Can I use a GPS during flight?

[Delta9]

As a pasenger, am I allowed to use a GPS during a flight? The device in question is a Garmin GPSMAP 60csx.

The reason I ask is just because I love looking at data like speed, heading, altitude, location etc. I think I saw a pilot on a tiny plane in Venezuela using the exact same device for navigation actually.

http://i.imgur.com/7DsvNyp.jpg

A lot of passengers nowadays are nervous (me included) and I wouldn’t want to set off any alarms as a passenger fiddling with a strange electronic device.

Regarding reception - I’ve tried turning on this device on a previous flight and it didn’t seem to be able to find any satellites to connect to - is this normal? Is it due to altitude or location?

This would be on a United flight from Europe to the US. Am I white male, in case it matters.

Thanks!

[Espada III]

Been asked on here many times. Most of us who do, simply use our cellphones with the Flightmode turned on and GPS turned on as well. Need to have an app which records speed and also have a map app turned on. Otherwise as is does not send you are generally fine and I have never been queried about it.

[yellowtriumph]

I thought these devices needed to have clear line of sight access to multiple satellites in orbit? How does this work if your sitting inside a fairly enclosed aluminium tube? I'm genuinely interested to know.

[ZFT]

Why would being male matter?

[Bushfiva]

Most airlines allow GPS during cruise (e.g. KLM explicitly states the fact on its web site), but sometimes the cabin crew aren't aware of this.

[deanm]

Why would being white matter?

[ZFT]

That was my point!!!

[El Bunto]

I'm not familiar with dedicated nav devices like that, but for phones I found the best procedure is to turn-off A-GPS otherwise it will waste time and energy trying to triangulate from all the cell towers it sees whizzing past seven miles below.

Then, hold near a window for a couple of minutes to obtain the initial fix. After that it seems to work fine despite the Faraday effect of the fuselage.

[Basil]

Why would being male matter?
Why would being white matter?
Profiling.
Although, with crackers turning to the Dark Side, even that isn't bulletproof.

[wiggy]

Most airlines allow GPS during cruise (e.g. KLM explicitly states the fact on its web site), but sometimes the cabin crew aren't aware of this.

OTOH some airline's documentation is quite ambiguous (I've just checked the advice my lot issue and it's not at all clear).

What I would say to the OP is if he does decide to try using it in flight please don't get into a "I know my rights" argument if asked to turn it off by one of the crew...

[The Dominican]

I thought these devices needed to have clear line of sight access to multiple satellites in orbit? How does this work if your sitting inside a fairly enclosed aluminium tube

You need the signal from 4 satellites to get an accurate reading and you don't need to be in a direct line of sight (contrary to popular believe) with the satellite for your device to figure out where it is at...! GPS satellites are in essence, a very friendly clock! It is an extremely accurate clock that sends its signals in all directions at the speed of light constantly saying hello and giving the time..., it is a coded signal so that your device knows when the signal left the satellite and when it arrived at your device.., this signal has the limited capability to penetrate structures as long as they are not too thick with concrete, rebar etc...., but inside an airplane you can still get it.

[Dee747]

Used a Garmin car sat nav on a flight from Nice to the UK a few years ago while in a window seat without any difficulty. I just held it up to the window after the take off phase, it initialised and away it went. Great fun watching the display and hearing the ping every time we passed overhead a 30mph speed limit zone.

As an inadvertent added bonus, I moved up several notches on the Esteem-O-Meter with my teenage daughter's male friends when I could show them that the maximum speed displayed on the sat nav was 564mph. You could see them wondering how their Corsas and Leons were ever going to reach that sort of speed ..... :)

[Espada III]

Used a Garmin car sat nav on a flight from Nice to the UK a few years ago while in a window seat without any difficulty. I just held it up to the window after the take off phase, it initialised and away it went. Great fun watching the display and hearing the ping every time we passed overhead a 30mph speed limit zone.

As an inadvertent added bonus, I moved up several notches on the Esteem-O-Meter with my teenage daughter's male friends when I could show them that the maximum speed displayed on the sat nav was 564mph. You could see them wondering how their Corsas and Leons were ever going to reach that sort of speed ..... :)


Yep. I have a speedometer app which recorded my highest speed of 614mph of an East bound flight with a tail wind on an A320 earlier this year. Impressed my sons no end.

[S.o.S.]

Delta 9 Welcome to the forum. Whilst information is changing all the time there is some historical information in the FAQ at the top of this Forum.


Please bear in mind that, when on board a commercial aircraft as a passenger, you are legally bound to follow the instructions of the Cabin Crew. Wiggy in post #10 said it: If asked to turn off the unit = DO SO! Without delay or question.


By all means give feedback here after your trip. The thread will slide down the timeline and you can check subsequent pages for it, or search for it.

[Tech Guy]

This is from a GPSMap 62SC

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/sillystuff99/GPS/62/62Screen.jpg

[hoss183]

I've used GPS on planes many time, whether it be phone or handheld Garmin. I do tend to be a little discreet about it, in these times.

@ Dominican, you are wrong about the line of sight part. Civilian GPS uses the 1.5 Ghz band. That frequency range is attenuated by quite ordinary materials, e.g human body, tree cover etc, and certainly wont penetrate any 'structures'. Particularly the faraday cage of a jet.
The signal will reflect from some materials. But that is likely to cause errors rather than help, as bounced signal will have a longer delay and thus decrease accuracy.
However if you hold the device near to the window, you may be lucky enough to get the minimum 3 satellites for a signal (4 for 3D nav).

[cee cee]

I have used GPS on tablet devices successfully when on the window seats on commercial aircrafts. The steps I take are:


1. Turn off AGPS or other forms of assistance. Use device only bare bones GPS.
2. Turn on GPS and let it get a fix on you at or close to the airport. This will preload the satellites' orbit information and make it quicker for the GPS to get a fix on you later. Turn the device off for boarding and take off as usual.
3. During cruise, turn the device on and hold it to the window for a few minutes. I use GPS Test app from Chartcross Limited which shows which (or whether any) satellites can be seen and their respective signal strengths. This app can also shows your altitude, ground speed and heading once it gets a lock. Once the GPS Test app shows that a successful lock is possible, I can switch to my navigation app with preloaded offline maps. I use MapFactor GPS Navigation Maps for this purpose.
4. Once a lock is achieved, it can be maintained even with the device away from the window. Note that when you exit the app or switch apps, the lock will be lost, and you will need to regain the lock by holding the device at the window.

I have not been able to get a lock from the centre aisle of a wide body plane. Strangely enough, my last flight was on a 787, and I was unsuccessful in getting a signal even with the device at the window. Maybe the dimmable windows on that plane interferes with the GPS signal?

[Capot]

I've always understood that since a GPS is simply a receiver it cannot interfere with any aircraft system.

But I've never tried it because I have assumed that the fuselage would prevent the satellite signal getting to the unit, just as 3-5mm of GRP prevents the unit from operating in my boat's cabin.

[OzBob]

Does a mobile phone take its fix from the GPS satellites or from the mobile network cell towers ?
I understand the Garmin, or similar, even the G-mouse antenna connected via the USB to PC will take it from the satellites fix but does this apply to the mobile phone ?

[Wageslave]

Here's a slightly more scientific take on the subject.

GPSRFI (http://gpsinformation.net/airgps/gpsrfi.htm)

[ExXB]

My cell phone loses the signals indoors, although still connected to wifi.

[PAXboy]

OzBob. It depends on the make and model of phone. Some have a built in GPS aerial and some don't. Check the specification on the manufacturer's website.

[Pontius Navigator]

I used the GPS module on a PDA and it worked indoors under a single story pantiled roof, so it depends on the sensitivity of the receiver.
OTOH, inside an aircraft with a dedicated SatNav I did not receive enough satellites for tracking.

[Basil]

One little addition:
I have a separate GPS receiver which connects by Bluetooth to a display device.
That would not be acceptable for use on an aircraft because Bluetooth would have to be enabled on the smartphone or laptop and this particular GPS receiver transmits Bluetooth when switched on.
Otherwise, I don't think GPS is a problem but, if a crewmember says "No!", then that's it.