484]

I spoke to the insurance company. If you cannot hold your license and you have seen 2 doctors who agree on the prognosis, it will pay.

Now days, the authorities do not pull licenses for medical reasons any longer, due to the possibility of insurance fraud and if one day a cure comes about.
Instead of pulling the license, they will either give you a temporary suspention for a short illness or a continued suspention for a long term illness. When I spoke to the insurance company covering the China southern pilots, if the Chinese cad suspends you license due to ill ness or injury, and as long as a second Dr agrees, they will pay you out. This is no different to the Topcover and to the Comminsure one.

No you would not. You are only covered if you do not pass the medical in the country where the insurance is registered.

[Willing to Fly]

And to get back to the topic; this has all been such good advertising for Longreach too!


I'm an outsider trying to figure out my next move. Something like this is great PR for Longreach. Has me wondering what they have to offer. If I wasn't looking at them before, I am now.

[BlunderBus]

I would like to share with you some of the opportunities available in China. We work with 32 different airlines, and have opportunities for all aircraft types. We have offices in HKG, Shenzhen and Beijing.

We are anticipating scheduling some informational road show sessions in HKG in the coming weeks. I would like to know if you would be interested in joining us.

We will provide information on living and working in China, as well as detailed information about the following opportunities:

1. Juneyao Airlines. They will provide A330 Captains the option of transitioning to the A320, or B747/777 Captains to transition to the B787.
2. Guilin Airlines. They will provide transition opportunities to the A320
3. Capital Airlines. They are hiring A330 Captains.
4. Tianjin Airlines. They are hiring A330 Captains
5. Air China Cargo. They are hiring B777 and B747 Captains.
6. China Southern. They are hiring B777 and A330 Captains

As you probably know, working conditions have improved steadily in China over recent years, and pay levels are increasing annually. We would very much appreciate the opportunity to share this information with you.

Also...we have a referral program. If you can refer someone to us who is eventually hired in China, we will pay you $1500 as a referral fee.


WASINC International
1.702.553.3044
WASINC INTERNATIONAL (http://www.wasinc.net)

[Trafalgar]

Thanks Dave. I am sure you will receive numerous replies. I have friends working with Chinese airlines. By all accounts, they are happy and enjoy their jobs. Provide a good, solid and reliable contract and you will get the attention that is solicited. Regards.

[Rated De]

It really is that simple.

Sadly though, adversarial HR and IR means the bottom feeders are fed. They thrive on conflict, lack of trust and complexity. Their waking hours are spent ensuring their own survival.


If one is interested compare the labour unit cost at Ryanair to that of Southwest. It is 'lower' at Ryanair. The contrast is clear when it comes to output. Southwest is miles ahead.

Herb Kelleher summarised it for the myopic bottom feeders;

"You have to treat your employees like customers. When you treat them right, then they will treat your outside customers right. That has been a powerful competitive weapon"

It isn't that hard, but dismantling the whole adversarial 'model' is a task for leaders not managers. Integrity and selfless honesty left at the door in modern corporate life. CX lacks it, just like RyanAir and Qantas..

[raven11]

Blunder Bus...
Is there an email address for WASINC INTERNATIONAL?

[goathead]

Raven
Talk to Longreach.
Known and reputable.

[Airbubba]

Blunder Bus...
Is there an email address for WASINC INTERNATIONAL?

From their website: [email protected]

[BlunderBus]

Please follow the link to multiple international offices