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piperboy84
24th Jul 2016, 18:45
Murderous attacks in France and Germany all launched by folks with a Middle Eastern / North African Muslim pedigree, British holiday makers driving back from the continent messed about and forced to sleep in there cars due to France's unwilling to staff properly to enable them to get back over the channel.

Time to pull up the draw bridge, keep the animals out and let our caravaners enjoy touring unhindered and spending their money here at home.

Long live little England !

racedo
24th Jul 2016, 20:51
I though Brexit was British Exit not England exit.

As for murderous attacks......................... 7/7 was cause by whom again?

How many British citizens have gone to Syria again ?

meadowrun
24th Jul 2016, 21:01
There are plenty of fifth columnists in Britain.


And I don't like the terms little England or little Englanders. Sounds like something a German would say.

SASless
24th Jul 2016, 21:39
Or most any Country larger than say...the State of Alabama!


There are plenty of fifth columnists in Britain.


And I don't like the terms little England or little Englanders. Sounds like something a German would say.

Sallyann1234
24th Jul 2016, 21:46
Actually the longest traffic queues are on the British site of the channel, and involve EU travellers wanting to get home as much as British people wanting to go over there.

Of course if you want to block free movement across the Channel, this will have to be the regular situation.

But your blind prejudice won't let you see the true facts will it.

Gertrude the Wombat
24th Jul 2016, 22:06
Of course if you want to block free movement across the Channel, this will have to be the regular situation.
Yup. Get used to it. People voted for stricter border controls - #brexit are no doubt pleased that this has been delivered early.

meadowrun
24th Jul 2016, 22:11
It does not have to be the regular situation. You two just had to jump on that with more doom and gloom - skewed as usual. The problem is compounded by only three booths open and that turned into one at some point. That will cause mighty delays and is not the norm. Adequate staffing levels are a prerequisite for any smooth operation.

ZeBedie
24th Jul 2016, 22:15
Gosh, you remainics really are sore losers aren't you.

jcjeant
24th Jul 2016, 22:19
Hi,

State of emergency in France
Avoid any large gathering of people (Slogan of the authorities)
It seems they are making just the opposite :p

Fairdealfrank
24th Jul 2016, 22:37
Actually the longest traffic queues are on the British site of the channel, and involve EU travellers wanting to get home as much as British people wanting to go over there.

Indeed, which implies that UK border control is not doing its job properly. Is this correct?

G-CPTN
24th Jul 2016, 23:06
Indeed, which implies that UK border control is not doing its job properly. Is this correct?
The French have 'border control booths' at Dover.

the French border control booths have been seriously understaffed overnight with only three booths available for tourists out of a potential seven.
At one stage, only one French officer was available to check passengers on hundreds of coaches, resulting in each coach taking 40 minutes to process.
From:- UPDATE: PORT OF DOVER - FRENCH BORDER CONTROL (http://www.doverport.co.uk/about/news/update:-port-of-dover-french-border-control/13185/).

ExXB
25th Jul 2016, 08:57
Read that the politicians are adamant that there will not be a hard border between Eire and NI.

This suggests that the UK and EU nations agree to free movement of goods and people. Can't see it working any other way.

ATNotts
25th Jul 2016, 08:58
Gosh, you remainics really are sore losers aren't you.
No, those of us who voted to remain in the EU could have forecast the events that have happened since 24.6.17; political resignations included - however we'd have been convicted of scaremongering by the leavers who constantly spouted streams of bare faced lies relating to money for the NHS, Turkish membership of the EU and the like.

The electorate has been sold a pup; sadly however many of them will be dead before the true extent of their misleading comes to fruition

What really upsets me since 24.6.16 is the totally unacceptable rise in hatred towards foreigners that has reared it's ugly head, not just to people who "speak funny" but also towards Brits., born in Britain, who happen to have married someone with an eastern European sounding name, who are denied job interviews based on nothing more than their surname! That, by the way isn't anecdotal, it's fact - a real situation from my part of the world. Shameful.

B Fraser
25th Jul 2016, 09:44
The electorate has been sold a pup


To be fair, both sides were selling puppies as if they were going out of fashion.


With the recent attempted abductions, knifings, bombings, shootings and pointing trucks at crowds, does Brexit mean that our collective security agencies are not co-operating ? Of course not. Our recently departed PM said that Brexit would mean that the sharing of intelligence would be reduced. What utter cobblers.


With the FTSE-100 currently up by some 800 points at 6,750, the doom and gloom merchants are looking rather silly.

Sallyann1234
25th Jul 2016, 09:50
The electorate has been sold a pup; sadly however many of them will be dead before the true extent of their misleading comes to fruition
Yes it's the kids I feel sorry for. The Bible has the bit about "the sins of the fathers..."

We will never have the magic 'control' that was promised. We will never stop free movement. We will still have to follow all the EU regulations but no longer have any input to forming them.

The Leavers will no doubt continue jeering for a while yet and pretend they were right. Their children and grandchildren won't think it so funny.

wiggy
25th Jul 2016, 09:54
I am convinced this is an attempt by the French to caused disruption that can be blamed on Brexit.

Groan...yes, of course you are....... Given what has gone on in France quite recently you do realise the French security forces have a lot on their plate at the moment, and waving through British passport holders because they are British passport holders isn't perhaps their number one concern?

I'm quite willing to accept that there might have been a manning shortage/manning stuff up, but to hear the Dover situation yet again being blamed on the French deliberately punishing UK holiday makers for Brexit smacks of paranoia, perhaps with a bit of dog whistle post referendum politics thrown in ( perhaps at least one newspaper owner has no doubt decided "must keep the pressure up on Theresa").

I won't bore you all again with the story of how the France/Spanish border was being screened recently, with long delays inbound to France for French nationals in French vehicles.....(and yes, they were checking - documents, bags, car boots, the lot)...because it wouldn't fit the narrative....

sitigeltfel
25th Jul 2016, 10:04
The Leavers will no doubt continue jeering for a while yet and pretend they were right. Their children and grandchildren won't think it so funny.

And the Remainiacs will piously continue to claim they are right.

We are the children and grandchildren of a generation who fought to stop the creation of a tyrannical superstate, and unlike you, stayed awake during history class.

G0ULI
25th Jul 2016, 10:06
We live on an island. We can never be part of Europe because there is a rather wide body of water seperating us from the Continent. In terms of one size fits all European policies, we will always lose out precisely because of our geographical position.

Anyone who wants the full benefits of European living should leave the UK now and establish a life in one of the EU countries and apply for residency and a passport in their country of choice.

Do it now and stop moaning.

B Fraser
25th Jul 2016, 10:52
We will still have to follow all the EU regulations but no longer have any input to forming them.


Can you explain that one please.

Above The Clouds
25th Jul 2016, 12:01
Yes it's the kids I feel sorry for. The Bible has the bit about "the sins of the fathers..."

We will never have the magic 'control' that was promised. We will never stop free movement. We will still have to follow all the EU regulations but no longer have any input to forming them.

The Leavers will no doubt continue jeering for a while yet and pretend they were right. Their children and grandchildren won't think it so funny.
Oh for goodness sake grow up and get a grip.

Sallyann1234
25th Jul 2016, 12:19
Can you explain that one please.
It's not hard to understand. If you want to sell anything into the EU it needs to meet EU specifications and methods of work. As an EU member we have input into drawing up those requirements. Outside, we just have to accept what is decided

Oh for goodness sake grow up and get a grip.
As I said, you'll be jeering for a while yet.
The arguments for Brexit are unravelling one by one, and I can understand that you find this difficult to accept. Naturally you find it easier to simply be insulting, so do carry on. :rolleyes:

bcgallacher
25th Jul 2016, 12:24
What surprises me about the whole thing is that those who wanted to remain in the EU have not yet come to the conclusion that the organisation is not too many years off collapse. Germany will not be able to prop the financial system up for much longer - have a look at some of the numbers for the likes of Spain and Italy and tell me again the advantages of being in the EU.

B Fraser
25th Jul 2016, 12:42
Sally,

Yes, got that and it is the same for any market we trade with so nothing changes. The good news is that we will not have to follow the silly ones in the UK. Let's take an example

EU to launch kettle and toaster crackdown after Brexit vote (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/10/eu-to-launch-kettle-and-toaster-crackdown-after-brexit-vote2/)

Boiling a kettle in half the time requires twice the power but consumes that power for half the time. The overall energy consumption is the same. As you say, it's not hard to understand.

Sallyann1234
25th Jul 2016, 13:14
The kettle thing is actually a good example.
Manufacturers will now be producing kettles to the revised EU standard. If they even bother to make higher power versions just for the limited UK market they will inevitably cost more to produce.

Edit to say, I'm told by contacts in the generating industry that lower power kettles are a good thing because they will reduce the peak loading Coronation Street effect when millions of kettles are switched on simultaneously. As we all know the UK generating capacity has a dangerously low margin due to closure of old stations and few plans to replace them. Anything to cap the peak load will be useful.

engineer(retard)
25th Jul 2016, 13:20
The EU specifications often have to meet international standards; the top table is ISO et al. I expect that there are places outside the EU that are capable of the high tech required to make kettles and toasters

Above The Clouds
25th Jul 2016, 13:25
The kettle thing is actually a good example.
Manufacturers will now be producing kettles to the revised EU standard. If they even bother to make higher power versions just for the limited UK market they will inevitably cost more to produce.

Edit to say, I'm told by contacts in the generating industry that lower power kettles are a good thing because they will reduce the peak loading Coronation Street effect when millions of kettles are switched on simultaneously. As we all know the UK generating capacity has a dangerously low margin due to closure of old stations and few plans to replace them. Anything to cap the peak load will be useful.
Well I guess if thats all we are concerned about we will have to produce our own kettles therefore creating more jobs instead of out sourcing.

Sallyann1234
25th Jul 2016, 13:29
Of course ER you can make a 10kW kettle if you want. But there are efficiencies of scale to lose when special versions of anything is required.
Even the military has to buy COTS sometimes to save money.

Sallyann1234
25th Jul 2016, 13:32
Well I guess if thats all we are concerned about we will have to produce our own kettles therefore creating more jobs instead of out sourcing.

Now that is funny :)
Why do you think we import all our consumer goods?

Geordie_Expat
25th Jul 2016, 13:41
We will never stop free movement. We will still have to follow all the EU regulations but no longer have any input to forming them.

How do you work that out ? Surely one of the reasons so many of us voted to leave was so that we can ignore EU regulations if they are against our interests. If they are beneficial, we can bring in our own legislation.
Why do you guys want so badly to be dictated to by the EU ? Totally illogical.

rifruffian
25th Jul 2016, 13:48
uh huh....hmmm.....when I lit the fire under the kettle this morning, I checked the electricity meter for some indication of peak loading effect......but no effect was observed.....I credit the Leave vote.

Sallyann1234
25th Jul 2016, 13:51
How do you work that out ? Surely one of the reasons so many of us voted to leave was so that we can ignore EU regulations if they are against our interests. If they are beneficial, we can bring in our own legislation.That sounds wonderful doesn't it. It's inspirational but just not practical.

We are no longer a powerful trading empire, controlled from our island and surrounded by the biggest naval and merchant fleets in the world.
We have to compete in the real world of huge manufacturing countries and international conglomerates.
We can no longer 'do our own thing'. Those days have, unfortunately, gone.

If you'll excuse me now, I have a contract date to meet. From Germany :ok:

Geordie_Expat
25th Jul 2016, 13:54
That has nothing to do with EU regulations. Are you suggesting that the EU only trades within itself ? Other countries either trade with the EU or elsewhere. Why oh why should this be different for the UK ?

B Fraser
25th Jul 2016, 14:14
If they even bother to make higher power versions just for the limited UK market they will inevitably cost more to produce.


The UK kettle market is a third of the entire EU market and the manufacturers can use the existing source of higher powered heating elements. I'm not entirely sure where the "inevitably" increased cost of production will come from. Perhaps you can explain ? No doubt manufacturers will be passing on their costs of changing the production line for EU compliant kettles onto the consumer. Well done Brussels, another winner.

G-CPTN
25th Jul 2016, 14:19
When we moved to Denmark in 1981, I found it almost impossible to source an electric kettle - in the end I believe I bought one in Germany.

Kettles just weren't regular appliances - coffee machines were everywhere, however.

ShyTorque
25th Jul 2016, 14:32
I'm looking forward to buying a toaster where the bread goes brown before it goes stale.

Peter-RB
25th Jul 2016, 14:39
Sally,
Forget Kettles, it the new water from the EU it boils in half the time due to lowering the actual boiling point, also the tea leaves are a new type decreed by the EU they have to come in a softer way so as to retain live juices this helps the lower temp water to make the English Tea taste just as Good.

But also what about the Canadians are doing somersaults at the prospect of trade with the UK again as are the Aussies and the New Zealanders, Lamb from New Zealand had a distinctive taste..since the Common Market became the EU NZ lamb could hardly be found.

The Energy we all use has a EU tax on it, thats what has almost scuppered the Tata Steel Mills, they pay Millions per day just to use electricity, the French and Chinks are still going ahead with Nuke Power Stations as are the waste company Violia...so where is all the doom there then..? Get over it we are OUT.

The ECSC rules back in the mid 70s made it impossible for the British Steel Corporation ever to be able to carry on making steel in the way we were, we had to balance the price so our cheaper method of manufacture didn't cause job losses in France and Germany all courtesy of Jack Dolores who was then the man who single handedly made Job losses in the British Steel inevitable.. so Get over it we are OUT

engineer(retard)
25th Jul 2016, 15:30
Sallyann, I've checked and the stocks have fallen out of the team markets, China and India are laying off their workers because of EU kettles being inadequate to make a decent cup of tea. The EU is in turmoil because they've lost 11% of their market.

Andy_S
25th Jul 2016, 16:39
Edit to say, I'm told by contacts in the generating industry that lower power kettles are a good thing because they will reduce the peak loading Coronation Street effect when millions of kettles are switched on simultaneously.

Fair enough Sally, but what about toasters? What about vacuum cleaners?
As I understand it, these are ‘Green’ measures brought in by the EU to reduce power consumption. But how do you reduce power consumption when you’re using half as much power but it takes twice as long to do something?

This is the sort of pointless meddling that the EU should be avoiding but seems to love. It will have simply added a financial burden to the businesses who will have needed to redesign and repackage their equipment for no practical gain.

I don’t know how practical or cost effective it will be for us to make our own toasters, kettles etc. If we can’t, I’ve no doubt the Chinese or Taiwanese will do so and they’ll be cheaper than anything we currently import from the EU.

rifruffian
25th Jul 2016, 16:39
We just love our non-EU tea.......long live the Indian Tea industry...!

EGLD
25th Jul 2016, 16:57
I'm told by contacts in the generating industry

"I Googled it"

Deaf
25th Jul 2016, 17:47
It's not half the power for twice the time, it's actually more than twice the time ie MORE energy used.

While the water is heating there is heat loss from the kettle due conduction through the walls then convection and radiation (simplifying) and the longer time allows more heat to be lost hence more time to replace this heat.

Typical effort from green types

oxenos
25th Jul 2016, 17:51
".long live the Indian Tea industry...!"

You should buy Yorkshire Tea - grown on the south facing slopes of the moors, so I'm told.

LTNman
25th Jul 2016, 17:58
I would like to think that most people who voted no were looking at the long term benefits. Yes there is going to be some pain in the next few years but remaining in the EU was also risky and probably more risky than leaving.

We were warned that not going into the single currency would be bad for the UK yet it was our smartest move. Give it a few years when the EU is in financial and political turmoil and we will be glad to be outside it.

EGLD
25th Jul 2016, 18:02
I'm far more interested in the whereabouts of the much vaunted £350 million we were promised for 'our NHS', than I am in the electrical consumption of kettles. Apparently, no one said that, except the buses.

It was a sound argument, with a suggestion of what could be done with it instead.

No-one made any promises :=

Unlike Gideon for example, who promised an emergency Brexit austerity budget, and then backtracked like the weasel he is :D

Krystal n chips
25th Jul 2016, 18:15
" And I don't like the terms little England or little Englanders. Sounds like something a German would say "

That's dashed unsporting of them really now isn't it !.

Fancy making a statement that is both definitive and unequivocal after all....there again, I 've long since liked Germany and the Germans plus, to appease your angst, I would be more than happy to include myself in those who dare to make such observations as to the insular and, as I have said before, ultimately incestuous little island mentality that summates " Little Britain and Little Englanders".

You do however, have plenty of moral support on here so chin up old chap, the plucky British will rise to the fore as always......erm, no we won't.

As for the rise in racist remarks, a friend of mine, a lady who originates from Belfast ( ish ) and who has a PhD from the Sorbonne, currently studying for a Masters in a Mental Health related subject, was recently told, in a respectable venue, by, guess who ?..yet another middle aged so called "educated" white male in the company of his equally oafish friends, completely unprovoked and without any previous contact to "fxxk off back home you Irish bitch, you built our roads and that's all you're good for!".....the lady concerned actually does a lot for people with mental health issues in society and would usually be more than capable of shutting these gobby "middle England" yobs up....but even she was taken aback by the vitriol....this was in Nottingham.

B Fraser
25th Jul 2016, 18:35
While the water is heating there is heat loss from the kettle due conduction through the walls then convection and radiation (simplifying) and the longer time allows more heat to be lost hence more time to replace this heat.


Yep, the kettle will also lose heat proportional to the 4th power of it's absolute temperature due the Stefan-Boltzmann law. As the kettle will be at the higher temperature range for longer as it crawls from 363 Kelvin to 373 Kelvin, the radiative losses will be higher for longer.


We Brexiters are not as thick as the Remaniacs like to portray.


:8

VP959
25th Jul 2016, 18:45
Call me cynical, but I wouldn't mind betting that the energy company lobbyists are behind a lot of this "low power" nonsense, precisely because they know that a lot of lower powered appliances end up using more energy, and we pay for energy, not power....................

Gertrude the Wombat
25th Jul 2016, 22:59
As I understand it, these are ‘Green’ measures brought in by the EU to reduce power consumption. But how do you reduce power consumption when you’re using half as much power but it takes twice as long to do something?
I think the theory is - and I'll take this slowly, because the measure is being introduced because not everybody manages to work it out for themselves - that actually people will take exactly the same time to boil a kettle, because that's how long they're prepared to wait.


And how do they achieve this? - simples! - by not wasting energy boiling twice as much water as they're actually going to use.

Andy_S
26th Jul 2016, 07:13
I understand what you're saying, but somehow I don't think your average kettle boiler is going to modify their behaviour in the slightest.

And again, how about the other domestic appliances that are having their wattage reduced?

Seldomfitforpurpose
26th Jul 2016, 07:52
What about those of us already smart enough to only boil the water you actually need?

sitigeltfel
26th Jul 2016, 07:56
What about those of us already smart enough to only boil the water you actually need?

Ah yes, I had to grit my teeth recently when visitors filled our 1.5ltr kettle to the top just to make one cup of tea. :ugh:

rustle
26th Jul 2016, 08:12
Ah yes, I had to grit my teeth recently when visitors filled our 1.5ltr kettle to the top just to make one cup of tea. :ugh:
Pretty crap host if your visitors have to make their own tea: I'd fill the damned thing, too. :ok: