Virgin Pilots

[ManagedNav]

Rumors abound of a possible strike by Virgin Atlantic pilots. Is there any truth to this?

[PlankBoy]

No - there's a vote that will likely result in a period of 'work to rule' meaning the majority will only fly their roster and not volunteer for uncovered flights. Hopefully cooler heads will prevail on all sides before it comes to that.

[ManagedNav]

So, let's say it does come to that; what if a partner airline decides to add extra segments in order to mitigate any loss of block hours flown by Virgin....Would that airline's pilots be inadvertently flying "struck" work or otherwise scabbing?

[Eye off the ball]

I would argue that they would be doing exactly as you suggest. For that reason I'm sure they are unlikely to do it. If they did, it certainly wouldn't be inadvertent.

[jmgthepilot]

This is what the head of the union is saying https://vimeo.com/193526538/2dee49b9a2

[HeartyMeatballs]

Announced here not striking but will 'work to contract'.

[KelvinD]

BBC just announced Virgin pilots to take action "short of strike action" from 23rd December.
What does that mean? Are they going to shout "I am very cross" when boarding their aircraft?

[Alex Whittingham]

BBC News - Virgin Atlantic pilots vote to take action short of strike in union recognition row from 23 December (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38347181)

[MATELO]

Maybe they have been told to hold short......

[Hotel Tango]

No doubt it will mean they will work by the book without extending any (legal) favours to the management. This may well result in some delays and cancellations of flights.

[gbotley]

@KelvinD,

Liking the humour, but it's essentially the Virgin Pilots Union wanting recognition as the sole union of the company. It looks like it's' simply going to mean pilots won't offer favours for the operational management. Most likely refusing to use discretional flying or additional flying days/standby support.

SOURCE:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38347181

[bignose340]

Well done the PPU now don't blink and stand firm...... unlike those clowns at BALPA did a few years ago!

[Astir 511]

Hilarious watching as Unions spend their energy fighting each other rather than the Employer! Splitters

[vctenderness]

Virgin pilots and virgin stewardesses hoping to come together in the new year!

[2Planks]

What's the % split between Virgin BALPA members and PPU members?

[oldchina]

So what are they complaining about ?

[DIBO]

I know, it's all about semantics, but if Virgin pilots and virgin stewardesses have been f**ked up by their management, can we still call them Virgin pilots and virgin stewardesses?

[FL370 Officeboy]

The PPU only exists to go on strike. They were formed by a disaffected bunch that weren't marched out on strike when they were desperate to do so. They HAVE to go on strike otherwise their whole reason for existence becomes irrelevant. It doesn't matter what the issue was, they'd call out a strike regardless.

However, the Company know all the above and will play their cards accordingly. The end result will not be to the greater good of the VS pilots.

What a shame.

[noflynomore]

In my previous company - one that desperately needed such action BALPA made it abundantly clear on numerous occasions over the years that "working to rule", such as turning up on time as opposed to the usual 20 minutes early in order to get a briefing done in the 5 minutes "allowed" or declining to go into discretion was illegal action and contrary to all union rules and agreements and would result in all sorts of personal sanctions.

Apparenetly, they said, if you habitually bend over and show up early (many FOs routinely turned up 30 mins before report time imagining it earned them kudos and always fraudulently declared an imaginary report time - frequently busting min rest) , require as much time as you actually need for a briefing (as opposed to how much the Co. "allows" you) or do discretion as a matter of course then you somehow de-facto agree to this as a normal part of your contract and by withdrawing it you are in breach of contract - despite what is being happily accepted by the company being demonstrably illegal, unsafe or by definition not theirs to expect, yet the flatly refuse to condemn such blatantly illegal procedures.

It's an outrageous abuse of the goodwill/desperation of particularly junior aircrew though this cancer is advancing through the ranks with seniority as airmanship gives way to P2F kowtowing as they are now increasingly taking over the LH seats. Not that my generation was much better at defending ourselves, we just had even less to lose.

[Thad Jarvis]

Action short of strike... management must be quaking in their boots. What next? A very strongly worded letter? :rolleyes:

[back to Boeing]

What not doing those things when you habitually used to do them is ASOS (working to rule) and to protect the workers (as much as the very weak TU law in the uk protects them) you must ballot. Otherwise it is illegal action.

[Twiglet1]

Many many years ago Britannia Pilots had a work to rule, no discretion etc.
Except on XMAS Eve the fog and disruption came in and - all bets off - discretion-a-plenty
Such a long time ago it might have been spun a few times but.....

[Count von Altibar]

I very much doubt this will get them anywhere. At least it's a start though, the company should accept the PPU as the majority voice imho

[2Planks]

Meanwhile I expect the BALPA boys and girls are picking up a bucketful of overtime. Must make for some cross cockpit issues though, which is never a good thing.

[ManagedNav]

The pilots of Delta have been put in a very difficult position. Here is a letter from the Chairman of DALPA:

Dear Fellow Pilot,

Recent news about Virgin Atlantic has raised questions about ALPA’s involvement. The
Virgin Atlantic pilots are represented by the British Air Line Pilots’ Association
(BALPA). There is another entity, the Professional Pilots’ Union (PPU), which is
attempting to represent the Virgin Atlantic pilots. At this time, BALPA is the only
union recognized by Virgin Atlantic as the pilots’ representative.

We learned on Friday that the PPU had concluded a ballot of its members on whether
to engage in an industrial action. Specifically, the PPU is calling for an Action Short of
a Strike (ASOS), similar in nature to a “work to rule” campaign. The ASOS is NOT over
pay, rules, working conditions or job security. The ASOS is over which union will
represent the pilots of Virgin Atlantic. While this is illegal under the Railway Labor
Act, it is legal under British law.

When a union is preparing to enter into an industrial action that involves the
withholding of services, labor protocol is for that union to reach out to other unions
that have an interest to advise of upcoming action. Sometimes a union will ask other
unions to refrain from performing “struck work.” A union may also request that other
unions not to honor their strike because they believe this will inflict more harm on
their company as the customers’ money goes to another company.

While the Delta MEC has a relationship with the unions of all of our codeshare or joint
venture partners and attempts to coordinate labor strategies, the PPU has never
made any contact with the Delta MEC during their campaign to replace BALPA. In an
attempt to check every side of the story, I personally reached out to the PPU (the
unrecognized union) and made clear our legal situation and encouraged them to
communicate with us in a timely manner. It was difficult to make contact: only after I
made several attempts to call their leadership, with no calls in return, did I speak to
their leadership. The PPU’s inexplicable failure to initiate any contact with Delta MEC
as they prepare to enter a potential industrial action undermines their credibility and
ability to generate support for their cause. The Delta MEC also asked BALPA (the
recognized union) if it intended to participate in this work to rule campaign. In
response to our query, BALPA replied that it has instructed Virgin Atlantic pilots to fly
as normal including overtime.

All of this begs the question of whether we should be taking (or refusing to take) some
action in support of the PPU. Our contract permits us to lawfully refrain from flying
extra sections or adding extra frequencies if there is a lawful strike at one of our
codeshare partners. This is not a strike. The PPU can legally call for a strike, but
chose to call for an ASOS. Again, other pilots at Virgin Atlantic may fly overtime
during the ASOS and according my conversation with the PPU, this is not being
considered struck work.

In response to the PPU’s ASOS, Delta management informed ALPA that they intend to
add extra sections to London Heathrow. In accordance with our contract and after
conferring with the Delta MEC and the ALPA President’s office, ALPA will not object
to Delta adding those extra sections. Again, this is not a dispute over the betterment
of a pilot groups’ contract, it is an internal dispute over who will represent the Virgin
Atlantic pilots. If one of the unions representing the Virgin Atlantic pilots were to call
for an actual, legal strike, the Delta MEC would come into session and respond
appropriately.


Fraternally,

Captain John Malone
Delta MEC Chairman

I would really like to hear from Virgin Atlantic pilots as to their thoughts on the posted letter from the leader of Delta ALPA.......

[McNugget]

It's an internal scuffle involving a non-recognised union and management. It has nothing to do with DL or DALPA at this stage.

Any involvement from DALPA would be in the event of a strike, regardless of the status of PPU recognition.

Their contracts stipulate, quite distinctly, "struck work".

[ManagedNav]

I agree with you McNugget.

The problem is, there are some Delta pilots going around screaming that any Delta pilot picking up these extra sections should be labeled as scabs. Most of this comes from the supporters of DPA, the Delta version of PPU.

[ManagedNav]

So, does this mean they have not, and will not engage in the threatened "Work To Rule"?

[Akrapovic]

But it appears to be having little or no effect as most Virgin Pilots are not partaking

PPU is by far and away the majority union, so your assumption is wrong!

[Shaman]

How's the industrial action going chaps?