QF A380 Engine Fire

[Metro man]

A MELBOURNE-bound Qantas flight has avoided midair disaster after one of its engines caught fire nearly two hours after taking off.

Australian Transport Safety Bureau spokesman Michael Walker confirmed the Qantas flight was forced to land.

WERE YOU ON THE PLANE? Email [email protected]

“We have been notified of a Qantas flight that took off from Los Angeles and experienced severe engine troubles and was forced to return to Los Angeles International Airport,” he said.

A passenger, who asked to remain anonymous, told the Sunday Herald Sun the “engine blew up in flames two hours into the flight”.

“The plane was then turned back and landed safely but multiple fire trucks were lining the runway when we landed,” the passenger said.

[Goddamnslacker]

Isnt it about time Rolls Royce came clean on the A380 Engine...before a major incident with loss of life..

[KelvinD]

Are Rolls Royce maintaining these engines? I am sure they didn't design spurious fires into the engine so I suppose problems with them now are maintenance related?

[White Knight]

I am so glad that here at EK we are now getting RR powered 380s:ugh::rolleyes:

[AerialPerspective]

A MELBOURNE-bound Qantas flight has avoided midair disaster after one of its engines caught fire nearly two hours after taking off.

Australian Transport Safety Bureau spokesman Michael Walker confirmed the Qantas flight was forced to land.

WERE YOU ON THE PLANE? Email [email protected]

“We have been notified of a Qantas flight that took off from Los Angeles and experienced severe engine troubles and was forced to return to Los Angeles International Airport,” he said.

A passenger, who asked to remain anonymous, told the Sunday Herald Sun the “engine blew up in flames two hours into the flight”.

“The plane was then turned back and landed safely but multiple fire trucks were lining the runway when we landed,” the passenger said.
"engine blew up in flames two hours into the flight” - Oh P L E A S E... when will the media stop quoting the ravings of idiots who know nothing about what they are talking about... turbulence or some minor engine fault (not saying this was minor but will wait for the F A C T S and not trust the first flush of a media frenzy) is always accompanied by hordes of passengers wailing and carrying on about how "it was sooo scary and we thought we were going to die... etc.".
My guess, happy to be proven wrong, is that this was probably a small failure followed by an engine shutdown and air turnback.
I am so sick of media reports of 'near disasters' that turn out to be routine. Let's see what the experts say.

[atakacs]

Well as long as it remained a contained engine failure....

Happy to see that they did not elect to continue the flight (yeah I know different type and circumstances but still having a gripe about that 3 engines BA 747 flight).

[cflier]

I am so sick of media reports of 'near disasters' that turn out to be routine. Let's see what the experts say.


yes,lets wait and see, has Geoff Thomas commented on it yet? :O:O

[ChaseIt]

"engine blew up in flames two hours into the flight” - Oh P L E A S E... when will the media stop quoting the ravings of idiots who know nothing about what they are talking about... turbulence or some minor engine fault (not saying this was minor but will wait for the F A C T S and not trust the first flush of a media frenzy) is always accompanied by hordes of passengers wailing and carrying on about how "it was sooo scary and we thought we were going to die... etc.".
My guess, happy to be proven wrong, is that this was probably a small failure followed by an engine shutdown and air turnback.
I am so sick of media reports of 'near disasters' that turn out to be routine. Let's see what the experts say.

Completely agree! Any media take note! Cause every time I hear about an aviation incident on the 'news' it is littered with inaccurate facts and total rubbish.

On a side note, I have seen a photo and talked with a crew member. Standard engine failure and a job well done by the crew.

I look forward to hearing what the 'avaiation expert' has to say 😂

[B2N2]

"Standard" engine failure...?
We're not talking about 1930's radials are we?
Nothing standard about an engine failure with a modern high bypass turbine engine.

[Capn Bloggs]

WERE YOU ON THE PLANE? Email [email protected]
What's the story with that, Metroman? You on a spotters retainer? :}

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Bloggsie

Try it - there seems to be something wrong with that email address?? :confused: :confused:

I wonder why? :E :E

Tail Wheel

[Buster Hyman]

Happy to see that they did not elect to continue the flight (yeah I know different type and circumstances but still having a gripe about that 3 engines BA 747 flight).
Reminds me of an OA 747 that left SIN & was the subject of a bomb threat (I know, not engine related). They initially turned back but decided to continue on to MEL. Upon arrival, the Crew demanded a full security check which had to be conducted out on the taxi way!

[mrdeux]

It really does fall into the 'so what' category. Engines fail or are shut down for all sorts of reasons. And on a four engined aircraft, it really isn't a big deal. But, going by the gibberish in the newspapers, you'd think the sky had fallen.

[p.j.m]

Isnt it about time Rolls Royce came clean on the A380 Engine...before a major incident with loss of life..

Are Qantas just unlucky, or do they seem to have more incidents with their A380 engines than other carriers?

Where do they get these maintained btw? The Philippines?

[mrdeux]

Are Qantas just unlucky, or do they seem to have more incidents with their A380 engines than other carriers?

I expect that 'seem' is the operative word.

[Matt48]

I expect that 'seem' is the operative word.
Another Rolls Royce that 'failed to proceed' ??

[AerialPerspective]

Completely agree! Any media take note! Cause every time I hear about an aviation incident on the 'news' it is littered with inaccurate facts and total rubbish.

On a side note, I have seen a photo and talked with a crew member. Standard engine failure and a job well done by the crew.

I look forward to hearing what the 'avaiation expert' has to say 😂
Chase It, haha, I logged on to pprune this morning and thought exactly the same thing. I wonder if the 'world's greatest aviation expert' has got in on the act yet.

[AerialPerspective]

Are Qantas just unlucky, or do they seem to have more incidents with their A380 engines than other carriers?

Where do they get these maintained btw? The Philippines?
Painting is done in the Philippines... A380 engines are maintained by Rolls-Royce. Before there's screams of why isn't it done here in Australia, let's just remember there are some of us who've been around long enough to remember UA did maintenance on Qantas' 747s in the early 70s until QF had enough aircraft to justify the expenditure.

[Ken Borough]

Didn't Aer Lingus also do a fair bit of maintenance on QF’s Classics in the late 1980s/early 1990s?

[atakacs]

Are Qantas just unlucky, or do they seem to have more incidents with their A380 engines than other carriers?

Where do they get these maintained btw? The Philippines?

It would indeed seem that way.

I'm pretty sure that there are very few maintenance outfits for those Trents (anyone with specifics?) and that quality standards are enforced. As such the apparent issues at Qantas are puzzling.

[ACMS]

It's

QANTAS

[cessnapete]

Well as long as it remained a contained engine failure....

Happy to see that they did not elect to continue the flight (yeah I know different type and circumstances but still having a gripe about that 3 engines BA 747 flight).

Completely different circumstances, it wasn't a fire incident and plenty of en route alternates.
Mind you not helped by the crew fuel system finger trouble at end of flight. Plenty of fuel on board but in the wrong tanks. Unnecessary diversion to Manchester.
A 3 engine 747 has more options than a for example, a 767 with all engines running!!

[haughtney1]

QF bashing aside, nice work by the crew, all down safe and sound which is the ideal outcome :-)

[jolihokistix]

What is this with some news media using capital letters for emotive words all the time? Not simply shouting, but deliberately trying to start panic thoughts, it seems. Fragile society we have...

[compressor stall]

Well the ABC seems to have reported it well. "Pilots shut down engine" and "Appearing to spark" were the most dramatic words.

And linked to a twitter vid from a pax of the sparks. No "we're going to die" or other stuff, just the QF spokesman with the usual line.

Well done.

The question remains if it's actually newsworthy, but once it's in the open, it's of enough interés that they have to report it

[AerialPerspective]

Didn't Aer Lingus also do a fair bit of maintenance on QF’s Classics in the late 1980s/early 1990s?
Don't know about that, they certainly wet-leased Aer Lingus 747s for MAN-MEL and LHR-MEL flights during peak periods.

[backnforther]

Ch 7 headline has gone from engine exploded yesterday morning to spark flew from engine this morning.

[Ken Borough]

AP,

The Classics were ferried between LHR and Dublin for their checks but I can't recall how many times it was done but quite a few.

As for the wet lease, MAN was not a planned destination. They turned around at LHR.

[AerialPerspective]

AP,

The Classics were ferried between LHR and Dublin for their checks but I can't recall how many times it was done but quite a few.

As for the wet lease, MAN was not a planned destination. They turned around at LHR.
OK, I stand corrected but my question would be so what... none of them fell out of the sky so obviously whatever was done was done competently. I think Australian Engineers are very good and I know there have been problems in SIN (which QF don't use anymore, but funnily enough VA do and no one says peep about it). This thing that nothing done off shore can possibly be as well done as here is just a fallacy... there have been plenty of errors over the years by Australian engineers who are after all, human. Some of the constant bleating about safety makes one think the JFK assassination would be blamed on off shore maintenance if possible. Not saying you're saying that, just a general comment.

[Atlas Shrugged]

Ah, yes....the dreaded engine failure in a 4 engine aircraft which, according to the media, is yet another event of earth shattering proportions. :eek::eek:

Loud bang.....flashes of flame. Compressor stall...????

These engines are always "on fire". You just can't normally see it and being "on fire" simply means that it's hot in the "cold" section.....it isn't always necessarily all that dramatic.

Most likely a standard engine shutdown on an aircraft with four engines requiring no departure from normal operational changes other than return

.....your welcome.

[unobtanium]

.....your welcome.

My welcome drink? Snack? Door gift? Raffle ticket?

[AerocatS2A]

It's

QANTAS

Qantas says it's Qantas.

https://www.qantas.com/au/en.html

[ACMS]

Huh? The guy above my post spelt it QUANTAS.....then changed it.......

What are you on about?

[compressor stall]

Not seeing the original pre-amended post, it looks like you are telling people that it should be all upper case....

[Lodrun]

I have it on good authority that this was not a compressor stall.

[601]

Ch 7 headline has gone from engine exploded yesterday morning to spark flew from engine this morning.
The report should be interesting - that is the one CH7 Brisbane reports that Boeing are doing on the incident.

[atakacs]

Huh? The guy above my post spelt it QUANTAS.....then changed it.......

What are you on about?

Apologies (?) - that was me :rolleyes:

Back to the matter at hand I have it also a "good authority" that this was a significant engine failure. Well handled by all concerned but definitely newsworthy, at least in PPRuNe !

[AerocatS2A]

Huh? The guy above my post spelt it QUANTAS.....then changed it.......

What are you on about?

I didn't see any Quantas and thought you were being pedantic about it being all caps.

[maggot]

Ooooh significant
Im ready for another novel

[atakacs]

FWIW VH-OQG hasn't flown since...

They must be doing live novels readings

[V-Jet]

FWIW VH-OQG hasn't flown since...

They must be doing live novels readings

Anyone else heard this was a loan engine from RR but it flew a 'bit' longer than RR had 'originally' recommended?

[dragon man]

Don't know if it was a loaner but it was operating on an EA.

[Ida down]

Didn't Aer Lingus also do a fair bit of maintenance on QF’s Classics in the late 1980s/early 1990s?Eh, no. Qantas leased an Air lingus 747/200, and sent our lads over to pick her up. The Gingerbeer had writers cramp half way through the flight, with Tech Logs covering the floor, as they filed off his desk, hold item's, Trans Quals, you name it, she had it, and as Weipa came into sight, they almost wept with relief. When our Engineers looked her over, they were gobsmacked, and one remarked, thank God they are like ×#%$%# old Holdens, because this baby is a wreck. She was returned later, fit as a flea, but it cured Qantas of any liason for quite some time.

[mustafagander]

Well, Ida down, I did a few ferries to Dublin taking the B747s for maintenance. Most unfortunately for us crews it was a transit - drop off one, pick up the other and back to LHR. We did a mighty thorough inspection ex DUB though, you never know what might not be quite right!! ;)

[Bleve]

We did a mighty thorough inspection ex DUB though, you never know what might not be quite right!! ;)

To be sure, to be sure. :)

[dragon man]

I picked one up that had had thrust lever measurement decals put next to each thrust lever.ie they had added two extra. Boeing provided two , one between 1 and 2 and the other between 3 and 4 but that wasn't good enough. Another time they had replaced a nose wheel with the incorrect speed rated tyre for the take off weight of that model 747. We were in Anthens and it took hours to get it swapped. All good fun!!!

[Ken Borough]

I think Ida Down is confused with his history and is referring to what was VH-EEI, a 747-100 ex Highland Express. It carried FJ livery as VH-EEI

[Tankengine]

I think Ida Down is confused with his history and is referring to what was VH-EEI, a 747-100 ex Highland Express. It carried FJ livery as VH-EEI

I flew EIEIO as it was nicknamed a number of times as an S/O.
We refuelled in Guam once because it couldn't do SYD-NRT with a tempo.:}
It had three different engine variants out of the four! The Flight Engineer had the thrust levers really split on takeoff!:eek:

[JamieMaree]

Observed at Phoenix being painted as LX-NCV for Cargolux - August 17, 1986

Lease to Cargolux, Luxembourg was not taken up

Observed at Orlando, Florida in full Highland Express livery - June 05, 1987

Leased to Highland Express as the registered operator

Arrived Prestwick, Scotland at conclusion of delivery flight to Highland Express - June 09, 1987

Aircraft was named 'Highlander'

Entered onto the British Aircraft Register as G-HIHO - June 19, 1987

Cancelled from the United States Aircraft Register - June 1987

Operated first revenue service with Highland Express - July 04, 1987

Highland Express ceased operations - December 11, 1987

Repossessed by Citicorp and placed in storage at Brussels, Belgium - January 1988

Aircraft leased to Qantas Airways Ltd as the registered operator

Arrived Singapore as QF500D at conclusion of ferry flight (Captain C. Viertal) - March 02, 1988

Ferry route: Brussels - Bahrain - Singapore

Aircraft entered maintenance and repaint in full Air Pacific livery at Singapore - March 02, 1988

Entered onto Australian Aircraft Register as VH-EEI - March 11, 1988

Registered to Citibank North America

Arrived Sydney as QF500D at conclusion of delivery flight from Singapore - April 13, 1988

Aircraft was named 'Island of Viti Levu'

Operated first revenue service with Air Pacific Sydney - Nadi as FJ911 - April 27, 1988

Leased to Aer Lingus and sub-leased to Qantas - November 15, 1989

Cancelled from Australian Aircraft Register - November 21, 1989

Entered onto Irish Aircraft Register as EI-CAI - November 21, 1989

Arrived Sydney after operating final revenue service as QF21 - March 19, 1990

Returned to Citicorp on termination of lease - March 19, 1990

Cancelled from Irish Aircraft Register - March 23, 1990

Entered onto Australian Aircraft Register as VH-EEI - March 23, 1990

Ferried Sydney - Auckland as QF500D (Captain C. Viertal) - March 23, 1990

Entered heavy maintenance with Air New Zealand Engineering - March 23, 1990

Cancelled from Australian Aircraft Register - March 23, 1990

Aircraft had flown 43,900 hours with 12,284 cycles

[Fris B. Fairing]

Ken

I think Ida Down is confused with his history and is referring to what was VH-EEI, a 747-100 ex Highland Express. It carried FJ livery as VH-EEI

There were a couple of Aer Lingus 747-100 leased in around the time that QF also had the Tower Air 747 N93117 and the Martinair DC-10 PH-MBT. The rego EI-BED springs to mind but I think there were several aircraft involved in the lease.

VH-EEI was a real dog and I seem to recall the Fiji Prime Minister getting involved and asking for another aeroplane.

[AerialPerspective]

Ken



There were a couple of Aer Lingus 747-100 leased in around the time that QF also had the Tower Air 747 N93117 and the Martinair DC-10 PH-MBT. The rego EI-BED springs to mind but I think there were several aircraft involved in the lease.

VH-EEI was a real dog and I seem to recall the Fiji Prime Minister getting involved and asking for another aeroplane.
I think the Martinair aircraft was actually PH-MCF which was painted in a hybrid Qantas livery... Martinair red cheat line and black Qantas titles, red tail with wingless kangaroo. Could hear it coming from a mile off with its whiny GE CF6s.

Aer Lingus actually had an aircraft registered EI-EIO. A freighter I believe, same as when I was in Ireland and driving up a road with 'S L O W' painted across the road, then a bit further up 'S L O W E R'.

VH-EEI was a Boeing 747-123, originally delivered to American Airlines in the early 70s when nearly all the US majors briefly operated 747s (DL, TW, AA, EA - some leased from PA). One of her sister ships ended up being a Shuttle Carrier for NASA and carried the AA tricolor cheat line for years afterward. Even model kits had the AA strip on the decals.

[flycol1]

"Standard" engine failure...?
We're not talking about 1930's radials are we?
Nothing standard about an engine failure with a modern high bypass turbine engine.



I agree ...the truth lies somewhere between a pax. claim of bursting in to flames or w.t.t.e and the company assertion of a loss of power and shutdown and return to base..ho hum. There seems a credible account by one pax of' sparks and vibration'and scurrying cabin crew to the flight deck where hopefully the problem had already been recognised or a good reason why it hadn't been. Interesting engines these trent 900s-wonder if it might be a similar QF 32 event

[RickNRoll]

Are Qantas just unlucky, or do they seem to have more incidents with their A380 engines than other carriers?

Where do they get these maintained btw? The Philippines?

They seem to have trouble with their RR 747 engines as well.

[Ken Borough]

The wet lease with Aer Lingus was for one B747: EI-BED was used for the whole period except for one or two rotations when -BED went for a check in Dublin. The substitute aircraft was EI-ASJ.

Qantas wet-leased a Martinair DC10 at the same time. It was PH-MBT in full Martinair livery. The hybrid-liveried 747 PH-MCF came later. It was a freighter but in pax configuration.

Tower Air were wet leased to operate between MEL and LAX via Nadi and Honolulu using 747s. I think they used two units during the time.

[V-Jet]

Can we send our wet leased CEO back to Aer Lingus, or better yet, Victorville? In comparison performance EIEIO was hardly a dog, more a soaring angel!

[AerialPerspective]

The wet lease with Aer Lingus was for one B747: EI-BED was used for the whole period except for one or two rotations when -BED went for a check in Dublin. The substitute aircraft was EI-ASJ.

Qantas wet-leased a Martinair DC10 at the same time. It was PH-MBT in full Martinair livery. The hybrid-liveried 747 PH-MCF came later. It was a freighter but in pax configuration.

Tower Air were wet leased to operate between MEL and LAX via Nadi and Honolulu using 747s. I think they used two units during the time.
My mistake. I was around at the time but had forgotten about the Martinair DC-10... perhaps it only operated to SYD and BNE??? Definitely remember that MCF was a Freighter because you could see the forward door.

I think you're right about Tower Air, I think there was a substitute aircraft on some rotations. The main one (I have photos somewhere) was in a livery with Tower up the tail and TWA stripes. The other one was blue I think.

[Ken Borough]

I'm pretty sure that -MBT was a Sydney-based aircraft so would in all probability operate ex SYD, MEL & BNE to Asia and SE Asia. It was a long time ago!

With respect to -MCF, I recall that there were a number of complaints from F class passengers as the 'arms' that lifted the nose door interfered with what could be seen from the windows. I can't remember if those seats were subsequently blocked from sale, or last allocated or what the fix was.

I never had the dubious pleasure of even seeing the TowerAir 747s but I think everyone from the CEO down were very pleased to eventually see the back of them. I don't think CA was ever forgiven!

[AerialPerspective]

I'm pretty sure that -MBT was a Sydney-based aircraft so would in all probability operate ex SYD, MEL & BNE to Asia and SE Asia. It was a long time ago!

With respect to -MCF, I recall that there were a number of complaints from F class passengers as the 'arms' that lifted the nose door interfered with what could be seen from the windows. I can't remember if those seats were subsequently blocked from sale, or last allocated or what the fix was.

I never had the dubious pleasure of even seeing the TowerAir 747s but I think everyone from the CEO down were very pleased to eventually see the back of them. I don't think CA was ever forgiven!
Yes, that's right. I have this vision in my mind of the P Class Cabin and there was a window or two missing on each side where the door seam was located.

Not sure who CA was but I'm sure I'll remember if I think about it for long enough. We hated Tower Air and were aghast that the company had leased it or anything like it.

I do remember at the time it was when the government was putting extreme pressure on Qantas to provide capacity during the tourist boom and there was very little if anything available worldwide for lease, hence they had to take what they could get.

[Fris B. Fairing]

I realise this is serious thread drift but here are some images of the aeroplanes in question.

http://www.adastron.com/aviation/vault/PH-MBT-AD136.jpg

DC-10 PH-MBT at Brisbane on 03JAN88.

http://www.adastron.com/aviation/vault/PH-MBT-AD139-Qantas-sticker.jpg

Sticker "On Lease to Qantas" appeared over several of the doors on PH-MBT.

http://www.adastron.com/aviation/vault/PH-MCF-AI275.jpg

B747 PH-MCF. Note the two missing first class windows fore and aft of the nose door line as referred to by AerialPerspective.

http://www.adastron.com/aviation/vault/N93117-AI280.jpg

The Tower Air B747 N93117 still wearing its previous TWA livery.

[maggot]

Excellent thread drift :)

[AerialPerspective]

Excellent thread drift :)
Yep. Agreed... Interesting discussion ��

[Ken Borough]

provide capacity during the tourist boom and there was very little if anything available worldwide

I always thought that the Company's decision to wet lease was in response to commercial demand. Significant additional flying was scheduled with our own resources but that was insufficient to cope.

Accommodation in Sydney was also extraordinarily tight. Aer Lingus crews slipped at a funny little motel just off Oxford Street but the Martinair crews were accommodated at the Parramatta Parkroyal. I shudder to think what the crews thought but I guess they were happy to be out of the northern winter. I can't remember where TowerAir crew slipped in Melbourne - I think it was a case of 'out of sight, out of mind'.

There was a mild kerfuffle in the middle of the TowerAir lease as the initial aircraft required a check. Their maintenance base was in New York but the aircraft were operated during the lease between MEL and LAX. The two-man band responsible for negotiating the lease was somewhat embarrassed and almost in denial mode when confronted with the awful facts!

Thanks Fris for the photos. I wonder how many 'task forces' Qantas would set up today if similar circumstances prevailed?

[AerialPerspective]

I always thought that the Company's decision to wet lease was in response to commercial demand. Significant additional flying was scheduled with our own resources but that was insufficient to cope.

Accommodation in Sydney was also extraordinarily tight. Aer Lingus crews slipped at a funny little motel just off Oxford Street but the Martinair crews were accommodated at the Parramatta Parkroyal. I shudder to think what the crews thought but I guess they were happy to be out of the northern winter. I can't remember where TowerAir crew slipped in Melbourne - I think it was a case of 'out of sight, out of mind'.

There was a mild kerfuffle in the middle of the TowerAir lease as the initial aircraft required a check. Their maintenance base was in New York but the aircraft were operated during the lease between MEL and LAX. The two-man band responsible for negotiating the lease was somewhat embarrassed and almost in denial mode when confronted with the awful facts!

Thanks Fris for the photos. I wonder how many 'task forces' Qantas would set up today if similar circumstances prevailed?
Probably right.

What I was getting at was, yes, there was increased demand but the fact Qantas couldn't meet it immediately prompted a warning/threat from the government that if it couldn't, it would look at awarding traffic rights to more overseas airlines.

Qantas' response was to get hold of any capacity they could which I think is the real reason they 'settled' for Tower Air, not much else available due to the increased demand.

I remember there were Sales people from MEL on the Tower 747 to act as a 'Qantas Representative' on board.

Yes, if it happened today I'm sure the precursor to the response would be layered with much 'reaching out', 'resetting expectations', 'scoping the whole thing and... "What that looks like"' and a dictionary of other weasel words that ultimately result in no decision then a plan for the poor lower down persons who will be blamed... that's certainly how the opposition do it.

I think the Tower Crew might have stayed at the Old Melbourne from memory.

[Heywoodjablome]

PH MCF was the aircraft PER ground crew used to set a record for Guiness book pulling a/c along tarmac behind bays 56-53 at ITB from memory 59 staff

[Chris2303]

Getting (briefly) back on topic......

Has anybody heard definitively what happened to OQG?

[Going Boeing]

I always thought that the Company's decision to wet lease was in response to commercial demand. Significant additional flying was scheduled with our own resources but that was insufficient to cope.

At that time, Singapore Airlines was engaged in extremely heavy lobbying of the Australian Government to get more access/frequency to Australian ports and Qantas was strenuously opposing this. The SQ argument was that there was much more demand than available seats in/out of Australia so the Government told QF to put on more capacity otherwise they would grant SQ the increased access. Despite the belief in QF management that the high demand that SQ was quoting was artificially generated, the aircraft discussed in the previous posts were sourced and a significant capacity increase was generated. The capacity ended up being far more than the genuine damand and the Martinair Aircraft did very little flying as it wasn't really required.

Qantas didn't want to order any more of its own high capacity aircraft for the short term as they wanted to wait for B747-400 deliveries to start late 1989. The B744 was a significantly more efficient aircraft so the short term leases of EEI, Tower Air & Martinair filled the capacity gap.

I believe that most of the Tower Air flights operated via Papeete.

Now, can anyone tell us what happened to the A380 engine?

[Fris B. Fairing]

Back off topic for a minute.

I just remembered that there was another odd aeroplane around that time. Qantas sold B747-238B VH-EBG to El Al in May 88 but it came back into the Qantas fleet on lease in Sept 88. The lower lobe galley had been ripped out and the cabin was reconfigured so it wasn't the EBG we knew. Many manuals had to be rewritten and the aeroplane was generally more trouble than it was worth. It went back to El Al in June 89.

[AerialPerspective]

Back off topic for a minute.

I just remembered that there was another odd aeroplane around that time. Qantas sold B747-238B VH-EBG to El Al in May 88 but it came back into the Qantas fleet on lease in Sept 88. The lower lobe galley had been ripped out and the cabin was reconfigured so it wasn't the EBG we knew. Many manuals had to be rewritten and the aeroplane was generally more trouble than it was worth. It went back to El Al in June 89.
Wasn't it also substantially heavier too... I seem to recall EBA and/or EBB coming back as well from a stint at Air Lanka and had to be put through a D check because maintenance records weren't kept up to date by Air Lanka, so I was told.

A small point, was there evidence that the LLG had been 'ripped out' or was it perhaps just 'removed' (sorry, just being a smart alec).

[Ida down]

I think Ida Down is confused with his history and is referring to what was VH-EEI, a 747-100 ex Highland Express. It carried FJ livery as VH-EEI
My apologies Ken, you are right, she was a 100 series.EEI was correct. Or known as EIEIO, she she left EBB ( Buckets Of Bolts) as the usual disaster, for dead.

[Ida down]

Back off topic for a minute.

I just remembered that there was another odd aeroplane around that time. Qantas sold B747-238B VH-EBG to El Al in May 88 but it came back into the Qantas fleet on lease in Sept 88. The lower lobe galley had been ripped out and the cabin was reconfigured so it wasn't the EBG we knew. Many manuals had to be rewritten and the aeroplane was generally more trouble than it was worth. It went back to El Al in June 89.
EBG, was an interesting aircraft. It had a very distinctive tearing noise on the flight deck, each take off. Needless to say, many crews found it quite disconcerting, and repeatedly entered it in the Tech Logs. So they decided to pull her off line, and bascially gave her a phase check, even though she was not due, and pulled the flight deck apart, x rayed all parts, and found nothing. So they put her back together and back on line she went, only to continue the unusual noise, and the complaint in the logs continued. Probably still doing it, in some African country, where she does the milk run.

[AerialPerspective]

EBG, was an interesting aircraft. It had a very distinctive tearing noise on the flight deck, each take off. Needless to say, many crews found it quite disconcerting, and repeatedly entered it in the Tech Logs. So they decided to pull her off line, and bascially gave her a phase check, even though she was not due, and pulled the flight deck apart, x rayed all parts, and found nothing. So they put her back together and back on line she went, only to continue the unusual noise, and the complaint in the logs continued. Probably still doing it, in some African country, where she does the milk run.
Probably one of those mysteries that were never solved... wasn't there an anomaly within the 747-338 fleet that one or two of the airframes burned more fuel and no one could ever determine why... or was that solved at some stage???

[Fris B. Fairing]

Ida

That tearing noise must have been most disconcerting. Sadly the old girl emitted real tearing noises one last time in August 2007 when she was broken up.

[LeadSled]

Qantas sold B747-238B VH-EBG to El Al in May 88 but it came back into the Qantas fleet on lease in Sept 88
Folks,
That was not a lease-back, that was a sale returned because of non-conformance with the sales contract ---- and that is a really fascinating story, but that is for another time.
Re. the Martinair B747, it was a brand new aircraft, painted in the hybrid QF colours by Boeing, and delivered from Seattle to Sydney, without going anywhere near Holland until the end of the lease.
Tootle pip!!

[maggot]

Oh come on do tell

[Fris B. Fairing]

LS

That's interesting about EBG. They must have sorted it out eventually as it was still delivered to El Al after its brief return to QF. I believe the aeroplane ended her days with El Al. I too would love to hear the full story.

The Martinair B747 certainly looked brand spanking. Incidentally, it seems there was a second lease to QF from 02OCT89 to 20APR90. I don't remember that one.

Rgds