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View Full Version : Will Qatar Pilots be considered "Strikbreakers"?


aeropix
30th Jun 2017, 16:27
**I meant "Strike Breakers" but it's too late to change the spelling in the thread title.

I'm just curious, what would be the long term ramifications for the poor Qatar guys who will be required to fly the Strikebreaking flights for British Airways next week?

I really feel for those pilots, as they will have no choice but to fly the schedules they are given. But what if they ever want to go home and get a job in Europe, as most expats in the region consider doing? Will they be considered Strikebreakers and branded as "Scabs" for life?

It must be a really tough position for them, given that they cannot refuse the flights.

luvly jubbly
30th Jun 2017, 16:51
**I meant "Strike Breakers" but it's too late to change the spelling in the thread title.

I'm just curious, what would be the long term ramifications for the poor Qatar guys who will be required to fly the Strikebreaking flights for British Airways next week?

I really feel for those pilots, as they will have no choice but to fly the schedules they are given. But what if they ever want to go home and get a job in Europe, as most expats in the region consider doing? Will they be considered Strikebreakers and branded as "Scabs" for life?

It must be a really tough position for them, given that they cannot refuse the flights.


No. Not really.

No one will give a monkeys after it's all over. It's not USA or Oz.

oboema
30th Jun 2017, 18:10
....and thats why BA's already subpar T&C's compared to other Legacy carriers (cabin+cockpit) are going down the drain even further....

Basil
30th Jun 2017, 18:27
a) ME or HK you can't strike (Yes, I know about the CX CC).
b) You do as you're told or leave.
c) If anyone is, in future, such an ass as to ask then lie. Leave the bar and avoid the drongo.
As luvly jubbly says, don't worry about it.

wiggy
30th Jun 2017, 18:37
Basil ref your point c, I doubt anyone will ask down the road, it's fairly obvious that the Qatar pilots involved are in an impossible position...if anyone is looking to apportion blame it's a combination of U.K. Industrial legislation, and one side or the other or both of the actual dispute, but the Qatar pilots are just the PBI in this.

flash2002
30th Jun 2017, 19:22
Ja godverdomme

tonker
30th Jun 2017, 19:28
I never did it, but quite a few here at Jet2 did a few years back.

Generally the crews saw it as a nice change, and most of all, so did the passengers!

Never heard of any strike breaking comeback, then again, how would anyone ever really know.

Musket90
30th Jun 2017, 19:44
Other UK airlines have been used to assist in previous strikes (Thomson, Thomas Cook, Titan etc) and I'm not aware of any ramifications. Those that did assist I'm sure were
happy in providing spare aircraft and crews for the extra income.

pilotguy1222
30th Jun 2017, 21:06
It is. After the UAL strike in the 80s, my Dad carried a list in his flight case for the next 15 years. He didn't rant or anything, simply told them to keep their mouth shut unless it related specifically to the flight.
Some of the guys were very nasty.

I know the Qatar peeps won't have a choice, but all of the sudden my "stomach is really upset". #2

smala01
30th Jun 2017, 22:58
It would be illegal in the UK to discriminate employment or promotion based on any aspect of inclusion/exclusion in any industrial action. We have no "closed shops" any more. I'm pretty sure its illegal in EU law too.

bananaman2
1st Jul 2017, 04:04
... the thread was referenced to 'pilots'... surely it's the cabin crew on strike and not the pilots... so a totally different job group. I even remember during some other BA cabin crew dispute circa 2009/10 after the banking crisis... BA were asking for volunteers to help out with cabin crew duties - and even some pilots volunteered - I know a mate did... the company was in a bad way at the time and he thought it was better than potentially losing his job... due to redundancies across the board.

Also I was lead to believe not all the cabin crew are striking it's just a 'small' proportion on the new 'inferior' contract... so surely the other BA cabin continuing with flying might also be in just a difficult position.

ironbutt57
1st Jul 2017, 04:46
all of the "permanent replacement pilots" that crossed the picket line (scabbed) at Continental Airlines during the '83 strike, were "forgiven" in 1994, and went from being "scabs", to ALPA members in good standing with unfortunate dates of hire...in other words, the whole thing is a load of bollox...there may be nasty rhetoric flying about while the strike is in progress, yes, there is a list, I have on my computer, no, nobody cares except a few sore losers....

Tankengine
1st Jul 2017, 07:40
It would be illegal in the UK to discriminate employment or promotion based on any aspect of inclusion/exclusion in any industrial action. We have no "closed shops" any more. I'm pretty sure its illegal in EU law too.

Proove it!

Metro man
1st Jul 2017, 23:02
For some Australian pilots, 1989 is still fresh in their memories.

parabellum
2nd Jul 2017, 01:41
For some Australian pilots, 1989 is still fresh in their memories.


The interesting thing about 1989 in Australia is that it wasn't a strike, the pilots resigned en masse to protect their threatened superannuation.

Airbubba
2nd Jul 2017, 02:53
all of the "permanent replacement pilots" that crossed the picket line (scabbed) at Continental Airlines during the '83 strike, were "forgiven" in 1994, and went from being "scabs", to ALPA members in good standing with unfortunate dates of hire...in other words, the whole thing is a load of bollox...there may be nasty rhetoric flying about while the strike is in progress, yes, there is a list, I have on my computer, no, nobody cares except a few sore losers....

Just Google 'Jumpseat Protection List' but I don't think it's been updated for many years. Was the last major U.S. airline pilot strike Northwest in 1998?

Going on strike is not the great fad that it once was in my observation. Like a lot of us, I've been there, got the picket line t-shirt more than once. Never crossed the line and watched guys that did merged ahead of me on the seniority list with their 'unfortunate' dates of hire. :ugh:

Yep, there was an amnesty given by ALPA to the 'former' scabs at Continental. Did it apply to the United $75K and $50K pilots as well? :confused:

For some Australian pilots, 1989 is still fresh in their memories.

Well, they can't call anyone a strikebreaker since AFAP never went on strike in 1989. The union told the members to fax in their resignations (don't worry, trust me etc.) and the rank and file complied. :eek: Their ALPA brothers at United flew a couple of Oz 'humanitarian relief charters' before they were called on it. Anyway, the companies accepted the resignations and many of the AFAP members became Whistling Dan Romans in the expat world. :(

ALPA has certainly crossed the picket line of other unions, e.g. AMFA at Northwest in 2005. It will be curious to see if they try to (illegally) blacklist non-union QR pilots for flying the BA charters.

U.S. citizens and green card holders at the Middle East carriers are bailing out of the left seat on the A380 and Triple and upgrading to right seat on the 737 and A320 at places like DL, AA and UA. But, getting fired at QR for refusing the BA flights might be riskier than being put on some list for U.S. airline résumé purposes.

A newhire FO and former EK poster child now completing her probationary year in the right seat at United:

7T-ujzU6vSc

Flyboy_SG
2nd Jul 2017, 03:44
A New airport almost every day, she said it herself !

Emma Royds
2nd Jul 2017, 04:29
This is nothing more than a storm in a teacup and it will be forgotten soon enough. This is not the first time that BA Mixed Fleet crew have engaged in industrial action and I doubt it will be the last.

The fact that it's business as usual for cabin crew on the legacy (Eurofleet and Worldwide) contracts as well as witnessing pilots volunteering to work as cabin crew in past episodes of industrial action, highlights that there is little solidarity amongst crew in BA, never mind elsewhere.

ironbutt57
2nd Jul 2017, 04:56
Yup Airbubba, have the "jumpsuit protection list" on my desktop...some familiar names are on it, most of the "fleet qualified" 75K United folks went on to other airlines...the name calling and threats were real during the events, but soon forgotten, and after all ALPA is a business, they need income, and pilots provide this...while I tend to agree in principle with the strikes, and the reasons for them, lets be real, the threat of career destruction is an empty threat...would I cross a picket line?, no, but again have always been gainfully employed so it wasn't a consideration, others I know did so to feed their families..

Basil
2nd Jul 2017, 09:46
I recollect a ground handling strike at LHR in which BA staff loaded and pushed back BA aircraft. IMHO, better than incurring a huge operating loss.

Black Pudding
2nd Jul 2017, 11:34
Let's get the facts straight

Some BA cabin crew are on strike, the word is some, not all. The % on strike is low. The remaining cabin crew do not feel they should take part or support the small % of cabin crew. That's their decision and nothing anyone from Doha can or will comment on. The reason for the strike is ????? Maybe you should try and find the exact reason for their (cabin crew) dispute.

No pilots at BA are taking or supporting any industrial action. That is their decision and nothing anyone from Doha can or will comment on. Had pilots at BA been striking, then this may of been a different story and your thread may of been relevant. The fact is their own colleagues are not even supporting them. Sad but true. The reasons I do not know.

Our crew from Qatar, both flight crew and cabin crew, are working as required on a wet lease contract. They are acting professionally and under unusual circumstances. To say they are doing a good job in such circumstances and short notice is an understatement. The amount of planning and roster alteration in such a short time scale has been achieved and the logistics undertaker to move both aircraft and crew is amazing. You only have to try and think about hotel accommodation alone and you have an idea of the vast scale of this operation.

Please get your facts correct before using such words as Scabs with reference to what is happening at LHR.

I have to say that what I have seen over the last few days from our crew makes me feel proud I working with such mature and professional crew members, from all levels including management all the way down to the local drivers who are transferring crew. A warm welcome is also being received from all BA ground staff menebers at LHR as well.

The passengers boarding our aircraft are thankful and grateful their travel plans are not being disrupted.

Amazing job done so far from all management involved in sorting this out and all crew involved in putting it into action. Well done all involved from the top to the bottom.

Comments made here on this thread referring to other industrial action taken at other times around the world maybe different from what is happening now at BA. This is Cabin crew from another company and only a small % of such who are not being supported by their own work colleagues.

As BA say, We are here to serve.

Maybe you should start a thread on another forum asking would BA staff be considered scabs ?

Move along, nothing to see here.

Emma Royds
2nd Jul 2017, 14:21
Tongue-in-cheek moment....

Extract from the Independent.

BA Passengers expecting strike delays get luxury upgrade (http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/british-airways-unite-union-mixed-fleet-cabin-crew-strike-heathrow-qatar-airways-a7817896.html)

Neil Taylor, who was aboard the flight to the Estonian capital, said: "There was amusement at the start, when the pilot announced that we were heading for Tallinn in Ukraine, but he was quickly corrected."

quietfrog
2nd Jul 2017, 14:56
Let's get the facts straight

Some BA cabin crew are on strike, the word is some, not all. The % on strike is low. The remaining cabin crew do not feel they should take part or support the small % of cabin crew. That's their decision and nothing anyone from Doha can or will comment on. The reason for the strike is ????? Maybe you should try and find the exact reason for their (cabin crew) dispute.

No pilots at BA are taking or supporting any industrial action. That is their decision and nothing anyone from Doha can or will comment on. Had pilots at BA been striking, then this may of been a different story and your thread may of been relevant. The fact is their own colleagues are not even supporting them. Sad but true. The reasons I do not know.

Our crew from Qatar, both flight crew and cabin crew, are working as required on a wet lease contract. They are acting professionally and under unusual circumstances. To say they are doing a good job in such circumstances and short notice is an understatement. The amount of planning and roster alteration in such a short time scale has been achieved and the logistics undertaker to move both aircraft and crew is amazing. You only have to try and think about hotel accommodation alone and you have an idea of the vast scale of this operation.

Please get your facts correct before using such words as Scabs with reference to what is happening at LHR.

I have to say that what I have seen over the last few days from our crew makes me feel proud I working with such mature and professional crew members, from all levels including management all the way down to the local drivers who are transferring crew. A warm welcome is also being received from all BA ground staff menebers at LHR as well.

The passengers boarding our aircraft are thankful and grateful their travel plans are not being disrupted.

Amazing job done so far from all management involved in sorting this out and all crew involved in putting it into action. Well done all involved from the top to the bottom.

Comments made here on this thread referring to other industrial action taken at other times around the world maybe different from what is happening now at BA. This is Cabin crew from another company and only a small % of such who are not being supported by their own work colleagues.

As BA say, We are here to serve.

Maybe you should start a thread on another forum asking would BA staff be considered scabs ?

Move along, nothing to see here.

The QR flight attendants are flying struck work so they are scabs. I'm not saying this is an easy position for them with the laws in the Middle East being what they are. I could be wrong, what am I missing?

HZ123
2nd Jul 2017, 15:38
Before you cast aspersions on the QR CC please remember there are up to 1000 ground staff that hold recency as CC, who will no doubt be flying as CC during this period. I can comprehend that their positions may not be comfortable but as with the majority they undertake the duties they are assigned.
What is more important is that AC & WW resolve the issues, AC has been in charge now for CC industrial actions going back to last year, collapse of the booking system and withdrawal of services on shorthaul. His tenure as CEO must be limited by now! Losses must be starting to stack up and there will be nil bonuses or pay rises for the majority this year!