CPL/IR in States?

[J-Heller]

Since the new change in conversion of foreign IR's, what are the benefits (and drawbacks) of taking this route over doing the training in the UK?

At the moment I am thinking of the money saving, with the possible drawback that the UK airspace and procedures are slightly different...

How much money would I be likely to save (esp on the IR)?

Would future employers look down on this route to a licence?

Also, I have heard of some people going to the US, doing their FAA licences and then instructing for a while, before returning home to convert. What VISA schemes will allow that, which schools and can you still do that?!

Right thats enough questions for now.

Thanks for your help,


JH.

[The Greaser]

J

There is a huge money saving potential to this route, an FAA IR will cost you $5000 or less and then the conversion back here if you are proficient should be no more than £2000-3000. Previously I had to spend £12000 on my JAA I/R even though I had an FAA IR and 1500 hours and was proficient.

With regards to instructing in the states, look for schools that offer the J-1 exchange visa. I don't know what the current situation is re the likelihood of getting one of these, but if you can then the opportunities it gives you are excellent.

A J-1 lasts for 2 years and allows you to instruct during that time. I went to the US in '99, did my CPL/IR and CFI, instructed for 2 years and then returned with 1500 hours and 500 ME. The conversion took 8 months but should now be easier.

Good Luck

[J-Heller]

Thanks Greaser,

Just in the middle of my ATPL's right now (no exams sat yet though)...

Would you suggest completing the ATPL's then going out to the US on a J1 visa, before returning within the 36 months to convert?

Cheers,

JH

[The Greaser]

J

Depends how many hours you have now, I'm assuming you have a UK PPL with a hundred and something hours?

You could stay here, hour build, do the full CPL and IR course at the cost of about 20000 pounds and end up in 6 months with fATPL with 200 hours and no chance of a job.

If you go to the States on a J-1 then you will have do the IR, build 250 hours then do the CPL test and then CFI. Probably take 4-6 months and cost 20000 dollars, instruct for 18 months and return here with 1500 hours. Conversion then will cost with MCC about 8000 pounds in my estimation. Money wise not alot in it but you will be alot more employable and what likelihood have you got in this country for a couple of years anyway?

[Freak On A Leash]

If you`re already in the middle of the ATPLs you should go ahead and do the exams - might as well get them out of the way.
Doing the commercial/instrument/multiengine in the US is WAY cheaper than anywhere in Europe - not to mention quicker.
Assuming you have a European (UK?) PPL you should have no problem obtaining a J-1 visa (valid for 2 yrs. and you are permitted to instruct as well), but if you have more than a PPL there are some restrictions with regards to visas.If I`m not mistaken you will not be able to get the J-1 with more than a PPL (because this license is directly converted to the respective FAA one), but can still do training in the US, albeit with an F-1 or M-1 visa.The main difference is that with a J-1 you can instruct and with the others you cannot.
Try getting in touch with North American Institute of Aviation www.naiasc.com
They can get you a J-1 and their courses are extremely quick (good weather, eager instructors and so on...)
Hope that helps!:)

[J-Heller]

Thankyou Greaser,

I have 145 ish hours at the moment, and am about 3 months into my ATPL studies. Up until now I have been set for getting the ATPL's done, then CPL, then FI(R) and working for a while at instructing before getting the IR done within the three years...

"However"

Along comes this ruling on foreign IR's and I remember all of the stuff people had written about going over Stateside and doing these J1 Visa Internships, coming back with 1500 hours and useful multi hours....

Even without that, it still looks very appealing to go over to the states to do an instrument rating to add to my ICAO PPL out of an interest in my basic airmanship / safety.

What would the knowledge/licensing (note the US Spelling :))requirements be to obtain an FAA IR even though I have a Non FAA PPL?

Anything wrong with doing this?

To sum up I am suggesting:

Going to US with my PPL, obtaining an FAA IR,
Completing JAA ATPL's
Completing JAA CPL in UK
Converting the FAAIR to JAAIR within UK

Hopefully resulting in fATPL.

Thanks for your help so far,



JH

[The Greaser]

You could do this as well for sure.

Requirement for grant of US IR is :

1. Pass written exam (could do this with a week or so of hard study)

2. Have 50 hours cross-country time (must be greater than 50nm legs) and include a 250nm cross country on airways with 3 different types of approach.

3. 40 hours of dual training, simulated or actual instrument time.

So yes, you could just go over and do the IR, for about 5000 dollars and 4-6 weeks of time.

The basic IR is normally done in a single - I dont know if the same 'conversion' rules then apply because a Uk full IR has to be completed in a twin. You could however get a twin IR rating in the states for about an extra 1500 dollars and less than a weeks worth of time.

Let me know if you need more details.

Good luck

[J-Heller]

Freak on Leash,

Thanks for your post. I am just wondering about the J1 Visa availability....Where do I stand with an ICAO PPL and 145 hours...Would I qualify for the J1 or do you have any sources of information you can direct me to?

Many thanks



JH

[The Greaser]

J

You definitely would qualify for a J-1. Those already with commercial licenses would not.

[J-Heller]

And...Greaser,

Thanks for your help tonight - I'm keeping you busy!

Well I am going to be researching doing an FAA IR and would like to begin by taking you up on your offer of more advice.

Please either email me direct, or just post it here on the thread.

A few things in my mind....I am working fairly hard on the ATPL's at present, but they are Distance Learning, so are self paced....

Would you say doing the FAA IR together with the Distance ATPL would be a bit too much..?

And Which schools in the US would you recommend for getting the FAA IR?

Cheers,


JH

[The Greaser]

I would definitely advise continuing and completing the ATPL's first before commencing the IR.

I'll email you with details of US flight schools.

[gus_honeybun]

Greaser,

You couldn't forward a copy of that email to me aswell. I'm in exactly the same position as J-H is and any info at the moment is greatly appreciated.

forewarned is forearmed and all that.

ta muchly

[gorky]

you qualify for a J1 visa if you spend around 20000$.
and J1 visa is NOT a "work visa".You can be paid by your school for 1/4 of your time training.Means 18 months study and 6 months fly as a cfi.
well, guys the FAA is the way ahead.JAA is exprensive and doesnt give you a real pilot experience.JAA frozen 200h is a joke in front of a JAA/FAA ATP 1500h TT, 500 multi, 300 turbine,...
For the same price, the FAA/JAA is the futur of our airline pilots.

[J-Heller]

Ronchonned after just 7 posts!

Please someone else contribute and don't let that be the way the thread ends ;)

Cheers,


JH

[Grivation]

J-Heller,

I wrote this somewhere else not so long ago but probably worth repeating. Take this from someone who has been involved with recruiting -

Companies will be on the lookout for people attempting to 'shortcut ' the JAA system. The conversion process is designed for professional pilots who for one reason or another find themselves working in a foreign land (I'm one!)

If you are thinking of heading to the US to instruct for a while then I can't see any problems with coming back to JAA land with 1500 hours or so and then converting. As long as you have used your licences 'in anger' you are effectively completing a bona-fide conversion process.

For the bods who think an FAA IR followed by a 15 hour conversion is a good way to save money - BEWARE!! you will be asked to justify your actions at an interview!

[J-Heller]

Thanks for that, Grivation:

Exactly what I was looking for someone to post. It makes sense too.

(I wonder if PiperPilot might have something to say on this ;) )


Cheers,


JH

[BEagle]

Of course there is also a way of obtaining a JAR-FCL ATPL(A) by just obtaining a Class 1 medical, flying an IR and passing just JAA Air Law at ATPL level!


But you'd have to be a military aeroplane pilot with 2000 TT, of which 1500 must be on an approved Multi Pilot aeroplane (e.g C130, VC10, TriStar etc etc) and of which 1000 must be as P1C of the approved Multi Pilot aeroplane.......

[clear prop!!!]

Just to add a slightly different spin on this,…

Does anyone know what the current situation is with regard to teaching JAA in the States.

Obviously JAA instructors must be in demand if it is a requirement that non member States use JAA instructors.

Must you have an FAA CPL/IR and FI rating even if you teach only JAA students? I can understand the CPL/IR bit, but is the FI a requirement?

Another way of cutting down the cost (short term), of your IR could be to do a single IR and upgrade later. This would protect your ATPL exams beyond the 36 month deadline.
…that’s assuming I’ve read things correctly

Perhaps, a good option for those who don’t see the job market improving, or wish to instruct for a while.