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View Full Version : HMRC Dear Customer we owe you . . .


Loose rivets
27th Sep 2016, 20:19
A MSG on t'phone while one was out hoofing along the cliff-tops.

At this moment we owe you a refund of 482 GBP, tax for the past two years. Please visit http://on (all one word) line-refund-services.co.uk

Ooooo, Goooody! I need that right now. But Customer? Was I ever a customer of HMRC? And does one pay TAX to HMRC?

Nervous SLF
27th Sep 2016, 20:23
Be very careful it could be a scam, I would suggest that you phone the main number for HMRC before you go to that website.

HMRC is the newish name for the Tax gatherers was Inland Revenue I think.

denachtenmai
27th Sep 2016, 20:25
In the same vein, my wife has a refund of 82 odd waiting for her attention on a website, from the TV license people, with the proviso that any attempt of misleading info will be criminally pursued:uhoh:

Seldomfitforpurpose
27th Sep 2016, 20:26
A MSG on t'phone while one was out hoofing along the cliff-tops.


Ooooo, Goooody! I need that right now. But Customer? Was I ever a customer of HMRC? And does one pay TAX to HMRC?

Do they notify in that manner? My unexpected tax refund this year came as usual through my post box in the standard brown envelope.

I have heard quite a few stories about dodgy emails/text messages/phone calls asking for details a genuine tax officer would not ask for.

G-CPTN
27th Sep 2016, 20:59
It's a scam.

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/phones/2016/06/warning-fake-hmrc-calls-on-the-rise---what-to-do-if-youve-been-targeted

rusty sparrow
27th Sep 2016, 21:26
That's a scam - those bastards wouldn't make life easy by offering a tax rebate.

For current info on HMRC, the best site is this (http://hmrcisshite.********.co.uk/)

Hydromet
27th Sep 2016, 22:04
Same version of that scam and many others also doing the rounds here in the antipodes.

Had one yesterday on the answering machine, heavy accent stating that I or my lawyer must ring my local policedepartment (they never call themselves that, it would be the police station if anything) on 02 8310 7734, which looks like a local number. Gurgled the number and there are numerous reports of various scams linked to it. I understand that somehow it is routed to an offshore number.

radeng
27th Sep 2016, 22:43
I had the usual brown envelope through the post telling me that I had overpaid tax for last year by the enormous sum of 2.23. It didn't say what they were going to do about it - presumably adjust next year's tax code.

The interesting thing is that they tell me that they aren't going to want a tax return next year. Which means that IF I overpay, they keep it. IF I underpay, they can come down on me for not declaring it and charge a penalty...Deliberate attempt at extortion I call it.....So I'll ask for a tax return, and send it in - on paper

Mike6567
28th Sep 2016, 15:07
I do my and my wife's Tax Return still by post. This year both done by the end of July. For various reasons this year my wife's was a refund of just over 20.00 (well it is enough for a bottle of scotch).

At the beginning of September she had a letter from HM Revenue & Customs saying she had paid too much tax of over 700.00 and to go on line to claim the refund. As we have never had anything to do with HMRC online we decided it must be a scam.

I telephoned her HMRC office and ,while waiting, noticed that the previous tax year she had a refund of the same over 700.00 figure. Sure enough the tax man on checking realised and confirmed it was all a mistake and not a scam!

oldchina
28th Sep 2016, 16:56
The advice of HMRC (and probably others) is if you need to use internet to dialogue with them please enter via the site's home page.
Do not click on external links.

Tankertrashnav
28th Sep 2016, 17:24
Mrs TTN has just been told in a letter from HMRC that she owes them 141.63, as explained in the P600 tax calculator which they recently sent her (which she never received).

I rather fear this isn't a scam, but as my accountant told me that HMRC is now staffed entirely by novice accountants who haven't a clue about the systems they are supposed to be operating, she wont be paying up until she receives an the explanation she has requested, which I guess wont be any time soon.

I thought it was well known that HMRC never phone or email their "customers", but always write, so the OP's phone call is definitely a scam.

Democritus
28th Sep 2016, 17:44
...........The interesting thing is that they tell me that they aren't going to want a tax return next year. Which means that IF I overpay, they keep it. IF I underpay, they can come down on me for not declaring it and charge a penalty...Deliberate attempt at extortion I call it.....So I'll ask for a tax return, and send it in - on paper

I got the same letter a few days ago - SA251(pen) - version HMRC 01/15, saying that "We have noticed the only reason you fill in a tax return is to claim a repayment of tax on your bank and/or building society interest. For this reason we are taking you out of Self Assessment because if we continue to send you tax returns and you don't send them back on time we would charge you a penalty."

Eh? They required me to fill in the Return and I've always sent them back on time as they always owe me money because I claim Gift Aid relief every year for varying amounts.

Then they say: "you may be able to have your interest paid tax free. If this applies to you fill in form R85, 'Getting your interest without tax taken off' and give it to your bank or building society."

Don't they realise what the changes were in relation to bank/building society interest being paid tax free with effect from April 2016!! No wonder Joe Public gets confused about tax when HMRC can't even send out a letter with the correct information on it. I rang HMRC to complain about the out of date information in the letter - a waste of time, I would have got more sense out of a brick wall.

VP959
28th Sep 2016, 18:02
I've had the same run-around from HMRC; they decided to take me out of self-assessment for the same reason, and I had to force them to put me back on it. The bottom line is that if you fill in and send a self-assessment return on time, they are obliged to handle it, no matter what BS they may spout. For the past three years this is what I've been doing, just to get wrongly paid tax back.

The odd thing is that the different parts of HMRC are completely different to deal with. I've been dealing with the VAT part recently and they are very helpful on the phone and respond quickly to every request I've made. The income tax part of HMRC is a whole different ball game, my experience has been that they are a bunch of numpties that don't know their arse from the elbow.

Gertrude the Wombat
28th Sep 2016, 18:18
The odd thing is that the different parts of HMRC are completely different to deal with. I've been dealing with the VAT part recently and they are very helpful on the phone and respond quickly to every request I've made. The income tax part of HMRC is a whole different ball game, my experience has been that they are a bunch of numpties that don't know their arse from the elbow.
The VAT people being competent is something I've experienced for decades.


We did once have an interesting income tax experience. We were invited to a meeting with a local tax inspector (in the evening, to suit us).


She: "Looks like you've underpaid about a grand"
Us: "?"
She: explains all the details, and she's right
Me: just about to ask "well, can we have a few years to pay then?" but I don't get a chance to open my mouth:
She: "But as you gave us all the correct info, and it was our cockup, I've looked into the rules for us letting you off this tax. It turns out that you're too rich for this rule to apply, so under the rules you have to pay us. However I personally think this is somewhat unreasonable, so I'm going to let you off anyway, and worry about arguing with my boss in the morning."


Quickest and easier grand I've ever made.

Saintsman
28th Sep 2016, 18:48
On a similar vein, one of my wife's friends had a call from 'Norton' saying her computer was infected by trojans. She's paid them 169 to cleanse it.

I've told her that she is being scammed but she is convinced that she spoke to Norton 'because she got the number from the web site and called them', but I know that they were still on the line waiting for the call...

She has called her bank on my insistence to check that it's still secure, which fortunately it is.

I doubt she's heard the last of it though.

gemma10
28th Sep 2016, 19:08
LR, It is a scam, have a detailed look at the spelling and grammar. I`ve had it several times. Pshishing scam. HMRC do not send out these notificaions.

just noticed it was not via email. tut tut must try harder

Loose rivets
28th Sep 2016, 21:05
Yes, one has become resigned to the ethereal nature of my windfall. :{

Democritus
28th Sep 2016, 22:05
........The odd thing is that the different parts of HMRC are completely different to deal with..........

My wife is the treasurer of a charity and has been trying for at least a couple of months to register online to put in a Gift Aid claim which is due to the charity. When multiple attempts at this failed she made multiple phone calls to them - most of them being unanswered - and finally gave up being given the run around on the phone and wrote a letter to them three weeks ago. Someone phoned from that department of HMRC ten days ago but we were out. They said they would phone back. Nothing heard since, no more phone calls and no reply to her letter.:ugh:

Previous to this when she became treasurer she had to give details of two charity members who were known to HMRC. She did but they were found to be unacceptable as HMRC said they were not known to them. When she protested that they were both taxpayers and therefore must be known to them as she had given HMRC their National Insurance numbers they said "aha - we're the charity arm of HMRC, we don't talk to the income tax arm so your referees are not known to us.":ugh::ugh:

chevvron
29th Sep 2016, 17:47
I do my and my wife's Tax Return still by post. This year both done by the end of July. For various reasons this year my wife's was a refund of just over 20.00 (well it is enough for a bottle of scotch).


Me too.
About last March, I got a letter from them telling me I had underpaid by 762 and they would adjust my 16/17 tax code to pay for it.
I didn't want that so insisted I pay them in full by cheque. They reluctantly issued me with a form and I sent them the cheque.
Last week I receive a letter saying I have now overpaid by 512 and if I wanted the refund quickly I should go on-line.
I refuse to go on line because it's obviously not secure.
By the way, I've also had a coupe of e-mails saying I'm entitled to a refund and I forwarded both to WEB Enforcement as for a start, they both appeared in my SPAM folder and secondly I was already corresponding with HMRC for the above matter.

ricardian
29th Sep 2016, 19:54
Not HMRC but similar difficulties. A few years ago I was the treasurer of a small Anglican parish in North Yorkshire. I tried to persuade the finance people at the diocesan HQ that it was not a good idea to provide monthly statements that ran from the first day of the month to the first day of the next month because the amount carried forwards never matched the amount brought forwards. I even tried comparing with bank statements that ran from the first day of the month to the last day of the month - but to no avail. "We've always done it this way and nobody has complained before"
So I did what everybody else did and ran my own spreadsheet for parish finances

radeng
29th Sep 2016, 20:04
A member of my Probus Club is a retired Tax Inspector, as is a member of the local Age Concern Committee. Both would disagree that HMRC is now staffed by numpties, as they say this overestimates the intelligence and competence of present day HMRC staff!

To get through to HMRC on the telephone, call at 0801 in the morning.....

Democritus
24th Jul 2017, 21:21
I got the same letter a few days ago - SA251(pen) - version HMRC 01/15, saying that "We have noticed the only reason you fill in a tax return is to claim a repayment of tax on your bank and/or building society interest. For this reason we are taking you out of Self Assessment because if we continue to send you tax returns and you don't send them back on time we would charge you a penalty."

Eh? They required me to fill in the Return and I've always sent them back on time as they always owe me money because I claim Gift Aid relief every year for varying amounts.

Then they say: "you may be able to have your interest paid tax free. If this applies to you fill in form R85, 'Getting your interest without tax taken off' and give it to your bank or building society."

Don't they realise what the changes were in relation to bank/building society interest being paid tax free with effect from April 2016!! No wonder Joe Public gets confused about tax when HMRC can't even send out a letter with the correct information on it. I rang HMRC to complain about the out of date information in the letter - a waste of time, I would have got more sense out of a brick wall.

Opening this saga up again, I knew HMRC taking me out of Self Assessment and not requiring a Tax Return would end in tears! HMRC have just sent me a P800 Tax Calculation for 2016-17. Almost none of it is correct - all they got right was my private pension and the combined tax paid on it and my State pension. They got my State pension wrong, my savings income is incorrect....and they have taxed me on it which is wrong, my dividends income is incorrect, my gift aid contributions are incorrect and the tax refund due to me is understated.

So I've now filed a full Income Tax Return online - I was going to do that in due course anyway as a voluntary submission. So instead of HMRC receiving and acting on one Self Assessment online submission they now send out an incorrect assessment which I have challenged and they have to act on the correct details in my online submission which they said they didn't need.

Jobs for the boys - double the workload for them in my case. I can't imagine what will happen for 2017-18 when Scottish Tax rates apply to me.......


PS...and they sent a copy of the tax statement to a firm of Chartered Accountants who I stopped using 12 years ago and had informed HMRC of that fact at the time of cessation!

gupta
25th Jul 2017, 02:56
We've always done it this way

A sure sign of an organisation desperately in need of a review but being fiercely resisted by entrenched workers who have lost the capacity to think

Pontius Navigator
25th Jul 2017, 13:55
Year before last was getting batches of tax code notices. They were allowing more tax free allowance than the pension paid.

Took months to get them to tax it properly.

Tone
25th Jul 2017, 18:56
Remember that HMRC will contact you by email if you have set up the on-line system. Conatct emails are from '[email protected]', and are adressed to you personally. They simply ask that you log in to your account by the normal route, the message generally say that a link is not provided for security reasons.
I have had notice of tax overpayments by this route, it do bring a smile to my face.

NorthernChappie
25th Jul 2017, 20:52
Now at the moment I would welcome such a text, as they are genuinely due me a refund for 2016 / 2017 because of a glitch in their software. But they say they can't do anything about till after the end of 2017 / 2018. They sent me most of the refund but have held on to 1,000. Bar Stewards.


Something to do with our tax arrangements where we take a fair old chunk of dividends in addition to salary and other things, but the 5,000 dividend allowance for 2016 / 2017 which should be added to the basic rate band, isn't built in to their software correctly. Their advice to someone who filed electronically in May rather than waiting till January?


"Should have filed a paper copy this year sir". But does the website tell you that? You can guess the answer.

llondel
26th Jul 2017, 04:45
I'm waiting to see if they've finally figured out I'm out of their clutches, having been through the process of telling them I didn't send them a tax return because I'm not resident and so their attempt to fine me for it is invalid. It's sorted for this year, but it's not the first year we've been round this loop so I'm not completely convinced it's sorted.

Pontius Navigator
26th Jul 2017, 07:14
Never an email though I file on line. Got a letter saying me and missus didn't need to file. Ah, freedom, except they OWE me money. Of course if I owe them then I must tell them.

Thinks, if they know I owe them without a a return .. .

llondel
26th Jul 2017, 17:48
They knew they owed me money without a return. They clearly know more about my finances than I do because I haven't worked out where it came from yet. Methinks I've 'lost' an account or some shares (I thought I'd flogged them all off) somewhere in the international move.