Hearing Aids

[Pontius Navigator]

I am posting here as many military of my age were subject to noise with no protection. Many of us now suffer from noise induced hearing loss. If you were 'lucky' you might have got a payment from the Veterans Agency.

This though is about NHS hearing aids.

I had NHS aids for 17 years with big plugs and moderate improvement in hearing. In August I had a problem but found the NHS Trust had contracted out to SpecSavers. As my aid was u/s I was entitled to replacement ahead of the normal 5 year cycle.

The new ones, still Siemens, are slightly smaller BTE and can have 4 different programs and about 10 click volume range.

Instead of the big plug they have small buds that sit well inside the ear.

The improved sound is amazing and my ears no longer produce loads of wax.

That is the good news. However not all NHS Trusts have contracted out.

I was not referred to Spec Savers, I just rang up and got an appointment. Just ask them if they do NHS aids in your area.

[RubiC Cube]

Pardon? Speak up old boy.

[BEagle]

"Repeat please"......

VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV

[NutLoose]

Good to here PN, I notice some loss in my right ear, when lying in bed with my head and left ear on the pillow. The alarm is a dull beep without the high pitch part of the note, rolling onto the other side I hear the full high pitch note.

[Pontius Navigator]

NL, they won't work lying in bed :)

Without them our grandfather clock is a muffled thump. With them it is a clear resonating tone. Well worth having a hearing test.

Those with perfect hearing might get a shock. Mrs PN has the TV volume too high :), it used to be too loud. Another benefit, with the plugs in and batteries out it is blissfully quiet. I can't hear the MiL or WIWs.

[Brian W May]

Have a look at Hearing Direct (for those whose Health Authorities opted out - like Doncaster).

They're less than half the High Street price.

[John Eacott]

I picked up some Siemens BTE from Specsavers in UK a few years ago, excellent service and product. Almost half the Australian rrp of $A9,900 which justified the mucking around for appointments in the middle of a holiday!

And yet I still pass my ATPL Medical.....

[DON T]

My wife is a nurse in the local hospital ENT department. The hospital still has it's own audiology dept. The latest hearing aids are supplied free of charge and servicing, tubes and replacement batteries are supplied for the life of the hearing aids. She is always saying me 'Don't let any of your friends spend lots of money on hearing aids, the NHS free ones are just as good.'��

[Pontius Navigator]

I clearly did not make it clear, our NHS Trust has contracted out to SpecSavers. The service remains completely free. Also one of my buds was painful, slightly too large. Walked into SpecSavers and had a new bud fitted in moments. No appointment and it was not my regular SS.

[Pontius Navigator]

Don't, I can't agree that all NHS are as good; they aren't. In February I had new NHS moulds fitted. I had an appointment to have moulds taken, a fortnight later I had them fitted. They are large plugs, my ears heat and produce wax. They were 'ok'.

In contrast the SS buds were fitted there and then, they go right into the ear and are near invisible. As they seal better and are deeper the clarity is much better. Only if the NHS uses buds and the very thin tube could they equal these.

[Fitter2]

Having spent a few years in close proximity to Javelins and Lightnings before the days of ear defenders, my high tone deafness became bad enough about 12 years ago to get a NHS hearing aid, ear mould type. It was uncomfortable and didn't give much help. Moving on 8 years (and NHS areas) I gave the audiology people another go, and was measured and given a pair of Phonak type with in ear buds. Brilliant, I can hear what my friends are saying about me. I agree, don't pay a fortune for hearing aids, the NHS ones can be as good as you get.

[MPN11]

Hmmm ... I guess I should start exploring this subject. My left ear is pretty ineffective, as I have high-tone deafness resulting from decades of shooting that started before ear-defenders bacame fashionable. I've been told that the car has a 'beep' when the indicators are in use, but despite sticking my head down around the dashboard (when stationary, of course) I absolutely cannot hear a bloody thing. Sibilants are an issue in conversation, too.

No NHS here, of course, but I'm half-tempted to try doing something about it ... once I've finished with MRI scans and assorted other appointments.

[DON T]

Don't, I can't agree that all NHS are as good; they aren't. In February I had new NHS moulds fitted. I had an appointment to have moulds taken, a fortnight later I had them fitted. They are large plugs, my ears heat and produce wax. They were 'ok'.

In contrast the SS buds were fitted there and then, they go right into the ear and are near invisible. As they seal better and are deeper the clarity is much better. Only if the NHS uses buds and the very thin tube could they equal these.

Those buds are exactly what you will get at our local NHS, my wife actually uses them. However there are people who think you cannot get them on the NHS, you can and without the purchase price and ongoing service and battery costs. Check first before spending.

[Pontius Navigator]

Don't it is clear that different trusts have different arrangements. To reiterate, Lincolnshire uses SpecSavers and these are free.

In contrast North East Lincolnshire do not use SpecSavers and will not issue my mother in law with two. They do not have buds.

[1771 DELETE]

So after flying 30 years in a MR 1 and 2 i am way beyond 50% high tone DEAF, i even wear bluetooth head phone when watching the TV, I was deafening the missus setting the volume.
Living in the states, its going to cost me around $8000 for a pair of tuneable bud aids.
Any suggestions as to how i could get some on the NHS.

[Rosevidney1]

I think most of us have become high tone deaf to a greater or lesser degree due to years of military flying, or as ground crew who were equally exposed to a high decibel count. In my case it was helicopters and it seemed to me that the Gazelle was probably the worst culprit.

[PEI_3721]

Gradual hearing loss (WIWOL) necessitated hearing aids. Being overseas two units were bought privately; however on the return to the U.K. several years later, a GP referred NHS assessment replaced both units with the latest Phonak external / tube system at no cost. These are far better than the private units and well supported by the NHS, free batteries, etc.
Ms P now has similar systems, however with differing requirements there is no agreeable level of TV volume.
NHS recommended seeking advice from the charity ‘Deaf Direct’ (Hereford / Worcester area).
Their advice has been magnificent, recommending and testing a solution covering independent TV volume (for an old type of TV), telephone, PC, iPad.
This involved purchase of a remote mic and amplifier unit, loop system, with independent volume and tone control (discount via DD), and free NHS activation of the loop control function in the aids - weekly drop in, maintenance and repair service as required.
Suggest contact GP - NHS, choose a system with loop option and adjustable volume if offered (no need to activate these immediately). For specialist options, discuss with DD or similar; or even start with them re NHS.

[Brian W May]

Doncaster opted out and it's not free.

Hearing aids do not assist high tone deafness, that is permanent damage in the inner ear, they do however amplify the stuff you can still hear.

Hearing Direct HD500s are very good, but are not free. If you have a free service, then use it, beats the hell out of a grand outlay.

[Pontius Navigator]

BM, my hearing flat lines above mid tones but is at a borderline level for the next loss level. The aids enable me to hear Bird song (noisy buffers) and changes muffled sound to crisp notes.

1771, I would guess no chance. Maybe contact the RBL though I expect age may be against you - MR2 out of service 47 years ago and AEW 27 years.

[DGAC]

The wearing of hearing aids entitles you to apply for a Disabled Railcard, allowing you and a companion to reduced rate rail fares and reduced fares for the Railcard holder only, when using an Oyster Card

[ACW342]

PN
Many thanks for the heads up on both Specsavers and the VA. I was unaware that I could make a claim for hearing damage, as I had been advised by a solicitor that, as most of my time in the RAF was covered by Crown Indemnity, I wouldn't be able to claim. Having visited the VA site I will now be putting a claim in.

I have several hearing problems the most debilitating being severe tinnitus. As audiology is not contracted out by my local health trust I have been referred by my GP for an audiology consult. I am now 24 weeks into a [B]59 Week Waiting List.[B] We have no NHS as such in Northern Ireland, rather a combined Health & Social care agency, but, of course, there is no executive in place and the HSA will probably be running out of money soon.

After 22 years of working on airfields both as an SAC out laying Glims and LE58s and other such jobs with no ear defenders, or working as a Runway Controller, originally in the old Commer 'vans with absolutely no soundproofing or the newer but almost equally noisy caravans I would think that I am eligible for, at least a grant to cover the cost of a decent hearing aid. Either that or its back to my wifes home village of Dunscroft and pop down to SS in Donny and get the taxpayers of the Soviet Socialist Republic of South Yorkshire (A Nuclear Free Zone, IIRC) to pay for it.

[tucumseh]

I was unaware that I could make a claim for hearing damage, as I had been advised by a solicitor that, as most of my time in the RAF was covered by Crown Indemnity, I wouldn't be able to claim.I can only speak from personal experience and legal advice I was given as a programme manager. In the context of aircrew hearing loss, the litigation clock started running in 1996, when a viable solution was developed, trialed and accepted. (Analog Active Noise Reduction). Part of this was offering aircrew made-to-measure helmets. Another immediate change was to the type of earshell padding, which offered greater protection to those with spectacles. Another proposal, using decent (French) transducers, was rejected on cost grounds, although the funding was there. That applied, at the time, to the Mk4A helmet. If pressed, I'd say there is absolutely no excuse for aircrew or groundcrew being exposed to excessive noise dose after 2000. If you search ANR in Hansard, you'll see Mike Hancock MP (Portsmouth) asked very pointed questions in the House about this, concerned about litigation. Janes' ran a very good article, citing the drop in allowable flying hours, to around 60 a year in helicopters, without protection. Hitherto, this had all been made difficult by tables of indecipherable decibel notation. If you decide to take it further, give me a shout and I'll provide the papers.

[langleybaston]

The wearing of hearing aids entitles you to apply for a Disabled Railcard, allowing you and a companion to reduced rate rail fares and reduced fares for the Railcard holder only, when using an Oyster Card

I believe the Disabled Railcard has no advantage over the Seniors' Railcard: both appear to give a 1/3 discount.
Please have I got this right?

[I am another victim, probably three years of Lightnings and Hunters at EDUO, my MQ was rather near the threshold!]

[Pontius Navigator]

DGAC, interesting though I have a free veterans oyster card as I have a disability pension.

[Pontius Navigator]

ACW, read BrianWs post above. The SSRD have retained audiology in_house.

Your difficulty will be to get agreement that you have noise induced hearing loss and not age induced.

The Veterans Agency will try and assess any loss at below 20%, I got a grant 17 years ago of £4.5k with 15%.

A friend ex lightning got nothing.

As Tuc said, the litigation clock started in 1996. Actually I know people who got more cash earlier than that.

In the 60s we were actively ordered not to wear ear defenders as we could not hear shouted warnings. In the 70s there were trials to replace lightweight headsets that only carried the earphone with noise reducing one's. In the 80s we had these but they were only used in the aircraft. In the 90s paranoia and you wear them on the apron.

If you didn't have any, tough. At Coningsby, going between the WOC and Ops you were in a concrete chasm that amplified jet noise but no ear defenders.

Truth be it known, but my problem probably originated at school when firing a 303 in a quarry.

[DGAC]

Pontius
The advantage of the DRC is that another person can travel with you at the reduced fare, without the need to hold any Railcard themselves.

[MPN11]

PN ... I tried for hearing disability assessment when I retired. I was not deaf enough, but the specialist said my frequency loss (2-4 mhz?) was apparently classic .303. My fault, possibly. I used to clear hangovers at CATCS by begging a few rounds from the ATC on Saturday mornings!!

[tucumseh]

PN I believe you are correct. Before about 1998 it was very difficult to find out what R&D was being conducted. Then it was all put on a database, so (in theory) you can now search by key word, and avoid reinventing the wheel. If I recall, a Group Captain in Main Building ran an Applied Research Package into ANR in the 80s, but his remit was for RAF Harrier only. They had difficulty integrating it into the helmet and work ceased. No process existed for others to pick it up. In 1994 I had to phone round and stumbled across this chap, who passed me all his old work. It transpired a company had carried on with development, and owned the IPR for what was inside the earshells, but not the circuit design itself, which was ours. The first production version used battery boxes, then it was fully integrated into aircraft power and comms - with the helmet becoming a comms system LRU as well as AEA.

Generally speaking, Analog ANR is aircraft type and, often, Mark specific. Anyone selling a generic aircrew ANR is having a laugh. The only exception I came across was Sea Harrier and Sea King AEW could use the same one, as the damaging frequencies just happened to be the same, but from a different source. MoD's Digital ANR was designed by 1999, the idea being a single helmet mod, and you blew the EPROM for whatever aircraft you were using that day. Analog met the old 85dB(A) requirement, DANR the new 75dB(A).

The MoD-wide noise protection business case was submitted on 1st August 1998. Don't know what became of it, but I know alternative technology is now used which wasn't physically small enough at the time.

[Pontius Navigator]

TUC which moves smartly to ANR Headphones for passenger use. Flying Emirates I certainly found some noise reductions when their headsets were powered up.

What about lost cost personal ones? Active Noise Cancelling Bluetooth Headphones Wireless Earphones Headset | eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Active-Noise-Cancelling-Bluetooth-Headphones-Wireless-Earphones-Headset-/282678429494?epid=789421269&hash=item41d0f28736:g:FI8AAOSwYL9Z0qyq)

[ancientaviator62]

If anyone cares to look on post 3167 of the 'Global Aviation Hercules ' thread you will see page one of a noise trial done on the C130K.
Despite working on the Javelin, Hunter and Lightning plus 30 years flying in the C130K my hearing has stood up remarkably well. It is my wife who needs the TV sound turned up not me !

[Pontius Navigator]

AA, hearing loss incideous. First noticed mine when flying in the Nimrod. My other nav, ex-Shack, had accute hearing and could pluck a weak radio call out of the ether. OTOH a 17,000 hr Shack and Nimrod pilot became so deaf as to be grounded.

I know we did everything we could to avoid the Quacks which might threaten our flying status. With hindsight I don't know why Serving aircrew could not have hearing aids.

[Shackman]

Alas I too suffer from too many years of Griffons either side of my eardrums. Of note shortly after the AEW came into service I took one to Boscombe for various trials, the final one being a noise assessment in the cockpit and Nav/Eng compartment. After orbiting a well known landmark (Arthur's Tower) for some time, we were asked to return to BD at maximum power. Max rpm and water meth engaged was certainly one hell of a noise, we exceeded Vne by xx knots, and on completion the boffin declared that the noise level was above acceptable limits - for a blast furnace! The results were not published!

[Shack37]

I spent my entire service, 9 years, as Shack groundcrew involving many starter crew, engine runs and a not insignificant number of hours as a passenger on detachments. On a periodic medical for offshore work I was warned I could fail the next one due to hearing loss. I applied for a pension and was turned down. On appeal I and my BL helper faced a panel of 6 or 7 people including a lawyer and a medical hearing expert and lost again. The reason given was that once removed from the high noise source no further hearing loss occurs.


The good thing is for the appeal MoD provide you with medical and service records. Had it not been for those records I would never have known I had served in Germany.:sad:

[Pontius Navigator]

The reason given was that once removed from the high noise source no further hearing loss occurs.:

Indeed my award specified that no further deterioration could be attributed to the initial noise induced hearing loss. I was 'lucky' for at that time they were giving some compensation. I can't recall now the ratings. I was awarded 19% which covered by back and my hearing.

[Royalistflyer]

Say again PN. Yes I got the Aviation Medicine people saying I had hearing loss and I didn't care for the postings I got after that. I got given good remote controlled hearing aids - but now I need new ones.

[Pontius Navigator]

RF, Remote control are a great idea and essential for In The Ear though it gives you something extra to lose :)

The NHS does not do ITE as far as I know with one exception and that is people with an ear issue that prevents then wearing a BTE. As for remote, I have no ide if they do that.

Now with mine, with 10 positive volume increments and 4 programs, I am really happy with them In fact a 5th program came in useful in a shop today with very loud and annoying music. Pull the batteries and it was 100% successful in stopping the noise.

[Royalistflyer]

PN the advantage with the remote (in a leather pouch on my belt) is that I can instantly turn off irritating music/other people's children/female chatter - then the in-ear aids just act as ear plugs

[Pontius Navigator]

RF, very true. Only by opening the battery ports can I get blissful silence when MiL visits.

[langleybaston]

RF, very true. Only by opening the battery ports can I get blissful silence when MiL visits.

Really? I find the setting that selects "hearing loop" reception produces delightful silence. I am too old to have a MiL but there are other contenders ...........

[ricardian]

PN ... I tried for hearing disability assessment when I retired. I was not deaf enough, but the specialist said my frequency loss (2-4 mhz?) was apparently classic .303. My fault, possibly. I used to clear hangovers at CATCS by begging a few rounds from the ATC on Saturday mornings!!

I suspect the frequency range was 2 to 4 kilohertz.

[oldpax]

I had two years as groundcrew on Shacks with some detachments.No ear defenders,then Hunters with sometimes ear defenders and then Varsities with ear defenders!!After that I joined the power industry and believe me a turbine building or boiler basement is far noisier than an aircraft!!Now I have NHS hearing aids which are good but a devil to get correctly in place ,no chance of any pension from any employees !!

[Pontius Navigator]

MHz, kHz,

Like MPN I think part of my hearing loss was in the range for gunfire and not high freak.

[Haraka]

Without trivialising a thread about a distressing and debilitation condition, I am reminded of an incident during a boring presentation at RAF Wyton years ago.
From a retired Wg.Cdr. to his mate on the other side of the audience.

"Hey Les, do you know how you can catch Hearing AIDS?"
.
.
.
"Listening to @rseholes."

[ACW342]

I have been speaking with the NI co-ordinator/organiser? for the VA, who is arranging a visit from my local VA rep (I didn't know anything about all this stuff at a local level). She also informed me that the Royal British Legion (RBL) manages something called the Veterans Hearing Fund (VHF, very apt.) for the funding of hardware or therapies not typically available through statutory sources (the NHS, for example) The paperwork consists of an Eligibility Application and an MoD form 1694, Subject Access Request Form which permits the Mod, under the Data Protection Act 1998,to release to you a copy of your service audiometry reports.

[MPN11]

oooh ... thanks for that. I might get some leverage through RBL here (being outwith the NHS). I'll have a chat with my GP next time he's extracting my blood for more tests.

[ACW342]

MPN, not a whole armful I hope?

[middlesbrough]

I was referred by my GP and after hearing tests received NHS hearing aids, which were excellent. I was told I might be eligible for an RBL Veterans Hearing Grant, which I applied for, and eventually ended up with a pair of upmarket Resound hearing aids.Slightly more versatile than NHS model.Hearing loss the result of 30+ years flying Shacks, Nimrods and Hercs.

[ACW342]

With reference to my previous posts (21&44) I applied to the RBL for a grant and, having sent out all the required paperwork, arranged a hearing test at my local Specsavers. The audiologist was totally au fait with the RBL VHF and sent the results of my hearing test and a report on my tinnitus. off to the RBL

As for my 89 week wait for an initial consult at ENT just last week I received an update to my referral to the South East Health & Social Care Trust. Due to a lack of resources brought about, I suspect, by our politicians opting out of working on behalf of the electorate, my initial appointment was now extended to 112 to 116 weeks.

That point is now moot as just this afternoon I received a letter from the RBL saying that my application to the Veterans Hearing Fund for £3,373 has been approved in full.

[ACW342]

With reference to my previous posts (21&44) I applied to the RBL for a grant and, having sent out all the required paperwork, arranged a hearing test at my local Specsavers. The audiologist was totally au fait with the RBL VHF and sent the results of my hearing test and a report on my tinnitus. off to the RBL

As for my 89 week wait for an initial consult at ENT just last week :DI received an update to my referral to the South East Health & Social Care Trust. Due to a lack of resources brought about, I suspect, by our politicians opting out of working on behalf of the electorate, my initial appointment was now extended to 112 to 116 weeks.

That point is now moot as just this afternoon I received a letter from the RBL saying that my application to the Veterans Hearing Fund for £3,373 has been approved in full.

[cliver029]

Thanks again PN.
Bit late to the party and just picking up on the thread (just getting over a hip operation).

First job out of training was Aircraft Prep at Lyneham!
Ear defenders (when you could find any), basic model with the pads that go over the ears and filled with glycerine, there is nothing much worse than having one split and go dribbling down your neck when on a ground run when its raining anyway!:ugh: That set the scene for the rest of my time, a couple of years Hunter Avpin starts and then Lightnings and then Tankers.

Result, a "wonderful" high pitched tinnitus plus deaf in one ear and partly gone in the other.
Told my brilliant local GP and he has arranged for me to go into SpecSavers Cambridge. BTW he did say that he considered the latest NHS models are as good as most others out there, discuss?

[EngAl]

My wife has an NHS one which looks almost identical to one which her friend got privately for a couple of thousand pounds. The biggest surprise came when my wife lost hers and, having steeled ourselves for a big bill for a replacement, they replaced it in a week for £65.

[Pontius Navigator]

My wife has an NHS one which looks almost identical to one which her friend got privately for a couple of thousand pounds. The biggest surprise came when my wife lost hers and, having steeled ourselves for a big bill for a replacement, they replaced it in a week for £65.
Cambridge is one of the cheapest trusts as some charge up to £150. https://www.cuh.nhs.uk/addenbrookes/services/clinical/audiology/services/lost_or_damaged_hearing_aids_and_earmoulds.html

I 'lost' mine a few years ago before I wore them every day. No fee then. Found them the next year in my summer shorts.

[Pontius Navigator]

he did say that he considered the latest NHS models are as good as most others out there, discuss?
Not worn both, but knew someone with IE aids with remote control. He swore by them but said they ate batteries. Then spoke to a friend with BITE which looked like mine. His cost a bomb and I think he had a regular maintenance programme, but he still had hearing problems.

Had my Specsaver Siemens for about 6 month now. The small buds, vice moulds, so comfortable that I often forget I am wearing them. By accident went swimming once and shower several times.

[MPN11]

I think I must explore this subject in more depth. OH is getting very pi$$ed about “Words Thrice” ;)

[Pontius Navigator]

I think I must explore this subject in more depth. OH is getting very pi$$ed about “Words Thrice” ;)
Exactly.
Problem occurs after you get the aids. TV too loud. Also, when she gets used to it, launches into statement without giving you time to tune in.

[Rigga]

NHS hearing aids differ for regions /NHS trusts. Mine doesn't have volume settings and is automatic for almost all needs - revving up automatically for phone use and Hearing Loops. I can only change the battery or press the single button if no auto-detection is made.
I too have tinnitus and this unit has helped dramatically with that too....maybe its just me....

[X1FTS]

Pontius
The advantage of the DRC is that another person can travel with you at the reduced fare, without the need to hold any Railcard themselves.
Another advantage is that it can be used at any time, without the limits imposed on normal railcard users.