BA- advance seat reservations - shambles.

[yellowtriumph]

So, many months ago I spent thousands of pounds on club world return tickets to Johannesburg only to be told after handing over my money that I cannot reserve my seats until 30 days before the flight unless I cough up even more cash even though we are exec club members!

Outraged I protest but there is nothing I can do about it. Now, 30 days before, I ring up to reserve our seats and now I am told we cannot do it until 24 hours before the flight unless I cough up that cash! This is outrageous and that's what I tell them.

What kind of outfit are these people running.

With Virgin Atlantic, where we have now booked some future economy seats many months into the future and used points to upgrade them to Premium economy, we could book our seats straightaway. Sheesh.

[alserire]

I was thinking about taking a BA business class fare to JFK until I saw that seat reservations were not included and were around €100 returns extra. In business class!!!

Are there any other major airlines that holds true for?

Absolute madness.

[Background Noise]

I guess it's all about demand and pricing - I suppose that if seat selection was 'free', then the seat price would be higher. That said, it is poor when Air Canada can do it at the time of booking - in fact they do it before booking. You can see the seat availability before you choose a particular flight and then pick your seat there and then. That was for a trans atlantic flight in PE for exactly the same price as the identical BA flight.

[wowzz]

The last time I flew PE I deliberately chose Virgin over BA, entirely due to the fact that Virgin offers free seat selection. As it turned out, the Virgin experience was so much better than BA [friendlier crew, better food, more comfortable seats] that I would now make Virgin my first choice, given a choice between the two airlines.
I think charging for seat selection, especially for Business Class, is a prime example of accountants running the company, as alienation of the biggest profit earners does not seem to have been 'costed in' to the decision.

[PAXboy]

BA ceased to be my first choice for lh over 27 years ago. It's a pity because the actual service on board is really not bad. That said, I have only experienced their PE in the 744 and it was certainly less than VS. It might be different in other aircraft but the basic seat config is not as good.

[Helol]

Emirates. Flying economy, I was able to book a fantastic window seat on the A380, just a couple of rows from the front for no extra charge, at least 4 months before the trip.
South African - I also did the same
AirLink SAA - Ditto.

Furthermore, I also had the choice of changing the seat choice, at no extra charge on all 3 airlines.

[yellowtriumph]

But BN, I have paid my money, I am on the flight, I will be sitting in the business class section - there is no question about it - I will be sitting somewhere in that section of the plane.

What does it matter to BA where I sit in the cabin? They are not trying to entice me to buy their ticket as opposed to someone else's because I have already bought my ticket.

What does BA gain by this practice?

Edit. I rang them back again and by somewhat nefarious means (suggested by the BA rep on the other end of the phone!) I have now reserved our seats on the plane. (No, I can't divulge this wheeze I'm afraid).

[Heathrow Harry]

"What does BA gain by this practice?

Money, money , money... that's all they think about these days

Emirates allow me to book seats for free 3 months ahead of leaving

[Andy_S]

As it turned out, the Virgin experience was so much better than BA [friendlier crew, better food, more comfortable seats] that I would now make Virgin my first choice, given a choice between the two airlines.

Seconded. Add in the extra elbowroom in VS PE and the lack of toilets in BA WT+ and it's a no brainer.....

[LandIT]

"What does BA gain by this practice?

Money, money , money... that's all they think about these days

I agree. It seems to me that if you book advance purchase discounted fares they will crush you in some way, even Business Class. For example, I have seen airlines charge for seat selection and also for additional baggage. It usually works better for higher frequent flyer classes but not always. Their algorithms are varied and inconsistent, especially when it comes to code-share flight bookings.

I've concluded the only thing is to go into the booking process far enough to see all the inclusions (more particularly if you can see the exclusions) and be able to escape before you pay if you don't like what you get. However I have been trapped and had to cough up extra for seat selection after paying for the flights and it irks me but what can you do?

They are trying to make extra revenue at any chance they get, so all the old expected rules are out the window. Buyer beware. Change airlines if you can verify a better deal. And try a good travel agent - sometimes they can come up with better than a direct deal!

[NorthernChappie]

Way I understand it is (inc Club)


BA - Gold & Silver Exec - at time of booking.


BA Bronze - 7 days in advance


Everyone else - 24 hours.


Flew out and back this month with friends - they are silver and booked seat last December. We had to do the 7 day booking despite booking at the same time.

[ExXB]

What does BA gain by this practice?


Profits and bonuses for executives. Do you really think they are going to change their policies for you?

Slightly off topic. Someone noticed that on BA's beta booking sight it no longer says food will be provided in economy FOC on all flights. It's still there on their old site.

[Heathrow Harry]

they flagged last month that on some flights they are doing away with catering.......

[yellowtriumph]

Way I understand it is (inc Club)


BA - Gold & Silver Exec - at time of booking.


BA Bronze - 7 days in advance


Everyone else - 24 hours.


Flew out and back this month with friends - they are silver and booked seat last December. We had to do the 7 day booking despite booking at the same time.
We have rattled down to 'blue' and when I first tried to book the seats ba said 30 days (after they had my money). But nonetheless, when I rang within the 30 days they said 'No, 24 hours' - Hence my frustration.

But politeness and reasonableness has got us the result we wanted in the end.

[yellowtriumph]

Profits and bonuses for executives. Do you really think they are going to change their policies for you?

Slightly off topic. Someone noticed that on BA's beta booking sight it no longer says food will be provided in economy FOC on all flights. It's still there on their old site.
No, I'm not expecting ba to change their policy for me*

But next time I'll be flying with someone else if I can won't I.

* in strict terms, they have actually as I got the result I wanted which was not in line with their published policy.

[ExXB]

Well done, as it appears that a poor working stiff has overruled senior management. This gumption has been seriously lacking in the past. They could be learning.

[ZFT]

I'm constantly amazed at these complaints. On every booking site I use before I hit the confirm icon, I ensure I have got everything I want, that includes seat selections etc...If I can't get what I want, I don't confirm as it is virtually impossible to correct afterwards.

[yellowtriumph]

I'm constantly amazed at these complaints. On every booking site I use before I hit the confirm icon, I ensure I have got everything I want, that includes seat selections etc...If I can't get what I want, I don't confirm as it is virtually impossible to correct afterwards.
The original booking was made by a third party tour operator, not by me. Given the date and time we needed to be in SA I presume it was their only option.

What do you do if you want to fly somewhere and only one operator suits your timing requirements?

I was recently sat in business on a very short european flight with my wife and the steward slowly made his way to the back of the cabin serving G&T's to where we were sat. He knelt down beside me, leant on the arm of the seat and said ' Mr Yellowtriumph, we have not seen you on our planes recently, is there any reason for that? Is there something we can do to see you more often? Is there something we can improve on to see more of you?

Somewhat flabbergasted I replied that my wife and I will fly to wherever on whichever airline suits our schedule and at a price we are prepared to pay, if that happens to be your airline then so be it.

He replied "yes, that makes sense, we all have to look out for value for money, I would strongly advise you to keep an eye on Qatar's website, they always seem to have a lot of good prices and I use them a lot myself".

I was sat on a BA flight.

(I make it sound as though my wife and me are gadding about the world sat in business class all the time - that's not actually the case, we are modest travellers really).

[Hotel Tango]

yellowtriumph, no need to be apologetic about your chosen class of travel. I am retired and certainly not affluent by any means, yet I choose to fly long haul in Business Class or not at all. Since I am paying for the privilege out of my own modest pocket, with the exception of airlines on my NO FLY list, I seek the best Business Class deals available. As soon as an airline wants to add this, that or the other on top of the offered fare, they've lost me as a potential customer. It's for this very reason that BA have never motivated me to use them.

[ExXB]

Emirates is joining the party.

Emirates to charge fee for seat selection from October 3 | GulfNews.com (http://gulfnews.com/business/aviation/emirates-to-charge-fee-for-seat-selection-from-october-3-1.1898007)

[Hotel Tango]

Yes, but only in Economy. I thought this thread was about charging for seat selection in Business Class?

[RevMan2]

Air NZ does the same thing, but subliminally.http://www.burland.de/Images/Screen%20Shot%202016-09-20%20at%2009.39.38.png
They offer seat selection in Premium Economy, but your choice is - in this case - restricted to adjacent seats between the WC blocks. Or you can pay $75 extra for "access to seating desirable locations" - the pink ones.
The blacked-out seats (and there are more than the image shows) appear to be drip-fed into the inventory as soon as some mug (paying $2700 a seat...) comes up with $75

[Octane]

Astonishing....

[Ancient Observer]

On another forum about Aviation, BA are much derided for their cut-backs on what they give you for the price, - such a only serving a packet of crisps as food on an afternoon flight, and they are also derided for charging for everything.
When they announce their cutbacks, they call them "Enhancements".
So BA is now reverting to its old name, (in Europe) of BEA.
"British Enhancement Airlines"

There is strong rumour that early next year, BA will cut all provided food on European flights, and be like Ryannair, with "Buy on Board"

So no free seat assignment, no food, and much more limited baggage. They get away with charging a Premium ove Ryannair as BEA operate a monopoly at Thiefrow.

[RevMan2]

Back in the day, the first BEA flight to FRA was the choice of everyone I knew. Full cooked English breakfast. (Maybe no black pudding - can't remember...)

[PAXboy]

They will charge whatever people will pay to meet their financial targets. At some point, they will ask too much and then the prices might fall. No different to anyone else.

[esa-aardvark]

After some unpleasantness I blacklisted BA in 1974, and subsequently Air NZ in 2002.
Unfortunately sometimes you just cannot avoid them.
1974 until 2000 were the years when I travelled quite heavily 1-2 returns per week.
Not that BA went everywhere I was sent of course.

[DaveReidUK]

Back in the day, the first BEA flight to FRA was the choice of everyone I knew. Full cooked English breakfast.

Sounds like a very expensive breakfast for the ones who didn't actually want to go to Frankfurt. :O

[esa-aardvark]

Back in my day I used to fly back & forth Amsterdam Frankfurt
(LH83/84 ?). Aircraft was a quick change freighter/passenger,
freezing cold, meal such as it was in a doggy bag. May have been a 727.

[ExXB]

I recall CP's one hour flights YVR-YYC had a full meal service served by hand (no trollies) in all (both) classes. China service, plated silver cutlery and s/p shakers. Cabin crew never stopped.

Wardair's catering on long haul flights were also very memorable.

[TCU]

BA simply rewards loyalty. Fly them enough and you get a Silver Card so you can play with the seat map for weeks in advance of your flight.

Where I sit in an A320, I have no care. In a 747 or A380, yes its nice to have a choice, but its hardly a life changing decision.

[Heathrow Harry]

It can be if you are stuck in an aisle seat in the back row of slave next to the washrooms on 14 hour flight.....................

[TCU]

HH, assuming the last two rows of a BA 747, that's just 8 seats out of between 145 and 243, depending on configuration in Y

Actually, that's where I park myself on my regular runs down to Southern Africa in the BA747's, when the budget does not allow Club....The window aired seats, some side leg room on the window seats and first service with the bar and food runs....oh and being close to the loo means I avoid the queue by going when its quiet. Nice view of wings and the Rollers too.

I am not sure BA has many 14hr single leg flights anyway....perhaps GRU/EZE?

Whilst accepting it may have is discomforts, its not life changing

ExXB rather hits the spot....great food, but where are CPAir and Wardair now?

[ExXB]

Government regulation and incompetent management killed them both. Probably more the latter than the former.

[Helol]

Helol wrote: "Emirates. Flying economy, I was able to book a fantastic window seat on the A380, just a couple of rows from the front for no extra charge, at least 4 months before the trip".

Oh. Well, that's that then.

Emirates Airlines will now charge you extra to pick your seat - Business Insider (http://uk.businessinsider.com/emirates-airlines-seat-selection-charge-2016-9?r=US&IR=T)

The world's largest international airline announced that it will "institute a minimal charge" for certain economy-class passengers who wish to select their seats before their flight.
Passengers should expect to pay $15 per person for short flights and $40 per person for long-haul flights.
The policy, which will go into effect on October 3, applies only for customers traveling in economy on discounted special or saver fares.

[alserire]

Minimal? $40 is minimal? Is that return or one way?

Flying is just getting more and more annoying.

LH are bringing it in now too on some fares.

[yellowtriumph]

So, we set off soon on our adventure.

Does anyone know if BA will be providing us with 'Jim Jams' in Club Class? - or should we take our Virgin ones?!

[PAXboy]

No idea yellowtriumph as I tend not to select BA.

To the substantive point about what is no longer inclusive, it is clear that BA want to have 'LCC' in Y and Full service elsewhere. They cannot jump to it in one go as that would be too obvious - but they have been playing 'Grandmother's Footsteps' for long enough to show the path.

It is a perfectly reasonable response to the changes of the last 30 years and I'm sure we shall see all main line carriers going on this route.

[Helol]

Pax, talking of which, just listened to a piece on R4, BA will no longer provide a sandwich in economy on flights less than (I think) 5 hours. In future food will be an additional cost back in cattle class. Here you go...

BA drops free food and drinks for passengers in economy | The Independent (http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/ba-food-drinks-dropped-economy-flights-free-inflight-meals-prices-charges-a7337046.html)

[TCU]

yellowtriumph

No jim jams in Club, so bring your trakkie bottoms. No point taking your Virgin ones....no one will notice; just get over it.

If you want BA PJ's, dig deeper and go 1st...you might even boost your card to Bronze from the depths of Blue

Are you on the 747 or the A380 run to JNB? Let us know where your seats are and I will tell you if they are any good or not.....us highly carded BA regulars tend to bag the best spots first (in all classes)!!!

[PAXboy]

Yes Helol, I had seen that earlier. Along with folks suggesting that the cabin will smell of a well know fast food restaurants. I recall a trip ex-LHR over 16 years ago that smelt of take aways.

[yellowtriumph]

TCU, I think you get the wrong impression. I have no other jim jams - even at home, I am not intending to wear Virgin's to make any sort of point - it's all I have unless I sleep nude!

Only we, and we alone can tell me if my seats are 'good or not' as one mans meat is another man's poison.

I think you are trying to rain 'on our parade' - is that why you appear to be boasting? This is a great adventure for us as we are not regular flyers.

[TCU]

yellowtriumph....I wish you an excellent trip, but refer you back to your whinging thread opener about BA's very well publicised seat allocation policy. Why did you not just book VS?

As a regular through JNB, one top tip is make sure your checked in bags are well and truly locked and secure and easily identifiable on the luggage conveyor

If you want a real treat and a J Class bargain, go EK next time...I use them rather a lot when i'm not in a hurry down to Southern Africa

[yellowtriumph]

TCU. As per my previous post - we did not book the tickets, a travel agent did. Johannesburg is not our final destination, we are now in Durban having transited smoothly through joburg. I guess the agent thought using a single airline would be preferable for us. Our bags are securely locked and we use those strap things that not only provide an additional layer of protection against bags inadvertently opening but they also have our surname embroidered in them to make baggage reclaim easy.

Anyhow, here we are having experienced BA's business class offering. Having had a somewhat painful experience booking our seats prior to setting off we discover at the airport that we have been moved! Why? no-one on board can tell us. The couple sitting in our original seats look very similar to my wife and I and we can see physical reason why we were moved? Neither can the cabin crew tell us. Is this important? Well the seats we were moved to were very close to the galley and overnight the crew kept yakking and yakking and yakking - even though Mrs yt went and saw them and politely asked them to keep it down. In fact Mrs yet thought it got worse after she had politely asked them to quieten down. Bastards. So we have arrived here knackered due to BA's thoughtlessness.

When we get back to the uk we will not be troubling BA again.

[Haven't a clue]

JNB eh? A380 maybe? Upper deck? Near the galley? Done that. Went politely into the galley and said that I was embarrassed. I could hear every word that was said and really thought I shouldn't be listening to a private conversation. Apologies and silence for the rest of the trip. I guess it's the way you say it?

[PAXboy]

That's a very bad result yellowtriumph. Certainly sounds like the folks who had been allocated seats near the galley were regulars and knew the problem. What cards they dealt to get switched (possibly at check in) one cannot say. It mayhap that the folks who got 'your' seats paid the fee and thus trumped your call on them.

I've only once had this happen to me on BA, but it was on Concorde and that's another story. BA are always my second or third choice. Which is a pity as their actual product is still very good. But, eventually, their management will 'win'.

[yellowtriumph]

Pax boy. Our seats were confirmed as per our selection when we checked in on line within the 24 hour window, so I presume we were 'bumped' within that window as you suggest.

Did I mention the lumbar and head adjustments didn't work in my seat. The crew reset my seat to try and sort it out, but managed to reset the 3 seats in the same row and ended up stuffing up the the film a chap was watching in the third seat. But these things happen and the crew were only trying their best which is all I ever ask of anyone, the faults did not affect my personal comfort to any degree. I was sat in the middle row, middle seat, I could lean forward and kiss my wife to the right, or if I chose, I could lean forward and kiss the chap in the left seat!! I really was disappointed in the whole A380 business experience. Give me the 747 any day. Rabbit hutches and the crew chose to lean over the outside eats to serve the inner seats, that would have really annoyed me.

A couple who joined us from London flew to Durban on Emirates and had a lovely time - as TCU suggested, if we come this way again we will give it a go.

[yellowtriumph]

OK, my last post on this subject - really just to lighten it up if need be.

We were in Kasane, Botswana checking in for our return link flight to Joberg with 'Air link', we had three bags as we were otherwise business class passengers linking up directly with our BA return flight to Heathrow. We explained our luggage situation to the very pleasant check in lady and she not only understood but offered to check our bags through to London. We took her up on that.

A local behind the counter eyed our bags and quietly took them from us to somewhere behind the service counter, he looked at them, he looked at us. He looked at the bags again and looked at us again, but this time holding up 3 fingers towards us in an inquisitive manner with one hand and putting a finger across his lips with his other hand in a sort of 'ssh' gesture. We proceeded to continue check in and were given some paperwork to fill in before passing through security, our bags disappeared.

A couple of minutes later said chap came quietly over to us and solemnly informed us that our bags weighed in at 65Kgs but that he had altered the paperwork to be 45Kgs and thus we were assured our bags would be ok to depart. He hesitated, hesitated some more, and then went to mooch off. I had a momentary vision of our luggage spending the rest of eternity on the bag carousel at Joberg assuming it even left Kasane, so I got the message. I called him back and greased his palm with 2 USD, better to submit to spending £1.50 and getting my luggage to Heathrow than never seeing it again.

I smile when I look back on it now, but I did muse to my wife at the time that in the unlikely event of us hurtling towards the ground at a great speed then we could be assured it was our 'extra' 20Kgs that most likely caused it. We did get our bags at Heathrow, so £1.50 well spent.

[PAXboy]

It is a problem in Africa (doubtless elsewhere too) that ability to load an item is not always linked to the actual weight of an item. If it is seen that the aircraft hold is not full then, obviously, it can take more stuff... The larger the aircraft the slightly less of a problem, except that there are many more opportunities to overweight the machine.

Small aircraft (you would have been on AirLink'sAvro RJ) can have problems. My nephew (when operating light twins) noticed a black substance dripping out of a suitcase. It turned out to be oil. Someone had checked in a suitcase with an engine block inside, when put back on the scales, the numbers did not add up.