Aircraft crew deploys emergency slide by accident

[underfire]

a big oops..

The aircraft’s emergency slide accidentally deployed after the Airbus A321 taxied into the gate at Tullamarine airport about 9.30am.

“The aircraft was slowly taxiing into the bay when the slide was deployed about 10 metres from its final stop,’’ he said.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/vic/a/31693221/emergency-slide-deployed-in-error-during-jetstar-flight-crew-stood-down/

[MarkerInbound]

Always thought it is odd when I hear the announcement in some countries to disarm the slides while the plane is still moving.

[wiggy]

TBF you've got to make the announcement at some point and if somebody is going to have finger trouble I don't think it makes any difference whether the aircraft is moving or not...

Also if the slide blows after you've parked I suspect there's more chance of the thing hitting ground crew......

[HeartyMeatballs]

Disarming when still moving when the pax are seated means the exits are completely clear and there are no distractions so the doors can be disarmed and (depending on airline) cross checked with the door opposite. Should anything happen between disarming and getting steps to the doors, rearming the doors in the bus takes a second.

A certain A320 operator in Europe did this a few years back and to my knowledge has not had an accidental slide deployment since. I believe it was found that passengers got in the way and also distracted the crew. So they overhauled their disarming procedures, and a checked to confirm that they are disarmed, and once again double checked before opening each door. Each time a door is opened (in normal ops) two crew are required.

Do Qantas group airlines cross check their doors? I heard that they stopped doing that. And do Jetstar use 2L for boarding on the A321?

[Metro man]

Isn't the first time and won't be the last. It doesn't matter how good your procedures are, with the number of times it's done eventually someone will find a hole.

[Capt Claret]

There but for the grace of the deity .....

[Buster Hyman]

Nothing to see, move along. Slap on the wrist, take a few days off, back to work next week.

https://s.yimg.com/ea/img/-/160525/57452aaa0fe65_inline_jetstar_1bkaa5c-1bkaala.jpg?x=656&sig=uoBxaDQElHQxdzQyn7EOYA--

By the way, that looks steep!

[Piltdown Man]

You make an interesting point Buster. It makes you wonder what sort of angle the slide would be if the right main gear collapsed.

And here is the interesting question. Excluding the 737, why do we insist on disarming the slides and opening the doors ourselves? What is the benefit? Virtually all aircraft will self-disarm the slides if the doors or opened from the outside. By allowing ground crews to open doors you reduce the possibility of finger trouble but more importantly, reduce cabin crews' door opening repertoire to 'in emergency only'. The benefit of that is when push comes to shove, a disarmed door won't be opened in error. It speaks volumes for cabin crew that this has rarely happened but emergencies they need all the help we can give them.

[Spotted Reptile]

On our recent Kiwi flight Air NZ disarmed the doors after we had come to a halt and engines stopped. Thought that was interesting. They also had full cabin service when the seat belt signs were on. Said 'their safety wasn't important' as they trundled past with drinks and food.

[Oakape]

I believe that you have to open the door before the slide will deploy. If so, that was one major stuff up - opening the door instead of disarming it, particularly while moving.

[wiggy]

Okape..very insightful.

As Capt Claret has said, there but for the grace of... On the rare occasions I've been involved in opening the things I've always quitely breathed a sigh of relief when it all went as advertised...these days I delegate door problems to the F/O (coward, me...)...

why do we insist on disarming the slides and opening the doors ourselves? What is the benefit? Virtually all aircraft will self-disarm the slides if the doors or opened from the outside. By allowing ground crews to open doors you reduce the possibility of finger trouble but more importantly, reduce cabin crews' door opening repertoire to 'in emergency only'.

We used to have that as our SOP, it changed a few years back, can't remember why.

[FlyANA]

This happens far more times than gets reported! Always costly and the biggest fear is that ground crew might get hit, they come out at quite a speed.

Crew opening doors is partly an OTP reason along with the hassle of getting all the handling agents to have different procedures for different airlines becomes a headache. Disarming whilst moving is also because as soon as the Aircraft stops, pax get up and start moving about. Giving the crew a few moments of space to concentrate while pulling onto stand is supposed to reduce events.

There's a large amount of human factors behind events like these. Like pulling the pin out with the same arm and same way every time. Dis-arming motor memory discipline.

[Lookleft]

The person disarming that door is the Cabin Manager so questions will be asked about their experience and training. Given the current CASA spotlight on Jetstar this is not a good look.

[maggot]

You make an interesting point Buster. It makes you wonder what sort of angle the slide would be if the right main gear collapsed.

And here is the interesting question. Excluding the 737, why do we insist on disarming the slides and opening the doors ourselves? What is the benefit? Virtually all aircraft will self-disarm the slides if the doors or opened from the outside. By allowing ground crews to open doors you reduce the possibility of finger trouble but more importantly, reduce cabin crews' door opening repertoire to 'in emergency only'. The benefit of that is when push comes to shove, a disarmed door won't be opened in error. It speaks volumes for cabin crew that this has rarely happened but emergencies they need all the help we can give them.

Qf doors are opened from outside.

What metroman said

[Capt Fathom]

Good to see the slide worked as advertised !

[StudentInDebt]

Qf doors are opened from outsideThat's the procedure for JQ as well.

[Capt Claret]

Virtually all aircraft will self-disarm the slides if the doors or opened from the outside.

I've only flown two jet types, neither had automatically disarming doors.

[wheels_down]

he person disarming that door is the Cabin Manager so questions will be asked about their experience and training. Given the current CASA spotlight on Jetstar this is not a good look.
Cabin Manager should be at L1. L2 is never used so not sure why the handle was moved?

I have read stories in the US about disengaged staff members causing trouble and opening slides.

[600ft-lb]

Simple, put it down to a brain fart. It happens, humans make mistakes, without knowing the exact details I can almost guarantee that someone intended to disarm a door and they lifted the handle to open the door by mistake.

[Pakehaboy]

I believe that you have to open the door before the slide will deploy. If so, that was one major stuff up - opening the door instead of disarming it, particularly while moving.
Yeah mate,that's exactly how it works(there's a little bit more detail to it,but no need to go there),a huge lack of concentration on cabin crews part,or some form of personal statement.Ive had 2 slide deployments by the crew,the first,brand new CC on first trip off IOE,the second at the gate,into the jetway,mis communication between jetway driver and lead CC.Different procedures for different airlines for sure,but no matter the procedure,not a cheap fix.I see it as job security for some,a job loss for others

The procedure for dis-arming the doors is very simple,and a co-ordinated system,those of us on the Bus are familiar.I ve talked to trainers of CC,most say the arming/dis-arming of the doors is one if not the biggest issue.I believe a TUI billboard could be the order of the day....YEAH RIGHT!!

[rog747]

A321 doors 2 and 3 L & R always are emergency exits only - they are never used for boarding or catering so why would anyone wish to open this door in normal ground mode or ops?

unless the under door fuselage mounted & housed slide went off on its own accord due a defect....

[The Green Goblin]

This door certainly isn't the CMs door. It's L2.

The LF is bloody lucky they where not flung out into a spinning engine. The doors open with quite some force. If you're not holding the inner handle when you lift the door handle, It could get messy.

JQ procedures are to open door from outside. An Airbus door will not deploy the slide while armed if opened from the outside.

The L2/R2 L3/R3 doors are not use on the 321, must have been a mega brain fart. Such things happen when you're dealing with people.

[Chesty Morgan]

You make an interesting point Buster. It makes you wonder what sort of angle the slide would be if the right main gear collapsed.



It would actually be (slightly) shallower. The only things higher following a gear collapse are outboard of the remaining gear.

[Kiwiconehead]

I've only flown two jet types, neither had automatically disarming doors.

146 disarms slide when you pull out the external handle - or have you expunged that type from your memory Clarry?

[Ollie Onion]

^^^ couldn't agree more, the 'line training' the new crew get is a joke!

[RU4Real]

I have trained hundreds of crew with a major Australian airline in EP's
Lack of concentration is the major cause in arming/disarming procedure mishaps.
As a debriefing team we always saw an issue with A320/21 with the door arming device and the door operating handle having the same motion��

[Lookleft]

How hard is it to remember "pin,lever,pin"The big problem is the perception of the F/A role within the company as being nothing more than a glorified waitress. Thats why the training course has been reduced to a 3 week fire hose method of instruction and a 3 day line training program. Once the F/A role is viewed as being safety critical then hopefully the only "brain farts" are simply forgetting a sign on time. I doubt whether this is a lapse of concentration. I would suggest it is a result of someone not being adequately trained or assessed for the job.

[tail wheel]

https://au.news.yahoo.com/vic/a/31693221/emergency-slide-deployed-in-error-during-jetstar-flight-crew-stood-down/

The crew responsible for flight JQ700 have been stood down while Jetstar investigated the incident, the Herald Sun reported.

[Capn Bloggs]

Bula, would you mind explaining all that in English? :confused:

[juzanuthapilot]

Out of curiosity, do any JQ 320/321 operate with slide rafts? Or are they all slides only? I've lost continuity with AUS reqs.

[underfire]

I wonder how long it will be before the regulator thinks that maybe the approval for a huge reduction in cabin crew line training was a step too far.

You mean like when the passengers in the exit rows over the wings are trained on when and how to open the exit door?

I have always found that a bit amusing, and always try to sit in an exit row to make certain the other passengers open them when supposed to. (or not supposed to)

[Capn Bloggs]

You mean like when the passengers in the exit rows over the wings are trained on when and how to open the exit door?

I have always found that a bit amusing
In my outfit, Underfire, the Exit Row pax get a thorough briefing on when and how. I would be very surprised if the exit row pax you sit next to weren't given the same...

[Capt Claret]

Must've done Kiwiconehead, the only bit I remember was having to manually disarm them each EPs. Mind you, it's been 11 years but I think I'd recognise one if I saw it.... :8

[waren9]

when a pilot has a decent f. up his previous couple of rosters get looked at.

flight attendants? not so much.

i wonder what this flighty's last fortnight involved. (20-something partying habits aside)

[Oriana]

the Exit Row pax get a thorough briefing on when and how.

Well, I that's comforting.:rolleyes:

[Ken Borough]

Didn't a Qantas SP expeience an accidental slide deployment once upon a time in Townsville? :}:E

[Capn Bloggs]

Well, I that's comforting. :rolleyes:
Our FAs type Level 6 English too! :ok:

[Croissant2016]

JQ do not cross check armed and disarmed doors anymore but all doors are opened from the outside to prevent inadvertant slide deployment.
This door was not the L1 door but a mid cabin exit. It was not even a normal door. The crewmember may of had a brainfart and removed the plastic cover to open the door in armed mode (which is not normally opened on this aircraft unless in an emergency anyway) or a pax has done it. I feel sorry for the crewmember involved if this was a genuine stuff up. I cant imagine the horror of the seeing the door opening and slide coming out and realising you've just screwed up big time.

[framer]

Does JetStar have a fairly robust internal investigation process? I imagine it does but don't know. The reason I ask is that when I see cabin crew making errors like this ( if it was cabin crew) then I immediately think of the punishing rosters they fly. Will their rosters be analysed as a matter of course to asses likelihood of fatigue or does Jetstar decide on the investigation components on a case by case basis?

[Madame Bandit]

Will their rosters be analysed as a matter of course to asses likelihood of fatigue
The roster will be analysed and assessed as "legal" and the poor crew member will be hung for not managing their rest appropriately. Don't mention the "F" word. This will create a problem with the FRMS approval.
Does **** have a fairly robust internal investigation process?
Yes, this is commonly known as the "Just" culture. That is, Just sack em and upper "management" Just cover thy ar*e at all cost.:rolleyes:

[CurtainTwitcher]

CASA 2010 Jetstar Special fatigue audit (http://www116.zippyshare.com/v/S7r0pOmi/file.html]Xenophon 180311 (2).pdf), sober reading. Has anything changed?

(Jetstar Culture: Toughen Up Princesses! (https://web.archive.org/web/20110410024313/http://resources.news.com.au/files/2011/03/31/1226031/270701-jetstar-email.pdf))

[Lookleft]

Disregard Madam Butterflies Undone framer as he/she has no idea. The Flight Ops safety department is entirely separate from Flight Ops Management and they conduct their own investigation. One of the ticks in the box with the current CP is that she has been involved with airline safety investigation from both the union end and the operational end at the mother ship. The rosters will be looked at with the current focus on FRMS, there is no way CASA are just going to disregard the possibility of fatigue. There is a reason why they have knocked back Jetstar's FRMS twice. As for the CASA special audit, most of the Jetstar management personnel, both flying and non-flying have all been replaced since that report was written and once again why do you think CASA have knocked back the Jetstar FRMS?

[Icarus2001]

It was not even a normal door.

What was abnormal about the door?

[Madame Bandit]

The Flight Ops safety department is entirely separate from Flight Ops Management and they conduct their own investigation.

Yes, but investigations are often conducted with most favourable outcomes.

“Confidence and naivety is something you feel and believe before you truly understand the situation”
― Julie E Czerneda

[Croissant2016]

What was abnormal about the door?
Sorry should of specified it was not a normal door in the sense that it was opened daily and/or touched by crew in any kind of opening capacity other than eps. Similar I suppose to an overwing exit door- it has a guarded handle and the FA would never see that door open or need to go anywhere near the door handle unless in an emergency. This was not a L1 door that is opened and closed several times daily

[Lookleft]

Yes, but investigations are often conducted with most favourable outcomes.

That is an opinion that has been stated about most investigation bodies e.g ATSB,NTSB,TAIC,AAIB,Dutch Safety Board, TSBC etc, etc etc. If the outcome is not what an individual would like to see i.e.total exoneration, then the investigation is accused of being biased and flawed. Sometimes the criticism is deserved but at Jetstar in the present time investigations are conducted independently of flight ops.

[Roller Merlin]

I understand said cabin crew was suffering from heavily fatiguing rostering.

[rog747]

weird to open any door at posn 2 (OR the doors at posn 3) on an A321 - they are NEVER used normally except in emergency -

one C/C member sits for t/off and landing on a rear facing jump seat at 2R
(in most configs opposite 2 pax seated row 10 11 or 12 depending on density)

Door 2L has no jump seat and has a row of pax seats either 2 or 3

I do not buy fatigue or error stories sorry does not add up - pax do not ever disembark from door 2L - how do you mistake such a major exit ruling

see here
http://www.yssyforum.net/board/showthread.php?t=36&page=9

[wheels_down]

United Airlines flight attendant loses job after activating emergency slide and bailing (http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/incidents/another-flight-attendant-quits-by-triggering-a-grounded-planes-emergency-slide-and-bailing/news-story/d52ef0bc524ce84c6496e9115dc24c33)

[romeocharlie]

I have heard similar, was fatigue. 2 back of the clock followed by an early morning shift. Sounds familiar - computer says you can do it, then why can't you.... :ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh: