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DirtyProp
26th Jul 2016, 20:09
Holy crap!

Man injured in shooting at Malmö shopping mall - The Local (http://www.thelocal.se/20160726/man-injured-in-shooting-at-rosengrd-shopping-mall)

Seriously, WTF is going on?

Kulverstukas
26th Jul 2016, 20:22
Any crime will be blown up and inflated to make more shit hit the fan and more ad clicks for media?

Lonewolf_50
26th Jul 2016, 20:35
Kulver, I think you are on to it.

MrSnuggles
26th Jul 2016, 20:39
Rosengård is one very well known trouble area in Malmö. They used to throw hand grenades at each other there. Exclusively low income, low education area. Throwing stones at coppers and ambulance, those sorts of things. Nothing to see here, business as usual.

Kulverstukas
26th Jul 2016, 20:47
I highly hope that ISIS will "claims responsibility" for any such crime and quickly discredit itself similar to Al-Kaeda.

DirtyProp
26th Jul 2016, 20:51
I found this video about Sweden and Malmo.
Somebody please tell me it's fake, exaggerated, etc etc.
MrSnuggles, what do you say?

S68NP1tYUr8

MrSnuggles
26th Jul 2016, 21:01
It is somewhat exaggerated. The problems in Rosengård are very well known, and this has been going on for a very long time, nothing new. Last winter there were some throwing stones at synagogues in Malmö, but it was unclear if it was the Muslims or the far-rightwingers who did this.

HOWEVER, the Swedish Democrats are a bunch of criminal brats and the party was founded by a volunteer Swedish SS officer. Their ideas about Swedishness includes forbidding certain foods, prohibit import from certain countries and stuff like that. They are just as insane as those stone throwers in Rosengård.

Tankertrashnav
26th Jul 2016, 22:24
Have they called Wallander in? He's not too far away in Ystad!

er340790
27th Jul 2016, 01:01
Murder, mayhem and mutilation in Malmo mall.

Peter Piper. :E

MrSnuggles
27th Jul 2016, 10:05
C195

The rape thing is somewhat complicated. Please spread this information to those who repeat this slightly misinformed mantra.

1) In Sweden, our laws have an extended definition of rape. What other countries may classify as "sexual assault" is classified as "rape" in Sweden. Without this knowledge I can understand that a lot of outsiders believe that there is a rape edidemy going on.

2) According to this law, wifes can report husbands for rape. I have come to understand this is not the case everywhere. Rape in Sweden is, according to the law, any attempt for penetration without consent from the victim (it is written so that it should include even homosexual people). We have had some highly controversial pedophile cases where the victim was "too young" and therefore "didn't understand consent" and the pedophile was freed. This is why the law was renewed to include a broader variety of cases.

3) There are actually some people, of all flavours, who wants to renew the law even more, that the "rape" charge should include all cases where a victim did not say a clear "YES" to the offender.

4) Rape cases are mostly regular drunk Swedes who assault regular drunk Swedes. It is when we come to the more violent crimes that trends can be seen.

5) We have something translated to "violent rape" where the offender has done extra harm to the victim. This includes torture, repeated penetrations, beatings, kidnap, use of foreign objects, multiple offenders, etc. This is where it differs. Regular Swedes are more likely to be alone in the violent rape situation. If there is a rape with multiple offenders, it is extremely likely that this is a gang of people of Middle Eastern descent.

This kind of sums it up. I hope you feel more enlightened. As for the specific details in the Kalmar case, I don't know anything else than written in the papers. Apparently is has been attacks with multiple offenders. Well, I draw my own conclusions from that, based on history.

MrSnuggles
27th Jul 2016, 15:14
C195

Yes, the numbers of reported rapes with multiple offenders has gotten lot of media coverage since maybe ten years ago with the first really news worthy multiple offender rape. It happened in Rissne, outside Stockholm, and of course the offenders were Middle Eastern descendants, coming from an low income, low education, low integration area.

As I said, the absolute majority of multiple offender rapes are from people with Middle Eastern descent. There was one instance on a boat a few weeks ago where the perpetrators seems to have been Swedish. Lots of alcohol involved, noone sure what happened really.

And, of course we had our own serial rapist, a fine specimen that was released early due to good behaviour, purebred Swede. He got beaten up by some honourable chaps who took a serious dislike to him once they realised who he was.

The sexual assaults during music festivals are, again, a consequence of our laws who are very strict in this sense and of course the fact that EVERYBODY is on high alert now, since Köln. Again it seems like there are trends about who does what. The occasional groping is from your random Swede. Organised attacks with multiple offenders are from, well, the usual suspects.

Problem is, since Köln, the media has started reporting on it massively; this groping has been a silent problem for yeeeeeears, starting with the first music festivals in the 80's! I volunteered at one music festival from beginning of the 90's to 2011 and there was always something like that going on. Police didn't take it seriously though because they went for the drug use instead, arresting people hither and dither for alleged drug use, bragging about how successful they were because they could charge 75 out of 14000 visitors.

Since Köln it seems mass hysteria set in and everyone is reporting everything everywhere. The only real problem we have had with groping, that noone has talked seriously about, is that the usual suspects are creating uneasy situations in the public swimming pool areas. Again, as always, they come in groups and harass women. In my own public swimming pool there has been a lot of these youngsters wreaking havoc especially in the men's changing room. For some reason, ejaculation in the sauna is a major achievement for them.

Sometimes the larger Swedish newpapers are reluctant to write the ethnicity of assailants. This is both good and bad. The bad thing is that some paranoids accuse media of "cover up" and "immigrant hugging" while the good thing is that a crime is a crime, regardless of ethnicity of the offender, and logically the ethnicity should not be a factor. I'm torn about this, because I agree that the crime should not be judged by ethnicity. Otoh the trends are harder to see, there is no reliable data that explicitly says that it is a fact that multiple offender sexual crimes are much more likely to be committed by Middle Easterners. It is just an impression we get from reading the papers about who did what.

EDIT: This is only MY opinion and should not be confused with fact. This is NOT an official policy!
My own take on this is that we should only allow females here. They don't cause stirs like this and then they will get some real respect for their talents, something they can use in their home countries to change their awful treatment of women. Studies have shown that in order for poor communities to evolve, the most effective way to do that is to teach the women to read and do math. They are the ones taking care of business while the men just hang around or fight about something. Probably both.

Kulverstukas
27th Jul 2016, 15:26
My own take on this is that we should only allow females here. Mmmm... What about transgenders than? Seriously, how can any country "only allow females"? What about male elders and children refugees? Gays couples flee "guy unfriendly" countries like Russia?

MrSnuggles
27th Jul 2016, 15:41
Kulverstukas

Please note that it was my take which means that you don't need to bother about that at all, since it is just my own very unprofessional thought on this subject. I solemnly swear I have not thought this through with regards to any LGBT person, neither did I consider any humans rights opinions at all. It's just my own very personal and extremely biased opinion, based on those groups of Middle Eastern young males who harrass women. I just want it to stop. This would be a great solution, in MY mind. But as you point out, of course it makes no real sense to implement this on a large scale. I will edit my post to clarify this is my opinion only.

Kulverstukas
27th Jul 2016, 16:06
As a technical person I just point you that your solution is unimplementable. Best way is to remove the need for them to flee - i.e. stop the war in their countries. Highly fantastical.

Second one is to accept them but not promise them heavens and sugar mountains - their life must be relatively safe but not such one will dream about. It's typical refugee camp in countries close to conflict zones - Turkey, Jordanian, South Europe. You know that outcome is still unpleasant - some riots and clashes with police - but at least it's not affects life of citizens of host countries.

Third is now commonly accepted as only right one - to "integrate" them into "democratic multicultural society". IDK if it works, but it's definitely very slow way, heavily affected by number (and proportion) of subjects who can be "integrated" and by restrictions and rules (some of them even unwritten) local people follows because they are grown into them and "new Europeans" don't (don't know or don't want).

We here also have long and windy story of "new society of modern people" "from cold Finns to hot Georgians" living happily as a lamb with a tiger. :(

MrSnuggles
27th Jul 2016, 16:48
Yes, in Russia the diversity is big and great. You have everything. The nomad Siberian people, the muslims, jews, christians, non-believers, kosacks, tatars, everything. And no ethnical riots, no police shooting blacks, no suicide attackers with lorries. At least nothing I have heard or read about (I read Moscow Times online a few times a month...).

How did you accomplish that?

Cazalet33
27th Jul 2016, 16:52
Probably by overlooking the Chechens.

MrSnuggles
27th Jul 2016, 16:54
Cazalet33

The Chechens were the kind of freedomfighters that we now see in France. I was supportive of Putin then and I still support him in his dealing with those.

Kulverstukas
27th Jul 2016, 17:26
I don't want to say that Russia is a great example, even less USSR.

After it broke into pieces there was terrible wars in almost every part of it - Armenian vs Azerbaijanis, Georgians vs Ossetians, civil wars in Central Asian republics. Not forget also about "alien Russians" extrusion and even massacres in a lot of places, including about at least couple hundred thousands which flee Chechnya, leaving their flats and houses and belongings... Even "truly European" Baltic countries still has thing unheard of in "new democratic world" - alien "noncitizens" status for people born and raised in this countries but of "non-indigenous" nationality...

The only lesson which can be learnt from USSR and Russia example is that people of different nationalities, races and religions CAN live together in relatively peaceful conditions. This conditions must be "you respect state rules - we respect your culture" and "we are open for talk about peace - we will destroy anybody who want's war".