RAF Bans Skirts on Parade

[ORAC]

Speaking as someone who is TG, I don't understand the reasoning behind the decision here at all.

RAF women banned from wearing skirts on parade | News | The Times & The Sunday Times (http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/burglar-guilty-of-raid-on-simon-cowells-home-zvgcpf66j)

The Royal Air Force has banned women from wearing skirts on parade and issued a trousers-only rule in an attempt to become more inclusive. The move is partly owing to an increase in transgender troops and was discussed at a meeting by officials who address issues such as diversity, inclusion and uniform policy.

It is believed to have been put into action last year as part of a regular review of uniform policy. No decision is believed to have been made on whether to continue with the ban. The rule change has been criticised by some servicemen and politicians. Philip Davies, the Conservative MP, said: “It’s a ludicrous decision.”

The RAF first allowed women to wear trousers on parade in 2001. Some 14 per cent of the RAF’s 33,000 personnel are women, a higher percentage than in the Royal Navy or Army.

[megan]

Lets have a casual day, seven days of the week. Must be coming, jump in first and put the progressives to sleep.

[Kitty Hawk 1]

Why ban them? Why not make them optional as I believe the daily dress rule is. Glad I am no longer involved.

....was discussed at a meeting by officials... I would be interested to know who these 'officials' were. Probably blanket stackers and scribblies.

[Jayand]

If you are born a male with dangly bits you are a male, if not then you are a female! If you grow up feeling different then fine, I have no issues but society shouldn't have to change or bend over backwards to accommodate you. The world has gone mad.

[ORAC]

You are entitled to your view, but it's irrelevant to the question I asked, which is how banning skirts is supposed to make things more inclusive?

I would suspect they were more worried that some anti-TG barrack room lawyer would insist on the right to wear a skirt, and it was easier to preempt the situation and make everyone wear trousers instead.

[Ogre]

So what are the pipe band going to wear now?

And before I get the inevitable comments, my roots are North of the wall and it will always be a kilt to me.....

[BEagle]

The Royal Air Force has banned women from wearing skirts on parade and issued a trousers-only rule in an attempt to become more inclusive.

What's a 'parade' these days?

The new American boss of some UK company raised a few eyebrows when he demanded that "No women are to wear pants in the office!" - until it was explained to him that words in English and American don't always have the same meaning.

Perhaps this nonsense was dreamed up by the same idiot who required female cabin crew to wear flying suits rather than the much smarter blue cabin dresses they used to wear. The RAF then (and probably now) didn't issue flying suits which fitted every figure...

[Ogre]

The RAF then (and probably now) didn't issue flying suits which fitted every figure...

Oh I don't know, one only had to observe a Nimrod crew to see the variety of sizes and girths available in stores, or was that down to some hidden elastic....

[The Oberon]

A couple of years ago there was a thread about the confusion on a joint service parade where you had the Light Infantry charging about at 140 ppm,the bulk of the services at 120 ppm, the RN at 116 and the Guards at about 98 ppm. Also in the mix was skirted females whose skirt width only allowed a pace length of 27 inches as opposed the standard 30 Ins. Let's face it the RAF bands are multi gender, and no skirts there. Having said that, if this ruling is adopted across all 3 services, I can see the Royal Marines having something to say about it.

[The Old Fat One]

.....I have no issues but society shouldn't have to change or bend over backwards to accommodate you.

Hands down funniest quote on forum so far in 2017. ;););)

[langleybaston]

What is TG ...... cannot be Top Gun in context but ........ ?

[AnglianAV8R]

Perfectly reasonable. I suspect they're ensuring an absence of hairy legs on display.

[Al-bert]

Well, someone had to!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z5pRYacssM :ok:

[sitigeltfel]

Well, someone had to!

Get you!

W2jgrGtiYHE

[Wensleydale]

Well, someone had to!



and this one of course.....


http://images.oobject.com/thumbdir/thumbnails/9/0c/90ce5903de3e8cb32f6d7c15edd90ffa-orig

[Sideshow Bob]

Oh I don't know, one only had to observe a Nimrod crew to see the variety of sizes and girths available in stores, or was that down to some hidden elastic....
More a testament to the strength of the stitching, and before anyone says, yes that included mine (and several other FEs)!!

[Flying Binghi]

Let em wear shorts...:)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zAtnS6fXcgU

[NutLoose]

Of course there is a cost to all of this, you will need a new number 1 trouser or whatever designation it is today, and that will no doubt entail a new uniform so that they both match... judging by some of the WRAF I knew, transgender has been accepted for years. End of the milk bottles... who would have thought it.

[The Oberon]

Of course there is a cost to all of this, you will need a new number 1 trouser or whatever designation it is today, and that will no doubt entail a new uniform so that they both match... judging by some of the WRAF I knew, transgender has been accepted for years. End of the milk bottles... who would have thought it.
Ah yes, new uniform and gender discrimination. Due to fabric shortages, the then new T63 was issued in dribs and drabs. It was rumoured that SROs at Wittering said "Due to material shortages, WRAF skirts will be held up until SNCOs without trousers have been satisfied"

[ExAscoteer]

Sounds like a load of horlicks to me.

From AP1358:

0302. Ceremonial Occasions/Females on Parade. Mixed dress of skirts or trousers is not permitted within a parade. When on unit ceremonial duties or
parade, the parade sponsor will decide whether skirts or trousers are to be worn.

[Tankertrashnav]

Parades or not, I still think female personnel look much smarter in skirts. I complemented a female RN officer from Culdrose on how smart she looked in Tesco a while back. Bit of a risky move these days, as had she been a feminist she might have construed my comment as sexual harassment, but fortunately she accepted it graciously.

I got a bollocking from Mrs TTN though :(

[noflynomore]

"the parade sponsor"

sponsor!!!! wtf????

[NutLoose]

Wikipedia gets me, bar the token Flight Sgt in No1's they managed to describe all the other uniforms as worn by senior Officers, heck even the combat kit is shown on an Air Commodore! talk about top heavy lol.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uniforms_of_the_Royal_Air_Force

I note the J/T badge has gone, I take it that means the last one has left or been promoted?

During 1973 the wartime "Hairy Mary" working dress uniforms were replaced for all ranks with the 1972 pattern No 2 uniforms

WRAF were still being issued with them in 1976!

[Krystal n chips]

" I note the J/T badge has gone, I take it that means the last one has left or been promoted " ?

This much cherished rank has been gone, along with the wearers, for some time now.

I do know of one who was promoted as a result however .....which is the only way he ever could have been promoted to Cpl anyway.

As this thread is about uniforms, and parades, I'm delighted to say I upheld the tradition of the appearance of a J/T on such inane, and time wasting, activity when unable to avoid such.

Even more so as a Cpl.

[FODPlod]

Ah yes, new uniform and gender discrimination. Due to fabric shortages, the then new T63 was issued in dribs and drabs. It was rumoured that SROs at Wittering said "Due to material shortages, WRAF skirts will be held up until SNCOs without trousers have been satisfied"
Part of an Admiralty signal allegedly sent during a wartime shortage of navy blue serge uniform material:
...Therefore, and in view of the above, all Wrens clothing is to be held up until the needs of the sea going man have been satisfied.

[Fonsini]

Can someone please do a remake of Colditz where all the captured RAF pilots are transgender and the German guards don't know whether to call them Fred or Dorothy ?

I'm not sure I live on the right planet any more.

[Flight_Idle]

I spent the seventies in the RAF & managed to avoid almost all parades after training. I would have loved to wear heels & smart dresses when off duty, but I feared that the SWO would have gone purple with rage!

A different age then, so I had to toe the line dress wise.

[Danny42C]

Al-bert (#13),

Thanks for the link ! Why was I born 70 years too soon ?

Now that's what I call "smart" !

Of course you should keep skirts (how else can you tell 'em apart ?)

Danny42C.

[Melchett01]

What a load of bollocks!

Or not as seems to be the problem.

[downsizer]

This kind of sh1t, true or not, is because the RAF is infested with posts like SO1 Diversity and Inclusion. Why are we employing W/Cs on **** like that as opposed to our core business.

[downsizer]

" I note the J/T badge has gone, I take it that means the last one has left or been promoted " ?

This much cherished rank has been gone, along with the wearers, for some time now.

Errm, saw one last week!

[Flap Track 6]

I would suspect they were more worried that some anti-TG barrack room lawyer would insist on the right to wear a skirt, and it was easier to preempt the situation and make everyone wear trousers instead.

Jest ye not.
I have experience where the dress code at a company function (Suit and tie for Gentlemen and cocktail dress for ladies) was successfully challenged by a bloke who claimed it was sexist that only ladies were allowed to wear a dress.

[ORAC]

I wasn't jesting.

[pr00ne]

Quite right too! Old fashioned blinkered thinking around gender and what is and isn't "acceptable" to wear belongs in the Ark, it is outdated BS.

[NutLoose]

Don't get yer tights in a twist Pr00ne.. :p

[pr00ne]

Am not Nutloose, but thanks for the advice! It's the ancient old dinosaurs on here that have missed the last thirty years that are in a twist!

[Aynayda Pizaqvick]

Given the increasing propensity for women to decorate their legs with naff tattoos, having a trouser only rule makes sense to me.

[GlobalNav]

I think tights would be the best way for the RAF to go. The surest way for Danny to tell them apart.

[Ogre]

I think tights would be the best way for the RAF to go

Guess that rules out bringing in compulsory stockings and webbing then....

[tartare]

Lordy, Wensleydale - that is a fine photo!

[chopper2004]

Guess that rules out bringing in compulsory stockings and webbing then....
Like this

cheers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTC4M-jh42g

[Melchett01]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogre View Post
Guess that rules out bringing in compulsory stockings and webbing then....
Like this

cheers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTC4M-jh42g

Chopper,

You can't put that clip up! It's not BoB season and BEagle's not getting any younger ... he needs to take a run up to Miss York in all her glory rather than just being ambushed like that :E

That said, I think it's a damn sight better than the RN's version of Mess 'Undress'!

[MPN11]

Arrrrgggghhhh ... where are my pills? :)

[brakedwell]

I suppose trousers only means no knickers :cool:

[Al-bert]

.......trousers-only rule in an attempt to become more inclusive.

Henceforth 'stockings and webbing' may be considered optional and may be worn beneath the trousers of all genders, and those of no gender.

[Finningley Boy]

I'm trying to imagine the particular shade of puce that one Sgt R.M. Smith, Discip NCO at Boulmer c 1978-80, would have turned if someone would have presented this snapshot of the present day RAF to him!:eek:

Anyhow, I reckon Lord Trenchard is currently spinning in his final resting place like the proverbial propeller.:uhoh:

FB:)

[Danny42C]

Glad I got out in '72, when: "what was so was so. and what was not was not" (King Mongkut [Rex Harrison] in "Anna and the King of Siam".

D.

[ORAC]

I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on the frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words. When I was a boy, we were taught to be discrete and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise and impatient of restraint.

--- Hesiod, Eighth Century B.C.

"I believe what really happens in history is this: the old man is always wrong; and the young people are always wrong about what is wrong with him. The practical form it takes is this: that, while the old man may stand by some stupid custom, the young man always attacks it with some theory that turns out to be equally stupid."

G. K. Chesterton

[Al-bert]

ORAC - PPrune so needs a 'like' button - although that thought will no doubt be despised by some as a frivolous departure from the serious debate that is forever PPRune :=

[chopper2004]

ORAC - PPrune so needs a 'like' button - although that thought will no doubt be despised by some as a frivolous departure from the serious debate that is forever PPRune :=
PPRUNE is not going to turn into Fakebook and Linkedin is already doing the 'like' button.

Now back to the topic - the Polish police force do not have sucha problem lest the Warsaw Police Dept :)

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g209/longranger/3201760850_bfd66f441a_zpslpkqqgr0.jpg

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g209/longranger/5999182347_f991a31c89_zpspmrhznrq.jpg

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g209/longranger/military_woman_poland_police_000004_960_zps8wdsqpun.jpg

cheers

[Tankertrashnav]

Blimey - fancy that lot playing good cop/bad cop with you! (with one in reserve should one get tired)!

"I confess officer" (in Polish).

[BEagle]

"Ve haff vays of making you talk....??"

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/AR_1_zps292f6094.jpg (http://s14.photobucket.com/user/nw969/media/AR_1_zps292f6094.jpg.html)

[Warmtoast]

I'd love to travel on this airline - the female attendant would certainly get the male passengers to look up from their iPads whilst she did her safety briefing, but the mind boggles as to what would take place during her 'post-flight' de-briefing!
I've "touched-up" the photo (no pun intended) to preserve the young lady's modesty.


http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r231/thawes/Topless%20Air%20Attendant_zpskqwhkumz.jpg

[NutLoose]

As if putting gloves on would make you follow her hand signals..

[Linedog]

She looks like she's demonstrating the operation of her flaps and air brakes.

[Top Bunk Tester]

Hate to throw a stinger under the wheels of the PPrune Outrage Bus, but this has not happened, it is False News. Check out the Intranet Portal and you will see a denial and disclaimer.

[GipsyMagpie]

Hate to throw a stinger under the wheels of the PPrune Outrage Bus, but this has not happened, it is False News. Check out the Intranet Portal and you will see a denial and disclaimer.
Epic. Maybe we can do a bit of reverse logic. If we put a real, but stupid rule, on here perhaps the powers that be will declare it false news and change it.

I'll start - "RAF pilots required to do swim test every year to prove they haven't forgotten"...