View Full Version : TT 737 Fleet
Helmethead
6th Jun 2016, 13:17
I'm hearing all 737 fleet for TT and getting added to VA pilot list any truth to this ? and if so what's the benefit for anybody either in VA or TT ?
Break Right
7th Jun 2016, 02:42
Yes and yes.
Ha I would like to see this happen, tiger guys will hate the thought of VA FO taking their commands.
VH-FTS
7th Jun 2016, 03:30
Ha I would like to see this happen, tiger guys will hate the thought of VA FO taking their commands.
If it did happen, why would it be any different to the 'Y' integration lists previously used. Each side is then protected and new guys are at the bottom of both lists.
Berealgetreal
7th Jun 2016, 03:57
Benefit? Ask the VARA F50 guys.
The joint list allows people to move around as life and needs change. What seems unpalatable today turns out to an be an option tomorrow. You never know what can happen in life or where you might end up.
But by far the greatest benefit is when a fleet/company is scrapped and redundancies are looking likely. With a joint list it's unlikely someone more qualified (type rated and current) will be hired from outside whilst you are on the phone to your bank manager.
Unpredictable industry, having options is a good thing.
wheels_down
7th Jun 2016, 05:15
Expect an announcement shortly on A320 and A321neo.
A321LR is going to be a great machine, especially Aus-Asia.
Beer Baron
7th Jun 2016, 05:23
Expect an announcement shortly on A320 and A321neo.
Really? Haven't VA already ordered a bunch of MAX's? Or do you mean more 320's for TT and no consolidation between VA/TT?
jibba_jabba
7th Jun 2016, 05:43
..........
kirkbridge
7th Jun 2016, 06:54
321NEO? Tell him he's dreaming.
Confirmed that TT on the bottom of the list. VA pilots to have priority over TT 737 positions.
Happy Christmas
jibba_jabba
7th Jun 2016, 07:06
Confirmed that TT on the bottom of the list. VA pilots to have priority over TT 737 positions.
Ha, wind up alert.......
You got it right....va dreaming....
Going Nowhere
7th Jun 2016, 07:17
Aren't the TT 737 flights flown by VA pilots anyway?
jibba_jabba
7th Jun 2016, 07:18
not for long aparently
aintsaying
8th Jun 2016, 00:05
So you are saying VA has finished its fleet review. You are saying that TT will become an all 737 Fleet.
So when will VA take over the maintenance of the TT fleet?
When will VA take over operational functions? Example: MOC?Planning?Scheduling? etc?
Will VA get those TT aircraft parked in Alice Springs back into service?
This sounds interesting.......
wheels_down
8th Jun 2016, 02:01
Indigo are soon to drop 12 A320s back to Tiger after the short term leases end.
These were all new aircraft, these are replacing end of leases in Singapore and Australia.
Octane
8th Jun 2016, 02:42
My bro is a VA Captain flying TT (737) aircraft for the time being. The problem is apparently lack of TT crew interest in converting to the 737. He's not too concerned, enjoys his Bali jaunts as you would!
PoppaJo
8th Jun 2016, 05:25
Lack of interest no surprise....
Majority of Tiger Pilots are heavy on Airbus Time, would probably be more attractive options in Asia than sinking to the bottom of the 737 list.
A330 opportunities would probably change that...
Summer Lovin
8th Jun 2016, 05:56
Apparently it's written into the Tiger EBA that existing FOs will have command priority to guard against expansion and amalgamation. The FOs are looking at a very rosy future indeed! Good luck to them.
Capt Fathom
8th Jun 2016, 11:59
Where is BNEA320?
aintsaying
8th Jun 2016, 21:21
So when will VA take over the maintenance of the TT fleet?
When will VA take over operational functions? Example: MOC?Planning?Scheduling? etc?
Berealgetreal
9th Jun 2016, 05:23
Is it there is a clause for Direct Entry Captains? Mate of mine (73 Skipper) from the sandpit is pretty excited at the prospect of coming back.
With issues such as:
1. Donald Trump
2. Apartment glut SYD/MEL
3. Election/negative gearing issues
4. VA Capital restructure
I think the bottom of the list is more of a concern!
Toluene Diisocyanate
9th Jun 2016, 07:35
Berealgetreal: absolutely no chance whatsoever of DE captains.
They have a well-established seniority list with highly experienced crew suitable for upgrade.
Hope your mate has good luck at Bankstown getting a job :)
Goat Whisperer
9th Jun 2016, 09:56
I don't even think the ATR will see another DEC.
I don't know how people are jumping to the conclusion that no TT crew are interested in the 737 when they haven't even bidded yet.
Time will tell, and I dare say it will 90% be filled internally.
morno
Helmethead
5th Jul 2016, 23:38
It's true A320s gone over next 3 years. Replaced by 737s a real cost saving there retraining all the pilots to 737.
porch monkey
5th Jul 2016, 23:44
Yeah, a one off cost versus the ongoing costs of having 2 fleets with everything separated. :rolleyes:
kirkbridge
5th Jul 2016, 23:49
Management: TT A320s being replaced with VA metal one for one over the next three years, although apparently not affecting virgin employees at all.
Translation: All A320s to go by year's end. Virgin domestic routes decimated. Waiting list for new VA hires to transition to domestic has increased ever so slightly to infinity.
TBM-Legend
5th Jul 2016, 23:59
Both foreign owned carriers, what does it matter?
neville_nobody
6th Jul 2016, 00:02
absolutely no chance whatsoever of DE captains
That will depend on how many Tiger guys have Boeing experience. Usually CASA will want a percentage of the crew to have type experience. If hypothetically noone in Tiger had Boeing time you will find there will be a few DE commands for people with experience
porch monkey
6th Jul 2016, 00:05
So you think virgin can train enough crews to replace all the A 320 airframes by years end? You've obviously never worked in the VA training department.
porch monkey
6th Jul 2016, 00:07
The DE issue has already been discussed, and the basic rule set is that there may be DE's for both seats, allegedly for fixed time, then either out the door, or to the bottom of the list if there are spots available. Now where have I heard that before........
Who's to say that there aren't plenty of experienced Boeing drivers at Tiger already?
Ten Two Hundred
6th Jul 2016, 00:46
Now if only there was one pilot group on the one contract. Is this even possible under current regulations (I think not??). Group pilots either went to work as a Tigerair pilot (egos permitting) or a Virgin pilot for the day.
The benefits are twofold. This gives management access to a huge common resource pool of pilots they can use for either brand, with some serious savings to be made. It also alleviates the concerns of VA pilots having their career stunted.
Only problem is, most likely this common contract would be similar to the Tigerair contract or worse.
PoppaJo
6th Jul 2016, 05:45
This has been around the traps for a few months now....Jetstar were recently talking to Tiger drivers.
Some have accepted offers, including myself.
cavemanzk
6th Jul 2016, 07:16
Wouldn't it be funny if NZ picked up TT 14x A320, then used them against Virgin along with the already trained TT drivers?
14x A320 would nicely fill the gap on the Tasman, should NZ choose to end there Tasman agreement with Virgin.
It would also allow them to open up more direct route ex-AKL, removing the needed VA domestic connections.
Could enable
AKL-CBR
AKL-HBA
AKL-PPQ
heard a rumor that they are exploring 24 month contractors for tigerair, all makes sense now. DEC are coming.
Gate_15L
6th Jul 2016, 10:59
Tiger to be all 737s.
A320s are going....
TWOTBAGS
6th Jul 2016, 11:42
All the major lessors and have been tramping a path to Macquarie Place of late.
Word is that 320's returned, with 738 transferred from the mothership paving the way for 738Max as already ordered to hit town.
Sale and lease back is the only way the balance sheet will work and it depends upon how long it takes to place the 320's.
Its just another VAH pantine commercial..... "it wont happen overnight..... but it will happen":{
wheels_down
6th Jul 2016, 13:38
Shouldn't be an issue finding them a home, all but about 3 are still fairly new.
Indigo took 15 A320s of Tiger Singapore few years back and were hungry for more...
More interested to see where BAE Engineering sits. They signed a multi year deal with Tiger and started a new A320 Facility. One would only imagine all Tiger 738s are maintained in house?
cavemanzk
6th Jul 2016, 19:11
More interested to see where BAE Engineering sits. They signed a multi year deal with Tiger and started a new A320 Facility. One would only imagine all Tiger 738s are maintained in house?
VA 738 fleet currently gets anything major done by ANZES at CHC, and sometimes AKL if CHC is busy.
aintsaying
9th Jul 2016, 08:12
Who cares about BAE Engineering?
Who cares about Tigerair staff?
aintsaying
10th Jul 2016, 08:20
Aww...common you pilots.......
Who cares about the Tigerair staff and BAE staff who improved the on-time performance of the airline to beat all the other Austrtalian airlines?
Those staff who did their bit to make things better only to be sh**t on by VA who want to dump smaller less efficient aircraft onto Tigerair.
No comment from you DEC entry Pilots??????
NO....Nothing????
The Green Goblin
10th Jul 2016, 08:33
Actually the 737 is more efficient than the A320 in the longer term.
aintsaying
10th Jul 2016, 08:58
"The 737 is more efficient?"
Yes, a smaller fuselage diameter, smaller galley, smaller flight deck, on the 737, then yes I must agree the 737 is more efficient.
But how long before the general public wakes up and realise VA has dumped older 737's on to tiger air?....you know...smaller seat pitch.....
And when tigerair's on time departure drops as they leave the current maintenance provider, then what? Who cares? yes?No?(you know.......it drops to match VA's departure rate).
OK, thanks for your informative post, I was not aware the 737 was more efficient than the A320.
I guess lease rates must be cheaper........................
atlas12
10th Jul 2016, 09:55
There is talk of 18 month contracts for TT 737 crew as VA is currently strapped for crew. My question is, how many 737 rated pilots be interested in an 18 month contract with a guaranteed boot at the end of it? :confused:
wheels_down
10th Jul 2016, 10:15
I'd like to see the strings attached to that contract.
I've seen it done before with new companies introducing new types. Pilots get the free type rating on the new type do few months, resign and head to the competition (Jetstar) who are currently in need of experienced Pilots!
Makes the logbook look a bit brighter I guess!
Berealgetreal
11th Jul 2016, 03:00
As I understand it, older ones go to TT as the lease costs are significantly lower than the new ones. The older ones have their advantages! I'd say the only "advantage" from a pilot perspective is ACARS which might be retrofitted at some stage.
As for reliability, I can say that either old or new, I've found that we hardly ever have an MEL and even rarer is an inflight fault. Leaves every other multicrew type I've flown for dead.
F50, Ejet, A320 all great airplanes but ultimately the business decided on the 73 regardless of pax/pilot perception. I think the 73 fleet has consistently made money since day dot for QF and VB/A. Ultimately even if the above were better it would be a total nightmare to convert all the 73 pilots to another narrow body.
Atlas, I think with the conversion being the entire fleet now, TT Fo's will gain experience and upgrade. Contractors? 73 being the most common type on the planet should be too hard to find someone to come down under for 18 months before they head off to China!;)
cavemanzk
11th Jul 2016, 08:12
Atlas, I think with the conversion being the entire fleet now, TT Fo's will gain experience and upgrade.
That's if NZ doesn't make an poaching offer to some of the TT FO's to jump ship to there expanding A320 fleet.
Beer Baron
11th Jul 2016, 08:48
aintsaying:
But how long before the general public wakes up and realise VA has dumped older 737's on to tiger air?....you know...smaller seat pitch.....
Not sure what you are getting at here. Everything I have read tells me that the cabin length of a 738 is longer than an A320. So it either fits more seats, (more efficient) or allows greater seat pitch for the same passengers.
Either way, passengers fly on Tiger based on price. I'd be amazed if there were more than a handful of passengers who suddenly choose not to fly on Tiger because they swap to 737's.
chookcooker
11th Jul 2016, 09:20
aintsaying:
Not sure what you are getting at here. Everything I have read tells me that the cabin length of a 738 is longer than an A320. So it either fits more seats, (more efficient) or allows greater seat pitch for the same passengers.
Either way, passengers fly on Tiger based on price. I'd be amazed if there were more than a handful of passengers who suddenly choose not to fly on Tiger because they swap to 737's.
I liked the bit where Tiger was the most on time airline in Australia.
Berealgetreal
11th Jul 2016, 10:08
cavemanzk, ANZ from what I hear are a top outfit to work for so it would come down to what you want long term.
Certainly it wouldn't be easy 320 to 737 for similar money initially. The command could open some big doors however. My mates on the 320 at JQ cringe at the 73. Lol!