Ryanair direct contract EU conditions

[Nighty]

Does anybody know the current offer for Ryanair DEC in the EU especially SXF?
What would be the yearly gross income?
What about health care and social security?
Where would you be taxed?
Are the training days during off days?
I would be very thankful for a quick response since I soon have to make a decision...

[JW411]

Why don't you call Ryanair and ask them?

[zerotohero]

lol awesome reply. We all know the reason

[Bayerische]

You might even get Michael on the phone....I'm sure he'd love to hear from you.

[TheMightyAtom]

Salary = rubbish
Perks = non-existent
Tax = you can ask the tax men directly while they raid your house

[Say Mach Number]

Ask for a copy of the contract.

It must be on there.

Anyway if rumours are correct the money is going up by about 20% to keep people and encourage joiners.

[Nighty]

I was hoping for some information during the weekend, so I can chew on the idea before the office opens...

[Skornogr4phy]

If they are desparate for pilots, they'll wait for your decision

[gearlever]

What's the percentage of "Ryanair direct contract" pilots versus agency / self employed?

[TheMightyAtom]

About 25% employees/ 75% contractors

[Nighty]

The offer is a "Ryanair direct employment Contract with outstanding earnings potential"...
Even I am very sceptical about RYR, the Base and Rostering would suit my needs pretty well. So I thought maybe as a real employee life could be ok. That said, certain conditions (see above) have to fulfilled otherwise it is not worth the effort...

[lederhosen]

There is very little information in the public domain. The Ryanair web site gives no information about pay and Ppjn is pretty vague. 145€ per block hour for contractors is listed somewhere. But other than employees getting a small pension contribution and apparently no salary increments it is hard to compare numbers, which would actually be quite helpful in driving up pay in our own companies. Surely someone on here might lift the veil a little.

[Vokes55]

People are still considering joining Ryanair? There is no hope for this industry...

[a370]

Apply. And you will find out. Eventually. For none rated, the process is excruciatingly long.
Their recruitment dept don't give feed back at all after you apply. Zero, zip. Then expect you to turn up a week later for assessment.

You cannot contact them other than by the given email. No address. No tel no.
Arrogant. Self entitled lot. Total disdain for experience , and most on here know it.
But, work 4 the little 'Leary Leprechaun? No tks.Not now. Not ever.

Tells you a lot really. Do I need to go on?

[Ryanairpilot]

The pay may look OK on the face of it but the conditions are crap hence the exodus. They're trying to throw money at it in their usual ham fisted way without understanding the problems.

Do let us know if the promises live up to reality.

[TheMightyAtom]

60-40 increasing

They like to say that, but I'd be surprised. Some DECS and all new CU on Ryanair contracts but 800 cadets per year coming in on agency contracts, I'd be very surprised if the balance has shifted that far.

Disclaimer: none of us know for sure, but we know that contractors outnumber employees, potebtially by a long way

[lederhosen]

Ryanair have four hundred airplanes so there must be at lot of captains who could answer this rather simple question. Do you get fired if you tell someone or is there some other reason?

[semmern]

People are still considering joining Ryanair? There is no hope for this industry...

This. It boggles the mind!

[Vokes55]

Ryanair have four hundred airplanes so there must be at lot of captains who could answer this rather simple question. Do you get fired if you tell someone or is there some other reason?

I'd imagine most are ashamed that they are working to the poor conditions that they are on, and contributing to the declining T&Cs across the industry. Not even being valued highly enough to be given water is fairly demoralising

Just my opinion of course.

[lederhosen]

Ryanair have said they will benchmark against Jet2 and Norwegian and match pay. Actually they said they would beat it. With a bit of luck this will increase pay across the industry. A simple table with basic gross, flight hour pay, average monthly expenses and any extras for example pension contribution would be interesting to compare for a UK base and a continental base for these three carriers, although apart from perhaps occasionally a standby aircraft in Spain I do not think Jet2 have any european bases.

[Bayerische]

With all the bad press at the moment I can't believe that people are still looking to join this outfit. 700 pilots leaving last year should tell you all you need to know.

If you enjoy working in a toxic environment then go for it.....there are better options out there even if that involves commuting.

[lederhosen]

The Norwegian conditions (OSM) for Europe are available on line: basic 7700, per diem/allowance 1300, flight pay 14 euros per hour and some other bit and pieces, so basically 10,000 euros a month. Be interesting to hear where Ryanair is currently against that benchmark for a permanent contract. I cannot see how getting this information into the public domain can be a bad thing in terms of driving up everyone's pay and conditions. O'Leary has promised after all to match Norwegian. Of course if he is already paying more....

[MaverickPrime]

When it comes to bench marking, the best 737 contract in the UK is arguably Thomson, so that’s all well and good for Ryanair pilots based at the same airport as Thomson crews. Plus the onus is still on the pilots to provide evidence that competitors at the same base pay more, what is considered satisfactory evidence? MOL is still trying to give as little as he can get away with!

[Jonnyknoxville]

Wow , thats not bad at all

[lederhosen]

Thanks Bonway, very helpful

[RAT 5]

Oh Dear. How the mighty have fallen: or shall do again.

Nothing to do with RYR, but I have reviewed, over the years, the requested/required characteristics of aircrew applying to join airline XYZ. All the usual dross is trotted out about leadership, problem solving, self-reliance, team-player, etc. etc. I never saw 'self-respect & determination' included. Shame that.

[MaverickPrime]

Bonway, that pay deal is impressive. However, Spanish taxes are pretty high so I wonder what the net figures would look like! How would the bonus be taxed?

[Luibar]

Hopefully the same deal will be offered to the small bases pilots.

[FL_100]

If you pass all the requirements to get all the allowances below is net figure yearly and monthly in Spain.

salaryaftertax dot com/es

Gross Income: 140,000
Tax Due: 54,373
> Social Security Contribution: 2,775
> Income Tax: 51,598
Net Income: 85,627



Monthly:
Gross Income: 11,667
Tax Due: 4,531
> Social Security Contribution: 231
> Income Tax: 4,300
Net Income: 7,136

[MaverickPrime]

I wonder if the SBH rate will be increased for contractors? I can hardly see all FR pilots being offered ‘employee’ contracts. It’s the small bases that could suffer!

[jeehaa]

There will not be an increase of the SBH rate for sub contractors

[MaverickPrime]

Then the exodus shall continue!

[TheMightyAtom]

One thing to remember for outsiders, a Ryanair pay deal is not a normal pay deal. None of those figures are contractual and are subject to change at any time.

25 years ago you could earn incredible money at Ryanair, how did that deteoriate to the point that they can't stop hundreds and hundreds leaving every year?

Throughout years and years of incredible success at Ryanair, the T&Cs went down like the Hindenburg.

Do you trust these new figures? Would you bet, given their track record, that it will stay so appealing beyond next week? O'Leary is practically claiming to have seen the light and repenting for the poor conditions, as though they happened by accident. So why not put them in a contract and not a 'base agreement' (which amounts to nothing but a vague promise from some very untrustworthy guys)?

Why not offer them to all pilots who fly Ryanair planes, not just the minority that have the privelige of being employees?

[Can737]

Spot on TheMightyAtom, I just want to add to that, quality of life. Job can make your life hell or pleasant, you can bring home all the money you want, if it is an empty home, not great.

Get a Union FCS. You will secure good money and decent working conditions at the same time, and it will only get better throughout the years.

[RAT 5]

I wonder if the SBH rate will be increased for contractors? I can hardly see all FR pilots being offered ‘employee’ contracts.

This would assume that, when tested correctly by the tax authorities, the 'contractor model' is declared kosher. Has that test been carried out thoroughly? Do we not hear reports that some countries have it under scrutiny. The Storm/McG rates are less than the BRK rates and the new latest agency rates lower again, so any rise given to contractors would only replace what was taken away in the fist place.

[jmvdb22]

I've (hopefully) attached a PDF file here that will give some detail on the above.

Just wondering, are these figures also true for the contractors or is this just for direct contracts?

[lederhosen]

Is the social security in Spain really so low that you only pay 231 euros? In Germany that figure would be much higher. Again many thanks to those posting real information rather than conjecture. It would be nice to get more transparency as is the case with the hourly pay rate tables in the US. The Spirit pilots won a considerable victory over there, hopefully we can now see a similar improvement in Europe.

[MaverickPrime]

I think Ryanair pilots need to keep pushing for European wide representation instead of negotiating at the base level. Ryanair will keep dangling a bigger and bigger carrot in the hope that individual bases will accept an offers, they desperately want to avoid a unified work force. As already stated, it should be the same deal for all pilots across the network. I think until that happens, people will and should keep Leaving. I didn’t know that the base level deals were not legally binding, in that case it’s not worth the paper it’s written on. Good luck to all the folks at Ryanair, I hope you get the pay you deserve!

As for social security in Spain, I’m no expert, but I know it’s a tiered system, the more you pay into it, the more you are entitled from it.

[TheMightyAtom]

At the moment this pay deal posted and similar ones are set to be rejected, pending votes in each base. In favour of pushing for a systematic change in employment. MOL will fight such change tooth and nail, he's ideological opposed to the idea of a fair deal, it's bad for the bottom line.

Throwing a few extra k in 'allowances' is what the management consider the minimum effective dose - enough to avoid mutiny, without costing more than it has too.

Ryanair is a big player, their terms and conditions will colour everyone else's in some way, at any airline in Europe and beyond (witness the US pilots associations offering support).

I'm baffled by the people on these threads who want to call the Ryanair pilots spineless etc and sit there, waiting for them to fail.

A victory in achieving equitable terms for all at Ryanair, with a fair system of representative, would be an enormously positive thing for all of us flying in Europe.

[skyloone]

Folks, read the condition clauses and take a look back through history. Sickness clauses.... read the small print about recovery of sick days. Uk guys can’t actually comply as doctors won’t issue sick notes for less than five day and FR insist on them after 3 I think. You also have to agree to give up a certain number of days off to help out.... 5/4 roster.... think not! They can and will change any current offerings at any time. This is actually a very poor deal and almost every Ryanair pilot I’ve spoken to has seen the pitfalls. This deal also excludes probably more than 50% of the workforce as it’s presently structured. The feedback is that this is a short term cash ruse and seems to have gone down like a lead ballon! Apparently not much negotiation. I gather folks told, thats it.... vote and sign...Is this the nice cuddly MOL.