Private pilot and ferry flights of private aircraft (non AOC)

[rollcloud]

What are your opinions with references to the law or experience, of private pilots conducting ferry flights?? (Pilot receives no form of payment or reimbursement for the flight. Only property of the pilot or owner is carried. And no other persons on board other than opperating crew and/or the owner. Owner pays all expences (pilot makes/receives absolutely no money but also spends no money)).

Just to give you guys a better picture, I am a mechanical GA and Regional Airline LAME looking at the possibility of preforming pre delivery inspection, review and delivery of aircraft for no fee (aircraft would not be be opperating under a AOC/private opperations only). Im only planing on doing this a few times a year threw word of mouth (no for of advertisment) mostly to do somthing a little different and build my general experience as a aviation professional.

P.s. before i ever did conducted any such activity, i would consult with the authority.. Im just looking for educated opinions for now. Cheers

[aerobatologist]

The regulation for a PPL is "not for hire or reward". While you've got the personal reward part mostly eliminated, there is still an implication here that you are operating for hire. It could also be interpreted that the company you're working for will collect some reward for offering the service, and you might also need the company to not pay your salary for those hours that are being flown.
Also think about insurance. - who will cover the costs in the case of an accident?

I would definitely get approval from the authority before doing this. And get it in writing.

[Lead Balloon]

The personal transportation of the owner of an aircraft is a private operation, even if the pilot is paid handsomely. So, take the owner along (and don't sell seats or space for anyone else's cargo) and you're private.

CAR 1988 2(7)(d)(i).

Good luck getting anything coherent out of CASA.

[djpil]

The regulation for a PPL is "not for hire or reward".which reg is that?

It is worth reading Part 61 to compare the privileges of a PPL with a CPL.
Noting there about a PPL not being paid, nor does it state that a CPL may be paid.

[mostlytossas]

What you describe is a private operation. Have done simular (or had done for me by a LAME) to enable aircraft to be retrieved following mechanical breakdown on a couple of occasions over the years.

[Horatio Leafblower]

The wording of "for hire or reward" disappeared from the CARs nearly 20 years ago

[Aussie Bob]

Blimey ..... :sad:

Giss de keys, I'll take it wherever it has to go. Why ask dumb question?

[Duck Pilot]

CAR 206 might help. From what you have described would be a private operation.

Nothing different in terms of a legal context to a vet flying out to do a job on a sick or injured animal or a mustering pilot hearding cattle to be sold - someone is making money indirectly out of the operation. Shouldn't be a gold plated service IMHO.

If you get anything out of CASA that might answer your question, make sure it's in writing even if it's in the form of a one lined email.

[Runaway Gun]

good luck in getting anything in writing from CASA. My last few attempts at getting information over the telephone, I requested their response in writing. They refused to even supply a one lined email. "We're not allowed," he said to me.

[Car RAMROD]

Ah Runaway, you need to learn this handy trick, works very well if you know their direct email.

"Hi (insert person),

Thank you for your phone conversation earlier today confirming (insert details here)...."


Copy in other recipients too, especially other department email addresses, or their superior. Worked a treat many a time for me :ok:

[Lead Balloon]

With a second sentence: "Please let me know if my understanding of what you said is inaccurate or incomplete and, if so, in what way."