RAF C130 undercarriage problem

[Simplythebeast]

There is a C130 circling around over the Wisbech area with main gear down but no nose wheel showing, has been circling for some time . Last pass there seemed to be one set of main gear fully down and the other partially retracted.

[sycamore]

That`ll be a wind-down then....

[Top Bunk Tester]

That'll be a fit loady with aching arms then....

[VX275]

Do the Dash4a side beams stop the safety chains being fitted? Unlike good old Skydel.

[Simplythebeast]

That would explain all the circuits.....must be lots of winding!

[Dougie M]

And free fall the nosewheel.

[bunta130]

Or blow it down on the Aux System

Skydel......the reason why our old Hercs had unique floors.....(or one of, including the need for MSP restraint points). Dash 4 is better due to natural vertical restraint offered, amongst other things.

[Top Bunk Tester]

Or blow it down on the Aux System

Remind me again where the changeover lever is?

Unless of course Bunta130 is Tom Cruise's Prune Username :)

Or is the J different?

[haltonapp]

I had a main gear failure to lock down on a C1K going into Bardufoss in the early 70's, went into the hold at 10000', depressurised, carried out the wind down drill, still no engagement of the pins in the travelling block, undid the rear viewing window and noticed a brake hose trapped between the two, wound it up a bit and pushed the hose out of the way. Wound it down into downlock, landed safely. All that effort at altitude was knackering, would I have seen the problem with side guidance and a full pallet load?

[Rosevidney1]

I hope the gear is down and locked by now!

[WIDN62]

Remind me again where the changeover lever is?

The previous posts are talking about lowering the nose gear using the Aux system - the lever is on the port side forward of the escape hatch. Tom Cruise might have to stand on tip toe to reach it!
TBT you are probably thinking of the Ground Test Valve which is definitely Tom Cruise territory in flight!

[woptb]

Do they still carry a Binfield Hook?

[Brian W May]

Do they still carry a Binfield Hook?

Ha ha, I wonder how many remember that magnificently simple piece of kit.

I remember having the MLG frozen UP and landing at Gander, loaded with Sparrow Missile bodies was somewhat delayed until I unscrewed the Shelf Bracket access doors and blew some hot air into them - the gear then trundled down - phew!

One Phil Fox was the skipper, a LONG time ago !!

[Top Bunk Tester]

Ah apologies Bunta130 and thanks to WIDN62.

I read it as blowing the main u/c down using the Aux System. Thought I was going mad and just went back through my old diagrams. But even using the Emerg NLG Lever surely this just unlocks the NLG allowing it to freefall, then the loady visually checks the down lock throught the viewing port?

It was twenty years ago mind, so could be wrong.

[ancientaviator62]

As I recall (and happy to be corrected) the nosewheel free fall lowering could be initiated by the lever under the co plots feet. To use the emergency system via the lever on the port forward side of the cargo bay you needed hydraulic pressure. This was either with the aux pump running or by the hand pump. As I recall the drill was to try the hand pump first to check that the system held pressure . If you did not and the problem was a leak in the nosegear hydraulic lines the the aux pump at full pressure would pump the reservoir contents overboard before you could blink.
In respect of the mainwheels I have had a couple of assymetric lowerings usually after a winter transit from cold climes. I took the inspection windows off both times and after a while the gear came out to play. Interestingly it was the port gear both times.

[Brian W May]

As I recall (and happy to be corrected) the nosewheel free fall lowering could be initiated by the lever under the co plots feet. To use the emergency system via the lever on the port forward side of the cargo bay you needed hydraulic pressure. This was either with the aux pump running or by the hand pump. As I recall the drill was to try the hand pump first to check that the system held pressure . If you did not and the problem was a leak in the nosegear hydraulic lines the the aux pump at full pressure would pump the reservoir contents overboard before you could blink.
In respect of the mainwheels I have had a couple of assymetric lowerings usually after a winter transit from cold climes. I took the inspection windows off both times and after a while the gear came out to play. Interestingly it was the port gear both times.

That was my recollection too Bill - and funnily enough the port gear was the worst (mind you both were locked by ice, from a slushy runway at LYE - yes we recycled the gear).

[96to106]

Hmm, all that heat from the Cargo Air Con pack on the stbd side may have had something to do with that....

[ancientaviator62]

Bryan,
yes both of mine were from Goose/Gander snow and slush with a winter pond crossing. Wonder why the port gear ? Back to the nosewheel do I recall correctly loss of the Aux system meant loss of emergency brakes and nose wheel steering ? Poor old memory cell is in turbo recall mode. It cannot last !

[bunta130]

Ah apologies Bunta130 and thanks to WIDN62.

I read it as blowing the main u/c down using the Aux System. Thought I was going mad and just went back through my old diagrams. But even using the Emerg NLG Lever surely this just unlocks the NLG allowing it to freefall, then the loady visually checks the down lock throught the viewing port?

It was twenty years ago mind, so could be wrong.

TBT

We may well have been on the Fleet at the same time....I was from 1984 to 2003.

I was indeed referring to the emercency lowering lever on the port side, and not to the ground test valve that allowed the Aux system to power both Booster and Normal systems.

The lever allowed the nosewheel to be fully extended....and kept it there as long as you maintained Aux system pressure (by keeping the pump running). Bill is spot on that you kept the pump switched off and tested the pressure held by hand pump operation.

The unlocking lever under the Co's legs allowed the uplock to be disengage (at 120 ish Knots from memory)....when pulled and gear travelling the Captain used to accelerate 'smartly' to about 150 Kts to use the airflow to encourage the door to close and the gear to lock down...

Had a couple of occasions with gear frozen up despite recycling after takeoff from contaminated surfaces.....opening the inspection hatches and running full hot down the back cured it on both occasions.

Happy days......

[bunta130]

Bryan,
yes both of mine were from Goose/Gander snow and slush with a winter pond crossing. Wonder why the port gear ? Back to the nosewheel do I recall correctly loss of the Aux system meant loss of emergency brakes and nose wheel steering ? Poor old memory cell is in turbo recall mode. It cannot last !

Failure of Aux System pump meant you only had accumulator pressure (assuming no pipe break and associated fluid loss) for 2 (from memory) applications of the brakes (with selector to Emergency). There was an accumulator on the Normal System too.....

NWS was/is operated by the Normal System.....

Still good tech from an ancient loadie though!!!

[ancientaviator62]

Bunta,
strange thing memory ! Very poor short term but reasonable recall for events long ago ! Or at least some of them.

[ancientaviator62]

Bunta,
it was of course emergency brakes that would be lost without the aux system and not nosewheel steering. Doh !

[VX275]

Or blow it down on the Aux System

Skydel......the reason why our old Hercs had unique floors.....(or one of, including the need for MSP restraint points). Dash 4 is better due to natural vertical restraint offered, amongst other things.

The comparative merits of Dash 4a and Skydel aren't the issue here. The Dash 4a rail more or less covers the inspection covers so you can't see where the main gear down stops are or use the cross cabin chains to secure them. Or don't they bother with that procedure on the J?

[DCThumb]

If it was a selector lever failure (I think) you could always use what Derek Jeans called......

DC Thumb.

[ancientaviator62]

DC,
most of us I I think assumed that the usual simple solutions had been tried including your famous namesake. Derek did have a few ways of reinforcing tech knowledge. Using the chain down method would IMHO could not have been implemented on an a/c with cargo in the vicinity. Unless you decided to jettison the cargo ! It was bad enough moving the pax seated in front of the u/c inspection windows .

[Rossian]

.....the mess of tech detail and reminiscences above - one assumes that they managed to land safely without any major drama, somewhere?? Or did I miss that bit in spite of having reread the thread.

The Ancient Mariner