Question on WW2 Search & Rescue

[whowhenwhy]

I'm after a little help and before I speak to the team at Hendon, I thought that I would ask here first.

A friend is trying to locate the sight of his father's ditched Spitfire 9;apparently, he was the first to successfully ditch in that mark of Spitfire. He was picked up in a Walrus relatively quickly and we have an approximate position and what might be a grid reference vM 3385. Does anyone have any ideas what this number might be? If it helps, the approximate position was 10 nm west of Ault in France.

Thanks all for any help that you can offer.

[Green Flash]

https://www.echodelta.net/mbs/eng-grids.php#s5

Try French Lambert Zone 2, plug in vM3385 and that should give you a position

[Green Flash]

Sorry, use the Nord de Guerre Zone grid, that gives you just west of Ault.

[whowhenwhy]

Thanks greenflash, I knew that someone on Prune would know.

[India Four Two]

Green Flash,

Thanks for the great link. I have a professional interest in maps and projections and although I know quite a lot about OS and UTM maps, I had never heard of these maps.

Further research led me to a treasure trove, at McMaster University, here in Canada:

https://digitalarchive.mcmaster.ca/islandora/object/macrepo:10

Not just WWII maps, but also WWI and Cold War maps.

I have attached an annotated clip of the Abbeville-Dieppe map in question, which I found here:

https://digitalarchive.mcmaster.ca/islandora/object/macrepo%3A8823



whowhenwhy,

Grid ref vM3385 is indeed about 10 nm W of Ault. "W" marks the spot. :)

There must have been a staggeringly large OS organization producing these maps, given the sheer number of maps required and all the compilation and computational difficulties involved. For example, the map legend mentions that the origin of the grid is 55 Grades N and 6 Grades E of the Paris Meridian. All French maps used to use grades/grads (400 grads in a circle) rather than lat/long, so the OS staff not only had to compute the Cassini grid, but also a lat/long graticule.

[Wensleydale]

As an aside for those researching WW2 SAR - Graham Pitchfork's book is excellent....


https://www.amazon.co.uk/Shot-Down-Drink-Commonwealth-Aircrews/dp/1472827279/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1506241778&sr=8-6&keywords=Graham+Pitchfork

[JOE-FBS]

This book is an excellent view from the sharp end of those operations:

Another Kind of Courage: Stories of the UK-based Walrus Air-Sea Rescue Squadrons book by Norman Franks | 0 available edition | Waterstones marketplace Books (http://www.waterstonesmarketplace.com/Another-Kind-of-Courage-Stories-of-the-UK-based-Walrus-Air-Sea-Rescue-Squadrons-Norman-Franks/book/31033246)

The prices in that link are shocking. I got my very sound hardback copy about a year ago for a couple of pounds.

[albatross]

Thanks Green Flash....your post now precludes any useful work being performed today as I happily explore your links!
Green Flash,

Thanks for the great link. I have a professional interest in maps and projections and although I know quite a lot about OS and UTM maps, I had never heard of these maps.

Further research led me to a treasure trove, at McMaster University, here in Canada:

https://digitalarchive.mcmaster.ca/islandora/object/macrepo:10

Not just WWII maps, but also WWI and Cold War maps.

I have attached an annotated clip of the Abbeville-Dieppe map in question, which I found here:

https://digitalarchive.mcmaster.ca/islandora/object/macrepo%3A8823



whowhenwhy,

Grid ref vM3385 is indeed about 10 nm W of Ault. "W" marks the spot. :)

There must have been a staggeringly large OS organization producing these maps, given the sheer number of maps required and all the compilation and computational difficulties involved. For example, the map legend mentions that the origin of the grid is 55 Grades N and 6 Grades E of the Paris Meridian. All French maps used to use grades/grads (400 grads in a circle) rather than lat/long, so the OS staff not only had to compute the Cassini grid, but also a lat/long graticule.

[Cazalet33]

A quarter of a century ago (Omigawd, izzit really that long?) I was peripherally involved, more or less on a hobby basis, in the rectification of a misidentification of the identity of a North Atlantic wreck which was known/suspected to have been twatted by a u-boat.

The misidentification had arisen from a (then) modern misunderstanding of the German u-boat grid system.

I spent many hours/days trying, ultimately successfully, to identify exactly where that particular attack had been recorded as having taken place. It was a bear of a job which I could not have surmounted without the very able assistance of Prof/Dr Jürgen Rohwer who is (I hope he's still alive and still as sharp as a tack) a serious expert on all things u-boat.

I'd like to add to this thread a website/tool which I'd love to have existed when I did those geodetic gymnastics in the early 1990s.

It's a lovely converter for finding the Lat/Longs of the u-boat (and I think most of the rest of the German Navy) grid system position.

Naval Grid Calculator (http://www.navalgrid.com/)

[NutLoose]

Also register and ask here, a wealth of Spitfire historians on the site.

https://forum.keypublishing.com/forumdisplay.php?4-Historic-Aviation