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View Full Version : 14 hour delays for the British but not if you live in Belgium


LTNman
24th Jul 2016, 09:12
So the French have stepped up security at their border point at Dover resulting in 14 hour delays.

I wonder why the French are more relaxed with security at their border crossings with Belgium, Germany, Italy, Luxembourg, Monaco, Spain and Switzerland.

Maybe it is because the French trade unions are not holding a strike this weekend that the French Government has decided to target the British again who always seem to be the victim of French action.

Sometimes I think they they just don't like us!:yuk:

sitigeltfel
24th Jul 2016, 09:23
Have you never heard of Schengen?

LTNman
24th Jul 2016, 09:39
Yes I have heard of Schengen but Schengen makes a mockery of French claims to be increasing security when Belgium citizens can just drive over the border without checks and cause a massacre. This is France playing politics and has nothing to do with protecting France.

Sallyann1234
24th Jul 2016, 09:48
If it's playing politics it isn't working very well.

The BBC news last night interviewed two stranded motorists. From their accents, one was French and the other German.

ATNotts
24th Jul 2016, 09:56
The reporting of this really makes me laugh - in irony.

The French are simply doing what the UKBA has been doing at Eurotunnel, and presumably at Calais port since Theresa May decreed that they could no longer use their common sense in checking passports, but instead behave like US Immigration.

Of course, if the UK does it (in France) we're protecting our borders - if the French doing it (in UK), they're just being bloody awkward / inefficient.

Iv'e been through Coquelles this year, and been held up 2 hours by UKBA, NOT by "increased security" (checking vehicles for explosives and the like). Delays at Eurotunnel UK terminal this morning are 60 minutes. The Dover debacle is largely due to the usual cock-up which is UK infrastructure planning.

KING6024
24th Jul 2016, 09:57
From what I've read and heard the big problem is a shortage of French Border Staff in Dover,from what I've read British Border Staff are being drafted in to assist.It seems a bit daft to a start crackdown without having the resources in place.

Peter-RB
24th Jul 2016, 10:10
Typical French..Anglo British type of co-operation.... would hate to see what would happen if Tanks started rolling across the broad plains of Poland agin..!!.... would we and the good ole US of A become preferred partners again..??

wiggy
24th Jul 2016, 10:13
From what I've been hearing from someone who was struck at Dover yesterday it's what ATNotts says.

Frankly you can't instantly implement tighter Border controls (going either way) and have seamless Border crossing....

Maybe it is because the French trade unions are not holding a strike this weekend that the French Government has decided to target the British again who always seem to be the victim of French action.

BTW it's not unusual these days to be stuck in lengthy queues on the Autoroute trying to cross the Spanish/French Border near us at La Jonquera..... but of course that doesn't tend to make the UK news..so it's all down to the dastardly French having a go at the Brits......

ATNotts
24th Jul 2016, 10:25
The whole passport checking thing (to the extent that UKBA do it in France and the French are now seemingly doing it in Dover and presumably Folkestone) is nothing more than pure political grandstanding to satisfy a domestic audience.

I would happily sit in a two hour queue if I thought that proper security checks (checking under vehicles, bonnets, in boots, rucksacks and the like) were actually being done - but unless anything has changed in the last 4 weeks, they're not. Swabbing a steering wheel and checking door handles for explosive residue doesn't cut the mustard.

ciderman
24th Jul 2016, 10:42
Can anyone explain why my daughter and her family left Somerset at 0300 this morning and were in the tunnel at 0800? We looked at the news last night and it seemed that there was no other way to the tunnel than get in those queues which were for the ferries. She sounds incredibly lucky to me. I am puzzled.

ATNotts
24th Jul 2016, 10:55
Can anyone explain why my daughter and her family left Somerset at 0300 this morning and were in the tunnel at 0800? We looked at the news last night and it seemed that there was no other way to the tunnel than get in those queues which were for the ferries. She sounds incredibly lucky to me. I am puzzled.
The infrastructure at Eurotunnel is infinitely better than at Dover, they have more land to work with at the tunnel terminal, and I am guessing, there is more covert, electronic security at the Eurotunnel terminal.

I went through Dover last autumn, diverted from Eurotunnel because of migrant issues, and even though it was comparatively quiet, it still took just short of an hour to get to the P+O check-in there. it is hard to see where they could get the extra land to improve logistics at Dover - perhaps the Chinese could help when they've finished building islands in the South China Sea!!

Just add, the tunnel exit from the M20 is well short of Dover, so the queues started beyond the exit.

Windy Militant
24th Jul 2016, 10:59
Originally Posted by ciderman
Can anyone explain why my daughter and her family left Somerset at 0300 this morning and were in the tunnel at 0800? We looked at the news last night and it seemed that there was no other way to the tunnel than get in those queues which were for the ferries. She sounds incredibly lucky to me. I am puzzled.

They didn't go by train by any chance! ;)

Gertrude the Wombat
24th Jul 2016, 11:30
The UK has voted for stricter border controls.


The #brexit voters should be pleased that this has been introduced early.


Get used to it.

Above The Clouds
24th Jul 2016, 11:40
The UK has voted for stricter border controls.


The #brexit voters should be pleased that this has been introduced early.


Get used to it.
Marvellous; 'Brexit' is already having an effect on controlling our borders.

Fully agree with the statement ^^^^^ from Gertrude the Wombat.

ciderman
24th Jul 2016, 11:44
Thanks Notty. That explains all. She was expecting trouble but very glad she booked the Tunnel.

ATNotts
24th Jul 2016, 11:48
Thanks Notty. That explains all. She was expecting trouble but very glad she booked the Tunnel.
No problem. Hope she isn't returning through Coquelles on a Saturday afternoon! She'll find it slower coming back due to UKBA. I'd be interested to hear how she gets on then.

vctenderness
24th Jul 2016, 12:27
I heard on the radio this morning that on the busiest day of the year for cross channel traffic the French had ONE official checking passports and vehicles at Dover.

In my opinion it has nothing to do with Brexit and all to do with French working practices and sheer bloodymindness.

The conspiracy theorists trying to pin it on Hollande seem to miss the fact that the large majority of these travellers are off to French resorts to spend their money and support the failing French economy.

sitigeltfel
24th Jul 2016, 12:28
Yes I have heard of Schengen but Schengen makes a mockery of French claims to be increasing security when Belgium citizens can just drive over the border without checks and cause a massacre. This is France playing politics and has nothing to do with protecting France.

You refer to a historical event, there is a new reality. Belgium is not the only access to France. Security has been stepped up at many other access points, docks, airports etc. and there are only so many staff to go around. French security forces are under severe strain with leave, holidays etc. cancelled. Calling up the reserves might ease things a bit but many of them are currently undergoing refresher/firearms training before they can be deployed.

wiggy
24th Jul 2016, 13:07
Vc...

You are right, it is nothing to do with Brexit...but as sitigeltfel as rightly pointed out post Nice serious questions are being asked of certain French politicians about security measures and the whole French security apparatus is severely overstretched, even with the call up of reserves.

I really don't think Dover is being singled out for "special measures" or being picked on, but it seems to be a choke point and I suspect what has happened in the last couple of days is collateral damage in the French "fight against terror".

ExXB
24th Jul 2016, 14:39
No sign of any French border controllers on the Frontier with Switzerland today. As the Swiss guys stop their spot-checks after the French shops close at midday Sunday, it's wide open now.

As the UK moves from EU to something else, I don't expect this will improve for the Brits.

HeartyMeatballs
24th Jul 2016, 15:43
Well its just politics and no coincidence that it is the first week of the English school holidays.

They have made it so public that they are tightening checks. If I was a terrorist there is no way I'm waiting in a 12 hour queue no matter how determined I am. I'd simply hop on a ferry to Amsterdam or Zeebrugge and simply drive accross the border into France.

Remind me how many terror attacks have occurred in France by UK nationals?

meadowrun
24th Jul 2016, 15:44
Are people complaining about one hours delay in boarding a ferry somewhere?


It does seem the ffrench have got their state of emergency arse backwards. Their clearly defined security problem is entry to France from directions other than west and from those illegals they've already let in using France as somewhere just to get the hell out of as soon as possible towards the west.


But, everyone must be equal, nevermind all those reported unmanned border crossings here and there.

wiggy
24th Jul 2016, 16:12
If it's any consolation I have just been reminded that my eldest was returning to France from Barca a couple of weeks back on a French coach and had to sit in a queue for an hour and was then subject a 40 minute delay whilst French customs and Police went through all the passengers docs and baggage at the French/Spanish border...and this was just before the Nice attacks....

But those of us who live on the " mainland " are obviously wrong ... so I'll bow to the DM and those with greater knowledge who are adamant that this delay at Dover is solely aimed at the Brits, is simply down to French spite over Brexit and that no other Crossing points into France are routinely subject to checks and delays.

HeartyMeatballs
24th Jul 2016, 16:23
One must ask however when Brussels is the terror capital of Europe why the France/Belgium border is allowing the free flow of people between the countries. They are very selective over who they check. Perhaps they know something we don't know. But then again they're probably just being difficult.

Standby Scum
24th Jul 2016, 16:52
Don't forget chaps, the French are always there when they need us.

Gertrude the Wombat
24th Jul 2016, 16:54
Perhaps they know something we don't know.
Quite a lot, probably, in places where people have to have ID cards, have to show then on demand to police and others, have to register where they live, ect ect. It's the complete free-for-all of the UK not being a police state that they have trouble with.

ciderman
24th Jul 2016, 18:13
"Don't forget chaps, the French are always there when they need us."

Remind me please when the French last won a war?

strake
24th Jul 2016, 18:20
For what it's worth, we have a gite in France and our guests drove down from Dover via ferry. They left their house in London at 6am yesterday and arrived with us in SW France (near Saintes) at 03:30. 21 hour journey.

Pontius Navigator
24th Jul 2016, 18:47
Not just UK, shortly after the Brussels shooting we saw a Dutch border patrol stopping vehicles from Germany, then we went through a Germany check point.

Alsacienne
24th Jul 2016, 18:49
I have previously found that the Border Control checks in both Calais and Dover to be lacking in rigour.

Whilst I have maximum sympathy for those stuck in their cars, has no one considered that, whilst the matters of the Brexit and French trade unions may have some bearing on the situation, the most obvious reason is surely that the French have extended their period of Vigipirate following the atrocity in Nice on Bastille Day.

SMT Member
24th Jul 2016, 22:18
I wonder why the French are more relaxed with security at their border crossings with Belgium, Germany, Italy, Luxembourg, Monaco, Spain and Switzerland.


I wonder why, bit more than a month ago when entering France from Belgium by car enroute to Le Mans, that we were subjected to a stop and passport check by the French borderpolice? The reason for my wonderment is, that I've just learned here that the French only bothers les Rossbiffs when they attempt a hop across the Channel, whilst leaving every other border open.

Or, rather, stop talking bollocks mate and get a grip on reality. By far, very far indeed by the looks of it, the longest wait is on the UK side of the water. Now, who's responsible for that? Who were the numpties who put up the infrastructure there? Who's not a member of Schengen? Who want's to leave the union?

And, yet, you blame the Frence. As always, how frigging original!

Fairdealfrank
24th Jul 2016, 22:33
The question has to be asked: why hasn't the UK border control been doing this?

It's too easy to acquire the tools of terrorism in some parts of Europe then transport them over national boundaries accross the continent right up to the UK border. It's also dead easy for people traffickers and drugs smugglers.

France lost control of its borders years ago, the presence of the Calais "jungle" is a permanent reminder of this.

FlyMD
24th Jul 2016, 23:42
It's a well-known fact that the English like waiting in line, and also that the rest of the Brits are made to do what the English like. So, despite your very rude vote, Europe gives you what you like, and now you don't like it?! Ah putain, merde, jamais contents les Anglais......

messybeast
25th Jul 2016, 00:35
Fairdealfrank,

Britain has been doing this, in France, for some time under the Treaty of Le Touquet, with control posts at Calais and Dunkirk staffed by UK Border Force personnel.

The responsibility for the problems in this case lies with France, who are responsible for staffing the exit Border Control Points at Dover, and they have either underestimated demand or have been unable to supply the level of staffing required. The problem on Friday was caused because only between one and three points were open. UK Border Force have now had to step in to help.

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juxtaposed_controls for more information.

llondel
25th Jul 2016, 01:30
One must ask however when Brussels is the terror capital of Europe why the France/Belgium border is allowing the free flow of people between the countries. They are very selective over who they check. Perhaps they know something we don't know. But then again they're probably just being difficult.

Wouldn't it be nice if they decided to clamp down on the day the EU Parliament has to decamp to Strasbourg.

llondel
25th Jul 2016, 01:31
"Don't forget chaps, the French are always there when they need us."

Remind me please when the French last won a war?

They don't win many but they're very accommodating when it comes to providing a venue for one.

Checkboard
25th Jul 2016, 02:13
Typical French..Anglo British type of co-operation.... would hate to see what would happen if Tanks started rolling across the broad plains of Poland agin..!!.... would we and the good ole US of A become preferred partners again..?? Navy in 1939:

http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv20/Checkboard/1939%20fleet_zpsv4bsects.jpg

Navy now:

http://i665.photobucket.com/albums/vv20/Checkboard/aafeb38f-93c6-4d6a-99cd-6583b601b610_zpsozbvg3sf.png


... I really don't think they would care that much.

ExXB
25th Jul 2016, 12:32
Pots calling the kettle black.

Heathrow passport queues: Staff brought in from ports - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36868585)

EGLD
25th Jul 2016, 12:39
The UK has voted for stricter border controls.


The #brexit voters should be pleased that this has been introduced early.


Get used to it.

Remainiacs desperately looking for opportunities to stick the boot in over what's looking like a masterstroke vote to leave the EU! :D

Pretty poor effort this one lads :=

ukc_mike
25th Jul 2016, 12:42
Just to add a fact. I'm British, live in Belgium and returned home on Saturday.

3 hour queue on A2, 2 hours queue in port before border check then 90 minutes to the checkin booth. (Randomly selected for port security check added 5 minutes.) 4 hours late onto the ferry and home.

So, no 14 hours and nobody asked where I lived.

radeng
25th Jul 2016, 23:57
No sign of any French border controllers on the Frontier with Switzerland today.

Certainly wasn't last Friday early afternoon either.......Or was it because my driver happened to be an extremely good looking 23 year old blonde girl?

ExXB
26th Jul 2016, 09:44
Radeng, If that story is true then I would have expected the French officers to have made a point to do a security check on your vehicle an its contents.

Even when the crossings are unmanned there are video cameras checking the number plates and facial features etc. Recently someone 'known to the police' tried to sneak back into Switzerland and was caught 3kms after the crossing.

Perhaps I could ask for a recap of the highlights of last Friday afternoon!

ukc_mike
26th Jul 2016, 11:38
Think yourself lucky you were not on the M/A20 then. They were tailed back to the Hythe junction when I drove past on Saturday and sat in the road not moving.
No luck involved - local radio was broadcasting the queue lengths at 15 minute intervals.

It probably helped I know the area and have a satnav app that is very good at comparing possible routes (in the past its taken me off the M20 to the A2, so when it disagreed with the gantry signs I was inclined to trust it).

HeartyMeatballs
26th Jul 2016, 11:50
14 hour delays for the UK, yet more terrorist attacks in France. The French will see right through this pathetic high profile policing. The French should be crying out for real action on their high risk borders. The U.K. crossing is a soft target, and what better way to get back at those pesky difficult Brits. The normal people in France are once again paying the price for the failure and misguided actions of their government. I hope Hollande is booed again.

Fairdealfrank
26th Jul 2016, 12:30
It's a well-known fact that the English like waiting in line, and also that the rest of the Brits are made to do what the English like. So, despite your very rude vote, Europe gives you what you like, and now you don't like it?! Ah putain, merde, jamais contents les Anglais...... What is a "rude vote"? Don't understand, maybe lost in translation?

"Europe gives you what you like, and now you don't like it?!" What are you talking about? it sounds a bit like the words of an embittered old remainiac.


14 hour delays for the UK, yet more terrorist attacks in France. The French will see right through this pathetic high profile policing. The French should be crying out for real action on their high risk borders. The U.K. crossing is a soft target, and what better way to get back at those pesky difficult Brits. The normal people in France are once again paying the price for the failure and misguided actions of their government. I hope Hollande is booed again.

Doesn't need booing, needs voting out next March (or is it April). Looks like that will happen, or Hollande won't stand for re-election. He would not get past the first round, even he must see the writing on the wall.

FlyMD
26th Jul 2016, 14:11
Fairdealfrank, if you don't have either a sense of humor or a an irony detector, what is it exactly that you do have left to offer the world?

EGLD
26th Jul 2016, 19:22
despite your very rude vote

Our "rude" vote? I've heard it called many things, but... :D

How dare we be so "rude" as to speak against the almighty and all knowing EU :oh:

Nothing new here, remaniac lunatics

30 June 2015
Travel chaos continues on both sides of the Channel tunnel today as strikes at the port of Calais disrupt ferry services.

Apr 12, 2015
New passport checks lead to 10-mile traffic jam leading into Dover

2 June 2012
Traffic heading for Dover came to a standstill after eight-mile queues built up as bank holiday travellers headed for the Kent ferry port.

edi_local
26th Jul 2016, 19:34
Britain bangs on about "getting back control" and "strengthening the borders" and now it's gone and been voted for, so we can't blame the French for doing the same thing. If the French are purely doing this to pick on us and show us what we have coming then good on them. Not being in the EU makes the UK even more foreign to France so they have every right to delay people as much as possible when entering their country form outside the EU...I realise that day is yet to come, but as we aren't in Schengen either then we can't moan as France is upholding its duty of protecting the border free area too. When the day comes that we do eventually brexit then I presume we will get back that long lamented "UK passports only" line at the border (haven't missed it to be honest) so we will no doubt throw all the EU nationals into the "other" line and make them wait while we process the world and their dog. Remember, that's the treatment we will get in Europe too, so it's only fair it's reciprocated. The French are just getting in a bit early.

G-CPTN
26th Jul 2016, 22:31
Back in 1968, I was 'parachuted' into Germany at two days notice to replace an English work colleague who was 'urgently recalled' for 'misbehaviour'.

I do not recall any complicated procedure was necessary before I jumped on an aircraft and flew to Frankfurt, nor any embarrassing questions during the months that I worked at our German facility.

1968 was before Britain joined the EEC - so why was it so easy for me to enter Germany for working?

My point is, will it not return to that situation when we leave the EU?

meadowrun
26th Jul 2016, 23:47
1/ Were you doing a specialized job a German could not do, or be found to do.
2/ You were company staff replacing company staff.
3/ You were benefiting a company in Germany and therefore Germany/


Returning to that situation depends solely on what political minefields are sown in your path and called punishment in whispers.

G-CPTN
27th Jul 2016, 00:07
1/ Were you doing a specialized job a German could not do, or be found to do.
2/ You were company staff replacing company staff.
3/ You were benefiting a company in Germany and therefore Germany/


Returning to that situation depends solely on what political minefields are sown in your path and called punishment in whispers.
I was employed in the UK for a GM subsidiary, and we were doing work (for the UK subsidiary) using premises and facilities of the German GM subsidiary.

I was supervising UK employees, and, as mentioned, I replaced a UK manager who the company decided 'needed to be brought home' (to avoid possible embarrassing outcomes) - so it is possible that the initial set-up of the arrangement had involved negotiations, and I was just a 'spare part' - ie a replacement for a previously agreed 'alien' - though I was never aware of any paperwork or 'visa' - I was simply told to collect my passport and report to Heathrow and catch the flight (all this happened within two days over a weekend).

There was nothing that I did that couldn't have been done by German staff, other than that the work was on UK products for the UK division.

There was no benefit for the German company (although they were cooperative whenever we needed help - although I do not remember needing help from them).

We used the German facilities, including the loan of German fleet vehicles for our employees to travel to and from the place of work to our hotels.

We ate in the on-site canteen at the same times as the German employees (I don't remember whether we paid).