Disappointing distant airshows 2016

[cyflyer]

Anyone else disappointed with what they have seen at all airshows this year ? Went to Beachy Head for the Eastbourne Airshow yesterday Saturday hoping to get some lovely photos of the aircraft as they banked around the Beachy headland as they approached Eastbourne, as in all previous years from year zero, hundreds of people camped out in the beautiful sunshine, lenses and cameras at the ready. Aircraft approached over Eastbourne town, displayed so far out from the seafront that the show was probably visible from a French seafront, and departed towards Beachy Head so far out to sea that they were just blips in the distance. Absolutely ridiculous and absurd. Only aircraft that were within long lens range were the BBMF, like they decided to revolt against the rules. I was not the only one that said I would not be wasting my time again and not bothering again. These new rules for keeping such an 'over the top' distance are, I believe, going to kill airshows because more and more people will not bother. I enjoyed the view of the lovely landscape, but as an airshow, an absolute washout. This applies to all shows I've attended this year, but to route the flights that are mostly over the sea, so far out to sea away from people was the worst of the worst wastes of time.

[dazdaz1]

Being a local, Beachy Head is not the location for photographic opportunities, the town sea front is the place to go. I was there Friday outside the Cavendish hotel the tide was in and the Reds flew close to the tide line as did other display aircraft.

[cyflyer]

Well Daz, I guess all the people that have been wasting their time so many years taking photos like below, from Beachyhead, didn't realise what they were missing.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=beachy+head+air+show+photos&safe=strict&biw=1920&bih=1106&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjG-NeK9MDOAhVILcAKHbGvCHsQ_AUIBigB#imgrc=v5IY0qNrKVIseM%3A

Eastbourne from Beachy Head - 15 August 2015 (http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=68953)

[andytug]

I went and watched the Blackpool air show last Sunday - the displays weren't noticeably further away than before, in fact due to the stiff onshore breeze (15-20kts with gusts to 25) the display director asked at least 3 of the displays to give the North Pier a bit more "wiggle room". Erring on the side of caution definitely, but anyone without a scanner wouldn't have known any different.

Maybe Blackpool like Southport is lucky in having a flat offshore display line due to the coast being straight, where places with headlands etc sticking out might have to adjust theirs further away accordingly?

[ShyTorque]

Cyflyer, how much did you pay to watch?

[cyflyer]

Cyflyer, how much did you pay to watch? Well, what on earth does that have to do with it ?? Lets see where you are going with that question.

[ShyTorque]

Well, what on earth does that have to do with it ?? Lets see where you are going with that question.
I was going to suggest that you ask for your money back.

[cyflyer]

:ugh:Is that what you call an 'intelligent' contribution ? :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

[surely not]

I went to Beachy Head yesterday to watch the Eastbourne Show and hopefully to get some nice topside photos as aeroplanes either arrived from the west or departed to the west. Usual position down near the Bomber Command memorial along with many others.

Sadly only a few came the way of Beachy Head and of those only the BBMF and the Blenheim came relatively close in.

The complaining from the big lens operators was tiresome. One oaf was going to write to the various aircraft operators and the show organisers, complaining that they had ignored the audience on Beachy Head! On and on he blathered finally stating 'well I certainly won't be coming again' as if anyone cared about that.

It is the Eastbourne Airshow NOT the Beachy Head Airshow. The aircraft operators are paid to display along Eastbourne promenade NOT over Beachy Head therefore that is what they did and very well from what I could see.

ShyTorque it is a free airshow, but monies received from buying official programmes etc go towards the costs. Even though these are not on sale on Beachy Head I did notice that quite a few of the guys and gals taking the photos had bought copies...................... although not those complaining the loudest.

[cyflyer]

Beachy Head is part of Eastbourne, at least Eastbourne council parking meters are there, and has until now been part of the display. In fact, from the official website, it is included in the recommended places from whence to watch the show by the organisers, probably because there would not be enough space, and parking, at Eastbourne seafront should everyone decided to watch only from the seafront.
Plan Your Visit to Eastbourne Airshow (http://www.eastbourneairshow.com/Visit.aspx)
As for money payed, how much do you think was payed by the hundreds of cars at Beachy Head car parks at £5 a go for all those days ?

. I went to Beachy Head yesterday to watch the Eastbourne Show and hopefully to get some nice topside photos as aeroplanes either arrived from the west or departed to the west. Usual position down near the Bomber Command memorial along with many others.
You see, you went there also with greater expectations, why if it is not 'The Beachy Head' airshow ?

[El Bunto]

Portrush airshow in NI is another that is nominally 'free' but exists because it makes spade-loads of money for local businesses. Few of the attendees bring themselves a picnic and so require catering, many stay over in local hotels and even more buy overpriced trinkets to keep their children amused.

I used to go to free airshows but now I can't afford the cost...

[cyflyer]

El Bunto, take your packed lunch like most people at Beachy do ! However, there is a really lovely pub/restaurant there which we always end up in for a meal afterwards. For me, to tell the truth, being from London, the attraction is the wonderful landscape at Beachy ! Just being there is part of the pleasure.

[SpringHeeledJack]

I went to the show when the 2 Lancasters were flying 2015?2014? and went to Beachy Head as I dislike crowds in general, and the scenery is rather stunning on a nice day. The various aircraft came quite close at times flying parallel and even below the cliff height. The Red Arrows and the Gnats even flew over our heads with a few hundred feet to spare which was pretty exciting. After Shoreham, such flying is a thing of the past and sadly as far as the Eastbourne Show and Beachy Head go, one is on the right side of the tracks, the other not and that's just that. I might be wrong, but I think we'll be hearing more and more people bemoaning the distance between flying display aircraft at various shows. Perhaps the USA will be the only arena where the 'old ways of the old days' will still be available.

[ShyTorque]

:ugh:Is that what you call an 'intelligent' contribution ? :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
Judging by your replies, it seem that you have an anger management issue.

You went to a free air show and now complain on a professional pilots' forum that it didn't meet your expectations because the aircraft weren't close enough for your liking.

It's only a year since the Shoreham tragedy. The regulations have changed. The pilots were probably complying with them, that is why they were flying further away from the public.

[cyflyer]

Yes, I have an anger management issue with people that come on with the usual argument of 'oh its a free show and all you freeloaders should not enjoy a decent show because it is free'. Yes, l know its not the pilots' fault, and nobody has blamed them here. In case you haven't noticed the discussion is about how distant the aircraft were at this, and other shows, compared with THE SAME show in all previous years, as this is what the thousands of people at Beachy had come to see. I, along with with everyone else, could not see the logic of the display being so far out as it was over the water even at the nearest of times in the past. Shoreham happened, yes, and I was there, but the authorities have gone WAY over the top with the so called 'safety measures'. Airshows are are meant to have an element of EXITEMENT to them. Killing that off totally will kill off airshows eventually. As for reminding me that this is a professional pilots forum, and that you are obviously a professional pilot, let me remind you that this is the Spectators Balcony/Spotters corner thread for exactly that purpose, and maybe you are posting on the wrong discussion.

[Gulf4uk]

After Shoreham we were all waiting for the reaction we knew things would never
be the Same at Any Airshow .Many shows been cancelled those that have taken place
have been well attended but and include Eastbourne displays were higher and
futher away in some cases display line even further away .Farnborough was in
mine and many others view a total disaster in the display viewing
Show costs have been going up and up over the years nothing is for free
these Days so its good that we do get a few shows.
We know things will never be the Same after Shoreham but hopefully after
a while things will be relaxed a little .

Tony
farnborough

[bobward]

The only flying show I went to this year was RIAT (Sunday). I didn't notice any major changes to the display datum there. As for farnborough, being there on the Monday was a bad choice as the cloudburst happened just as the flying display started.

As was said earlier, the Shoreham effect is still working it's way through. Please be patient, I'm sure the aviation professionals are doing their best.

[ShyTorque]

Yes, I have an anger management issue with people that come on with the usual argument of 'oh its a free show and all you freeloaders should not enjoy a decent show because it is free'I never said it was a free show. I didn't know that it was. I merely asked how much you paid to watch and you immediately began insulting me.. anger management issues indeed.

The rule changes require display aircraft to operate with greater separation from the general public passing by i.e. not attending the actual airshow. As you were at Shoreham, you ought to have been aware that this would have an impact on other airshows this year. For example, the rules even prevented the Reds from displaying at Farnborough this year and caused local road closures. I first attended that airshow with my father in the early 1960s and I've never known the Reds fail to display there before this year (a few weather fails in the past maybe).

Also, the Shoreham accident aftermath has caused the usual "spotters" field on the southern boundary at Duxford to be closed off with a police presence.

I don't agree with the rather draconian extent of the new restrictions but we're all stuck with them.

[cyflyer]

I don't agree with the rather draconian extent of the new restrictions but we're all stuck with them At least we agree on something.

the rules even prevented the Reds from displaying at Farnborough this year and caused local road closures I was there, now that was absurd, the Red Arrows limited to one single flypast (in formation with the A400M), a waste of time them being there. If this carries on they might as well disband the Red Arrows.

One thing I am curious about. At Eastbourne, if all the pilots were under strict instructions to keep well away from Beachy, but the BBMF were the only display item that actually skirted the Beachy coast line on every day apparently, did the BBMF pilots break the rules and ignore instructions ?, why ? one rule for all the others and another for the BBMF ? Interested to hear from anyone in the know.

[HZ123]

There is certainly very few new additions at any UK airshows, sadly seen one you have seen them all. The 'Arrows' display which supposedly changes annually always looks the same albeit still excellent.

[UCLogic]

I was at Eastbourne on Saturday sitting on the beach and was thoroughly entertained. Looking at my photos taken with the same lens, I cannot tell the difference in size or framing of subject between two years ago and this year. The show is a free show and does wonders for our local economy. The point of airshows is to entertain and also promote aviation it is not there primarily as a photography subject. The show is targeted at the centre line and not the surrounding hillsides which do however provide another perspective to watch from.

From the official site, the places to watch from:

Seafront & Beach
Watch from prime position on the seafront at the frontline of all the flying action, with a host of trade stands and the huge beach as the ideal location to catch all the flying action. Alternatively reserve your place and avoid the crowds with the Bandstand's exclusive seating for ticket holders. Excellent, uninterrupted views across the display line.

Western Lawns & Wish Tower
Join the front row and watch all the Airbourne action on the Western Lawns amongst the military tri-service exhibition. For an elevated view take a walk up the Wish Tower Slopes offering great views along the whole seafront.

Beachy Head Viewing Airbourne
For somewhere a bit different and unique, head to the Park n' View car park for at Dencher, Beachy Head (near the pub), with excellent views of flying displays over Eastbourne*. Toilets and refreshments available. Warren Hill pay and display, normal charges apply/Warren Hill Field and Dencher, £5 daily charge.

* Please note all displays will take place on the display line between the Western Lawns and the Pier.

You can see that the Beachy Head is described as 'different and unique' but the note does indicate that the prime location is on the seafront.

For what it is worth I parked in town for £3:50 and in addition made a generous donation to furthering the cause for future years. I do not know whether at the Beachy Head car parks there was an opportunity to contribute or not. For interest several years ago there was a move to enclose the event and charge for viewing, perhaps best just to say it returned to being free for all the very next year. When son was small I did one year picnic on Beachy Head for ease (the day of the Delphin accident) but the experience prior to the accident was different, have been to the seafront every visit since.

I enjoyed the show on Saturday which I think is the main point.

[Gulf4uk]

The arrows flybys continued with All types B727 F35 A400M etc etc
And not onlylocal roads closed but Dog walkers and cyclists were prevented
from usingthe common , canal boats were banned from moving past the runway
end and Towpath closed someone got there revenge by conjuring up that cloudburst

[flyingtincan]

Reds on return from Eastbourne at Biggin

[surely not]

Beachy Head is part of Eastbourne, at least Eastbourne council parking meters are there, and has until now been part of the display.

I beg to differ. It has not been part of the show. The show area is along the Eastbourne promenade area close to the pier. That larger and faster aeroplanes needed to use the airspace to the west and east to get in position for their next manoeuvre in the main area does not make those areas part of the airshow. Smaller and slower aircraft such as the Bulldogs and Vari-eze that have displayed there in recent years didn't come near Beachy Head when displaying, nor did the Chinook and Sea King. Some of them came closer when clearing from the show AFTER displaying.

The RAF display aircraft do operate under different rules as they are still on the military register and not on the civilian register. The CAA are not their masters in the same way that they are to a civilian pilot.

Yup I went to Beachy Head, I never suggested it was the wrong place to go. I went there, like you, because in previous years the aircraft flew quite closely along the shoreline when arriving/clearing and some nice topside photos could be taken. Disappointing that times have changed but then my dad misses the days of RAF Hendon and the Gloster Gamecocks displaying whilst tied together wing to wing, and I miss the days of the fast jets arriving low and fast over the crowd from behind.

Each generation is left with never to be repeated memories, enjoy today because the future is getting more mundane with every invention.

[NutLoose]

Victory Show Cosby


I do not want to say this but if you pay to go to air shows, this is now one you need to miss, content was good, BUT the new display line is nowhere near the show, so you end up watching it in the distance, and I am talking using a 500MM lens with a 1.4 convertor on and the only way I could get anywhere near a full screen shot was to do a 100% zoom on the camera.
I and a lot of people left early because it was totally pointless staying, after the ground battle had finished, the only chance you had of getting a decent shot or indeed seeing the aircraft flying was during take off or landing, and I wasn't the only person being vocal in that they would never attend again in the current format, that in itself is sad as the profit's go to charity.
I know Shoreham happened and the CAA got anal and had to react, BUT the main crux of the matter of Shoreham was those killed were not involved in the show which by purchasing a ticket you accept the risks, I understand that and see what they are trying to fix, but the sheer fact that they have moved the display line actually increases that risk as it no longer falls within the boundary of the display site the public pay for,
As with everything you get freeloaders, and I watched the show supervisors clear them for them to reappear again the minute the vehicle's left. these were none paying members of the public which are then UNDER the display line, so those that except the risk by purchasing entry are now in effect not being able to enjoy a show at a realistic display format, whilst those that haven't accepted that risk by purchasing a ticket have a full show, call me old fashioned, but isn't that doing exactly what the lessons of Shoreham were supposed to prevent, injury to those outside the show?????
Leaving early I saw more, and was closer to the Spitfire display driving through the uncontrolled environment of the village, than I was in the controlled and paid for show ground.
And in that, there is something fundamentally wrong in this new ethos!