FAA CFI and future plans

[georgebramb1]

Hello everyone here a Commercial Pilot asking for opinions and experiences,I recently got my FAA CPL SE and ME with IR in Florida,just got back to Italy for a vacation with the family my plan now would be this:

Pelican Flight training situated in Miami Florida would provide me training as a CFI (plus CFII and MEI) price listed around 21k:rolleyes:...then hire me as a flight instructor (with a F1 visa) for 1 to 2 years maximum:),that would lead me to gain my 1500 hours of experience and be more likely to be chosen by airlines around the world:D,and alsomy plan is not really to go back to Europe (would love to work in asia or middle east if possible) since i have heard my EU fellas are straggling with wages (ridiculous wages of 1000$ a month clear slavery) after spending 150k+ on a B737 Type and etc. then convert maybe into a Easa licence...or directly get an ATP from the FAA since i already have US licenses..

what would you guys do? would you spend some more extra money on a CFI++ training and build hours starting from the bottom as flight instructor with my FAA licenses or stay in europe convert all my licenses into EASA (also a pain since have to pass the 14 exams of the atpl and convert all of my licenses and ratings) and then try to get into the aviation business here in europe (really low at the moment from what i have seen) PRO and CONS? anybody with similar experience? every opinion is gold thank you guys! :ok:

[chitolin]

1500 Hours will land you a job at any regional in the US. Question is:
Will you have a right to work in the US? if not, get your ratings at a place that you can work at.

[georgebramb1]

I ll have a work permit valid for 2 years only then i will have to go somewhere else i was thinking about asia to build some time

[spaflyer]

I was offered the same, however some people commented me it was illegal, so I've asked SEVIS and the answer is quite straight forward:

Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 4:04 PM
To: SEVP
Subject: VISA F1 for Flight Instructor Courses
Hello!

I've been offered an opportunity to proceed with my CFI (I and II) and CFI ME courses and after complition stay some time for OPT with an F1 visa given by a flight school on Florida, however I've also receive some feed back from other sources that this is not legal if you do not complete also basic training (PPL,CPL, IFR) wich I already done in the past in USA with my F1 VISA, can you confirm if I can proceed?

Best regards.


Answer:

Good afternoon.

Thank you for your inquiry. If you would like to attend a flight school, you will need to file an I-539 to change your visa status to M-1 with USCIS. An F-1 student cannot attend a flight school.

If you have additional questions or concerns, please contact the SEVP Response Center

Kind regards,

SEVP Response Center
Student and Exchange Visitor Program
US Immigration and Customs Enforcement
500 12th St. SW STOP 5600
Washington DC 20536-5600
Phone: 703-603-3400 (tel:703-603-3400)
Toll-Free: 800-892-4829 (tel:800-892-4829)

[georgebramb1]

@spaflyer
Thank you for your response,but that's not always true I have met people who did it and now are working as Cfi if you attend Cfi cfii and Cfi mei you can be granted a F1 I believe because it's more than 25% of the whole training (PPL IR CPL ME => CFI CFII CFIMEI) if you just ask for cfi training they will not give it to you but if you do all the others yes

[georgebramb1]

And btw did you try at pelican?

[spaflyer]

georgebramb1 (http://www.pprune.org/members/461931-georgebramb1), It's not my opinion, is SEVIS one! Is people doing it? yes, same as there's people working illegally in USA and they might do it for years without been unnoticed.

You can get a F1 if you are a full time student at an Academic Center, for example Embry Riddle, and you do a Degree in Aviation and this includes as part of the training a pilot license. Same with an Integrated course, but if you ALREADY have even a PPL, then is not any more an integrated course.

Is up to you if you want to run the risk of been catch, deported and banned to get in the USA for 10 years.

[Valmont]

Just go back to Europe and convert those licences and look for a job !
1500h of Flight Instruction won't do you any good to find a job at airlines around the world. Besides the US...

And It's coming from an EU National, with an FAA ATP and no EASA ATPL. I'm currently flying an A330 abroad (outside EU).

[pponte]

Hi all,

is there any update on the legality of this f1 private to cfi/cfii/mei programme?

I've been told that because you'd be enroled in a full training you could get an F1 visa. Even if you already hold an FAA CPL. As a comparison, no one prevents you from going to multiple classes at different universities, although you would not get have the need to do your final exam again as you already hold the degree, does this sound plausible?

Also, looking at work prospects, what would be the advantage, if any, or chances of getting another type of visa without having to marry a us chic?

I don't see how spending another 20k on cfi training would get me access to US regionals or any other airline in the world. Would anyone have a different view on this as I'm trying to move forward with my career, with a CPL ME FAA licence atm.

Thanks guys

[peekay4]

The SEVP Response Center answer above that F-1 students cannot attend a flight school is incomplete.

Full-time, accredited Professional Pilot Programs at some schools are indeed eligible for F-1 visa issuance.

Some of these programs will accept "transfer credits" or equivalent, which may include previously obtained certificates/ratings (e.g., a PPL, at their discretion). There are probably some accreditation rules which state that a minimum of x% of the required training time must be completed as part of the program.

So is it legal?

Depends. If you were accepted & enrolled into one of the approved, full-time Professional Pilot programs mentioned above, then it's perfectly legal. You may be issued an F-1 visa and may be eligible for the F-1 CPT and OPT work permits.

If you intend to just take a some CFI courses at a flight school without pursuing an approved Professional Pilot course, then it's not legal. You must attend under an M-1 visa, and may only be eligible for limited OPT.

My 2 cents.

[pponte]

Thanks @peekay4, that's what I though also and it makes sense..

Any idea of what to do next after that training? I'm I'm not able to secure a work permit, that's just a waste of money as piston experience won't do much abroad.
I'm not even considering Europe also as it is expensive, loads of pilots available and just a bunch of jobs for selected boys.
Does anyone has experience or information about moving from an F1 to a regional?

Many thanks

[B2N2]

that's just a waste of money as piston experience won't do much abroad

And that's a bit of an ignorant statement really.
There is no substitute for experience and if you want to work as a professional pilot..well you need to work as a pilot flying whatever you need to fly in order to gain experience.
Do not underestimate the value of instructional hours.

And you cannot work for a Regional with an F1 visa.
There are only 2-3 visas that lead to the issuance of a green card and the F1 is not one of them.

[pponte]

And you cannot work for a Regional with an F1 visa.

Thanks for your information.
I've been told of people working for regionals on F1 OPT.
There are a few that only ask for work permit and don't require a green card.

Not sure if you are aware of any other limitations?

Thanks

[Transsonic2000]

Quote:
Originally Posted by B2N2 http://www.pprune.org/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.pprune.org/north-america/586223-faa-cfi-future-plans.html#post9695488)

And you cannot work for a Regional with an F1 visa.Thanks for your information.
I've been told of people working for regionals on F1 OPT.
There are a few that only ask for work permit and don't require a green card.

Not sure if you are aware of any other limitations?Well, I'd be really careful with that in light of the new Trump administration! To my knowledge if you get caught working illegally in the States, besides being kicked out of the country immediately, you're banned for lifetime not only for 10 years (which was mentioned above post #7).

I agree with the statement of "B2N2" that one can't work for a US Regional with an F1 visa. As a non US-citizen being issued the respective visa to work as a CFI (flight instructor) you can only work as such and only for the respective flight school.

My advise to the starter of this thread would be (even though it's from October of last year, but it might be useful to other readers), for a EU citizen I'd say instead of spending your money on an FAA CFI (which is certainly a great experience, but unfortunately useless here in Europe) I'd rather spend it on doing the conversion and get the EASA frozen ATP, since that's where you stand the best chances of getting hired as a rookie pilot.

Regarding the pilot jobs abroad (middle and far east) they're usually looking for highly experienced pilots with a couple of thousand hours on commercial airplanes like Boeing or Airbus, they aren't looking for rookie pilots, and if so they usually give preference to their own fellow countryman - like any other country does (in case of the thread starter this would be Italy/EU).

[Thales Coelho]

A school in Oregon is offering F1 visas for brazilian CFIs.

The propose is that a holder of a Flight Instructor License issued by Brazilian CAA (ANAC) would go to the US, convert his/her license to CPL, do the CFI and start the OPT, working at least the first year as CFI at the school.

The second year of OPT is open, so you can continue at the school or change job. They advertise with the history of some 3 guys who trained with them and flew the CRJ for some months during the second year of OPT.

That experience wold be of great value here in Brazil, where Azul sometimes hires FO with as low as 150h TT to fly brand new ATR 72 or Embraer E-190/195 and Avianca Brazil sets its minimum at 500h TT for the A320 family. As well it can open the doors at Copa Airlines of Panama, who asks 1000h TT of anything with wings and an engine to fly the B737NG across the continent.

My question is, is it true? Is really possible that one with pilot license (foreing) can do this process and work for two years, under the F1 visa?

[peekay4]

My question is, is it true? Is really possible that one with pilot license (foreing) can do this process and work for two years, under the F1 visa?

Yes and no.

It's not possible to get a 2-year OPT on a CFI course. An OPT period is only 1 year, unless pursuing a full academic degree (Bachelor's, Masters, etc.) in STEM -- Science, Technology, Mathematics.

What they're probably talking about is a 11 month CPT (as part of the course) plus a 1-year OPT after graduation.

US regionals require at least 1,000 hours (with a suitable bachelor's degree). No US airline will hire you on an OPT to fly a CRJ "for a few months". There must be more to the story there.

[pponte]

I agree with the statement of "B2N2" that one can't work for a US Regional with an F1 visa. As a non US-citizen being issued the respective visa to work as a CFI (flight instructor) you can only work as such and only for the respective flight school.

This is absolutelly not true. You can work on campus for up to one year, then be issued a cpt for up to 11 months which allows you to work at the school or for another school and thereafter an opt where you can work wherever, charter part 135 or regionals.

US regionals require at least 1,000 hours (with a suitable bachelor's degree). No US airline will hire you on an OPT to fly a CRJ "for a few months". There must be more to the story there.

It's not the regionals that require this. This is mandated by the FAA.
It's important that people don't get misinformed in this forum.

There are different regionals that require a green card, others only that you are entitled to work in the US. Donmt forget about charter operation companies under part 135.
You can work with an opt for any of these.
There have been cases of regionals sponsoring pilots after the opt expires.
This however is hear-say and one should not rely on this is if they depend on the jet experience to move forward.

Regarding the pilot jobs abroad (middle and far east) they're usually looking for highly experienced pilots with a couple of thousand hours on commercial airplanes like Boeing or Airbus, they aren't looking for rookie pilots, and if so they usually give preference to their own fellow countryman - like any other country does (in case of the thread starter this would be Italy/EU).

True but not the full story.
As you mentioned, they usually give preference to nationals and more experienced pilots. However they have twin turboprop planes also and cadet programmes and second officer direct entries.
Some accept from 400+TT. Susiair even accepts 250+ and they hire frequently.

The secret in aviation is to not stop flying otherwise you only have a very expensive piece of paper stowed away without any proficiency or currency when you get the call.
Will a 1500h pilot current single piston have more chances than a 250h fresh graduate who haven't flown for a year? I'll leave you guys to answer that but I know who they'd pick. Will it beat the jet requirement time? Hell no but not all companies ask for jet time.


This is just my 5 cents..as I'm struggling with similar decisions at the moment, US and Canada seem like a good option, converting to EASA also but all options have pros and cons.
There are plenty of people with a licence in Europe for the limited number of jobs so if you don't have any reference, your chances are dimm..

[mines_a_coffee]

As a crusty, early retired EASA ATPL & FAA ATP holder, I'm needing to do a CFI & CFII rating.

Any recommendations on which school to go for with a balance of good instruction/cost?

[Check 6]

Consider Canada - see this thread (http://www.pprune.org/fragrant-harbour/593793-more-pilot-shortage-articles.html#post9750427).

[bafanguy]

As a crusty, early retired EASA ATPL & FAA ATP holder, I'm needing to do a CFI & CFII rating.

mines,

You mention two regulatory regimes. Under which would you be "exercising the privileges of..." ?

[mines_a_coffee]

mines,

You mention two regulatory regimes. Under which would you be "exercising the privileges of..." ?

FAA, hence my searching for CFI/II course. There seem to be many around, I didnt want to take pot luck so hopefully some recommendations will come my way!

[bafanguy]

mines,

Wish I could be of some help but I know almost nothing about the CFI thing. Sounds like you've got a plan in mind. However, I might suggest a more US-centric website for advice. jetcareers.com forum (free sign up) is a relatively civilized place where lots of people appear to be familiar with instructing. Best wishes on your retirement.

[172_driver]

What none has talked about yet is the stick & rudder and instrument flying proficiency which is gained only through practice. That's an argument for going the CFI, CFII and MEI route. It will prepare you well for future airline interviews. It did so for me.

[pponte]

So a month ago I went to pelican, thinking it's going to be great, but I wasn't! I was tricked and lied to from the beginning, first they told me they hire every student as an instructor then once i went to the they said we only hire the good ones! They have 14 instructor and not enough students!

Only 3 aircrafts in the fleet!!

I paid them a month rent and a house deposit, once I told them on Friday I'll be leaving on Tuesday they told me to leave their school accommodation or else they'll call the police!

If someone on social media contacts you called Viktor don't thrust him, he'll be super nice to you on WhatsApp but in person he threats you like a dog!

Thank you so much for your feedback and insight about this school.
I was also almost tricked into joining them bit then started asking the difficult questions and the fleet was one of them...
Viktor seemed noce initially but if you ask him details he'll be rude even via email or whatsapp so I can only imagine that being worse in person once you've handed over the money.

Who runs the school after all? Do rate them on google and facebook, we need to use social media to rate these guys so that others are warned about them.

Thanks

[mines_a_coffee]

Thank you so much for your feedback and insight about this school.
I was also almost tricked into joining them bit then started asking the difficult questions and the fleet was one of them...
Viktor seemed nice initially but if you ask him details he'll be rude even via email or whatsapp so I can only imagine that being worse in person once you've handed over the money.

Who runs the school after all? Do rate them on google and facebook, we need to use social media to rate these guys so that others are warned about them.

Thanks

Agree with the above! I thought he was just having a bad day when he sent snotty messages via WhatsApp.

Aw well, the search for a decent school continues.....

[Marty33]

Just marry a nice American girl and Bobs Your Uncle.

[pponte]

Just marry a nice American girl and Bobs Your Uncle.

Would have to convert to islam to be allowed a second wife, which doesn't play well with the current setting and administration but thanks for the suggestion.

[crazydumb_pilot]

Hi Chitolin,

Are you guys contracting at la Costeña in order to fly the Caravan ?
Muchas gracias !1500 Hours will land you a job at any regional in the US. Question is:
Will you have a right to work in the US? if not, get your ratings at a place that you can work at.

[crazydumb_pilot]

Hi,

I was considering going to Pelican but IDK. A lot of people told me to don't go and EVERYONE are talking about this famous Victor. It's hard to find good messages about the school and what I'm afraid is to pay in advance the course. That's sound weird since you don't really manage your money. So guys, why did you chose to leave Pelican ? Because of the money or because the school management ? After all of this i'm considering to go to Hillsboro. Might be a good choice ?

Happy Landings,

[flyingcrankshaft]

Hi,

I was considering going to Pelican but IDK. A lot of people told me to don't go and EVERYONE are talking about this famous Victor. It's hard to find good messages about the school and what I'm afraid is to pay in advance the course. That's sound weird since you don't really manage your money. So guys, why did you chose to leave Pelican ? Because of the money or because the school management ? After all of this i'm considering to go to Hillsboro. Might be a good choice ?

Happy Landings,

Hello,

Curious to know which school you went attended? I am currently looking at both of these school for their CFI program.

[motorcitycobra]

can you guys share info about OPT on an M1 visa?

[Gomrath]

can you guys share info about OPT on an M1 visa?
Have you actually searched the USCIS website? All the information is fully documented there as to the requirements.
OPT is limited to a maximum of 6 months after completion of a full time purse of study. It is also only available if it isn't available in the student's own country.

[Gomrath]

can you guys share info about OPT on an M1 visa?
Have you actually searched the USCIS website? All the information is fully documented there as to the requirements.
OPT is limited to a maximum of 6 months after completion of a full time co​​​urse of study. It is also only available if it isn't available in the student's own country.