Long suffering 747 crew

[Xwindldg]

They've had a couple of years of bad rosters after milking the best possible rosters for many years, now it's non stop whinging. My heart breaks reading things like "it's not good enough, I pay my subs and expect blah blah blah".....

[Contact Approach]

Are you alright mate?

[spleener]

Yeah. Get a life.

[betpump5]

First time we agree on anything xwind - up to a point I should add so don't get too excited, mate.

I'm with you, especially with the whinging part. My heart bleeds for them. For the best part of a couple of decades, these guys have done 2 and a bit LHR flights or SFO flights etc etc a month. And on the Queen of the Skies, the "senior fleet". And did they give a sh!te about the " senior" captains on the Airbus? Did they care about a fleet transfer system?? Did they bollux. Much like the tripla guys whose main concern is not enough sectors for RQ and JFOs.

And now they are getting out their handbags as well as their violins because they feel that CC is affecting them more!! Diddums. Suck it up Princesses.

I can already hear the groans from the other Princesses on the tripla as they sense the impending smell of Curry through their nostrils. I'm sure a "Dear Gus" letter is already being drafted to vent their anger at the injustice that will occur. We are far too good for India.

However Xwind, that Violin Symphony in Whinge Minor that the 400 guys are playing has indeed resurrected a much needed discussion of a fleet transfer system which I feel is warranted on many levels.

[csd]

I'm all for seniority based bidding for fleets. There are some very senior members stuck on the 747 who deserve better. Wouldn't it make sense that as you approached your retirement, and after spending many years in the company, you should be allowed to transfer to the fleet of your choice?

Perhaps everyone should be required to have experience on two fundamentally different company aircraft types before a command upgrade? The cross-pollination of skills and ideas would be of significant benefit to both company and individual.

Of course the same can be said about 330 crews who have until recently been taking the brunt of the rostering gamble. Thankfully for them, the 350 is now bringing some relief. Sadly, the 747 fleet crew members don't have that light at the end of the tunnel.

[AQIS Boigu]

Fact is that some who whinge the most

- had the chance to get off the Jumbo but gambled with the "imminent -8i order" and stayed on it (or her)

- took an early freighter command knowing what freighters rosters would be like

- had the choice as JFOs to get onto another type but remained on it

Sometimes these gambles work out and sometimes they don't - respect to the members of the Jumbo community for their (industrial) efforts and trying to get a real seniorty system going. None of the 330 guys were able to create that sort of momentum 8 years ago.

It is quite ironic though that these same pilots who didn't care or showed ZERO sympathy in regards to the happenings on the regional fleet(s) are now crying poor and demand a seniority system.

[cxorcist]

... and hence the reason there is so little unity within our pilot group. Not only are we divided by base areas, but we choose to make different fleets further divisions amongst our ranks. Everyone out for themselves. That works awesome. Why don't we just save the Company the time and ammunition expenses and shoot ourselves? Pilots are so dumb!!!

[Trafalgar]

Regarding AQIS....curious post. Either, he is, a) a management plant, or b) a completely moronic and tone deaf individual who only his mother could (probably ) love. I agree with Cxorcist: we seem adept at doing the company's job for them. I don't know why we find it so hard to keep unity. Personally, I suspect choice 'a'. But who knows, there are some amongst us who just like to stir the :mad:.

[betpump5]

Cxorcist,

No one here is trying to cause divisions or trying to do the company's job for them. Just having a little dig and vocalizing a few home truths that the princesses who flew the jumbo and enjoyed the best rosters whilst giving little damn for their Senior Airbus Colleagues are now getting their violins out. Some even playing the "I pay my subs" tune.

And what argument was used to mute the Airbus complainers at the time? Common Salary. For some strange reason, apparently that "argument " is no longer valid as someone put it on the AOA Forgotten Fleet thread. Funny that.

[Dragon69]

I have to agree. Was only 4 years ago that the other fleets were more worried about ****ty pay rises than having a proper rostering agreement in place, whilst us on the Airbus were bearing the brunt and abuse of erything that was wrong with OUR RPs.

[Trafalgar]

....guys, do you REALLY think this is productive, and will help us in our fight against management? Just asking..... :rolleyes:

[betpump5]

Is it a fight against management or a 'fight' against the AOA and trying to get their priorities in order? I thought the thread on the other forum was purely bringing to the attention of the AOA what the priorities should be going forward? As far as management are concerned, they paid a common jet salary and decided to just have jumbo freighters. Probably weren't even aware of a "fight" because like others have said, 2 fleets didn't give a shiny stool about the Airbus guys.

[kiwicx]

and now they are on the AOA forums wanting to go straight from the 747 to the A50 bypassing the A330......

[Xwindldg]

A lot of the 400 guys used to be on other types and they transferred to the 400. There was an opportunity a few years ago to go to the bus but I guess they turned that down too, holding out for something better. Seems unrealistic that they should be able to transfer onto whatever is the best fleet whenever they feel like it.

[betpump5]

Yes, THEY (us, your colleagues, you know) want to go on the 350 ASAP, in company seniority order.

Do you have a problem with that ?

I'm sure the Airbus Captains who have done their time as FOs on the Airbus fleet and have done years as Captains and are aching for the A350 may have a problem if their conversion is delayed by those very same "Colleagues" who didn't give a damn about them as they were enjoying their 2 London's a month.

Moron

[Xwindldg]

Frank,

A couple of years ago they were asking for guys to go to the 330, why didn't you go then?

[Trafalgar]

....well, it's not too difficult to single out the Airbus pilots on this thread :ooh:. Frank said it all: at any other airline we wouldn't be having this conversation. Sadly, we will never be like 'other' airlines (think BA/UA/AA/LH etc...). HK, CX and years of abuse have turned most of us into intellectual pygmies, without the analytical ability to see what's all in our long term interests. The company is RIGHT NOW engaged in a debate to reduce our pay and benefits further, and you guys are worried about fleet transfers.... Unbelievable. :ugh:

[Xwindldg]

12 months ago the Bus pilots would have thought they had died and gone to heaven if they saw an ANC flight on their roster with a few days layover.

[Xwindldg]

Frank,

Were you forced to do your command on the 400? Did you do a quick/early command on the 400?

[Xwindldg]

".....we can't get directly to the A350.....ITS IS A DISGRACE"

Hahahaha!!!!!! That is fricken hilarious. Que the violins.

We will come to your Airbus, but we will only fly the best long haul trips. Surely it would be unfair for these guys to be asked to fly outside of office hours too.

[betpump5]

".....we can't get directly to the A350.....ITS IS A DISGRACE"

Its sentences like that xwind which gather little sympathy for those guys.

[Xwindldg]

Frank,

I take it from your non answer you did an early freighter command.

[Farman Biplane]

Frank,
If you take some rest after your delayed flight, wake up and find another delay that you will not be appropriately rested for, then you call in unfit, submit ASRF. If enough of the fleet had been doing this in the past, then you would not be in that situation now.

[Farman Biplane]

Aren't some of the long suffering seniors on the senior fleet there because they chose to accept a freighter extension to work past their contractual 55RA?

[PanZa-Lead]

I think what has caused all the angst against the freighter guys is that every new thread here or on the hkaoa board is hijacked by a freighter pilot say ' what about us'.
I think many of us have sympathy for the 747 pilots and their fight but when hijacking other threads it gets a bit boring.
When I was a very senior captain on the Airbus I tried to go across to the 747 but junior FOs were going right to left and no-one gave a damn then. So I just had to suck it up.

[cxorcist]

A lot of the 400 guys used to be on other types and they transferred to the 400. There was an opportunity a few years ago to go to the bus but I guess they turned that down too, holding out for something better. Seems unrealistic that they should be able to transfer onto whatever is the best fleet whenever they feel like it.

Uh, no! That's called seniority, and it's how the airline industry works. Fleets with better rosters are flown by the more senior crews unless THEY (the individual pilots) choose otherwise. Only at CX does a pilot get stuck on a fleet, for better or worse, with almost no chance of changing based on seniority.

[Auto_Flt_APOFF]

Only at CX does a pilot get stuck on a fleet, for better or worse, with almost no chance of changing based on seniority.

And Emirates

[Xwindldg]

As someone wrote on the AOA forums, it's different in CX because we have common jet salary.

[catpac]

Xwndldg...you are a pest. Maybe one day you grow up and finally get to see what all this is about.

Quit the keyboard and get back to building your model A350 in CX livery.

[Xwindldg]

The oracle has spoken!

[Glass Half Empty]

the orifice has replied

[cxorcist]

As someone wrote on the AOA forums, it's different in CX because we have common jet salary.


UPS has a common jet "salary" (pay). Somehow, they manage to not lock their pilots on one type for their entire careers. They honor seniority and make billions at the same time.

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Whats the difference between a Cathy Pilot and a Jet Engine.
The jet engine occasionally stops whining

[catpac]

Whats the difference between a Cathy Pilot and a Jet Engine.
The jet engine occasionally stops whining

An engine that stop whining is a failed engine. So with your argument, CX pilots are working very well, as we are always whining. Thanks for your complement :)

[iceman50]

An engine that stop whining is a failed engine.

Not when it is shut down at the end of a flight!:rolleyes:

[boxjockey]

Whats the difference between a Cathy Pilot and a Jet Engine.
The jet engine occasionally stops whining

You misspelled Cathay.

box

[megan]

He may be talking of Cathy the Pilot. :p

[Time2Win]

The freighter pilots seem to have a weird understanding of how cx operates. Completely out of tune with reality.

[Xwindldg]

Got to love the sense of entitlement being shown with each new tragic story of hardship. Stories of "7 sectors in the last 8 days" and 18-30 hour layovers. With heartbreaking and hard to imagine experiences like that I think these poor battered soldiers deserve only the best A350 trips on offer!

[kiwicx]

Interestingly so do KA and their transfers are seniority based.

What sort of fleet transfer do they have in place? 2,3,4,5 years on type before can swap to 330 or back to 320

[ACMS]

Xwindldg:-----you are a Richard Cranium of the highest order. Now fark off.

[Staggers]

What sort of fleet transfer do they have in place? 2,3,4,5 years on type before can swap to 330 or back to 320

2 year freeze on type (except for command bids when you can bid accross if you have the seniority).