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VickersVicount
17th Sep 2017, 14:09
Was EY AUH daily again for high summer and going back to just 5 / wk now?
EY is a bit of a mixed bag on this route with fluctuating frequencies and loads.

A350Saltire
17th Sep 2017, 15:07
AUH is now 5x per week year round except August when it is daily.

July load factor was 96% and I'd expect August's to be up there too.

edi_local
18th Sep 2017, 14:49
I don't really see how it is a mixed bag.

It's been 5 per week for over a year, same operational days every week, same aircraft at the same time every operational day. Loads are strong and there is very little disruption to their schedule. Only August brings some change in that it goes daily due to the demand.

Morus193
6th Oct 2017, 15:52
The latest I have read about Hainan to Beijing is its awaiting Chinese government approval, do we know what the expected start month could be? Any chance of a start before the end of this year?

canberra97
6th Oct 2017, 23:46
Surely no one can answer your questions before any final approval from the Chinese government is secured and even when it has been given I think any start will be in 2018 not before the end of the year.

inOban
11th Oct 2017, 10:27
September up 8.4%. international still growing steadily (14%) but domestic soft, and will presumably fall further when Ryanair drop STN.

4eyed anorak
19th Oct 2017, 17:32
Finnair increasing from 5 per week to 9 per week.

inOban
19th Oct 2017, 19:25
I noticed that. I suspect they will be using Embraers rather than Airbus.

4eyed anorak
20th Oct 2017, 11:20
Apparently Brussels Airlines are upgrading their flights to a A319 from next Saturday.

Sk1schoolsam
20th Oct 2017, 12:46
I wonder if that’s capacity increase or just a reflection on issues they have had with the leased Cityjet Russian built aircraft. Seen a few cancellations. May be ending there Cityjet agreement. Is the schedule remaining the same?

SWBKCB
20th Oct 2017, 13:53
Were the cancellations due to a/c reliability? If, so what?

GoEDI
20th Oct 2017, 16:54
I believe the SSJs are needed on thinner routes to cover RJ100 retirement and E145/Q400 leases ending, so EDI gets the A319.

Sk1schoolsam
21st Oct 2017, 13:34
Yes it’s the 100 seat E90LRs scheduled now. This looks like both a frequency increase (to with there long haul Far East operations?) as well as an increase in seats ( up from 660 p/w to 900 p/w). Positive news.....
Will the use of the E90 sacrifice any freight potential for the Far East?

Sk1schoolsam
21st Oct 2017, 13:41
Further reduction in seats to New York in S18 (following United cancelling the second daily Flight) with Norwegian reducing the Stewart route frequency from daily to 5 weekly. Providence seams to have benefited gaining the 2 extra.
We’re they not achieving decent load factors?

HH6702
21st Oct 2017, 14:14
Pound over the dollar and last few years been a lot of over capacity over profits something has to give

Breathe
27th Oct 2017, 16:23
I note that tomorrow will be the last Brussels Airlines flight operated by CityJet, and thus will mark an end of CityJet services at EDI after many years.

CabinCrewe
29th Oct 2017, 10:32
I flew on an SSJ with CityJet/Sabena to BRU and was a pleasant flight (aided by it being half empty!)
How often have SN proper (mainline) operated this route on a larger jet for any length of time?

Sk1schoolsam
30th Oct 2017, 10:52
As well as introducing the A319 the frequency seams to have dropped to twice daily and once at the weekends. Has this capacity reduction been in place for a while?

VickersVicount
6th Nov 2017, 21:06
I couldnt recall the various frequency reductions for QR and EY- just to see if an obvious explanation for over 5% drop on QR and 24% drop for EY cw last year.
Fairly big drops regardless on both routes.

OltonPete
6th Nov 2017, 22:01
VickersVicount

CAA stats for September 2016 show Qatar and Etihad were daily and the latter is now 5 a week.

Qatar is still daily as far as I know and is just suffering as is BHX and MAN and it does make the Cardiff start up even more bizarre. Heathrow was the only UK airport up on Doha and it was the same in August. July was grim for BHX and MAN although EDI was up 1% but there again it was July.

Jerry123
7th Nov 2017, 05:49
How is Cardiff bizarre? It's a new market for them without any competition. Would you say that if they chose Belfast?

FQTLSteve
7th Nov 2017, 07:17
I think he's referring to the fact that their existing services excluding LHR are not doing too well and that it appears unusual to add a new destination which may well dilute the passenger feed to them.

Jerry123
7th Nov 2017, 07:25
Not unusual considering it's not an area covered by the ME3 and a lot of passengers in this area use its rivals at Heathrow and Gatwick.

willy wombat
7th Nov 2017, 08:35
Do we know the figures for EK at GLA over the same period?

ATNotts
7th Nov 2017, 08:49
Ought not really be diverting this thread towards Cardiff, but so far as Qatar are concerned; 1) they aren't a commercial operators in the sense that we understand it, they are the Qatari's globally "willy" that they enjoy waving. 2) there was a straight fight between BRS (a commercial company) and CWL (a state owned "willy" of the Welsh government). One could throw a limited amount of privately generated capital at wooing the airline; the other state money - and the state incentive proved more attractive.

On a level playing field logic would have given the route to BRS, but as OltonPete pointed out, it still would be an odd decision given the relative proximity of Bristol or Cardiff and their conurbations to London and Birmingham.

A350Saltire
7th Nov 2017, 08:57
Do we know the figures for EK at GLA over the same period?

I suspect you may already know those figures

GLAEDI
7th Nov 2017, 09:07
CAA Stats

EK GLA

JUL +10
AUG +17
SEP +12

but obviously only EK know the yield and the drops in 2016 sustained when QR & EY started at EDI.

willy wombat
7th Nov 2017, 09:51
Indeed. I suppose if the rumours about A380 intro at GLA are true, they need to build volume.

Jerry123
7th Nov 2017, 13:09
Ought not really be diverting this thread towards Cardiff, but so far as Qatar are concerned; 1) they aren't a commercial operators in the sense that we understand it, they are the Qatari's globally "willy" that they enjoy waving. 2) there was a straight fight between BRS (a commercial company) and CWL (a state owned "willy" of the Welsh government). One could throw a limited amount of privately generated capital at wooing the airline; the other state money - and the state incentive proved more attractive.

On a level playing field logic would have given the route to BRS, but as OltonPete pointed out, it still would be an odd decision given the relative proximity of Bristol or Cardiff and their conurbations to London and Birmingham.
It can also be a question of choice. Not everyone from places like Cardiff and Edinburgh want to fly from London and also Qatar's passengers coming in to places like Scotland and Wales will probably prefer less stops and a more direct journey not to mention that their will be people who will travel to places like Wales and Scotland for the first time because there is a direct flight or a one stop flight rather than going via the likes of Heathrow.

SWBKCB
7th Nov 2017, 14:22
they aren't a commercial operators in the sense that we understand it, they are the Qatari's globally "willy" that they enjoy waving.

Nor sure I follow the logic, if they aren't a commercial operation why would "state" money be the deciding factor?

Getting back to OltonPete's point - if your regional UK routes aren't doing well, why launch another one seems a fair point. No slur on CWL!

Anyway, to EDI...

OltonPete
7th Nov 2017, 18:40
Jerry123

As SWBKCB stated it was not meant to be a slur on Cardiff, the comment would have been the same if Bristol, Belfast, Glasgow or Newcastle had been chosen at this time and I what I meant to do was highlight the timing in light of the current political situation Qatar finds itself embroiled in, as bookings have dropped significantly.

I know it has been said time and time again that we don't know what goes on behind closed doors and we haven't got a clue as to yields but a shiny new 788 with only 24 business seats and load factors between 60 and 75% doesn't sound a recipe for success and you would have thought Qatar would have avoided any further forays into the UK regional market at the present time.

Although not directly stated by ATNotts but would any other airline still be operating this route from EDI & BHX (not counting AI or PK) in similar circumstances and looking to expand?

FQTLSteve - Spot on but of course only Cardiff or Bristol would have affected BHX or similarly if Glasgow or Newcastle had been chosen in competition with Edinburgh.

As this is the EDI thread and to get it back on track (my fault if went off) what is the feeling about the Norwegian Transatlantic operation as the September figures seem a bit low despite the fact that the main holiday period was well and truly over. Have I got these load factors correct, as FR24 indicates SWF was daily, PVD 34 rotations and 26 for BDL.

Newburgh (SWF) 7207....average 120....65%
Providence (PVD) 3254...average 96......51%
Windsor Locks (BDL) 2837....average 109...59%

CabinCrewe
7th Nov 2017, 18:52
... mmm are they correct? Not great for a late summer month, no wonder theres been a double drop with Irish flight already!
Did wonder how these routes would fair into winter. Further adjustments to follow I suspect. Maybe a 737-7Max would have been better for capacity.

chaps1954
7th Nov 2017, 21:22
Just out of interest the Manchester flights had a B777 on many flights in summer 2016
which therefore had a lot more seats available so one explanation for the MAN drop also some pax would have connected to DUB from BHX/MAN which now has a non stop operation.

Porrohman
8th Nov 2017, 16:59
AFAIK, the Norwegian transatlantic flights are still restricted to 150 pax. If so, these load factors are not strictly correct.

The reason for the payload restriction is that the ETOPS-120 capable B73Hs don't have the range to carry a full pax load, especially westbound, and the B38Ms are not all ETOPS-120 capable yet, which means some of them need to take a longer routing over Greenland and Northern Canada.

Norwegian's transatlantic ops are being flown by a mix of aircraft with different capabilities and there are no advance guarantees of which aircraft will be available for which route so all flights have the payload restriction applied. On a day to day basis, if certain required equipment is unserviceable, ETOPS-120 aircraft will need to fly non-ETOPS routes.

When I looked last week, only two of the B38Ms (the first two to be delivered, EI-FYA and B) were flying ETOPS routings. The others were either flying non-ETOPS routings or were not being used on Transatlantic flights. I checked a seven day period for all six B38Ms so this didn't look like just a prevailing weather issue. There was a clear pattern.

Over the past seven days, one additional B38M (EI-FYE) has been flying ETOPS-120 routings most of the time.

Not all of Norwegian's B73Hs are ETOPS-120 capable. When a non-ETOPS B73H is used for a transatlantic flight, it is more likely to need to fuel stop. This happened last week, with one flight from EDI needing to stop at YUL.

Now that winter weather has arrived in northern Canada, Greenland and Iceland, non-ETOPS flights could be delayed or cancelled if the necessary diversion airports en route are unavailable.

I wonder whether Boeing is having to pay compensation to Norwegian. I presume the B38Ms were supposed to be ETOPS-120 capable by entry to service but engine problems late in the flight test programme delayed deliveries and appear to have delayed ETOPS-120 approvals of all six aircraft in the fleet. Three now appear to be operating ETOPS-120 routings.

Is it the case that individual airframes need to clock up a certain number of hours before ETOPS-120 ops can be carried out or is there another reason why individual B38Ms have not operated ETOPS-120 routings until quite some time after entry into service?

OltonPete
8th Nov 2017, 18:51
Porrohman

Thank you for the excellent summary and again another example that things are not always as they seem.

It sounds a bit of a nightmare in one sense when you are bedding in new routes and new aircraft as well as the winter weather to contend with.

I just hope Primera are taking note as my local will be getting an unproven transatlantic aircraft from next May and hopefully some lessons to be leant although one is Boeing and the other Airbus but still a new venture.

inOban
8th Nov 2017, 19:10
Just curious, but why is there a Jet2 flight to Krakow tomorrow morning? Presumably some kind of charter?

compton3bravo
9th Nov 2017, 04:57
I would guess it is an educational trip taking schoolchildren to nearby Auschwitz concentration camp which is not to far from Krakow.

inOban
9th Nov 2017, 10:20
I guess you're right. It's clearly a day trip, gets back late this evening.

EIFFS
9th Nov 2017, 15:21
Firstly Norwegians 738 & 7M8 deployed on the Transatlantic are 180 minutes ETOPS not 120.

There have been a number of different issues over the last 10 days that have caused some to be non ETOPS compliant, from things like APU inop, odd Maintainance msgs no real pattern.

The limit in number of seats at introduction was around 155 this is now increased to around 175, however I have seen and flown numerous sorties with 189 ( full)

A number of additional NG are being upgraded to ETOPS spec as week speak.

Porrohman
10th Nov 2017, 08:50
Thanks for clarifying EIFFS.

inOban
10th Nov 2017, 10:37
I see that the MAX8 returned last night, and the most southerly route I can recall: SW to over Shannon and then West.

EIFFS
11th Nov 2017, 02:09
The winds aloft over the Atlantic dictate the NATS OTS ( organised track system) especially west bound, this past week the westerly winds have been >150 knots + some west bound tracks have been North of Iceland, I know of one crew that did SNN from SWF in around 5:05

4eyed anorak
13th Nov 2017, 09:16
Record number continuing...

More than 1.2 million passengers used Edinburgh Airport in October, making it the busiest October on record for the terminal.
It’s the seventh consecutive month with over one million passengers using Scotland’s busiest airport.
A total of 1,226,109 people came through the terminal in October, an increase of 8.5% on the same month last year.
International passengers continued to surge, up 12.4% on October 2016 at 760,296.

October 2017
Vs Last Year
Domestic
465,813
+1.5%
International
760,296
+12.4%
Total
1,226,109
+8.5%
MAT
13,288,829
+9.2%

VickersVicount
23rd Nov 2017, 17:40
Faroe Atlantic Airways switching A319 to A320 during fleet maintenance reshuffle for a few dates in April. Looking at previous loads theres going to be lots of empty seats! Surprised its stuck around outwith high season tbh

inOban
23rd Nov 2017, 17:58
I always assumed it was used by the Faroese coming to do their Christmas shopping, which is why it continues until the turn of the year. What are the fares like? It may not matter if it's not full.

Porrohman
24th Nov 2017, 11:10
Typically circa £200 - £335 return when I've checked so the yield should be better than the load factors might indicate. I wonder how much cargo, mail and parcels they carry. That might add to the financial viability. Also excess baggage.

LAX_LHR
7th Dec 2017, 14:07
New weekly BA flight to Florence on Saturdays using E170 from May.

inOban
11th Dec 2017, 09:41
+ 8.7% in November, entirely due to International growth.

A350Saltire
11th Dec 2017, 14:08
18.1% growth in international passengers. Very impressive.

Sk1schoolsam
11th Dec 2017, 22:19
Don’t expect December to be that good, especially with the number of cancellations over the past few weeks. Was one of the unlucky today who’s flight to Birmingham was cancelled at the last minute.

Sk1schoolsam
21st Dec 2017, 11:49
Etihad reduces Edinburgh frequency in peak S18 (August) to 5 weekly in line with other months, disappointing and does this point towards further reductions?
Plenty other UK airports with new route activity for 2018 with TUi, Flybe, Wizz and Ryanair etc; but see very little coming EDI’s direction. Potential to harm growth.....
Apart from Washington DC (at the expense on a Newark rotation) no new long haul.
Does anyone have knowledge of anything new in the offering?

Jerry123
21st Dec 2017, 12:32
United Airlines Washington
TUI Malaga
Thomas Cook Antalya
Ryanair Szczecin and Hamburg
Jet2 Antalya Kos and Dalaman
BA Cityflyer Florence

Edinburgh has a few new or returning routes for Summer 18.

GoEDI
21st Dec 2017, 13:03
The increase to daily in August wasn't made until March this year, so still time for that to happen again if they want.

As for overall growth, Ryanair are currently +40ish rotations a week for S18 compared to S17 and that will bring healthy growth alone...

Norwegian recruiting for EDI based flight crew so not sure if they have anything up their sleeve, I'm not sure when MAX deliveries are due to recommence?

Richard Taylor
21st Dec 2017, 13:42
Etihad are reducing quite a few frequencies on their various routes, so EDI not alone in that regard.

CabinCrewe
21st Dec 2017, 16:01
EY loads and yields presumably determining those routes to be cut....

inOban
21st Dec 2017, 17:23
Actually, apart from Jet2 at STN and BHX, there's relatively little growth elsewhere, certainly not enough to replace Monarch. Wizz have dropped several routes.
The main growth is in routes aimed at inbound tourists.

BTW, Ryanair seem to have pulled the summer Bremen flights.

compton3bravo
22nd Dec 2017, 06:56
In Oban maybe it has passed you by about the Wizz expansion at Luton, seven based aircraft and a host of new routes with more to come.

inOban
22nd Dec 2017, 08:26
They have increased slightly at Luton. The based aircraft are mainly operating existing routes. They have dropped many routes from smaller airports such as Liverpool and, I believe, even Glasgow.

mwm991
22nd Dec 2017, 09:32
Yep they have been making cuts at their regional British ops. BHX, GLA, LPL, BRS, BFS, DSA have all experienced cuts of some sort. Looks like their UK focus is pretty much Luton for the foreseeable future.

chaps1954
22nd Dec 2017, 09:51
Have you forgotten about MAN as there is plenty of growth there by Jet2,Easy,TCX
and by early new year almost all the Monarch capacity will be replaced plus growth

compton3bravo
22nd Dec 2017, 14:26
You really must keep up inOban. Wizz have announced eight new routes from Luton recently plus increasing flights on some already established routes, representing a 23 per cent increase. It looks like they see a downturn in demand from a number of regional airports but not in the south east of England.

inOban
22nd Dec 2017, 17:09
I didn't say they weren't growing at LTN, I admit I didn't realise by that much. I wonder whether it balances the loss of capacity from other airports. Anyway Wizz don't fly from EDI, and among the published data for Nov, EDI at 8.5% was the highest I noticed. Several hardly grew at all.

I suspect that many may struggle to maintain numbers next year.

CabinCrewe
23rd Dec 2017, 08:26
Still don't get QR at EDI- now down to barely 50% load factor for Nov and biggest reduction in UK compared to other DOH routes. Surely thats not sustainable even with QR publicised issues?
Would love to go on an empty 787, would almost make that more appealing if the travelling public knew!
EY AUH not great either on 5 days per week. Wonder if two operators just too much. Outwith peak summer months even before blamed Qatar issues, QR loads were marginal at best.
Yet other ME routes consistently going from strength to strength - NCL EK DXB up 8%.

VickersVicount
23rd Dec 2017, 08:30
50% - you're having a laugh ?
Doesn't bode well for the CWL launch....
Interesting times. Seems fuel prices going up too. More likely low cost carriers such as DY will feel the pinch with that even with some more fuel efficient types on their fleet.

Jerry123
23rd Dec 2017, 08:54
CWL is completely different to EDI. Different market and a lot more competition. A better comparison for CWL would-be NCL.

GoEDI
23rd Dec 2017, 13:17
Still don't get QR at EDI- now down to barely 50% load factor for Nov and biggest reduction in UK compared to other DOH routes. Surely thats not sustainable even with QR publicised issues?

Not quite... EDI was down 11% (56% LF), MAN was down 15% (65% LF), BHX not even reported yet, but not normally a great performer so will almost certainly be in a similar ballpark....

Doesn't make great reading, but QR have bigger issues I think. They need these UK routes to feed their hub at DOH even if they are struggling due to loss of DXB connecting traffic and the rest, consumer confidence etc.
November is traditionally a weaker month though, December will no doubt show some improvement.

I'm more intrigued as to why EY was down 13% on last year. They should be taking advantage of QR's current situ, but it seems EK are steam rollering the Scottish market Eastbound. The strength of Dubai as an O&D destination no doubt helps.

j636
23rd Dec 2017, 22:01
QR start flying A350-9 from 1 July 2018 which is an increase in capacity....

inOban
23rd Dec 2017, 23:32
Emirates has a profile among the general public that the others can only dream of. Lots of Edinburgh PAX seem to travel to GLA rather than use their 'own' ME flights.

GoEDI
24th Dec 2017, 01:30
QR start flying A350-9 from 1 July 2018 which is an increase in capacity....

Funny timing after the above posts... Fair increase in J capacity. That's quite telling. As we know the load factors posted do not show the whole picture, particularly in terms of the full service airlines and this would appear to be a good example. QR could be filling J and bulking out the B788 with cargo on a regular basis, CAA stats will not tell you that...

Sk1schoolsam
24th Dec 2017, 09:15
Good point GoEDI......I have flown the Doha service 4 times this year and J class has been full each way each time. I do know they run a lot of offers though....
Personally love the service and find Doha HIA a great airport to transfer to AusPac or Asia.
Let’s hope the increase sticks.....

Porrohman
24th Dec 2017, 11:56
I hear the same. People I know who use the QR service regularly often find that business class is fully booked so the upgrade to A350 makes sense from that perspective.

CabinCrewe
24th Dec 2017, 18:53
Those wingtips and racoon nose will be a sight.
The booking engine still seems to show a mix of 787 and A359 and some dates blocked off, so maybe not finalised.
But I do still wonder with the vast majority of capacity Y space, there are not many routes can rely purely on standard underfloor cargo and if true, offer filled J seats.
Maybe CWL has required a reshuffle of aircraft, or maybe a pending A380 ��

A350Saltire
26th Dec 2017, 12:33
Given my username, I’m over the moon with this news. Wonderful aircraft and a step above the 787 to travel on so really looking forward to seeing the raccoon regularly at EDI.

Agree with others; the extra J and cargo capacity are probably the reason for this.

wub
26th Dec 2017, 13:55
Wednesday’s QR to Doha was delayed by 41 hours. Passengers are threatening legal action.

Plane.Silly
27th Dec 2017, 08:12
Wouldn't you, if you were one of them? nearly 2 full days inconvenience, and a lot of people value their time

Nil further
27th Dec 2017, 13:42
“Threatening legal action “

LMAO

wub
27th Dec 2017, 14:59
https://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/angry-passengers-threaten-to-sue-airline-over-41-hour-edinburgh-delay-1-4645847

Plane.Silly
27th Dec 2017, 15:04
The funniest thing about that link is right at the end where there's a link to EDI possibly getting a second service (albeit from 2014). Could do with sorting the first one out beforehand methinks.

edi_local
27th Dec 2017, 15:32
1 such delay in over 3 years of service and you claim they need to sort themselves out?

What's your agenda then?

wub
27th Dec 2017, 16:01
I was delayed 18 hours by Qatar in October, instead of being in Singapore, I spent a day in Doha. They had to pay me compensation of €1,200 Euros (after initially refusing to pay anything), so this is not an isolated incident.

SWBKCB
27th Dec 2017, 16:09
Agree with others; the extra J and cargo capacity are probably the reason for this.

From a quick look at the CAA stats for the last three months, I don't think extra cargo capacity is the reason

chaps1954
28th Dec 2017, 06:51
No the reason for cargo last 3 months is loss of Lufhansa Cargo

SWBKCB
28th Dec 2017, 06:57
I've not been clear - my comment was around Qatar changing from the B787 to the A350.

Sk1schoolsam
28th Dec 2017, 08:14
No the reason for cargo last 3 months is loss of Lufhansa Cargo

What has happened to the LH Cargo business?

chaps1954
28th Dec 2017, 09:32
We are talking Manchester but the Long haul flights from the states have been dropped

so caused a 4% drop in cargo

SWBKCB
28th Dec 2017, 09:37
You might be talking Manchester, but this is the EDI thread!

A350Saltire
28th Dec 2017, 09:58
From a quick look at the CAA stats for the last three months, I don't think extra cargo capacity is the reason

What is the reason then?

SWBKCB
28th Dec 2017, 10:18
No idea - but the CAA stats for Sept, Oct, Nov shows that freight carried on Non EU scheduled operations is 20/30 tonnes a month for EDI, approx. 700t for NCL and 1500t for GLA. The NCL figures will be all on the daily EK 777, and presumably GLA is mainly EK as well.

If this is right, the EDI figures look extremely low and suggest QR aren't in the need of extra freight capacity, unless the 787 is subject to restriction on the freight it can carry.

GoEDI
28th Dec 2017, 12:41
I've tried to look at these figures before and there's something just not right. I think the overall totals are correct but the sub-totals just don't make sense.

For example, the CAA stats for March show either unreported or zero freight carried by "other overseas operators" on scheduled services, yet the following photo taken on the 15th of that month shows that can't be the case-

https://flic.kr/p/U5uwVY

CabinCrewe
28th Dec 2017, 14:48
yet, as we're told elsewhere... dont base performance on a single month (or should that be photograph....)
Wonder where most of the profits are generated on a passenger aircraft? yield managed full cabins or filling an empty hold with freight instead of pax luggage. Guess, in this scenario we'll only know if they keep plodding on outwith peak with low passenger loads

edi_local
29th Dec 2017, 11:07
I was delayed 18 hours by Qatar in October, instead of being in Singapore, I spent a day in Doha. They had to pay me compensation of €1,200 Euros (after initially refusing to pay anything), so this is not an isolated incident.

But were you delayed by 18 hours leaving EDI though? A small delay can of course lead to a misconnection, but that's hardly unique to QR.

According to the Scotsman today QR is actually the most punctual airline at EDI, based on CAA figures, so yes, last week appears to be an isolated incident. As unfortunate as it was for those involved.

4eyed anorak
4th Jan 2018, 08:58
New routes for the summer to Seville and Jersey from Easyjet.
New year, new routes



About Us (http://www.edinburghairport.com/about-us/)
Media Centre (http://www.edinburghairport.com/about-us/media-centre/)
Press releases (http://www.edinburghairport.com/about-us/media-centre/press-releases/)
New year, new routes (http://www.edinburghairport.com/about-us/media-centre/press-releases/new-year,-new-routes#)

Two new routes have been added to the summer offering at Edinburgh Airport after easyJet announced they will operate flights to Seville and Jersey from March.
Both routes will be twice weekly through the summer season and will come into operation from the 26th of March and the 31st of March respectively.
It increases the number of destinations from Scotland’s busiest airport to 146.
Chief Executive of Edinburgh Airport, Gordon Dewar said:
“The New Year always brings fresh opportunities and adventures, and we’re delighted to be able to offer two new summer destinations to passengers in Seville and Jersey. We know choice is important and these new routes only add to the huge selection we already have – and it’s never too early to be planning that next trip!
“We have a strong relationship with easyJet and the fact they are continuing to grow at Edinburgh is a sign of their commitment to Scotland’s busiest airport and of the success we have had already and will continue to enjoy in 2018 and beyond.”
Ali Gayward, easyJet’s UK Country Manager commented:
“We’re really pleased to be adding even more routes to our Edinburgh network and to be putting flights on sale today, allowing our customers to book early and take advantage of our lowest fares for both leisure and business travel.
“easyJet is the largest airline in Scotland and we have been committed to Edinburgh for over 22 years. We are proud to have carried more than over 41 million passengers in that time.
“We’re committed to expansion at Edinburgh and the addition of new routes will help us to deliver long term, sustainable growth, providing passengers with a greater range of destinations, all with low fares and great service.”

airnoc
4th Jan 2018, 13:21
Hi All
Looks like NOC to EDIN proving sucessfull as near daily for Xmas 2017 and new year 2018 good to see long it may it contuine :ok:

inOban
4th Jan 2018, 15:18
There were a lot of routes operated with larger a/c than normal, eg a 320 instead of a 319, or at a higher frequency. One day this week SAS had two flights to Stockholm taking the revellers home.

BAladdy
4th Jan 2018, 20:00
SK are increasing the frequency of there flights to ARN this summer to 13 x Weekly. That’s more than double the frequency operated during S17 (6 x Weekly). SK plan to use the following aircraft to op the route:

A319 - 3 a week
A320 - 1 a week
CRJ900 - 3 a week
737-700 - 4 a week
737-800 - 2 a week

Info based on schedule for mid July 18

inOban
4th Jan 2018, 20:09
Wow. One of the flights this week was a Cityjet CRJ900 I think.

inOban
10th Jan 2018, 10:12
The Helsinki route will go AYR after it resumes in March. 3/wk in winter. Being promoted as the quickest way to China - 6-8 hrs shorter using the ME3 because Finnair have rights to use Russian airspace.

inOban
11th Jan 2018, 09:08
https://www.edinburghairport.com/about-us/media-centre/press-releases/a-record-year-for-a-scottish-airport

Up 8.6% over the year, 7.2% in December.

13,432,485. Total for the year.

FFHKG
11th Jan 2018, 09:24
Surely its not the Russian airspace permit that makes AY quicker than the ME3, but it is avoiding the 'dog-leg' flying south to the Gulf that makes them quicker. BA and other European carriers fly a similar routing to the Far East, except most of these carriers have to fly an extra 90 minutes or so before starting out across northern Russia. With AY from the UK regions, you avoid the initial back-track to LHR/AMS/CDG/FRA so save a considerable amount of time.

VickersVicount
11th Jan 2018, 12:12
stimulus or deterrant for the much trumpetted 'pending' China route announcement?

inOban
11th Jan 2018, 15:45
Good question. On the one hand it could establish the demand for a more direct route, and to which cities. On the other, it could abstract potential PAX.

People are such creatures of habit. They have got so used to using the ME3.

sinbad73
15th Jan 2018, 19:28
EDI loses DY to BDL March 25: Bradley airport loses Norwegian Air flights to Scotland | masslive.com (http://www.masslive.com/business-news/index.ssf/2018/01/bradley_airport_loses_norwegian_air_flig.html)

SWBKCB
15th Jan 2018, 19:48
WINDSOR LOCKS -- Low-cost carrier Norwegian Air will stop its weekly flights between Bradley International Airport and Edinburgh, Scotland, citing delays in a Scottish tax break the airline expected.

APD reduction?

Jerry123
15th Jan 2018, 21:30
Sounds like it.

canberra97
16th Jan 2018, 02:58
As if the future success of EDI to BDL was relying on a possible tax break from the Scottish government and Norwegian using that as an excuse plus APD as a cause for cancelling the route, there wasn't a decent schedule and not enough demand and therefore a lot less bums on seats.

EDI to BDL had failure written all over it the day it was first announced.

Sk1schoolsam
17th Jan 2018, 08:03
No sign of Norwegian reversing the reduction in the other 2 NAM routes, so this will mean a loss of an 737max from Edi (14 flight per week to 7). 2 aircraft to 1. With the loss of Malaga too then this is a downscaling of their ops at Edi. I wonder if this puts future plans for mid haul NAM with A321neo LR at risk, as well as jobs. Suspect this will dent growth next year at Edi unless they have some rabbits to pull out the bag on new routes.

GayFriendly
17th Jan 2018, 12:43
I think in time Norwegian will concentrate their UK ops at LGW. They have already vacated MAN and BHX, it would seem EDI saw growth as Norwegian sniffed the scent of (alleged) tax breaks to help support routes. Now they are themselves saying these breaks haven't materialised then sadly they have scaled back their EDI ops. Hopefully they will hang on for the long term, Norwegian have always been incredibly difficult to second guess!

LAX_LHR
17th Jan 2018, 12:56
They haven’t vacated MAN, still operate 3 year round routes.

Charlie Roy
18th Jan 2018, 12:24
https://www.aviationanalytics.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/Norwegian-Air-Shuttle-USA-Destination-Routes-Average-Profit-per-Seat-by-Origin-Airport-2017-1024x552.jpg


https://www.aviationanalytics.com/2018/01/09/norwegian-overstretched/
Aviation Analytics analysed Norwegian's profit per seat in 2017, on USA routes, from European airports. Edinburgh's -42euro profit per seat will explain in part the shift of transatlantic 737's away from Edinburgh.

willy wombat
18th Jan 2018, 14:23
I don't know how they did this analysis but if it is correct it reminds me of the cartoon where a boss is standing in front of a graph which shows sales or profits and in which the line has plunged off the bottom of the graph down to the floor and he is saying "Everyone stop what you're doing".

Callum Johnstone
2nd Feb 2018, 07:12
https://www.scotsman.com/news/richar...o-us-1-4680550

ATL?

LAX_LHR
2nd Feb 2018, 07:31
Airline route reporting that Hainan have applied to the CAAC for a 2 weekly PEK-EDI-DUBvv and 2 weekly PEK-DUB-EDIvv from July 2018.

Skipness One Echo
2nd Feb 2018, 08:22
Still waiting for Branson's promised GLA-NYC he "hinted" at when BA dropped JFK. The Bearded Billionaire has almost nothing to do with VS on a day to day basis these days. Delta already offer JFK and unless they're redeploying the AB A332s already, they don't have the metal to operate. Just PR and column inches IMHO
Virgin could follow up its choice of Edinburgh as the location for its first UK hotel by launching a direct flight from the city to the United States, Sir Richard Branson has suggested. The billionaire revealed yesterday that Virgin Hotels is to open a 225-bedroom high-end hotel at India Buildings in Victoria Street ...

HH6702
2nd Feb 2018, 08:30
Having a hotel in the city isn't going to fill an aircraft.

Callum Johnstone
2nd Feb 2018, 08:33
I suspect "Virgin" launching new flights from EDI to the States could be as straightforward as DL re-starting EDI-ATL, on DL metal, with a VS codeshare.

CabinCrewe
2nd Feb 2018, 15:31
Fingers crossed. Werent we led to believe an announcement was imminent over a year ago? and arent Hainan's finances a bit 'iffy' ?
Hopefully the routing could be direct as double drops can sometimes put people off especially if any backtrack. Seem to get 'ok' online reviews though appear to just offer 2-class cabins with no PE or F. Lets hope its not on their older 767's and newer A330/787 show up.

GLAEDI
2nd Feb 2018, 17:19
The problem with double sectors is the offloading of ALL passengers in Edinburgh & Dublin to clear Immigration into the CTA. The rules regarding Immigration & Customs, which is to be even more complicated by the exit of the UK from Europe, into the CTA are complicated. The aircraft will be on the ground for approximately 2hrs. The Home Office and the equivalent Irish Dept will have to agree to this exceptional route. Multi sector flights are a rarity as the risk of Immigration & Customs offences is high especially from China. This has been one of the major hurdles in this route starting.

A350Saltire
3rd Feb 2018, 01:51
Absolute respect to team EDI for getting this over the line though despite the challenges! Very impressive!

SWBKCB
3rd Feb 2018, 06:01
Is an airline applying to the CAAC the same as getting it over the line? Applying is one thing, getting another!

GrahamK
3rd Feb 2018, 06:04
I'd wait until you can book the flights before celebrating

Callum Paterson
3rd Feb 2018, 09:48
How often are the coach's from Glasgow to EDI? Weegies seem to be flocking to EDI like never before!!

Unbelievably, despite the fact that GLA has upward of 40 flights a day to London, there are even Glaswegians using EDI to travel to London!

This goes to show how happy Weegies are to use EDI. I'm sure Team EDI will be using this to their advantage when speaking to airline.

Fly to GLA and you'll only serve Glasgow. Fly to EDI and you'll serve both cities.

Congratulations on securing Scotland's China link. Now will GLA finally stop referring to itself as Scotland's principal long haul airport?

VickersVicount
3rd Feb 2018, 10:00
you really dont do yourself any favours with that tone.
Getting a bit of a reputation on here now.

Callum Paterson
3rd Feb 2018, 10:09
Legitimate question and factual statements aren't welcome?

inOban
3rd Feb 2018, 13:09
There are a lot of people to travel to GLA to catch EK, rather than using the other ME3 from EDI. There used to be talk of a Wall somewhere around Harthill, but it's open both ways now.

Callum Paterson
3rd Feb 2018, 13:23
Of course there will be some, but I don't think the numbers will be remotely close.

You'll find far more Weegies at EDI than the reverse. Also, I highly doubt you'll find anyone at GLA who is travelling between Edinburgh and London. You'll find Weegies traveling to London at EDI.

The message from those in the West of Scotland to the world's airlines is clear: You need not come to Glasgow, we'll come to you at EDI. This is perhaps a more fitting strap line than the current Proud to serve Scotland.

Skipness One Echo
3rd Feb 2018, 15:56
Callum please stop trolling, this isnae the fitba :)
In purely catchment area terms GLA is on the wrong side of Glasgow for Edinburgh whereas EDI is on the right side of Edinburgh for Glasgow. Enough of the willy waving....

Richard Taylor
3rd Feb 2018, 16:27
Callum, as a die-hard Scots Unionist, you should be pleased about the pulling & sharing of resources in the UK. In this case, Edinburgh pulls Weegies to their airport, & lets them share the services! :)

LFT
3rd Feb 2018, 17:15
I wonder if the soon to be pulled ABZ-FRA DLH service will see Aberdonians flock to GLA to use the FR or soon to start DLH FRA service Richard?

GLAEDI
4th Feb 2018, 06:13
Callum what are you on! The deogratory comments calling people from the West Coast “ Weegies” and the manner you do it you are soooo sad a person. Anyway if you had any clue or knowledge of the facts which I know you actually don’t. Both GLA & EDI show that around 10% of their domestic passengers are from each other’s catchment area. Yes that will mean more people from the West use Edinburgh as it’s bigger. The people that keep on saying Glasgow Airport is on the wrong side, forget Newton Mearns, Giffnock, Clarkston, Scotstoun, West End, Milingavie & Bearsden are that side of the city. This is where your businessman who travel daily live. Also on side note the bus from Glasgow to EDI apt is nearly always empty and usually only has students going on the cheap WOW or FR flights. Oh Callum in case you think know more than me, I work at both airports and get all the published and some unpublished stats from both management teams.

Richard Taylor
4th Feb 2018, 07:18
Aberdonians don't flock anywhere LFT! :ok:

ScotsSLF
4th Feb 2018, 09:12
Travelled through from Ayrshire to fly EZY to MPL via BSL. Took me 1 hour 20 which wasnt bad but parking costs a fortune and security was not exactly stress free. GLA is cheaper (but still extortionate) for parking and security is far more friendly and efficient than the regular mess that is EDI. I dont want to start the usual pathetic EDI v GLA nonsense amd I am only stating personal experience. Would be good to for CP to back up his claims with a tual stats but I wont hold my breath.

Rob Royston
7th Feb 2018, 13:53
Living in the Glasgow area gives a traveller three easily accessed airports, so only a fool would not use which one suits him best for each journey plan.
This thread was begun with the parochial GLA/ EDI nonsense that has left us without one large Central Airport and left us instead with two inadequate City Airports and a huge coastal airport that, while a national asset, will always be a limited passenger's choice.

European carriers were very flexible with me when l travelled overseas a lot, letting me fly out from one airport and back to the other on the same ticket and price, but I spent many long waits sitting in the likes of CDG because my overnight was late and I missed the only early connection home.
I had plenty of time to work out that one Central Airport would have flights to all the hubs on a frequent basis.
I could see that the suggested site at Airth could not be better placed as a transport hub for all of Scotland, motorways and railways already on the doorstep. Dundee, Glasgow, Edinburgh and Prestwick could all be shut down, but I suppose that doing that would take away too many sinecures, and after all it's only working travellers who suffer.

rpmac
7th Feb 2018, 16:36
If the war had not broken out in 1939 Scotland's central airport might well have been in Grangemouth, in fact KLM operated one flight I believe. This site is about 28 miles from both Edinburgh and Glasgow and would have served the central belt very well. The present M9 is now very close, the Kincardine bridge was already built so connections to Fife were nearby, also railways and in fact the Forth too! How about a river connection to Edinburgh thrown in for good measure. Too late --- it is now a
refinery!! After the war both Edinburgh and Glasgow felt the need to have their own airports at Turnhouse and Renfrew. Grangemouth was history.

Donkey497
7th Feb 2018, 21:25
I hate to be pedantic, but the refinery and the airport co-existed for quite a few years and where the runways are built on, it's by houses, a shopping centre and small offices/workshops - none of the plant actually impinges on the runways..... I'm sitting only a hundred yards, give or take, from one of the original hangars.

Porrohman
8th Feb 2018, 09:16
There have been a number of studies over the decades looking at the possibility of a Central Scotland Airport. This is the most recent AFAIK; http://homepages.ed.ac.uk/mainbg/Files/csa%20study.pdf

nighthawk117
8th Feb 2018, 09:37
If the war had not broken out in 1939 Scotland's central airport might well have been in Grangemouth

I knew there was a reason I hated Hitler! :\

nighthawk117
8th Feb 2018, 09:40
Porrohman

This issue keeps raising its head every few decades. And every time, they decide if they'd done it last time they looked, we'd be better off, but to do it now would be a waste. And the cycle repeats.

At some point someone needs to take the hit and just do it!

Having two airports splits the market. How many extra flights would we now have if the market was combined? That China flight would have arrived a long time ago, that's for sure.

Plane.Silly
8th Feb 2018, 11:31
I certainly get the economics of it all, larger airport with a combined catchement area, offering more/ regular flights and more destinations.

At the same time, it'll never happen, for the exact reason NH117 has mentioned, no one is brave enough to bite the bullet. You need a huge plot of land with enough room for at least 3/4 terminals, 2/3 runways, parking for 5/10k cars and road/rail links. Imagine that getting passed through the governments budget would be almost impossible

Rob Royston
8th Feb 2018, 12:20
I hate to be pedantic, but the refinery and the airport co-existed for quite a few years and where the runways are built on, it's by houses, a shopping centre and small offices/workshops - none of the plant actually impinges on the runways..... I'm sitting only a hundred yards, give or take, from one of the original hangars.

I can remember seeing some hangers and other airport infrastructure while being up on the refinery in 1969. I can't now remember where it was located but it was not too far away.

OntimeexceptACARS
8th Feb 2018, 22:17
Was the historic reason always the Forth Valley being fog prone? Not such an issue these days, but back in the day...

But a pointless argument anyway. Like "Maybe they should have had security in that book depository."

Fairdealfrank
10th Feb 2018, 01:22
It will never happen because:
(1) there is no business case and there needs to be as UK airports are private (as is/was the case with Boris island);
(2) it would never get past all the planning hurdles;
(3) there is no need for it, Abbotsinch and Turnhouse are nowhere near capacity and Prestwick is hardly operating at all.

Skipness One Echo
10th Feb 2018, 18:09
Being wholly private means short termism wins over legacy and planning. Sure EDI and GLA are growing strongly and making money for their shareholders, but over the next 50+ years would a proper greenfield site plugged into national rail be better for the country?
EDI is well beyond design capacity and is now at the 1970s Heathrow stage of just bolting add ons left right and centre after closing two “spare” runways and kicking out all GA. That does have an ROI and kicks the full rebuild can 15 years down the road but that airfield needs a whole new terminal sooner rather than later.
Of course the Govt would have to buy out and close both GLA/EDI and that’s not affordable sadly. Strangely enough, suddenly, there’s something to be said for a BAA type of operation. Competiton is driving traffic in Scotland but at the price of two less than stellar airports.

inOban
12th Feb 2018, 12:55
https://www.edinburghairport.com/about-us/media-centre/press-releases/strong-start-to-2018

up 7.1%. much stronger than I expected.

Plane.Silly
27th Feb 2018, 09:29
Nince Ryanair growth in EDI, at GLA's demise
https://corporate.ryanair.com/news/ryanair-announces-11-new-w18-routes-from-edinburgh/

extra a/c and 11 new routes. not bad indeed

mwm991
27th Feb 2018, 11:15
Any frequency growths on the services lost at Glasgow, but continuing/launching at Edinburgh?

On the beach
28th Feb 2018, 07:46
Wonder if Emirates will get the message and follow Ryanair to EDI?

LandingConfig
28th Feb 2018, 07:55
That's a very different affair.

GLAEDI
28th Feb 2018, 09:18
Main thing Edinburgh’s runway too small for 777W & A380 with loads available at Glasgow. Edinburgh’s Middle East flights loads are not exactly setting the heather on fire. EK is very profitable at Glasgow, gets special treatment and the majority of the communities it serves live in the West. In EK’s mind Edinburgh is served by both GLA & NCL. Unless a super Airport is built in Lanarkshire or Stirlingshire we need both airports being successful and competing with each other. If some of the my airport bigger than your airport people have to remember no competitor higher fares, higher fees and horrendous parking costs!!!

Porrohman
28th Feb 2018, 09:58
GLAEDI, Edinburgh's runway is not too small for B777W and A380. The length is perfectly acceptable for most routes that might reasonably be expected at EDI in the foreseeable future and the PCN has been significantly increased. The shoulders on taxiways have recently been widened to make it easier for these aircraft to manoeuvre. Even before these works, B777Ws have operated from EDI on many occasions. The impediment to these aircraft regularly using EDI used to be the PCNs but most of these have increased as a result of recent works. EDI now has two new stands which are A380 sized and at least two more that can accommodate B777Ws.

inOban
28th Feb 2018, 10:06
The market will decide. FR seem to have found that the profitable shorthaul market is at EDI. Other markets seem to prefer GLA.
Who knows where we will be even two years from now. Will a Chinese service actually happen? With Finnair going year round, will some of the China and Japan market switch to the shorter route via Helsinki?

GLAEDI
28th Feb 2018, 10:47
Thanks InOban markets will decide but sometimes I feel that people make comments on routes getting cancelled at another airport with glee, oh I hope EK move as well blah blah, forgetting that 300(which I believe is a bit exaggerated) have lost their jobs & career in an area of Scotland (Paisley down to Gourock and Greenock) where unemployment is high especially in low entry requirement jobs like Menzies & Swissport roles. These people will find it hard to find new jobs, most are mothers & fathers with child care. They can’t move to Edinburgh to work. I work in both airports and I want both to expand. Yes it would have been better in 60’s we built a single airport but politically that wouldn’t happen it sited the politics at the time to have the regions fly through LHR. Also we couldn’t even build the M8 the most important road in Scotland until 2017!! And even now it really is a jumped up A class road from Blackhill to Edinburgh. Two lanes to serve 3.5m people! Sorry for rant but I just feel the the people being made redundant are more important than what Airport is biggest

inOban
28th Feb 2018, 11:37
I quite agree. Obviously GLA is my nearest airport, although for family reasons EDI is more convenient. I am delighted to see the revival of, for example, shipbuilding at Ferguson, and if we do manage to rebalance the economy towards real industries, the West of Scotland will thrive again. But the airline business, except for a few PSO routes, operates in the free market. Which is why I can't understand why PIK remains open for scheduled flights.
My sympathies to to the lower paid employees who may lose their jobs.

A350Saltire
28th Feb 2018, 13:42
Thanks InOban markets will decide but sometimes I feel that people make comments on routes getting cancelled at another airport with glee, oh I hope EK move as well blah blah, forgetting that 300(which I believe is a bit exaggerated) have lost their jobs & career in an area of Scotland (Paisley down to Gourock and Greenock) where unemployment is high especially in low entry requirement jobs like Menzies & Swissport roles. These people will find it hard to find new jobs, most are mothers & fathers with child care.

I agree with you but that should also be taken into account by those shouting for the closure of PIK. There will be significant job losses there too if that happens. We shouldn't only worry about it when it happens at GLA or EDI.

GoEDI
28th Feb 2018, 14:48
I imagine EDI might be on EK's radar once the B787-10s start arriving but that's still a few years off...

I agree with you but that should also be taken into account by those shouting for the closure of PIK. There will be significant job losses there too if that happens. We shouldn't only worry about it when it happens at GLA or EDI.

Quite, I've read a few comments online now bemoaning this decision but then shouting for the suspension of FR ops and closure of PIK. Bit hypocritical...

As horrible as any job losses are, there's no way that number is going to be 300 from this move, that's just FR with their usual grossly exaggerated numbers. Air crew will be reassigned and any ground crew reductions will ideally be restricted to fixed term contracts that would terminate at end of S18 anyway.

GLAEDI
28th Feb 2018, 14:50
PIK really needs to look alternatives in its product. Maybe the SG money instead of paying for a huge terminal look at a smaller one so Ryanair can continue cycling in frames for maintenance using PIK routes and some alternative actions, one with the way Brexit is going could be a Customs point with the Island of Ireland for goods. There’s going to be a lot of products needing cleared for circulation into the EU & U.K. markets. There’s a lot of job in Ayrshire reliant on PIK also.

Rob Royston
28th Feb 2018, 20:09
Ryanair got 100% on their 3 flights in and out from PIK today. Not sure if all the outward passengers made the flight or if the inwards got home.
This snow is weird, it must have been lighter down there. I looked at the Oban webcam this afternoon and it was like a Summers day up there.

wub
28th Feb 2018, 21:12
The Norwegian flight to Bradley Locks was struck by lightning on departure tonight and did a swift circuit of Central Scotland, before landing back at EDI.

inOban
28th Feb 2018, 21:37
It may have looked like a summer's day in Oban. I can assure you that it was perishing cold. Below freezing all day. The hills looked beautiful.

Porrohman
1st Mar 2018, 11:35
I'd like to offer huge congratulations to the staff at Edinburgh Airport yesterday for keeping the airport open for most of the day despite atrocious weather conditions. Most flight cancellations were due to crew and passengers being unable to reach the airport. The runway remained open apart from some short, pre-planned interludes for snow clearing.

4eyed anorak
1st Mar 2018, 12:08
Looking at the Jan 18 C.A.A. stats for Kevlavik-Edinburgh now has nearly double the amount of passengers compared to Glasgow (just over 11000). Surely Icelandair must be looking closely at starting the route as well or will they continue with Glasgow only? Does Icelandair and WOW compete on any other singular route?

Regards 4ea

theredbarron
1st Mar 2018, 13:05
The Norwegian flight to Bradley Locks was struck by lightning on departure tonight and did a swift circuit of Central Scotland, before landing back at EDI.

Unusual for a lightning strike I would have thought. As I'm not familiar with the Max and given that he came straight back in without holding to burn off excess fuel, would that have been an overweight landing?

Porrohman
1st Mar 2018, 14:16
Unusual for a lightning strike I would have thought. As I'm not familiar with the Max and given that he came straight back in without holding to burn off excess fuel, would that have been an overweight landing?

MTOW = 181,200 lbs
MLW = 152,800 lbs
MZFW = 145,400 lbs
OEW = 99,360 lbs
MDFC = 25,941lbs

Probably not an overweight landing given the likely payload at this time of year. but I'm just guessing.

EZYMAN
1st Mar 2018, 14:22
MTOW = 181,200 lbs
MLW = 152,800 lbs
MZFW = 145,400 lbs
OEW = 99,360 lbs
MDFC = 25,941lbs

Probably not an overweight landing given the likely payload at this time of year. but I'm just guessing.

If an aircraft needs to return, there is a safety LDW so it can land above MLDW as long as it’s within the safety buffer, which can fluctuate dependant on Zerofuel situation.

GLAEDI
1st Mar 2018, 15:42
Looking at the Jan 18 C.A.A. stats for Kevlavik-Edinburgh now has nearly double the amount of passengers compared to Glasgow (just over 11000). Surely Icelandair must be looking closely at starting the route as well or will they continue with Glasgow only? Does Icelandair and WOW compete on any other singular route?

Regards 4ea

Aren’t EasyJet also on the EDI route, three airlines would definitely kill yield??

goldeneye
1st Mar 2018, 18:21
Aren’t EasyJet also on the EDI route, three airlines would definitely kill yield??

EasyJet are O&D. Wow and Icelandair have a significant amount of connecting traffic onward to the US & Canada.

GLAEDI
1st Mar 2018, 18:33
EasyJet are O&D. Wow and Icelandair have a significant amount of connecting traffic onward to the US & Canada.

There’s quite a large number of self connections on the Easyjet. Fly Wow & FI to KEF and then stay a few days before flying to EDI. They’re mainly young USA & CAN and few CHN students. They don’t seem to think about fares from Wow and FI that allow stopovers.

Plane mad 134
5th Mar 2018, 12:21
Does anyone know the summer 2018 schedule for norwegian at edinburgh?

A350Saltire
5th Mar 2018, 15:19
Does anyone know the summer 2018 schedule for norwegian at edinburgh?

For TATL it will be:

SWF at 4x per week
PVD at 3x per week

Plane mad 134
5th Mar 2018, 15:30
Ok thanks that is quite a downgrade from last years american routes by norwegian

toledoashley
5th Mar 2018, 16:06
Yes, One aircraft has been moved to Dublin in order to begin the double daily to SWF.

A350Saltire
5th Mar 2018, 19:52
Ok thanks that is quite a downgrade from last years american routes by norwegian

Yes I believe in this case it’s another reduction due to the failure of the SG to cut APD as promised. No such problem in Dublin.

CabinCrewe
5th Mar 2018, 20:24
why would APD effects be unique to Norwegian transatlantic at EDI?

toledoashley
5th Mar 2018, 20:35
CabinCrewe - Norwegian are trying out a new ULCC model for transatlantic with the MAX. Part of that plan was a reduction in APD, which hasn’t materialised. To stimulate the demand it needs low pricing, but they cant make the sort of yield they want on it with the APD as it is. Therefore they have shifted the focus to Ireland.

A350Saltire
5th Mar 2018, 21:31
why would APD effects be unique to Norwegian transatlantic at EDI?

It won't be unique to Norwegian TATL at EDI as we have also seen FR can most of their GLA network as a result of this. As has been mentioned, for their business model on the TATL routes, APD at current levels is a huge barrier. More money to be made at Dublin and better chance of stimulating demand with lower prices overall.

willy wombat
5th Mar 2018, 21:48
or you could say, in the case of both Norwegian TA and FR, the product is so poor you can only sell it at rock bottom prices which APD stops you doing.

A350Saltire
5th Mar 2018, 22:18
or you could say, in the case of both Norwegian TA and FR, the product is so poor you can only sell it at rock bottom prices which APD stops you doing.

I wouldn’t say that though as I don’t think the product is poor. It serves a specific market.

willy wombat
6th Mar 2018, 08:32
Exactly - a specific market for which price is the be all and end all.

A350Saltire
6th Mar 2018, 09:01
Exactly - a specific market for which price is the be all and end all.

Yes but that does not mean the product is poor. Norwegian offer free WiFi for instance which is not universal throughout the airline world.

willy wombat
6th Mar 2018, 09:21
Obviously there are different views re this but if I had the choice of flying transatlantic on a 737 or, say, a 777, free wi fi wouldn't sway me.

Flightrider
6th Mar 2018, 09:26
Norwegian knew the APD situation when they started the routes. I'm told that they had apparently under-estimated the impact this would have ex US in particular, where they started to sell the same lead-in fares ex PVD and SWF to EDI as for DUB, ORK, SNN and BFS but of course, APD has to be deducted ex EDI. Unsurprisingly their yields are far stronger at the other airports than EDI, therefore capacity is being switched across.

They knew the score when they launched but missed a beat by recognising the impact of APD - and you can hardly blame the Scottish Government for that one.

nighthawk117
6th Mar 2018, 09:38
Obviously there are different views re this but if I had the choice of flying transatlantic on a 737 or, say, a 777, free wi fi wouldn't sway me.

But you are in the minority though. 83% of people will book not even knowing what type of aircraft they will be on.

I've never understood why people hate the 757 over the Atlantic. Once you sit down, you're jammed in between a window, the person next to you, and the seat 2 inches in front of your face. Doesn't matter if it's a 757 or a 777, you have the same amount of space.

Hogg
6th Mar 2018, 09:42
Having travelled quite a few times TA recently "in the back" the least room I had was T7. Comparing to similar seats on A330/T7/75/76 and 737M8 73Max was absolutely fine with zero complaints tbh.

A320.b744
6th Mar 2018, 09:42
In all fairness, there is very little difference between the onboard product of Norwegian and the US carriers when flying in economy class from Edinburgh to New York.

Both Norwegian and US carriers have the same seat pitch and seat width in economy class.
Both Norwegian and US carriers have free IFE - US carriers' is accessed via seat-back TVs, Norwegian's via your mobile device.
Only Norwegian offers free onboard wi-fi.
Norwegian charges for meals, whereas US carriers provide free meals.

The main difference between flying economy class on Norwegian or one of the US carriers is the arrival airport in the US, because the onboard product is almost identical.

SWBKCB
6th Mar 2018, 09:56
CabinCrewe - Norwegian are trying out a new ULCC model for transatlantic with the MAX. Part of that plan was a reduction in APD, which hasn’t materialised. To stimulate the demand it needs low pricing, but they cant make the sort of yield they want on it with the APD as it is. Therefore they have shifted the focus to Ireland.

Or maybe it's nowt to do with APD and there isn't sufficient demand. DUB and EDI aren't the same markets, differentiated just by APD.

renfrew
6th Mar 2018, 10:15
The SNP would like to reduce APD but they are a minority government and the Greens are against it.
Plus a snag has arisen re EU approval.

A320.b744
6th Mar 2018, 10:36
Norwegian knew the APD situation when they started the routes. I'm told that they had apparently under-estimated the impact this would have ex US in particular, where they started to sell the same lead-in fares ex PVD and SWF to EDI as for DUB, ORK, SNN and BFS but of course, APD has to be deducted ex EDI. Unsurprisingly their yields are far stronger at the other airports than EDI, therefore capacity is being switched across.

They knew the score when they launched but missed a beat by recognising the impact of APD - and you can hardly blame the Scottish Government for that one.

The Boston/New York area has a very strong connection to Ireland, so it should hardly be surprising that yield on the Irish routes is higher than on the Scottish routes.

Norwegian's decision has nothing to do with APD; it's simply a case of demand.

There is a lot more demand for transatlantic flights to the US East Coast from Ireland than there is from Scotland. Edinburgh and Glasgow already have an impressive offering to New York, and there's simply not enough demand to support all of these flights. The fact that United have reduced their GLA-EWR service to summer seasonal is evidence of this.

Furthermore, Norwegian's decision to operate three routes meant that the base was doomed to fail from the outset. BDL was only served from EDI, meaning it received a lot less advertising and brand awareness. Also, the fact that BDL is exactly halfway between SWF and PVD meant that passenger demand was split between three routes, instead of just two from BFS, DUB or SNN.

A350Saltire
6th Mar 2018, 10:54
The Boston/New York area has a very strong connection to Ireland, so it should hardly be surprising that yield on the Irish routes is higher than on the Scottish routes.

Norwegian's decision has nothing to do with APD; it's simply a case of demand.



Surely though if Norwegian were able to charge the same westbound prices from EDI as they can from DUB, SNN and ORK then they would be able to stimulate demand even more. As has been mentioned, their business model here is as a ULCC and for that they need to keep the prices low. EDI is really at a disadvantage here when competing with the likes of DUB.

That being said, I do agree with your assessment of the Irish connections between New York/ Boston and Ireland so the DUB routes were always going to do well, even with EI in the mix.

Plane mad 134
7th Mar 2018, 06:53
Does anyone know any route rumours for edinburgh

4eyed anorak
9th Mar 2018, 17:56
I see that Qatar will be using the A350 daily!
Doha – Edinburgh eff 01JUL18 A350-900XWB replaces 787-8, 1 daily.

Regards 4ea

Callum Johnstone
9th Mar 2018, 18:50
Does anyone know any route rumours for edinburgh
There are rumours aplenty!

* Hainan to Beijing
* China Eastern to Shanghai
* Virgin Atlantic to start direct US flights
* Emirates - will they or won't they?
* A Japan route
* Norwegian 737MAX service to Canada
* Norwegian 787 service to California
* Orlando - more frequent service courtesy of .... someone
* Wizzair - do they fancy a bit of the EDI action?
* AA - will they swap JFK for PHL?
* Is an Oxford route coming back?

The list goes on ....

Plane mad 134
9th Mar 2018, 20:31
Ok thanks thats great to hear i hope some of these routes get announced

billyg
10th Mar 2018, 00:21
Ok thanks thats great to hear i hope some of these routes get announced

In most cases , you'll have a long wait !

Haldane90
10th Mar 2018, 07:25
Won't say much but security being upgraded again this year in preparation for S19. Expansion in long haul so I'm told

A350Saltire
10th Mar 2018, 10:04
In most cases , you'll have a long wait !

I certainly think the Chinese route is not far off. There have also been rumours about Japan but those will more than likely be a series of charters.

Who knows what Norwegian will do although I reckon that hinges upon the reduction in APD. I do think Orlando is very much underserved and we could see movement on this soon.

One thing we can be certain of is continued growth which is great.

Plane mad 134
10th Mar 2018, 13:10
It is great to see the continued growth and i think some of these rumours might happen like the Beijing route it would be nice to see new airlines at Edinburgh as well

Plane mad 134
11th Mar 2018, 14:08
Does anyone know why aer Lingus/Stobart air are using an Aer Lingus A321 instead of the usual ATR72?

PDXCWL45
11th Mar 2018, 14:28
Does anyone know why aer Lingus/Stobart air are using an Aer Lingus A321 instead of the usual ATR72?
Rugby. Scotland played Ireland yesterday in Dublin.

inOban
12th Mar 2018, 10:09
https://www.edinburghairport.com/about-us/media-centre/press-releases/busiest-february-on-record

Up 4.3% in spite of the Beast from the East, which caused a significant drop in domestic PAX (-6%).

GLAEDI
12th Mar 2018, 23:25
According to Dublin pages, Beijing to be announced on Thursday NON-STOP. Are we to hear direct from EDI also? Or has Brexit (Irish Border problem) become the latest complication of a multi-sector shared with DUB? I’m currently out of Scotland so have no access to my contacts to check, but I wonder if anyone else knows?

Skipness One Echo
13th Mar 2018, 10:04
Don't DfT rules insist all passengers routing DUB-EDI-xyz re-clear security at EDI? This is why double drops no longer work in the UK market. DfT doesn't recognise any non UK security as to be a high enough standard, and to be fair, having come through some sleepier European airports in recent years, I can see why.

EZYMAN
13th Mar 2018, 10:24
Don't DfT rules insist all passengers routing DUB-EDI-xyz re-clear security at EDI? This is why double drops no longer work in the UK market. DfT doesn't recognise any non UK security as to be a high enough standard, and to be fair, having come through some sleepier European airports in recent years, I can see why.

There are still double drops from international grounds ie AYT-LGW-MAN operates during the winter, not sure about CTA to be honest

PPRuNeUser0176
13th Mar 2018, 10:26
Half of DUBs service will be non stop the other half via EDI however no idea if EDI will get its own direct or will be announced this week in Scotland.

Unless it has changed.

EIFFS
13th Mar 2018, 16:50
Or maybe it's nowt to do with APD and there isn't sufficient demand. DUB and EDI aren't the same markets, differentiated just by APD.

Agreed, very different markets, but APD works against EDI, having said that the loads out of EDI have stabilised and there have been some very good loads of late.

A number of SWF DUB rotations are already full for next month, the loads on SNN & BFS are good, BFS benefits from reduced APD under devolved powers.

It’s hallirious that the greens oppose the reduction in APD so more people fly to LHR before heading off over the pond, good joined up thinking that.

GLAEDI
14th Mar 2018, 10:00
The problem isn’t just DfT rules but also Immigration & Customs for the CTA.

1) all pax must clear Immigration at first point of arrival into the CTA ie EDI will clear for Eire & DUB would clear for U.K. this is where the problem arises is that for Immigration dirty passengers will be mixed with clean passengers. So a pax who is Transitting without Visa through Dublin will then be on a DUB - EDI CTA which increases the chances of undocumented arrivals. In practice a CHN national with a schengen visa could fly from Paris to DUB to join the DUB-EDI-PEK flight without see the Garda as long as they Transit airside. They then get off the flight in Edinburgh and claim Asylum. This is why these flights require permission from the Director General of Border Force

2) although CTA is free movement of people it’s still a Customs area for Prohibited & Restricted goods. Again the risks are higher for these flights.

3) nobody knows what will happen regards the U.K. & EU Border that’s being created by Brexit

4) Edinburgh had also asked for the passengers to enter the common departure lounge whilst being processed to DfT standards (they want them buying Duty Free) again this is a problem with an exit to the U.K. that’s not controlled.

Very complicated hence a great deal of negotiations. Also aren’t Hainan in finincial trouble??

EZYMAN
14th Mar 2018, 11:58
Very complicated hence a great deal of negotiations. Also aren’t Hainan in finincial trouble??

Hainan arnt in trouble... it’s there parent group HNA that are in trouble

The96er
14th Mar 2018, 12:04
Hainan arn't in trouble... it’s their parent group HNA that are in trouble

Which is the same thing ! - If the parent company fails, so do its subsidiaries unless purchased by someone else.

GLAEDI
14th Mar 2018, 15:47
Considering the argument is over non payment of aviation fuel, I suggest for an airline, the fuel getting turned off is a huge problem!

CabinCrewe
14th Mar 2018, 22:24
Globes English - Israir to launch Tel Aviv - Scotland, Norway routes (http://www.globes.co.il/en/article-israir-to-launch-tel-aviv-scotland-norway-routes-1001227510)
Is this a rehash of last years launch that never came to anything?

LAX_LHR
14th Mar 2018, 23:04
Will operate Wednesday’s 6H229/6H230 from June until 10th Oct.

EZYMAN
15th Mar 2018, 01:22
Which is the same thing ! - If the parent company fails, so do its subsidiaries unless purchased by someone else.

Hainan are purchasing HNA, HNA also are a major shareholder in Swissport... if HNA fail that would mean Swissport also could fall into difficulty

inOban
15th Mar 2018, 10:17
Having been in the local media since last night, the Beijing flights are now announced on the EDI website.

A350Saltire
15th Mar 2018, 12:44
Having been in the local media since last night, the Beijing flights are now announced on the EDI website.

Really great news and congrats must go to all that worked so hard to secure this service.

That is one of the rumours from up this thread ticked off at least.

Plane mad 134
15th Mar 2018, 17:09
I wonder if this will make china eastern turn away from a route to Shanghai

willy wombat
16th Mar 2018, 11:16
Good news for Scotland in general. You've got to laugh at the TV coverage on the BBC where the Scottish Tourism officials keep banging on about how this means Chinese visitors won't have to travel via London (and only London). Don't they realise that they also travel via Abu Dhabi, Dubai, Qatar, Amsterdam, Frankfurt etc etc

nighthawk117
17th Mar 2018, 10:58
Good news for Scotland in general. You've got to laugh at the TV coverage on the BBC where the Scottish Tourism officials keep banging on about how this means Chinese visitors won't have to travel via London (and only London). Don't they realise that they also travel via Abu Dhabi, Dubai, Qatar, Amsterdam, Frankfurt etc etc

I think what they meant is Chinese tourists come to the UK, stopping in London for a few days, before making a secondary, short trip to Scotland. Now they can come direct to Scotland as a main trip, spending longer here.

CabinCrewe
17th Mar 2018, 12:12
Id be surprised if most inbound Chinese tourists came to Scotland and only Scotland... without backtracking either way to visit London.

canberra97
17th Mar 2018, 15:25
Unless those Chinese tourists have been to the UK before and wish to visit other areas of the country on their return visit without having to transit or visit London, these Chinese tourists tend to be wealthy and are venturing further afield, there are some more on these forums who assume that the Chinese only ever make the one visit to our shores and that means London is involved which I can assure you is not always the case.

willy wombat
17th Mar 2018, 19:52
Indeed but the point I was making is that you already can visit Scotland from China without going to London. I know from personal experience that Dubai attracts large numbers of Chinese tourists who are, by and large, en-route to or from Europe.

edi_local
18th Mar 2018, 14:55
Id be surprised if most inbound Chinese tourists came to Scotland and only Scotland... without backtracking either way to visit London.

I think you underestimate Chinese tourism in Scotland. With so many Chinese students now studying here anyone visiting them is likely to have an extended stay in Scotland visit more than the usual 2 days in Edinburgh tacked on to the end of a UK package deal, which has been the norm. Scotland has been heavily promoted to the Chinese market in recent years.

CCFAIRPORT
18th Mar 2018, 15:30
Carcassonne cancelled for winter 2018-19
resumes march 2019

inOban
18th Mar 2018, 16:48
I wondered how many of the FR routes launched last autumn would prove viable.

Callum Johnstone
19th Mar 2018, 07:41
It appears representatives from Edinburgh Airport are back in China shortly to discuss connections with other Chinese cities:

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/airport-bosses-hoping-to-add-further-edinburgh-to-china-flights-1-4706603

Presumably this could be the China Eastern service to Shanghai which has been widely rumoured?

Plane mad 134
19th Mar 2018, 08:10
That would be great if edinburgh could secure that route as well

A350Saltire
19th Mar 2018, 13:22
So 13.4 million passengers passed through EDI in 2017. I note they have forecast 14.3 million by 2020 but surely they will smash that a year early?

I can see some of the expansion work planned being accelerated to facilitate this impressive growth.

Plane mad 134
19th Mar 2018, 21:48
Will edinburgh ever get a main second runway or terminal

goldeneye
19th Mar 2018, 22:11
EDI could do with a new modern terminal. Rather than an extension on an extension on an extension. But there really is not that many locations to build one. Did think that the cross runway that is being closed could be redeveloped into a new terminal building. But alas that’s unlikely to happen.

roverman
19th Mar 2018, 22:24
It appears representatives from Edinburgh Airport are back in China shortly to discuss connections with other Chinese cities:

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/airport-bosses-hoping-to-add-further-edinburgh-to-china-flights-1-4706603

Presumably this could be the China Eastern service to Shanghai which has been widely rumoured?

Good luck EDI. MAN has been promised the same as being imminent since the 2015 announcement of Beijing, by everyone from the Chinese Consul-General to various trade and airline industry big wigs. We're still waiting.

Heathrow Harry
20th Mar 2018, 08:52
TBH how many people want to travel to some of these places - even from London?

Probably 20-30 a day

The main users will be CHinese tourists - which isn't a big profit business

nighthawk117
20th Mar 2018, 09:43
The main users will be CHinese tourists - which isn't a big profit business

isn't a big profit for whom? All that inbound tourism is massive for the economy! From an airport perspective, a landing fee is a landing fee, regardless of the customer onboard.

Porrohman
20th Mar 2018, 10:17
Chinese airports are on, or very close to, the great circle routes between the UK and many places in Asia Pacific, including Australia and New Zealand. As such, they potentially offer shorter journey times and lower fares than routing via the Middle East.

Heathrow Harry
20th Mar 2018, 14:15
"isn't a big profit for whom?"

the only people who count when it comed to starting services - the airlines...............

Sk1schoolsam
21st Mar 2018, 15:18
Does anyone know if the new gates under construction at Edi will have air Bridges? Construction Looking closer to being finished but no sign of them yet?

A350Saltire
21st Mar 2018, 16:29
Does anyone know if the new gates under construction at Edi will have air Bridges? Construction Looking closer to being finished but no sign of them yet?

The three new widebody stands adjacent to the new extension will definitely have air bridges.

Skipness One Echo
21st Mar 2018, 17:45
Do they have direct access to the UK Border or is it a workaround or bus?

canberra97
21st Mar 2018, 17:51
Does anyone know if the new gates under construction at Edi will have air Bridges? Construction Looking closer to being finished but no sign of them yet?

Your asking a rather obvious question considering that the new stands are for wide body use.

Have you not seen the numerous images and CGI online showing the new Pier and Terminal extension where it clearly shows Air Bridges. The exterior may well look as if it's nearly complete but a whole lot more work has to be done with the fitting out of the interior of the building before it's actually finished.

A350Saltire
21st Mar 2018, 19:10
Do they have direct access to the UK Border or is it a workaround or bus?

They will be connected to a new immigration facility and baggage hall.

canberra97
21st Mar 2018, 19:51
Yes they will it's all part of the redevelopment but have a look on the internet honestly there are images and information regarding the expansion at EDI, even the airports website gives details.

Sk1schoolsam
21st Mar 2018, 22:47
Yes they will it's all part of the redevelopment but have a look on the internet honestly there are images and information regarding the expansion at EDI, even the airports website gives details.

Yes thanks Canberra97 I have seen these images and information on line, but having departed from Gate 26 today and passing the new extension as we taxied, I could not see where they are planning to attach the air bridges. Perhaps they still have to create the attached positions at all the new gates. I will take some pictures when I return on Friday.

Think online shows only 3 out of 4 gates with air bridges? No T5 style extended walkways to furthest out stand (16)

canberra97
21st Mar 2018, 22:54
Yeah your correct with your last comment I wonder if there will be just the three Air Bridges or the artist impression just shows that as it would have been better if there were the four.

Try and take some photos on your return as there hasn't been many updates lately.

Cheers

inOban
22nd Mar 2018, 19:15
I read that Hainan have now paid their fuel bills. HNA seem to have sold enough assets.

GoEDI
23rd Mar 2018, 13:54
Hainan now on sale. DUB-PEK can be booked only on days 26. PEK-DUB can be booked days 2467. EDI-PEK bookable days 47. PEK-EDI bookable 2467. So it appears only the non stop options can be booked Eastbound. Is this due to issues with the CTA/Customs & immigration and not being able to mix inbound/outbound pax?

GLAEDI
23rd Mar 2018, 17:22
Hainan now on sale. DUB-PEK can be booked only on days 26. PEK-DUB can be booked days 2467. EDI-PEK bookable days 47. PEK-EDI bookable 2467. So it appears only the non stop options can be booked Eastbound. Is this due to issues with the CTA/Customs & immigration and not being able to mix inbound/outbound pax?

It will be likely this is the reason. The U.K. & Eire currently have a joint visa regime. So coming to the CTA is no problem. The mixing can cause boarding card swaps and undocumented arrivals.

Sk1schoolsam
23rd Mar 2018, 18:11
Yeah your correct with your last comment I wonder if there will be just the three Air Bridges or the artist impression just shows that as it would have been better if there were the four.

Try and take some photos on your return as there hasn't been many updates lately.

Cheers

Have photos... how do I attach?

canberra97
23rd Mar 2018, 21:31
Have photos... how do I attach?

Quote my message, skroll down to where it says additional options and go to manage attachments and upload your photos :-)

Kinocker
25th Mar 2018, 15:11
Any chance the EDI-DUB leg of the new Hainan route might be bookable as a standalone flight? Obviously it's already a heavily trafficked route but flying it with Hainan would be a nice change from the monotony of the FR/EI duopoly...

GLAEDI
25th Mar 2018, 17:49
No chance! The immigration & Customs threat would be massive! Boarding card swaps, passport swaps and not mention duty free goods being re-entered into the CTA!

A320.b744
25th Mar 2018, 17:52
Any chance the EDI-DUB leg of the new Hainan route might be bookable as a standalone flight? Obviously it's already a heavily trafficked route but flying it with Hainan would be a nice change from the monotony of the FR/EI duopoly...

Dublin Airport have confirmed that Hainan will be selling flights between Dublin and Edinburgh.

LAX_LHR
25th Mar 2018, 17:56
You can already book flights between EDI and DUB but at £901 one way, I suspect the rest of the fares need to be loaded!

GLAEDI
25th Mar 2018, 18:10
Well considering you don’t need a passport to travel within CTA that’s going to interesting. I wondering what checks are going to be in place to make sure adequate documents from passengers “Transitting without Visa” via Dublin are going to provide to show they won’t get off in Edinburgh. You can’t TWOV EDI. I suspect a lot of £2000 fines for the airline.

CabinCrewe
25th Mar 2018, 18:16
depending on the triangle double drop routing, I hope the remaining inbound longhaul passengers get off and plane gets a good clean as I dont fancy boarding that...
Wonder if its a productive way relative to the length of flight for filling empty seats... would have thought might be a logistical reservations nightmare