Really worried (Class 1 Medical Question)

[quidam]

I've tried the medical forum with no success :(
So figured I'd give here a try:)

I'll not bore with details but a few weeks ago I was involved in a non fault road accident that left me with the pleasure of some fairly nasty leg injuries :( (No head injury and only injuries to one leg)

I've had the Op's and all appears to be healing ok, albeit a little slowly(or atleast it seems that way to me)

I have the permanent addition of internal metalwork holding my leg together and when the mesh is removed should have a nearly complete knee cap that Dr's are hopeful will regain full movement.

As a partially qualified (if there is such a thing) ATPL(h) holder as I'm sure all will accept, I can now pass house bricks whilst I recover.

I've been advised rightly(or wrongly) not to speak to the CAA until some idea of my recovery time and state are known, and I've been given very sound reasons for this advice.

I've no intention of flying until fit and the beauocrats have been satisfied.

However anybody else out there kept a class 1 after something similar???

Any views on how best to approach the pen pushers?? (either directly or via the Dr I use to renew my medical? )

Probably seems irrational to worry and yes I am still keeping things in perspective (still alive and things could be worse etc etc) but I hate the thought of my own 'little dream' being so abruptly pulled out of my grasp:eek: Especially after being allowed to re mortgage our house in the first place :D

Any advice greatly received

Cheers all

[ClearBlueWater]

I was involved in an RTA about eight years ago. My right knee cap was split in two in the vertical plane and had to be wired together. It took two attempts over several years to get the wires out of my leg and while they were there my mobility in the leg was less than 100% owing to discomfort in the knee. Once the wires were removed full mobility returned. I got the class 1 after all this happened. Essentially as long as you have full mobility and no instability in the legs you'll probably be OK. Good luck.

[Thomas coupling]

It is a legal requirement to inform the CAA medical department if you are unable to fulfil the requirements of your class 1 medical within 20 days (could be 21). Failure to notify them could result in a prosecution when (not if) they find out.
Nearly 3 years ago, I was involved in an RTC (used to be called RTA) where my lower leg was severed, my urethra severed, my pelvis cracked and right arm nerves dislocated.
I informed the CAA, they send out a standard letter: " you are not allowed to practice the priviliges of your licence until we receive notification from the AME that you are fit again.." letter.
You go away, get physio , constantly annoy your AME with requests for examinations, time passes and eventually they give you your class 1 back:D. I am now back to public transport flying.

There is no point in hiding it from your AME, he will ask awkward questions when you next go to see him for your class 1 (even after you have recovered).

Bite the bullet, be grateful you're still here and tell the appropriate authorities, then concentrate on getting better. Think positive.

There is no 'test flight' when you ask for your licence back. You tell the AME that you can fly full and free, he checks your body bits and voila your'e home dry...

Were you aviation insured??

Take care
:)

[t'aint natural]

Some AMEs are more empathetic and helpful to pilots than others. I have suffered anxiety and cost at the hands of an AME whose interpretation of a situation was perhaps more pedantic than it need have been. I was bailed out by a doctor who was prepared to exercise his medical judgement.
There are AMEs who go by the numbers, and doctors who want to help pilots to fly, as long as it is medically safe to do so. Hoping not to contravene advertising rules, I would recommend Dr Ian Perry, an AME, a pilot, and former Master of GAPAN, to whom I would turn for advice if I was in your position.
I have no connection with Dr Perry, nor was he the AME who hauled my conkers out of the conflagration. But he is a wise and helpful man. His website is www.tiamc.com.

[Draco]

quote Thomas Coupling - "my urethra severed" :eek:

What does this mean in plain speech? Is this 90% of a 'Bobbit'? That must have really made your eyes water - never mind the flying, what about the really important things in life?:confused:

[quidam]

TC,

Not looking to hide anything. Not been out of hospital long and even less out of plaster. Couldn't have done anything in 21 days!

Flying was not at the forefront of my mind (the large lorry had preoccupied my thoughts :) ) Was just looking for 'something' before I wrote to the CAA (phoning them takes too long!)

In a perverse sort of way its reassuring to hear that injuries far worse than mine haven't been a bar to keeping the medical and that in itself is more than enough to keep me looking at the remainder of the ATPL theory whilst I mend.

I have no aviation insurance but was at work when the little mishap occurred. I can remember when they were RTA's (before political correctness decided it needed to be changed) and for all it's faults my employer will look after me in that respect (the yellow jacket is a little torn and the white motorcycle slightly scratched :D )

T'aint
Thanks.That Dr is not a million miles from me I'll give him a call before speaking to Gatwick

CBW
Thank you

With time on your hands it is very easy for the mind to wander about foolish things. I'm still a little concerned about the long term, but thank you all for taking the time to get my mind back where it should be .

[Nick Lappos]

Quidam,

In the US, it might not be necessary to demonstrate full recovery of all function, just that function necessary to perform your flying duties without hinderance. This might involve practical demonstration of the skills, if there is doubt. I would hope CAA thinks similarly.

Just think "Douglas Bader" and you'll cheer up. Meanwhile, rest and recover, because your health is the most important thing. The sky will be there when you get back into the cockpit!

Nick

[Nigel Osborn]

I had the pleasure of meeting Douglas Bader at a naval mess dinner, incredible personality, and he did pretty well on 2 tin legs.

Concur that Dr Perry is a top bloke, definitely worth a visit.

In Australia it is up to the CASA approved doctor to assess you fit to fly after an accident or illness, not CASA itself. In my case I was off for 4 months and had no trouble getting back to flying.

I hope you guys fly better than you drive....... those injuries sound terrible!!!!:D :D :D

[John Eacott]

Qidam,

My experience (many years ago, I admit) with the CAA was excellent over a similar problem. Fractured femur, I went direct to CAA Medical in London, where the Senior Medical Examiner put a requirement of 90 degrees flexion on the knee to be fit to fly.

5 weeks later, fronted up at CAA, had a medical and a bit of a discussion, and was sent back to work. Biggest hurdle was the oil company having a pilot on a walking stick, living on a rig in the Brent Field :cool:

The pin took a year to work it's way out of the femur, so don't take any flannel about not being able to fly with metal work still in your body. I did have a check flight with the company on return to work, with emphasis on hydraulic out work, to ensure the leg had the strength to handle the pedals.

Nigel, DB was quite a fellow. I've still got his autograph :)

[Max Range]

John - I'm interested to hear you have Douglas Bader's autograph and would like to hear how and where and when you got to meet him. What was he like? I am only familiar with the Kenneth Moore portrayal.

[Nigel Osborn]

Further to your question to John about Douglas Bader and Kenneth More, I had the pleasure of meeting both when I was in the Royal Navy. Kenneth More made a naval comedy film at Dartmouth College where I was a sproggy cadet and Douglas Bader was guest of honour at a Culdrose mess dinner some 5 years later.

The resemblance between the 2 was quite amasing, similar height, build and square jaw. More had Bader's walk absolutely spot on including the way he stood with his legs well apart. I was surprised at the difficulty Bader still had in going up or down steps in the mess, possibly the thick pile carpet was a problem. The pair were very friendly and relaxed to talk to.

Some trivia!! More was a Captain during the war and the then Dartmouth Captain was a junior officer under him on the same ship!

Sorry I digress!:D :D

[HeloTeacher]

I had a little trouble with frostbite and lost the end of a foot and damaged a leg. The collateral damage kept me on a cane for some months as well.

The Canadian CAA (TC) was happy with me finding a doctor willing to certify me even after bad luck with the first one.

After 6 months I was flying and even got rid of the cane soon after.

[QDMQDMQDM]

I'm interested to hear you have Douglas Bader's autograph and would like to hear how and where and when you got to meet him.

I had a patient in the surgery last week who was in prison camp with Douglas Bader and said he was utterly obnoxious and impossible to deal with for both Germans and British alike. That said, he still admired him greatly and if he hadn't had an 'impossible' personality he'd never have done what he did, would he?

QDM

[Flying Lawyer]

quidam

I agree with t ain't natural's recommendation. Dr Ian Perry is first class.
I've used him for my medicals for many years, and have referred several people with problems to him.
You seem very worried (understandably) - the sooner you see him, the sooner you might find out you're worrying unnecessarily.
I suggest you consult him before you notify the CAA - he'll see you quickly if you explain the urgency.

If you need Dr Perry's contact details - or you have any difficulty getting an immediate appointment from his receptionist - email me and I'll speak to him direct.

Good Luck
Tudor Owen

[Hummingfrog]

Hi Quidam
I did something similar a couple of years ago when I damaged the bottom part of my knee joint and needed 6 screws and a titanium plate to help put it back together. The surgeon did a tremendous job but could not guarantee that I would get full movement back in the knee. I spent 3 months in a fibreglass cast followed by 6 weeks in a velcro splint. All I can say was that it was jolly hard work working with the physios. After the euphoria of getting the cast removed you become quite depressed at how little the knee will bend - about 10 degrees. The physios were brilliant, however, and goaded one into putting more and more effort into the exercises and gradually the knee began to bend. They had a little gadget which measured the knee bend and one became a junky always asking to be measured!!! I endured their attention every day until those magic words you've reached 90 degrees it is down hill from here. Getting my class one back just entailed a visit to my usual Doc who assessed that I could bend the knee and stand on one leg!! he rang the CAA there and then and hey presto back to work 6 months after the accident. If you hold any form of licence you must inform the CAA they are not out to stop you getting your medical back.
So good luck in your recovery and ATPL(H), it may seem a long road but it does have an end.
Regards
HF:)

[Wayne Jenkins]

Quidam ......But there for the grace of God.....I went as well!!

Three years ago I took a slide off the top of a B412 in Mumbai India [Proves I do pre-flights at least]...
As I was laying there with my foot at 90 degrees to where it should be...the thought of informing CASA and the FAA was not paramount in my mind, however once out of the Indian Hospital and consequently out of Royal Perth Hostipal after corrective surgrey, I sent a fax to Canberra and Oklahoma City explaining the circumstances...........the reply from both was to have the injury accessed by your AME at your next renewal.......as my Class 1 expired during my recovery period, it was not necessary for me to be cleared prior to flight.
At the next renewal [8 months after the fall], the AME was not really fussed.....he looked at the exwounds, we discussed the wires and screws insitu and he said if you can walk in here, then you can fly.........so get back to work.

It was easy for me, as the medical expired whilst I was recoverying.........if I recovered and went back to work whilst the medical was still current without informing anyone......well that is inviting trouble I would think.

Good luck......

[quidam]

Dr Perry contacted

CAA spoken to- Far nicer than I'd been led to believe and infinitly more helpful than FCL!!!! :)

Would agree that joy of cast removal is rapidly replaced by the dismay of little to no movement and wasted muscles that refuse to obey even the most seemingly basic requests.

Never really doubted that I'd walk and leg would eventually bend. Just paniced that injuries alone in some weird way could ruin chance of keeping Class 1

Feeling much better

Thank you all for your time
:) :) :)

[Heliport]

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