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View Full Version : And here we go again: another killing in Germany


DirtyProp
24th Jul 2016, 18:45
Machete-wielding Syrian refugee hacks pregnant woman to death and injures two others in Germany

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/1495355/syrian-refugee-kills-woman-and-injures-two-others-with-massive-knife-in-germany/

Syrian refugee kills woman with machete in Reutlingen in southern Germany (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/24/syrian-refugee-kills-woman-with-machete-in-southern-germany/)

Kulverstukas
24th Jul 2016, 18:56
He killed woman and injured man at the queue to Donner-Kebab booth if I get it right from news. So I wonder of which nationality these poor victims are.

SASless
24th Jul 2016, 19:59
What does it matter?



He killed woman and injured man at the queue to Donner-Kebab booth if I get it right from news. So I wonder of which nationality these poor victims are.

Newforest2
24th Jul 2016, 20:09
The Beemer driver deserves a medal!

Kulverstukas
24th Jul 2016, 20:09
What does it matter?

Why nationality of offender matters and of his victims it's not?

PAXfips
24th Jul 2016, 20:14
The Beemer driver deserves a medal!
Personally I say: YES!
Realistically they will punish him by "Strafbefehl" or even in court.

"Thanks, Mutti!"

Lonewolf_50
24th Jul 2016, 20:17
A witness told that a driver, reported to be the kebab shop owner’s son, prevented the man from harming more people.

“The attacker was completely out of his mind. He even ran after a police car with his machete,” the witness said. “A BMW driver then accelerated and knocked him down. After that he lay on the ground and did not move.” There's someone who used his head (and his BMW) to get a situation under control. Well played. :D

Kulverstukas
24th Jul 2016, 20:22
Hope this time ISIS will not claim responsibility.

SMT Member
24th Jul 2016, 22:09
Bloke kills his girlfriend. Horrible, yes, but hardly - and sadly - not an earth shattering event. Since when has this kind of 'news' been worthy of discussion?

PAXfips
24th Jul 2016, 22:12
HE felt in "love", not the pregnant polish lady.

Lonewolf_50
24th Jul 2016, 22:22
SMT, I may have missed part of the story, but where was it presented that this man and the woman he attacked were previously involved?

SMT Member
24th Jul 2016, 22:26
Lonewolf50, it's on the news in my part of the woods. Bild.de has it as well.

Lonewolf_50
24th Jul 2016, 22:45
OK, thanks, I suppose that makes for a more normal motive for a machete attack. :eek:

G-CPTN
24th Jul 2016, 22:50
From the OP:-
A Syrian man has attacked and killed a woman he was reportedly in love with with a meat cleaver taken from the kebab shop where they both worked.

Local authorities have identified the man as a 21-year-old asylum-seeker from Syria who was known to the police and had previously been charged with causing bodily harm.

German police said they were working on the assumption the attack was a "crime of passion".
"When a man and woman have an argument, we assume that we are dealing with a crime of passion," a local police spokesman told DPA, the German news agency, after media reported that the attacker and the murdered woman were close and worked in the same snack bar.

“She was from Poland and cleared the tables for us.”

SASless
24th Jul 2016, 23:13
So...running over a Killer with a Beemer is acceptable but shooting him with a gun would evoke outrage by some.

Am I alone in seeing a small problem in the logic that supports that kind of thinking?

Likewise the killer hacked his victim to death and it is of no interest....but I would suppose if a gun had been involved there would be an outcry by some to ban guns.




There's someone who used his head (and his BMW) to get a situation under control. Well played. :D

G-CPTN
24th Jul 2016, 23:17
It seems (by reading between the lines) that the BMW was driven by 'the son of a kebab shop owner'.

Lonewolf_50
25th Jul 2016, 01:05
G-CPTN: in the internet age, the stories get updated. That was not in the first few links that I opened. It is now, and thank you for the assist. :D As to the driver, yes, that was presented about the time I read the bit about effective use of a BMW. When you think about it, that was pretty fine work and vehicle control: hitting someone with a car can kill them.

meadowrun
25th Jul 2016, 03:15
And another A failed asylum seeker from Syria is believed to have killed himself and injured 12 other people after setting off a bomb outside an open-air music festival in the German city of Ansbach.
Bavaria's interior minister said the 27-year-old man detonated his device after being refused entry to the festival.
Joachim Herrmann said the man who died had entered Germany two years ago.
It is the third attack in the state of Bavaria in a week bbc


Just when is enough enough?

megan
25th Jul 2016, 03:20
Just when is enough enough?Give it time, it hasn't even started yet.

SASless
25th Jul 2016, 03:21
Asylum Seeker.....hang on a mo.....when a certain American Politician recently suggested we ought to take a very careful look at those folks for fear of some hard cases or other dangerous folks might get into our country and do harm....he was castigated, criticized, and made mock of by Open Border Types.

Is this proof that perhaps there was some merit the Man's concerns?

SOPS
25th Jul 2016, 03:24
No, the Donald is wrong. Just ask any huggy.

fltlt
25th Jul 2016, 04:29
No, the Donald is wrong. Just ask any huggy.

Meanwhile our SoS John Kerry is busy telling everyone that our refrigerators and air conditioning units are just as dangerous as ISIS because of their HFC's.

I plan to stand guard on mine tonight, one wrong move on any of their parts and it's going to be one round through the condenser.
Seriously though, you just couldn't make this stuff up, and he says it with a straight face.
Perhaps a return to tar and feathering, then run out of town?

evansb
25th Jul 2016, 04:47
What is SoS? What are HFCs?

HFC may stand for:


1 Chemicals
2 Financial institutions
3 Foods
4 Places
5 Sports
6 Other

meadowrun
25th Jul 2016, 05:37
Secretary of State
Hydrofluorocarbon

ORAC
25th Jul 2016, 05:51
I thought the HFCs that contributed to the hole in the ozone layer had been phased out and replaced decades ago?

sitigeltfel
25th Jul 2016, 05:56
"Bavarian Interior Minister Joachim Herrmann said the suspected attacker had entered Germany two years ago and had his asylum claim rejected a year ago.
He had been given leave to stay temporarily given the situation in his home country and provided with an apartment in Ansbach, Mr Herrmann added.
The minister said he was "incensed" by the attack, which he said demonstrated the need "to strengthen controls on those we have living in our country".
Mr Herrmann said the man was known to have attempted suicide twice and had spent time in a psychiatric clinic.
"We don't know if this man planned on suicide or if he had the intention of killing others," he said.
However, he added that the bomb in the backpack would have been sufficient to kill and injure many more people."

That one sentence encapsulates the stupidity of those elected to protect the people.
The terrorist makes a backpack bomb, and when refused entry to a music festival seeks out a crowded bar before detonating it.......and Herr Herrmann still speculates about it being a simple suicide!

Stark......staring......bonkers.

Ansbach explosion: Syrian asylum seeker killed by own bomb - BBC News (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36880758)

PAXfips
25th Jul 2016, 06:01
In the meantime Herrmann has changed his view to assume it really was an islamistic attack. Whodathunkit.

The attacker was refused to enter the area (and I've to add, one where fleeing would've been difficult, completly surrounded by buildings), because he had no ticket.

Maybe that makes some people think about handing out free tickets for anytime-everywhere in other cities (esp. baths).

Danke, Mutti!

Peter-RB
25th Jul 2016, 06:47
Well done Frau Merkel,

..being a leader in one of the largest Countries/members of the EU gang should/would possibly have taught her that caution should be a byword with the residents of the Middle East,...especially when she invited ALL OF THEM to come and stay... sadly this missing link of caution in her education must be the old Communists attitudes of "Do as we say"...not as we do.

She has opened up Germany and its near neighbours to lifelong security problems and on into the next century , and quite possibly beyond..through her infantile attempt at "Social Engineering " to have incomers to try to create the wealth for the great ageing population of the Germany state..Its almost fiction or Fantasy land, but whatever there really is now way out of it now..! :eek:

garp
25th Jul 2016, 09:13
What made her change her mind?

http://i68.tinypic.com/2n66j5e.png
[IMG]http://www.pprune.org/http://i68.tinypic.com/2n66j5e.png

sitigeltfel
25th Jul 2016, 09:38
What made her change her mind?

Interesting question.

In the six years since she said these words she has seen her dream of a German dominated superstate starting to unravel.
What better way to punish those who have defied her than to invite in millions of mercenaries who will adopt her scorched earth revenge, by proxy?

garp
25th Jul 2016, 10:06
^^^^^^^
Tragic but true. Also the reason I'm hoping that my children will seek greener and safer pastures in just a few years from now.

vctenderness
25th Jul 2016, 10:08
Well maybe Europe needs to ban immigration from all dangerous countries until we find out what the hell is going on here!

Cazalet33
25th Jul 2016, 10:26
The latest case (20:00z last night) involved a failed asylum seeker blowing himself up outside a music festival venue. He was known to be a mentally unbalanced self-harmer.

This arsehole was one of just 23 applicants, out of 162,510, to be refused asylum. Apparently the policy is not to deport these illegals. Instead they are given a free hotel and a bit of income.

Some say that Germans have no sense of humour. The government's choice of hotel for these Syrian crooks would suggest otherwise.

http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/3994/production/_90504741_034213290-1.jpg

garp
25th Jul 2016, 10:33
^^^^^^

Seriously, you cannot make this shit up. :sad:

Krautwald
25th Jul 2016, 11:31
Machete guy may not have been a terrorist in a political sense.

I do miss a public debate, though - about the undeniable fact that some cultures way of life will inevitable lead to an elevated level of violent crime when you put them into a free society with refined social norms and behaviors.

Some people argue that men controlling women by violence, men killing women out of jealousy and "honour", or men raping or gangraping "ownerless" women, and men dominating men they consider as being weaker, is not related to culture and origin. But it is. Not the phenomenon itself, but the likelihood, the motivation, the severeness, the form and the number of occurrences definitely is.

Applying our standards, a frighteningly large group of men from these dysfunctional societies would score high on the psychopath/sociopath scale, with low impulse control, insufficient anger management, distorted view of self, violent sexuality, misogyny at pathological levels, and so forth.

So even without political terrorism, we still have a disproportional behavior problem here. They are simply raised to act and think in ways that they regard as normalcy, whilst we regard them as deviant and destructive. You donīt need killings to see that, it starts way earlier than that, and the moderate and manageable examples still represent the core problem: if you believe in ownership of family, in violent decision making, in women not being persons, in male sexuality being irresponsible by definition, in feudal power, in religion before secular law, then you are the enemy. Simple as that.

Above The Clouds
25th Jul 2016, 11:43
What made her change her mind?

http://i68.tinypic.com/2n66j5e.png
[IMG]http://www.pprune.org/http://i68.tinypic.com/2n66j5e.png
So finally she is waking up and smelling the coffee, what was this idiot really thinking allowing 1,000,000 + to just walk across the border.

Above The Clouds
25th Jul 2016, 11:44
The Beemer driver deserves a medal!
I would have given the BMW driver two medals if he had reversed over him and completed the job properly.

Uncle Fred
25th Jul 2016, 11:51
Well said Krautwald. Well said indeed.

oldpax
25th Jul 2016, 11:53
They come from a medieval society where the religion is brainwashed into them from when they can speak and think so when they grow up its natural that they believe it all and look what happens,todays children (migrants)are tommorows bombers .Send them all back.

garp
25th Jul 2016, 11:58
So finally she is waking up and smelling the coffee, what was this idiot really thinking allowing 1,000,000 + to just walk across the border.
Do have a look at the publication date of the article.....

VP959
25th Jul 2016, 11:59
Machete guy may not have been a terrorist in a political sense.

I do miss a public debate, though - about the undeniable fact that some cultures way of life will inevitable lead to an elevated level of violent crime when you put them into a free society with refined social norms and behaviors.

Some people argue that men controlling women by violence, men killing women out of jealousy and "honour", or men raping or gangraping "ownerless" women, and men dominating men they consider as being weaker, is not related to culture and origin. But it is. Not the phenomenon itself, but the likelihood, the motivation, the severeness, the form and the number of occurrences definitely is.

Applying our standards, a frighteningly large group of men from these dysfunctional societies would score high on the psychopath/sociopath scale, with low impulse control, insufficient anger management, distorted view of self, violent sexuality, misogyny at pathological levels, and so forth.

So even without political terrorism, we still have a disproportional behavior problem here. They are simply raised to act and think in ways that they regard as normalcy, whilst we regard them as deviant and destructive. You donīt need killings to see that, it starts way earlier than that, and the moderate and manageable examples still represent the core problem: if you believe in ownership of family, in violent decision making, in women not being persons, in male sexuality being irresponsible by definition, in feudal power, in religion before secular law, then you are the enemy. Simple as that.
I'm afraid that I think you are right. Here we've had an ongoing problem that isn't terrorism, but is simply a clash of cultures. We've had "honour killings", where the perpetrators believe it is their duty to kill someone, gangs of men of Asian origin who have abducted, detained, drugged and gang raped young girls, because it is what they do in their culture (a look at how India is tackling this gives n idea of the scale of the problem) and a refusal to believe that the laws of our country apply to them, that somehow they should be subject to a different set of laws, just because of their cultural background.

This is not just people who have moved to the UK, either. A friend of mine (now retired) was a police officer, and she had to deal with a case where a young woman had been beaten and her face disfigured for life with a sharp knife, by her own brother. Both were born here in the UK, and their parents had lived here for around 30 years. The brother assaulted her because he had seen her going out with someone after school.

I remember clearly the amazement expressed by my friend when she interviewed him. He apparently couldn't see that he had done anything at all wrong. In his view his sister was the one that had done wrong, by being intimate with someone when it was his families responsibility to give her a husband, not hers. When he was charged he still refused to accept he'd done anything wrong, and ended up with a more severe sentence as a consequence, as he pleaded not guilty, despite legal advice that the evidence against him was overwhelming and that he freely admitted the assault.

We're not going to resolve this fundamental problem without doing something better than just spout forth a few platitudes about "better integration".

Above The Clouds
25th Jul 2016, 12:04
Garp
Do have a look at the publication date of the article…..


Excactly, and 6 years later she still didn't learn and just let them all walk in.

Peter-RB
25th Jul 2016, 12:04
Not long ago the Chancellor Frau Merkel, was saying the ageing population of Germany would run out of enough tax paying workers to keep them all in pensions, and suggested that would be good enough reason to "Invite " the middle east to come to Germany, we even on the News programmes saw badly informed citizen of various German Towns and cities standing like lemons holding placards telling the migrants they were all "welcome" have non of these placard wavers and or the Germany Government ever looked at how the Middle east Live, or do they feel they would all be Oil well owning Rolls Royce Driving well dressed and reasonable people, the majority who walked from the ME are uneducated (at least by Western Standards) so how were they going to set to and build up the coffers for the German Pensioners..
Total and utterly dereliction of COMMON SENSE by the German Government and the Fluffies who welcomed the immigrants, why not give all the male immigrants your daughters now, for they do not understand the Western way of Courtship or delicacy when talking to a female, they just want to get going , your German Government deserve all they get, but sadly its the German populations, who have all fought and worked really hard to throw off what their forefathers were involved in, are almost going back to the stone-age right now !

Krautwald
25th Jul 2016, 12:14
Could be an ivory tower problem. Anybody who has worked in large institutions over the past 2 decades, will know how detached and clueless leadership can be. Just look at them preferring gilded 26year old external consultants over their own experienced staff any day. I am pretty sure that this is no different in politics.

If this continues for long enough, leaders begin to believe in the expertise made to order to fit a beforehand agenda. It wouldīt surprise me the least if Merkel and the likes actually believe that Germany has millions of jobs (they donīt!), that all of the jobs are a big plus in taxes and pension (most are not!), and that it is sufficient to import a million people under 30 to fill them (it isnīt!), while the reformed (=crippled) social system can take care of the few unwilling (it canīt!). Simply because that is the narrative they themselves have been using to sell themselves internationally for so long. They probably never see any numbers or reports that suggest otherwise, and they certainly have no personal connection with normal life any longer, that could correct them a little bit.

Let them eat cake?

meadowrun
25th Jul 2016, 13:25
If Germany really thought there would be serious pension and worker shortfalls caused by an aging population they should have first considered attracting their fellow EU citizens to their workforces in greater numbers and from their own backyard.

Lonewolf_50
25th Jul 2016, 13:47
@meadowrun: while that makes sense, the Germans were importing gastarbeiter into Germany before I first lived there in the 1970's, mostly from Turkey at that point. The declared reason was "labor shortage" after WW II. Other nations had similar programs.
The Netherlands and Belgium gastarbeider
Sweden, Denmark, Norway and Finland: arbetskraftsinvandring
East Germany had Vertragsarbeiter"

A European cultural root to this continuing seems to be the low birth rate, which indicates a series of societal choices not to promote homegrown population increase, but import it. The Italians of my generation came from good-sized families, but they are having a lot fewer children.

Frau Merkel may or may not be making mistakes. The root problem is about a half a century old.

vctenderness
25th Jul 2016, 14:31
Is it not totally unacceptable for 'Spud' Merkell to have invited everyone to come to Germany when Schengen exists?

If Germany had closed borders with its other European neighbours it may have been acceptable however once this million or so mostly young males were inside Germany they can move anywhere unhindered.

That is not what 'free movement' was meant to do. It was free movement of EU citizens not free movement of the Middle East and Africa.:ugh:

Krautwald
25th Jul 2016, 14:35
True, but that "root problem" actually makes sense. Automatised jobs, low infant mortality, housing shortage, job shortage... it is only in terms of a greedy system that we are too few. Biologically speaking, the world is immensely overpopulated and the developed countries are reacting just right: by having few children and putting immense effort into their upbringing.

Now where this becomes a problem is when you choose to not live through the demographic side effects (i.e. system crisis) but import all those children from evolution-resistant places of the earth. In terms of the system, these are the wrong people to fill in, and in terms of evolution and resources, they are also too many. Too many in their home countries, and too many to integrate in a finely balanced and complex society.

We are missing the chance to shrink Europe to fit, by rewarding unsustainable behavior elsewhere. That GUEST workers never returned and eventually grew into whole clans with a questionable tax impact, is just one of our big mistakes.

Uncle Fred
25th Jul 2016, 14:52
Der Spiegel (SPON) reporting that the police have found quite a trove of material at the suspect's flat. Bomb making equipment and instructions, the usual radicalization sites, multiple phones and sim cards, etc. Oh...of course there is the video with the death to the infidels nonsense. Pretty much what seems to be standard kit these days in this milieu of gents keen to carry out attacks.

Either way, it has the clear marks of a planned attack. Herrmann and Demaiziere have spoken but as far as I can tell no words yet from Kaiserin Mutti.

Edit: Authorities are plussing up the police numbers at the Flughafen and Hauptbahnhof in Berlin. No concrete warning though so it might just be a precaution...developing

Wir schaffen das!

sitigeltfel
25th Jul 2016, 15:20
I would have given the BMW driver two medals if he had reversed over him and completed the job properly.

For that, the driver would probably end up in jail.

Lonewolf_50
25th Jul 2016, 15:34
For that, the driver would probably end up in jail. But he'd have two medals. :ok: @Uncle Fred: the past few days wir schiessen das has gained in popularity. :eek:

LTNman
25th Jul 2016, 16:08
Merkel and her European cronies criticised Hungary for putting up fences. No prizes for thinking which country has no terrorist problem.

She has sown the seed and now Germany reaps her reward.

Uncle Fred
25th Jul 2016, 17:18
@Uncle Fred: the past few days wir schiessen das has gained in popularity.

Lonewolf, I have to admit that even though it is rather a touch of gallows humour and with all due respect to those affected by the situation, that was downright funny--great play with the words. The definition indeed of drole.

Uncle Fred
25th Jul 2016, 21:20
Douglas Murray, writing in the Speccie, has some interesting thoughts on this: Terror is the new normal for Germany and France | Coffee House (http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/07/terror-new-normal-germany-france/?_ga=1.134130119.83446721.1455897487)

Hard to argue with much of that.

Lonewolf_50
25th Jul 2016, 22:21
It is this juxtaposition that ought to make newspaper and TV editors think, but won't ...
Nevertheless, this is going to require caution. When an Iranian born in Germany can be portrayed as a white nationalist but a set of ‘Allahu Akbar’-shouting Mohammeds are symptomatic of nothing in particular, you know our continent is engaged in a piece of cognitive dissonance from which we will be wrestled only very reluctantly. I offer the willful rejection of the obvious in the San Bernardino shooting a few months ago as a similar pathology on another continent.

Uncle Fred
26th Jul 2016, 03:33
Indeed. Another area in which the news reporting is making themselves obvious (whereas they should be solely reporting) is in very quickly claiming in some of the cases that the alleged perp did/does not show any links with IS.

Ok. No links to IS. They are not the only extremist group in town (so to speak) and so not having a link to them does not mean that one is not dealing with a radicalized perp.

Admittedly there might be no connection at all and it might "just" be a case of extreme violence seeded by any number of issues--mental health included.

That however, is the purpose of a thorough investigation. Having the media breathlessly trot out that one is not a member of IS does not always mean case closed.

Why are the officials and the members of the press so afraid of just letting the facts speak for themselves. It would actually help dampen pre-judgment at times and give the public a truer picture of what it does, and does not, face. No one is advocating being provocative but surely intelligent public answers are not going to spring from having old Auntie Beeb play word games.

Lonewolf_50
26th Jul 2016, 04:42
Sorry, I'll fix that, brain flatus. I have to go back to the bottle of JD and ask for the rest of my brain back.

sitigeltfel
26th Jul 2016, 06:05
Muslims disrupt Munich memorial site with shouts of "Allahu Akbar"

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=eda_1469468339


Tap the picture header to read the narrative.

Jetex_Jim
26th Jul 2016, 06:14
Muslims disrupt Munich memorial site with shouts of "Allahu Akbar"

Man in tracksuit in shouting match outside shopping mall.

That's big news...

sitigeltfel
26th Jul 2016, 07:32
Man in tracksuit in shouting match outside shopping mall.

That's big news...

It takes a special type of person who can dismiss an insult to the dead and maimed.

DirtyProp
26th Jul 2016, 08:07
Oh goody, what a strange coincidence:

Law enforcement officials in central Poland said Monday that a 48-year-old Iraqi man has been arrested on charges of possessing explosives.

The arrest on Sunday in Lodz took place just days before Pope Francis comes to Poland to meet with hundreds of thousands of young people from around the globe for celebrations of the World Youth Day. Poland's Interior Minister Mariusz Blaszczak says the gathering will be safe.

Beata Marczak, spokeswoman for prosecutors in Lodz said that "small amounts of explosives, not sufficient to make an explosion" were found on the man. He could face up to eight years in prison if convicted on charges of illegal possession of explosives.

The man was questioned in English and put under two months' arrest, but there were "no grounds for allegations of terrorism," Marczak said.

Poland Arrests Iraqi Man for Possession of Explosives - ABC News (http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/poland-arrests-foreigner-possession-explosives-40847701)

Peter-RB
26th Jul 2016, 09:24
Given the past history of the Poles and what they had to endure, I would say IMO they are being too Politically Correct in saying the man with explosives may not be prosecuted, Unless he is an Iraqi Quarry owner/blasting engineer, then ..why ? would he have explosives on his person...

If he was in the US, one hour after being arrested he would be on Rikers Island shuffling around in chains..!:eek: