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View Full Version : MD500 Crash - Caversham, 24 March '17


SilsoeSid
24th Mar 2017, 22:04
Helicopter crashes in Reading on banks of River Thames - Get Reading (http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/reading-berkshire-news/helicopter-crashes-caversham-banks-river-12795686)


Helicopter crashes in Reading on banks of River Thames

Two helicopter pilots were “extremely lucky” to escape from an aircraft crash with minor injuries.
The private two-seater helicopter lost control over The Warren in Caversham and landed its side at the banks of the River Thames at 5.48pm on Friday, March 24.

Crew manager Paul Jones, the on duty officer for Royal Berkshire Fire and Rescue Service (RBFRS) said the two pilots managed to crawl out of the top of the helicopter before emergency services arrived.
Teams were called from Dee Road, Caversham Road, Wokingham Road and Whitley Wood fire stations, as well as a specialist unit from Maidenhead.
Mr Jones said: "South Central Ambulance Service was close behind us when we arrived.
"They checked two people over at the scene who had minor injuries."
When Mr Jones spoke to getreading he said the pair were "extremely lucky to escape" and it did not appear either would have to be taken to hospital.
He added both pilots decided to leave the helicopter before emergency services arrived as there was "a lot of fuel on board" and they were concerned there would be a fire.

Fortunately the vehicle was made safe and no fire started.

http://i4.getreading.co.uk/incoming/article12795691.ece/ALTERNATES/s810/Helicopter-crash-near-River-Thames.jpg


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3173260/pilots-lucky-reading-helicopter-crash/

Pilots ‘extremely lucky’ after Reading helicopter crash as witnesses describe aircraft plummeting from sky ‘in a spin’

TWO men have had an “extremely lucky” escape after their helicopter dramatically crashed next to the River Thames in Reading.

Local firefighters said both men inside the aircraft managed to clamber out before emergency services arrived.
Witnesses told of seeing one of them give a “thumbs up” to show they were okay.

But crew manager Paul Jones, of Royal Berkshire Fire and Rescue Service (RBFRS), told GetReading the pair were “extremely lucky to escape”.

Fortunately, he said the chopper did not catch fire despite there being “a lot of fuel on board”, and both men were treated at the scene for minor injuries but did not need hospital treatment.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/nintchdbpict000311314803-e1490380974658.jpg?strip=all&w=646&quality=100


Reading helicopter crash: Aircraft crashes near River Thames after going into a spin | London Evening Standard (http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/reading-crash-helicopter-crashes-near-river-thames-after-going-into-a-spin-a3498966.html)

Reading helicopter crash: Aircraft crashes near River Thames after going into a spin

A witness said: "It flew over quite low and circled the playing field, it then went towards the river and flew along it.
"It then started to look like it was coming into land, it then went below the tree line but we could see it go into a spin, next we heard a loud thud.
"We ran over and saw it was laying on its side, it was on the opposite side of the river to us but we could see someone over there and shouted if everyone got out ok, they gave us a thumbs up.
Luckily there was no fire."

The witness, who was at his son's football training at the time, thought the pilot was "showing off".
He said: "To be honest all those watching thought the pilot was showing off but naturally that was just an assumption.

Hughes500
25th Mar 2017, 07:02
No
MD 500E G-MRRR

md 600 driver
25th Mar 2017, 12:03
Are you saying it's now a 500 that crashed ?

Democritus
25th Mar 2017, 12:27
G-MRRR was owned by this chap

Wiltshire 'flying fire engine' pilot Jeremy Paxton dies - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-21371552)

Not relevant - that BBC article is more than 4 years old.

FLY 7
25th Mar 2017, 12:33
If it is the 500 G-MRRR, then incident has taken place at, or very close to, its previous registered address - so presumably occurred during t/o or landing.

Millionaire water ski champion Jeremy Paxton wins appeal in £30,000 legal battle to keep helipad in his garden | Daily Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2233316/Millionaire-water-ski-champion-Jeremy-Paxton-wins-appeal-30-000-legal-battle-helipad-garden.html)

Hughes500
25th Mar 2017, 21:34
Obviously people have trouble reading ! It was G-MRRR The pilot told me what happened about 2 hours after it happened !

toptobottom
25th Mar 2017, 21:58
The pilot told me what happened about 2 hours after it happened !

And what did ML tell you?

Hughes500
26th Mar 2017, 10:19
Top

Who is ML ? ( CE maybe ? ) the owners are RP and RP and RP

toptobottom
26th Mar 2017, 12:06
Hughes - just PM'd you!

Spunk
26th Mar 2017, 20:38
Ohh come on guys, no secrets, we all want to know😋

Hughes500
27th Mar 2017, 06:41
G-MRRR is still owned by the same family company. Was flown by member of the family, the PF didnt put enough left pedal coming into land. Ac snapped to right ( 500's will do so quite violently if you pull the power in quickly when out of wind, or better way of putting it he didnt lead with the pedal ). Ac spun round 4 times, PF rolled throttle off, ac landed heavily the skid gear collapsed on one side causing ac to rollercoaster on to right side

John R81
27th Mar 2017, 07:12
H500: Assuming that you get into a spin like this in a 500, what would be the effect of then applying maximum left peddle? Is the tail sufficiently powerful to arrest the spin?

27th Mar 2017, 11:31
Probably a bit of a torque spike but that is infinitely preferable to crashing.

SASless
27th Mar 2017, 12:20
I am amazed I could survive my 500 flying listening to some of the Guru Speak being offered about the 500.

The 500 has proper tail rotor authority unlike the Jet Ranger.

Pushing the pedal works!

The Pedal adjustment is designed for the vertically challenged in life so that is not a problem.

Plainly the accident can be fairly seen as a gross failure of the Brain-Machine Interface.

Hughes500
27th Mar 2017, 12:21
I can only go on what the 2 brothers have told me ( I taught them both not only Ppl but conversion as well )
Coming into land in a field ( 300m x 300m ) gone over a set of low level power lines to a house ( all other 3 sides have tall trees ) with wind on left shoulder. The idea being to turn ac into wind before losing translational lift.
I can only assume they lost translational lift at the same time as starting to pull power in which further reduced speed ( so double whammy ). They say they were doing about 20 kts over the ground. The 500 has a powerful tail rotor on a short tail boom, so you really need to get pedals in early. So can only assume ( dangerous I know ) they didn't put enough pedal in. Normally the pedals will sort it so very surprised that it didn't. Did they put enough pedal in I don't know ? The other brother said the ac snapped right then back to the left ( twice ) before spinning 4 times ( the other brother said it didn't ).
PF then decided after 4 spins to close throttle as things were getting out of hand !
As with all these things there by the grace of God and difficult for us to make a judgement from an arm chair

Flingwing47
27th Mar 2017, 12:28
Perhaps the tail rotor snagged the power lines?

SASless
27th Mar 2017, 12:35
My Cozy chair traveled from offshore over the Arctic to the Mexican Border and included lots of mountain flying and sling work so I suppose passing judgement is a bit unfair.

After all we are talking about benign weather, a confined area you described as being about a thousand feet square at near sea level....with no mechanical defects affecting the controllability of the aircraft that suffered major damage.

Admit it....trying to suggest the aircraft is to blame for the accident is plain silly.

The pilot(s) diddled the pooch!

Hughes500
27th Mar 2017, 12:45
SAS
The brother who said it went right then left wasn't flying it, the brother who was said no it went to the right with no back to the left. Shows how 2 people in the same place can have different views of what happened.
Now as PF said pilot error but not sure why. He wants to get back in the saddle so I will try and find out more, but my mind is on pilot error

SASless
27th Mar 2017, 14:14
Getting back into the saddle is the right thing to do.

Learning from what happened is also a good thing.

Remembering that even a Monkey can fall out of a Tree....eases the "pain"!

They are not the only pair of Pilots that have bent a Bird.....the good thing is no one got hurt.

Helicopters can be replaced ....not so the occupants.

28th Mar 2017, 09:22
Next time, use a little nose down to keep the speed on during the yawing turn until back into wind - losing ETL leads to high power and power-pedal demand.

Hughes500
28th Mar 2017, 12:39
Crab, that would be forward and down then !!!!!!!!

nigelh
28th Mar 2017, 21:43
The 500 has very good pedal authority and flying in all sorts of bad weather , tail into serious wind etc I find it hard to believe a qualified pilot could let it spin . In my experience if you put the pedal in it does as it's told !! Strange , but at least the pax are ok .

29th Mar 2017, 05:54
Hughes - not if you raise the lever:ok:

Hughes500
29th Mar 2017, 06:57
Well crab, the forward and down is for pulling lever up ! Need to keep it flying forward and down as you pull lever up. Otherwise you would come to a complete halt well away from where you want to be :ok: Probably lost in translation

Nigel, can't agree more think it was lazy / paralysed feet

29th Mar 2017, 07:19
Probably lost in translation Or 'lost in transition' ;)

I got the impression that they were trying a yawing turn into wind from a downwind (or cross downwind) approach - ie a very low speed downwind quickstop.

Hence my comment to keep the nose down a bit to retain speed and ETL until that yawing turn is completed and the need for lever to help hold the height until facing into wind and finishing the approach to the hover in the time-honoured fashion.

Whatever they did, they seem to have completely porked it.

Hughes500
29th Mar 2017, 12:38
Crab

Yup spot on, that is what they were trying to do but keep translational lift on while making a cylic turn rather than pedal turn. So both right, I believe they allowed the airspeed to wash off too much, so a double whammy of loss of translational lift at the same time as bringing in too much power with causes nose to come up too high hence more power needed and more pedal etc etc. well to show a 500 can do it !!!
https://www.facebook.com/aitchconservation/videos/285252028500892/

SilsoeSid
29th Mar 2017, 13:03
The witness, who was at his son's football training at the time, thought the pilot was "showing off".
He said: "To be honest all those watching thought the pilot was showing off but naturally that was just an assumption.

Eyewitnesses eh! :rolleyes:

Fareastdriver
29th Mar 2017, 14:47
Hello Insurance Company. I would like to insure my replacement helicopter.

Click. brrrrrrrrrr.