EK Bonus

[LHR Rain]

I can't believe how quiet it's been on the Bonus front. No one wants to talk about it and the few that do say we aren't going to get anything. Rubbish!
The profit is going to be massive and we should get about 10-12 weeks Bonus. What does the pilot group think? What are we going to get?

[uba737]

Plan on 0, never disappointed if anything given!

[Mach_Krit]

big difference between what we should get and what we will get.. if history is anything to go by.

the lack of interest is telling though

[777-200LR]

No thanks! No profit share and no payrise - give me 15 days off a month and 60-70 hrs and that's the biggest bonus you can payout! I'm pretty sure I'm not alone

[Emma Royds]

I would say declaring a healthy dividend to the Investment Corporation of Dubai, is far more likely than us seeing anything worth talking about.

Petrol subsidies have gone, VAT is coming and a new 35AED 'service charge' is being levied on all airline tickets for all passengers passing through Dubai. You don't have to look very far to see that Dubai is quietly implementing its own version of austerity measures.

[Cenrifugel]

The bonus is a brand new free villa in Meydan South.

[lospilotos]

No thanks! No profit share and no payrise - give me 15 days off a month and 60-70 hrs and that's the biggest bonus you can payout! I'm pretty sure I'm not alone

That's for the coming year. I still want my profit share for working my a** off, helping to create the biggest profit ever, thank you very much....

[fatbus]

Pilot pay review has been completed already.Sounds like 5% pay raise for Capts and 20 % for FO's to curb attrition and promote recruitment. But increase in hourly for both, Capt slightly more than FO
Profit share this year 2 -14 weeks is my guess.

[lospilotos]

Pilot pay review has been completed already.Sounds like 5% pay raise for Capts and 20 % for FO's to curb attrition and promote recruitment. But increase in hourly for both, Capt slightly more than FO
Profit share this year 2 -14 weeks is my guess.

Is this a wind up, or do you actually have a credible source?

[donpizmeov]

Calm it Los, the full stop was missed. Should read 0.5% for Capts and 0.20% for FOs. Straight from the CSA on my last flight. She knows people that know people. Flight pay will increase as more hours will be flown.
The Bonus this year is we wont be getting an email from TCAS saying that the pay review has been delayed due lack of interest.

[lospilotos]

Calm it Los, the full stop was missed. Should read 0.5% for Capts and 0.20% for FOs. Straight from the CSA on my last flight. She knows people that know people. Flight pay will increase as more hours will be flown.
The Bonus this year is we wont be getting an email from TCAS saying that the pay review has been delayed due lack of interest.

Yeah, that makes more sense... haha!

[Calmcavok]

Nobody has a credible source on this!

I wonder if we'll conveniently miss our massive profit share target? If we do hit it, then something similar to last year, 8-10. Though 4 or less wouldn't be a shock.

Any pay rise likely will be in flight pay to absolve the company from increased provident fund contributions. No more than step on the basic.

In terms of remuneration, EK is no different from any other major these days. It's corporate and it's greedy. Replace EK with DL, BA, LH etc. It's about the shareholder(s) and nothing more.

No email from TCAS will be nice though.

[lospilotos]

Nobody has a credible source on this!

I wonder if we'll conveniently miss our massive profit share target? If we do hit it, then something similar to last year, 8-10. Though 4 or less wouldn't be a shock.

STC can be heard saying on ICE that the profit will be considerably bigger than last year's. This in spite of declining yield and the strong dollar. He also admits that the strong dollar ia actually both a pro and con...

But yes, the PS target is also considerably higher...

If anywhere near the PS target and less than last year will be paid out, it's a big slap in the face...

[Calmcavok]

Ja, I heard TopCat saying that as well. Around a month until we find out. Needless to say my breath is not bated.

[P7xkk]

There is a prime VP source within the Labour Camp. Though it may take water boarding to make him spill the beans - soft cushions and wailing were tried last year, to no avail.

[thefoxandfirkin]

Let's face it, if the company can't make big fat profits when the fuel price has been this low (despite pressure on yields, currencies, blah blah) there is no hope when the oil price rises again. I'm sure the prediction of 0-15 is bang on ha :}

[Panther 88]

Can we stop it with the "bonus" talk. We don't get any sort of bonus. A bonus is a reward. It's a stinkin' profit share. They make a profit....we get a share.....supposedly. When was the last time they rewarded us for anything, going the extra mile and all. We don't contribute one fil to their profit. Any profit they make will be first sent to whomever, and we get a share of the fils left over. It is not a bonus by any means.

[fatbus]

And before someone asks , take your basic pay x12 divide by 52 will give you weekly

[halas]

Weekly what? 😃

halas

[fatbus]

Weekly pay X #week profit

[Talparc]

Panther 88:

totally agree.
Guys going the extra mile is history, we get nothing or just some breadcrumbs.
A change in culture would be a small start but not happening.
Just adjust your behaviour accordingly.
They have stolen more money from us as they can ever repay with a rediculous profit share.

[Wingman82]

Heard 8 weeks and 6% a couple of times now... Could that happen?

[aussiefarmer]

Here's my prediction

- EK Group will just make the profit target.

- We will get an email along the lines of a challenging year due to competition, lower yields, load factors and strong dollar

- 2-4 weeks bonus will be announced - because we have to save $$$ for tougher times in the future

- Pilots will get a step increase and a further reduction of 2 or 3 hours in overtime threshold.

KEEP SMILING!

[GoreTex]

2 excuses will be chosen from below, I heard all of them the last few years

oil is too low
oil is too high
dollar is too low
dollar is too high

[CaptainChipotle]

Is profit share still in the contract or did they conveniently remove it?

Keep rowing...

[pacbro]

Let's get ourselves well prepared for the 5 stages of grief! The quicker we get to the last stage the better. Let's move on mi amigos!

[notapilot15]

I think they are in between rock and hard place.

They have to show profit (by cooking books) to other airlines to prove how great they are in managing airlines.

On the flip side employees expect profit sharing when you announce profit.

So the profit sharing they have to pay is actually additional loss.

[fliion]

To put it in historical perspective - Pay raises/bonus since 2000.

I have combined step or lack thereof in the raise number and called it a pay raise for simplicity
I do not have profit share or Edu support allowance numbers from 2000-2007.
2000-2007 numbers were provided by a colleague

05/00
3%
05/01
5%
05/02
6%
05/03
3%
05/04
5%
05/05
11%
05/06
10%
05/07
9%


Pay raise/profit share/Edu/housing since May 2008
05/08
12% 14 wks
05/09
0% 0 wks - GF Crisis
05/10
6% 3wks
05/11 (edu fund 32-40/54-60)
8% 12wks
05/12
3%
05/13 (edu fund 40-42/60-63)
3.5%
05/14 (staff travel erosion)
3% 3wks (edu 42-46/63-70)
housing up to16075pm for CAPTs
05/15
3% 9wks (edu 46-47.5/70-72.5)
OT thresh 88h

2012-13 prof target 3.5bn dhs (achvd 3.1bn) 10/5/13 - Target not achieved - no profit share

13/14 target 4.22bn (1st half 2.2bn) 8/5/14 - 4.1bn achieved - Target not achieved- 3 weeks profit share

2014/15 target 3.7bn (rwy closure)
1st half achieved 2.2bn - 2nd 3.2b for a total of 5.5bn) - 9 weeks profit share

2015/16 target 7.7bn
(1st half 3.7 achieved)

Make of it what you will - but I believe they will save a pay raise of 5% on top of step for all EK group UAE employees for next year to cover VAT.

This years profit should be on target - as to the "very recent positive" package developments email from JAROPS - (repairing ops 😉)

The longer they wait the greater the expectation - which is not a good thing for them and I just think the rot is very deep for there to be any change in sentiment unless it's a blockbuster.

Not holding my breath.

Since we moved to new HQ - the Atrium show has usually taken place on the third Thursday of April at 10am except for 2013 when there was no profit share.

[motojet]

Thanks for the payrise/profit share history Fliion. However I have never seen the profit share announcement in April, it has always been sometime in May.

[fliion]

Thought it was April Moto - stand corrected - fatigue and all that

[helen-damnation]

IIRC, the company results and profit share are announced in April.

The pay rise (or not :mad:) is announced in May.

H-D

[givemewings]

Let's not forget that we may need to add to the list of

high/low dollar
high/low oil price


huge insurance bill/payout/costs due to unfortunate loss at sister airline (FZ comes under the group umbrella does it not??)

It will not surprise me in the slightest if they announce that a share was to be paid, however due to the sad event those funds have been diverted into the pot to cover things there... in goodwill we will give you 2-4 weeks.


If we *do* get something, perhaps it would be nice if all of us could send something the way of the crew families down at FZ...

however I will believe a PS payment when it is in my account, as always...

[motojet]

I think everyone has been working too much, the profit share announcement has been in May for at least the last 8 years.

2013 Profit Share announced May10

Emirates Airline hits new heights with 52% rise in profit | The National (http://www.thenational.ae/business/industry-insights/aviation/emirates-airline-hits-new-heights-with-52-rise-in-profit)

2014 Profit Share announced May8

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/business/aviation/emirates-airline-profit-jumps-43-to-dh3.3-billion

2015 Profit Share announced May7

http://www.emirates247.com/business/corporate/emirates-group-posts-dh5-5bn-annual-profit-2nd-highest-in-its-history-2015-05-07-1.589921


Most likely there will be a few weeks yet before the announcment.

[InnocentBystander]

Please do not include the step increase in any pay raise look backs. It's a contractual longevity increase and should not be considered a raise. It's in my contract and has only once been denied due to extreme circumstances in 2009 even though the company had been substantially profitable that year.

Also Fly Dubai is completely separate from emirates group.

[fliion]

Innocent take a deep breath - go to post 28 - read second line again slowly.

[springbok449]

I think Mach Krit has hit the nail on the head with his last line...

The lack of interest is telling...

The way we are working and low morale has taken over from the profit share talk this year...

[Nikita81]

I heard that they've limited the profit share only to employees who don't have any warnings and QMs (Quality Matters, something of a small warning sh*t from Airport Services Dept, not sure if other depts have them). More reasons for more warnings.

[fatbus]

Heard from who?

[Nikita81]

They've got an e-mail from AS DVP stating so. Maybe it's valid only for AS dept (which is strange and discriminative if true) if you didn't get the same e-mail.

[donpizmeov]

Motojet,

The profit announce had always been the last Thursday in April. The change to May is a relatively recent thing. Pay review for pilots was always done prior to the 15th May, and paid in the May pay. The change to June for that is also a new development.

[The Outlaw]

:rolleyes::rolleyes:https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRgqwyNFCCNZBR8eS8ifssyq0lxq8-KhkYYAu1iiofhs6jLteo3


"Work hard Harry and each day you'll get a shiny penny"!

[InnocentBystander]

Innocent take a deep breath - go to post 28 - read second line again slowly.

Still wrong. The step increase is NOT a pay raise, no matter how "simple" you'd like to "word" it. Same as the "profit share" is not a "bonus". You know, words have actual meanings, believe it or not.

[fliion]

Oh FFS- this is chat forum not a policy contract...subtract 3% then...just passing on info (with a caveat) that guys might be interested in

I mean if you are such a stickler for contractual details, presumably anything over step - you gave back ...after all it's not in your contact. Right?

Or better yet - copy and paste my post - and actually take the time to break down the numbers and repost with step or lack thereof.

I hold no IP liability against you 🤔👍

[Fellowship of the drink]

Agree with Fillion.

Thanks for taking your time to compile it. The last few years have sucked in terms of pay adjustments!

[fatbus]

Fillion, I thank you for the recap and agree with you .

[fliion]

Pleasure gents

[InnocentBystander]

I mean if you are such a stickler for contractual details

Shouldn't everyone be? After all it's the contract you've signed.

Again, words matter. Because they have meaning. And for some strange reason you take my criticism to incite infighting among the minions.

While management leans back and laughs at us. Because they sure know the difference between a step increase and a pay raise and a bonus and a profit share.

[Uplink]

Innocent,

You allude to the contract you signed and what was written on it.....

When has the company ever abided by your contract. I can't even count that on one hand!

An increment is a contractural rise and even you admit one year they didn't pay it. That means they went against the contract. A bit like 42 days of leave. We are lucky now to get 30 of which half is normally now allocated.

In the end the rise in money you get from year to year is the same whether you call it an contractural increment or a pay rise. Honestly who gives a *%#+!

[Dixi]

Gents

I can understand your frustration but trust me somewhere else down the road is much worse...same salary since 2008,no increase whatsoever,rumors regarding reduction of allowances started going on.....at least you got a big bonus last year and an increase on the allowances 2 years ago....shall I continue ?
Cheers
Dixi

[White Sausage]

Who cares about somewhere down the road? We are not comparing other (possibly ****tier outfits) to this outfit. Apples and oranges, anyone? We are talking about this one here, and it doesn't bode well...

[OzoneAddict]

I think this year there is more interest in what is really current, exit strategy. Resignation. Find another seat to fly from. Guys were really excited and focused last year and the STC bragging massive profits and record breaking stuff, however this fizzled out by the lack of credible bonus payout, this solely may perhaps go down in history as EKs last blunder to salvage the sinking ship, whereby it was known to be the lowest fuel price ever and high profits. This year people have been displaced, Fly dubai has and accident with loss of lives, so low fuel equations and huge profits are bitter sweet!!

[lospilotos]

Guys were really excited and focused last year and the STC bragging massive profits and record breaking stuff, however this fizzled out by the lack of credible bonus payout, this solely may perhaps go down in history as EKs last blunder to salvage the sinking ship, whereby it was known to be the lowest fuel price ever and high profits.

For the financial year 2014-15 the jet fuel price was still at the highs for the first 6 months. It only for the latest year 2015-16 that we've been operating the the low regime for an entire year. That's why this will (should) be the year with record profits and record profit share...

[fatbus]

Wishful thinking .

[Divertnow]

Wishful thinking .
I did see an interview on the BBC with TC that said ek profits last year are up 40%! Not sure if they meant the last fiscal year just finished or the interview was old. Just caught the tail end. Can anyone shed any light?

[BigGeordie]

Record profits maybe. But the profit share target also went up significantly. If we don't make the target we get nothing. I'm not quite sure how this is supposed to motivate people- work yourself to death all year, miss the target by 100Dhs and get nothing.

[OzoneAddict]

sorry, may have been off the topic but its important for those aspirants who are sailing the dreams of EK pilot jobs:

https://donotflyemirates.wordpress.com/
Home - Emirates Illuminati (http://www.emirates-illuminati.com/)
Just Landed:- Thanks that article in Aussie news worth reading, from your above links

OR


Source: Flying tired: airline pilots on tough rosters battle fatigue (http://www.smh.com.au/business/aviation/flying-tired-airline-pilots-on-tough-rosters-battle-fatigue-20160413-go5fmo.html)

[Divertnow]

2 weeks is my prediction.

[CamelRustler]

What EK needs to do is stop making a target and just give the employees a flat % of the profit. It would feel much more transparent, and I think motivate the employees a bit more if they knew they were going to get a check as to this guessing game.

[Phil A Buster]

As has been said before, always expect nothing and everything over that is a bonus

[LHR Rain]

What don't we expect what we deserve? 10-12 weeks!
Have we been beaten to such a point where we don't even expect what we deserve? We are truly a pathetic bunch.

[fatbus]

I think we have been beaten down . Don't care anymore. Other airlines post massive increase in profit. We will soon find out, but in the mean time just don't care.

[lospilotos]

As I mentioned in another thread, that I can't seem to find at the moment, EK savings on fuel alone compared to 2014-15 should be in the region of 10-12 billion AED.

[V1cutz]

Same song and dance every year around this time. Who really cares anymore?

[Panther 88]

Well VeeOne, I damn well care that they should provide a substantial profit share to the minions, all of us. BUT, I can't get expectations too high knowing how they have tricked :mad: the books to deny us our share, in the past.

[EK-or-bust]

To put it in historical perspective - Pay raises/bonus since 2000.

I have combined step or lack thereof in the raise number and called it a pay raise for simplicity
I do not have profit share or Edu support allowance numbers from 2000-2007.
2000-2007 numbers were provided by a colleague

05/00
3%
05/01
5%
05/02
6%
05/03
3%
05/04
5%
05/05
11%
05/06
10%
05/07
9%


Pay raise/profit share/Edu/housing since May 2008
05/08
12% 14 wks
05/09
0% 0 wks - GF Crisis
05/10
6% 3wks
05/11 (edu fund 32-40/54-60)
8% 12wks
05/12
3%
05/13 (edu fund 40-42/60-63)
3.5%
05/14 (staff travel erosion)
3% 3wks (edu 42-46/63-70)
housing up to16075pm for CAPTs
05/15
3% 9wks (edu 46-47.5/70-72.5)
OT thresh 88h

2012-13 prof target 3.5bn dhs (achvd 3.1bn) 10/5/13 - Target not achieved - no profit share

13/14 target 4.22bn (1st half 2.2bn) 8/5/14 - 4.1bn achieved - Target not achieved- 3 weeks profit share

2014/15 target 3.7bn (rwy closure)
1st half achieved 2.2bn - 2nd 3.2b for a total of 5.5bn) - 9 weeks profit share

2015/16 target 7.7bn
(1st half 3.7 achieved)

Make of it what you will - but I believe they will save a pay raise of 5% on top of step for all EK group UAE employees for next year to cover VAT.

This years profit should be on target - as to the "very recent positive" package developments email from JAROPS - (repairing ops 😉)

The longer they wait the greater the expectation - which is not a good thing for them and I just think the rot is very deep for there to be any change in sentiment unless it's a blockbuster.

Not holding my breath.

Since we moved to new HQ - the Atrium show has usually taken place on the third Thursday of April at 10am except for 2013 when there was no profit share.
Just a quick correction to Fliions excellent post

13/14 target 4.22bn (1st half 2.2bn) 8/5/14 - 4.1bn achieved - Target not achieved- 3 weeks profit share

The 3 weeks deposited to our bank account was NOT a profit share.
It was the first time in EK history they paid a Bonus to us all.
We can only get a profit share if we meet (2 weeks) or exceed the Target.
These 3 weeks were a gift. Aka Bonus.
Probably to show goodwill. Fat lot of good that did ;-)

[ekwhistleblower]

Or screwed the books by buying an A380 in cash in the week before the announcement!

[fatbus]

Very good point.

[fringhtok]

One interesting little tidbit- I looked back through the profit announcements for the last 10 years (sick on the couch so time to burn). Only two times has the second half profit been larger than the first half. The target this year is 7.7bn and 'only' 3.7bn was achieved in the first half. The second half will have to have been unusually profitable or the target will not be met. Those extra 380s will not have helped that cause. Not long now until all revealed!

[lospilotos]

One interesting little tidbit- I looked back through the profit announcements for the last 10 years (sick on the couch so time to burn). Only two times has the second half profit been larger than the first half. The target this year is 7.7bn and 'only' 3.7bn was achieved in the first half. The second half will have to have been unusually profitable or the target will not be met. Those extra 380s will not have helped that cause. Not long now until all revealed!

Well, the fact that the Jet1A price was on average 30% lower in the second half compared to the first could help improve that...

[Nedul]

I did see an interview on the BBC with TC that said ek profits last year are up 40%! Not sure if they meant the last fiscal year just finished or the interview was old. Just caught the tail end. Can anyone shed any light?

http://www.bbc.com/news/36085203

[POTATOW]

Funny how the math works out;

Profit last year - 5.5 billion

If you increase that by 40% as sir Tim says in the press...you get EXACTLY 7.7 billion (the target).

So if that's true we will come in 1 dirham short and get nothing or maybe 2 weeks if we are lucky!

[moneyhoon]

Invitation out .....

[natops]

Invitation out .....

I wonder how many guys are going to waste their off day in eghq... Not me.

[TangoUniform]

Was down route and happened to chat with some Delta pilots about their PS. I know I know it's a whole different thing, but their's was close to 1/3 of their earned pay. Probably Delta's bean counters are not as proficient at hiding and diverting profit. Just for info and "grins". And of course their management is trying to rid themselves of that, in the ongoing negotiations for a new contract.

[Nikita81]

Guess he will get his bonus for sure.

Emirates exec turns down Air France-KLM CEO position - Transport - ArabianBusiness.com (http://www.arabianbusiness.com/emirates-exec-turns-down-air-france-klm-ceo-position-629475.html)

[Talparc]

Sorry, but the story smells a lot, wonder what is behind?

Typical troll

[Nikita81]

wonder what is behind?$2.7 Billion worth of PR. ;)

[Jet II]

Sorry, but the story smells a lot, wonder what is behind?


Doesn't half smell as much as the other story on that page... ;)


Emirates boss 'often travels in economy' (http://www.arabianbusiness.com/emirates-boss-often-travels-in-economy-says-clark-629241.html#.Vx5V2UGxaON)

[notapilot15]

It is not easy to run an airline in real world and I doubt EK management has any airline management skills left. Owner brings money and management spends and talk tosh to media.

Also, Can he scale fence?

[lospilotos]

Doesn't half smell as much as the other story on that page... ;)


Emirates boss 'often travels in economy' (http://www.arabianbusiness.com/emirates-boss-often-travels-in-economy-says-clark-629241.html#.Vx5V2UGxaON)

"...all of the fares have come down..." Yeah, except staff travel fares...

[alwayzinit]

^^^^^^

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!

Moo Poo!

[Talparc]

that explains why we always get downgraded
an example of leadership:-))
sit in economy and be happy as our leaders do! :-)
so more profit share!

[fatbus]

If staff travel fares were lower you would never get a seat. 10000s of eligible staff with very low staff numbers and big families would be taking up all available seats.

[dubaigong]

Talking about salary increase or bonus you are not in the worse position in the region.

To reward them for the hard work at Flydubai the pilots have just been informed that an increase of 12 Dhs per flight hours have been approved...

No basic salary increase , no bonus and it is like that for years.

In 7 years of operation there have been one bonus of 3 weeks basic salary , one small increase of the basic salary ( +- 4% ) and 3 increases of the sector pay around 12 Dhs each...

I hope that it makes you feel better...

[lospilotos]

If staff travel fares were lower you would never get a seat. 10000s of eligible staff with very low staff numbers and big families would be taking up all available seats.

Well they'd be aft of the J/Y divider and who goes there anyway...

[lospilotos]

Talking about salary increase or bonus you are not in the worse position in the region.

To reward them for the hard work at Flydubai the pilots have just been informed that an increase of 12 Dhs per flight hours have been approved...

No basic salary increase , no bonus and it is like that for years.

In 7 years of operation there have been one bonus of 3 weeks basic salary , one small increase of the basic salary ( +- 4% ) and 3 increases of the sector pay around 12 Dhs each...

I hope that it makes you feel better...

Well in the European LCCs you'd be grateful if you got a way with a 12 AED pay cut...

[Luibar]

To reward them for the hard work at Flydubai the pilots have just been informed that an increase of 12 Dhs per flight hours have been approved...

No basic salary increase , no bonus and it is like that for years.


With that fantastic pay review, guess who will attend the Ryanair roadshow in DXB... :E

[dubaigong]

Lospilotos if you read my post properly you would have seen that I have said IN THE REGION as far as I know Europe is not yet in the Middle East...

[lospilotos]

Lospilotos if you read my post properly you would have seen that I have said IN THE REGION as far as I know Europe is not yet in the Middle East...

Your geography skills are amazing. I just wanted you to broaden your LCC horizon a bit.

No but seriously, I didn't mean "you" as in "you Dubaigong" personally, but "you" as in a broader view. I'm not familiar with the Fly Dubai T&Cs, is there a bonus/profit share scheme as in Emirates?

[nothingsurprisesme]

I can't believe how quiet it's been on the Bonus front. No one wants to talk about it and the few that do say we aren't going to get anything. Rubbish!
The profit is going to be massive and we should get about 10-12 weeks Bonus. What does the pilot group think? What are we going to get?

It's the same every year...all this talk about a bonus. We don't receive a bonus (unlike so many in the 'company.') We receive a profit share only after they've found as many excuses as possible that it has to be low or non-existent. No one can speculate. Why are you wasting your time? Haven't you got anything better to do? Just wait and see. If we get anything, remember this is only one payment. It's pretty irrelevant in the long term, though we may possibly be able to pay off a credit card with it.

The most important announcement will be the pay review. That's what determines whether we stay or go if the past is anything to go by. Forget the step; that isn't a pay rise. Don't consider any moving of the goalposts by ek, ie better flight pay etc, as a pay rise. That all depends on your doing more and more hours. Over the past 13 years or so, in real terms, considering the rate of inflation and other goal post manoeuvres, the pay has decreased by 35%.

A very substantial basic salary increase is what's necessary. The rest would be an additional but important extra.

Wait for the facts and don't waste your valuable time and energy writing about stuff that may never happen.

[new tomcat]

"Was down route and happened to chat with some Delta pilots about their PS. I know I know it's a whole different thing, but their's was close to 1/3 of their earned pay. Probably Delta's bean counters are not as proficient at hiding and diverting profit. Just for info and "grins". And of course their management is trying to rid themselves of that, in the ongoing negotiations for a new contract."

...It was only 22% of our W2. That means the wide body captains received almost $70,000!
You are right the company is trying to adjust the PS but the pilots are going for a 40% pay increase. That will only get us back to 2002 wages though.
Don't worry you guys will probably get 10-12 weeks as the thread posters are pontificating.

[donpizmeov]

Are you glad you didn't make it through DEC selection New Tomcat? It's time to move on.

[Divertnow]

Funny how the math works out;

Profit last year - 5.5 billion

If you increase that by 40% as sir Tim says in the press...you get EXACTLY 7.7 billion (the target).

So if that's true we will come in 1 dirham short and get nothing or maybe 2 weeks if we are lucky!

That's what I thought. 2 weeks. Given there's an invitation to the circus, we should assume we stand a good chance of getting something. I don't think my view is pathetic or a brainwashed one for that matter. It's just the nature of this particular beast called Emirates.

[itaintgoingtothemoon]

Agreed - 2 weeks. 4 max.

The precursive speech might use the word, "Yield" negatively, then, "But", and we will all feel very fortunate to have gotten something outta what must have been a very tough year.......

[Cloud Bunny]

The only thing I've noticed regarding the BBC article from STC was that the only reference was to Emirates Airline profit being up 40% not the Emirates Group which is what the PS is based on.
Here's hoping DNATA have made a fortune!

[DCS99]

4 weeks max. Not expecting anything more.

[puff m'call]

I don't want a bonus, I want a life!!

We get what we get, simple as that.

I can't understand why people even talk about it, if it was going to be a life changing amount then yes why not get excited, but it won't be.

They will give as little as they can get away with. Things will only change around here when they're grounding 20+ aircraft due to the fact they don't have pilots to fly them.

So believe me, worry about other things in life and not what your bonus will or won't be, because it won't make any difference!

[Talparc]

Puff:
excellent post
totally agree

[lospilotos]

I don't want a bonus, I want a life!!

We get what we get, simple as that.

I can't understand why people even talk about it, if it was going to be a life changing amount then yes why not get excited, but it won't be.

They will give as little as they can get away with. Things will only change around here when they're grounding 20+ aircraft due to the fact they don't have pilots to fly them.

So believe me, worry about other things in life and not what your bonus will or won't be, because it won't make any difference!

It will make a difference to me so I´ll PM you my bank details for you to transfer your profit share since you are in no need of it...

[ruserious]

It will make a difference to me so I´ll PM you my bank details for you to transfer your profit share
Tragic
since you are in no need of it...
Umm not exactly what he said, are you management by any chance ;)

[sluggums]

Agreed, it was a bit cras...

[lospilotos]

He said he didn't want it...

[TOGA!]

Use of sarcasm is an art that is often lost in Dubai as most of us/them completely miss a sarcastic remark by someone of a different culture.

or

lospilotos remark is the result of a company induced lobotomy that only allows literal translation or interpretation.

everybody have a good drink and focus on the real problem.

[lospilotos]

Use of sarcasm is an art that is often lost in Dubai as most of us/them completely miss a sarcastic remark by someone of a different culture.

or

lospilotos remark is the result of a company induced lobotomy that only allows literal translation or interpretation.

everybody have a good drink and focus on the real problem.

Jesus guys! It was a joke! I want a good profit share and a life. Everyone ok now?

[sluggums]

No! And another thing....

We get it, everybody's a bit tetchy, can't think why...

[axialflow]

What about the KitKat bar?...won't they increase the size to 4 sticks? Can't get enough KitKat on the 0200 LT depts.

Ax

[Croc Dundee]

Don't forget the red bulls!

[LHR Rain]

We will know in just a few hours how much the company respects us.
I am still banking on 10-12 weeks. As The Donald often says the profit is going to be HUUUGE!

[fatbus]

I'm waiting for the pay review.

[Thebigblue]

I don't know how you came to that figure of 10-12 weeks!? It's written in black and white on the portal how it's worked out. I will only be 2 maybe 3 weeks max. Bet my mortgage on it

[Kamelchaser]

I'm pretty sure this is the only part of the world...and perhaps one of the few companies in the world...that announces its profit AFTER they pay the shareholder's dividend. What it means for us minions is it doesn't matter how much profit the company actually makes, it only shares what it wants to share after deciding how much goes to the shareholder (the govt). It increases or decreases its dividend depending on how much it feels it needs to give to the workers.

Therefore discussion about the "rules" of the profit share are moot..they decide exactly how much the profit exceeds the target every single year, and the actual profit has absolutely NOTHING to do with the equation.

[Fire Ball XL5]

Absolutely correct!! ^^^^^^^^

[delorean79]

Twitter @emirates US$ 2.2 billion profit.

@emirates (https://twitter.com/emirates/status/729917024256806912)

[delorean79]

And that means 2 to 3 weeks.

[bidabon]

That means nada, zippo, zilch !
The target was 7.7b and the profit just announced is 7.1....
Do the maths !

[uba737]

2.2B at 3.68 = 8.096B
The other number was for the airline only, not the group!

[bidabon]

10.24am: Emirates airline, one of the world’s largest carriers, made Dh7.1 billion for the full financial year ending March 31, 2016, up 56 per cent compared to the Dh4.6 billion it reported last year. Revenue fell 4 per cent to Dh85 billion.

From the local Pravda.
Of course I hope I'm wrong but...

[speedbirdhopeful1]

That's just EK, but profit share is based on the whole group.
From gulf news:

The Group, which also includes airport and travel services operator, made Dh8.2 billion in the 12 months to March 31, compared to Dh5.5 billion a year earlier. Revenue fell 3 per cent to Dh92.9 billion due to the strong dollar.

[Craggenmore]

Emirates Group Announces Record Profits (http://emirates-group-news.prezly.com/emirates-group-announces-record-profits)

AED 8.2 billion (US$ 2.2 billion)

[donpizmeov]

Gulfnews say 8.2 billion. Announced at 10.20am.

[bidabon]

You are quite right, Speedbird, I shall continue praying then !!

[sluggums]

The fact is, is that it could've been twice that...

[Emma Royds]

Last year the difference between the target and the profit was 1.8 billion and that resulted in 9 weeks profit share.

This year the difference seems to be 0.5 billion. Based on my crude maths, then 2-3 weeks should be about right for 2015-2016.

[delorean79]

They could still decide to give us more that what the maths say!

And I could stop smoking the **** I'm smoking!

:}:}:}

[TIMINGandLUCK]

Lets see, now that the annual report has been published we can compare.

Jet fuel cost 2014-15: 28.7 billion AED
Jet fuel cost 2015-16: 19.7 billion AED =

Savings in Jet fuel alone: 9 billion Dirhams

That means the savings in jet fuel alone is more than the entire group profit...!

Also, according to the 2014-15 report the strong dollar cost 412 million dollars in profit and somehow for 2015-15 it was responsible for 1.1 billion dollars in lost profit. How is that possible! Something seems fishy here and I don't think its just the Dubai creek...

[delorean79]

Emma, I used same rule of thumb... the problem is that we are 10.000 more in the group now compared to last year, which makes 2 weeks more probable, IMHO.

[my salami]

Guys I think we should look at the Group, and the Group made 9.3B..
An increase of 1.6B over the target which was set at 7.7B...
Hope I'm right😎😎

[JAYTO]

If the calculations are done correctly, then we should see 2 to 4 weeks,


So, after flying more than the legal limit due to factoring this last 12 months, they walk away with 2 billion USD and we walk away with a few thousand.

AWESOME...


back to rowing boys, there is still debt and dreams to be paid for...........

[TIMINGandLUCK]

My Salami you are looking at the operating profit of 9.3B. The profit share is paid out from the "profit attributed to the owner" and that was 8.2B as mentioned earlier.

[my salami]

My Salami you are looking at the operating profit of 9.3B. The profit share is paid out from the "profit attributed to the owner" and that was 8.2B as mentioned earlier.

Tks for that..😰😥

[alwayzinit]

It never ceases to amaze me that even with the massive drop in fuel costs, full aircraft, low workers salaries comparatively and crew working up and beyond the max ( subject to factoring) that the business rockets scientists on the 9th floor still only manage $2.2 Billion.
Hmmm, as usual for this time of year there is something fishy in the air.......................

[777-200LR]

JAYTO, I hear you bro, but try explaining that to the thousands who lost their homes, pensions, benefits etc when the markets collapse in 2008. The same bank managers walked away with 8 figure bonuses and scandals that followed. Did I mention that happened in first and free world?

[skytrax]

Apparently, the highest ever profit made.
Emirates group made 2.2 billion $.
Airline made 1.9 bilion $.

Let's see.

[Calmcavok]

It's a profit share target. The amount they pay out in profit share is then up to them. Not as simple as how much did we beat the target by.

Oh, and we may have a dedicated freighter fleet.

[itaintgoingtothemoon]

25% of the over-and-above is added to the 2 weeks but I think they're in the Mood to be "generous".

4-5

[Warlock2000]

EVERY YEAR the same BS. When will you lot learn that you can scrutinize the BILLIONS any way you please? It's not "really" a PROFIT SHARE (nice words to make you feel warm and fuzzy), it's a BONUS.

The numbers are worked and you get whatever is deemed appropriate.

Take it, say THANK YOU and keep working on the exit plan. :ok:

[Fart Master]

Wot he said. Exactly...

[Ynot]

5 (five) weeks...any comments?

[donpizmeov]

It's the full 5 weeks right? Profit up by 56%, profit share halved. Seems about right.

[P7xkk]

roughly in line with a fag packet calculation based on the delta between target and actuals zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[axialflow]

I wonder what the crowd reaction was like...

...but what about an increment ?

[electricdeathjet]

That's cool for me...
Got some spending money for the wife's summer holiday....

[BigGeordie]

Everybody clapped and cheered of course. The office workers don't do any more work year on year. Still start and finish at the same time every day. Wonder what the EGHQ Costa contribution to the profit was?

Pay rise is usually announced in about a week. Once the euphoria over the profit share has died down.

[P7xkk]

rounds of raucous applause heard from the Gin Palace, apparently...........

[lospilotos]

Target lowered to 7.2 to accommodate the 5 weeks as a show of good faith.

[Nancy61]

5 weeks bonus for 2016. Anyone have different info?

[clear to land]

Lets hope the 'unshared' balance goes into a significant double digit pay rise - which is what really matters to us anyway!

[axialflow]

Ok, whatevsss :hmm: on the profit share.

A serious increment (on top of the step) needs to be added now so we can start grocery shopping in Dxb again and not on layovers :{

[nothingsurprisesme]

Target lowered to 7.2 to accommodate the 5 weeks as a show of good faith.

Good faith...ha ha ha ha ha ha ha😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[sluggums]

More like a festering carrot.

[lospilotos]

Target lowered to 7.2 to accommodate the 5 weeks as a show of good faith.

Correcting myself, 7.2 is for next year...

[ekwhistleblower]

Profit up 50%, Profit Share down nearly 50%. How does the company always manage to turn a win/win scenario into a loss?

[yardman]

What's the opposite of generous?

[puff m'call]

Complete Joke!!:ugh:

[sluggums]

What did we expect. Their contempt for us is well documented.

[harry the cod]

Good plan DAYSEEMAL, then you can look as much of a idiot on the flight deck as you do on this thread!

The Company gives you 5 weeks extra pay, 5 weeks probably more than the majority of most airlines in this World, and you think a response like that is appropriate? What a prat. What would have made you happy? 8 weeks, 12 weeks? Personally I don't give a fudge about the profit share. I do, however, have concerns with the soon to be announced pay rise and the constant high hours we fly. That's where we should be focusing our energy.....

If you want the Company to treat you as a professional, behave like one.

Harry

[sluggums]

Harry, don't go there... While I admire your pragmatism, don't make the schoolboy error of comparing us to other companies. What did Delta get in the past, eh?

Let people vent. It's all we can do when we're being shafted, yet again.

[fatbus]

Some "pilots" need to grow up. You guys sound so pathetic. Sad to be associated with this group of pilots.

[harry the cod]

Sluggums

"What did Delta get in the past eh?" To be honest, I don't know, but perhaps you should ask that very same question to a few of the Delta guys that came to EK during the 2002/3 downturn, the time they were raped of their entire pensions and many were furloughed or lost their commands.

Good point though! :ok:

Harry

[cerbus]

Delta got over 20% of their wages in the form of a Bonus but the company is trying to their Bonus away.
I bet no Delta pilot flew anywhere near our yearly total yet made more money than us both in the form of wages and company profit.
There was a severe worldwide downturn after the terrorist attacks but Delta pilots and most other airlines voted to get rid of their pensions and take a pay cut. Look what it has done for them now. Short term pain for long term gain.
I wish I had a Green Card or an exit Card.
5 weeks after 1026 flying hours last 12 months? What a joke! Is flying us 11% over the yearly max professional? Shut up and like it, I think NOT!

[jack schidt]

@fatbus, I'm with you on your comment above. If it had been 10 weeks then there would have still been complaints. The immature nature or tone of some of these posts could have been written at a kindergarten.

It's not as good as it used to be, but it's the new norm. Put up, shut up or pack up.


J

[cerbus]

Is that comment to the pissed off vocal majority or to Fatbus?

[pacbro]

"Put up, shut up or pack up"

Battered woman syndrome Jack?

[anson harris]

"You've seen the end of the profit share" - Commonly held view by the frothing at the mouth types, after the year when it was zero weeks. Glad to see the sense of optimism continues...

[Talparc]

Neektu: I was fighting against the green bananas for years without success.
But on ULR the time should be long enough for them to get yellow.
So no change here as well to be expected.

[north flyer]

Just took a quick look at the annual report and the way I read it is, the group made 15.4 billion AED or about $4.1 billion USD, you just have to add the group profit and the "profit attributal to the owner" together.

$4.1bn USD makes sense based on the revenue when you look at what is going on in the rest of the airline world.

Another thing that caught my eye is the the profit attributable to the owner goes up by 50% ( +/- a percent or two) each year, bet you that it is around 10.5bn AED next year.

Warlock2000 almost has it right, they munipulate the numbers to come up with the number of weeks "bonus" that they think you need to feel like you are part of the "team" and keep you from going bat****, so I will take the money, but I won't say thank you.

We have all earned it the hard way.

[Fearless Leader]

We won't get what we expect - despite what all you financial wizards say
We don't get what we want - to keep up with inflation and counter poor recruitment
We won't get what we deserve - for flying 100 hours in 28 days and reduced leave
We will be disappointed - guaranteed

SS, et all.
Why are you still there?

[donpizmeov]

SS leaves soon.

Good luck to ya mate.

[Fearless Leader]

And you Don,

Why are you still there?

[LHR Rain]

Why are you here Fearless? Are you scared to leave or can you leave?
5 weeks was an insult I don't care what the company pilots said.
I am over 900 hrs and was expecting more especially with the profit "declared."

[harry the cod]

Mutts

Do you think they went for the carrots over the celery as it might improve our night vision? Not that we do much flying at night......... :hmm:

Harry

[Dropp the Pilot]

I made the evidence-based cynical prophecy a while ago that on this occasion and for the first time in company history the payout will be in June instead of May just to give certain resignees the parting gift of no gift.

Has anyone seen a reference to what month the share will be distributed?

[motojet]

Good observation Muttley. However each carrot stick is now 30% shorter resulting in a 8%
reduction in the amount of carrots. (I need something to do on long flights).

[nolimitholdem]

hahahaha! 5 weeks! As much as I have to feel for the pilots still slaving away, there is something pretty hilarious about the company having the cheek to offer that after the declared profit. It's truly fascinating to see the extent of the contempt they have for the source of that profit.

All I can say is, I hope there weren't too many potential resignations hanging on for a few extra months for THAT! Hell, there are tons of other jobs out there that routinely pay a 13th month salary every year, without the false drama of some made-up profit announcement bs and the requisite clapping seals in the atrium. (Pssst...five weeks is only a hair more than a month...)

No doubt the same few will be back next year, stretching for "just ONE more" Prophet Cher "and then we'll leave", the big one that never...quite...comes...followed by the breathless wait for some sort of smoke-and-mirrors non-raise in the salary. How many years in a row will people choose to remain in a job that is killing them, so that they can go backwards financially after inflation? (How long is a piece of string?)

Thank you Emirates, for completely vindicating the decisions of so many to leave this past year. :D

[Warlock2000]

Pay rise is usually announced in about a week. Once the euphoria over the profit share has died down.

Since any form of "euphoria" amongst the pilot body completely disappeared circa 2009 (when TCAS announced the TEMPORARY increase in flying hours), I'd say it would have been safe for "them" to communicate the next creative tweak to our T&C's 24 hrs ago!
:D

Lets hope the 'unshared' balance goes into a significant double digit pay rise - which is what really matters to us anyway!
That along with getting a LIFE back! Which is more important than $$'s

[lospilotos]

I made the evidence-based cynical prophecy a while ago that on this occasion and for the first time in company history the payout will be in June instead of May just to give certain resignees the parting gift of no gift.

Has anyone seen a reference to what month the share will be distributed?

It said May in the Powerpoint presentation...

[JAYTO]

oh well there you have. Same time next year guys???

[fatbus]

Always been in May pay

[Panther 88]

And the pay review is usually announced in June. Shall we now start speculating on that? :ok:

[fatbus]

The pilot pay review will show the lack of respect the company has towards its pilot staff.

[Fearless Leader]

LHR, I sense a bit of misplaced anger.

And Yes , I have left.
Just a lurker now

[GoreTex]

why don't you leave?

[sluggums]

"Some "pilots" need to grow up. You guys sound so pathetic."

Fatbus. You slag us for our comments, but are happy to claim your comments as more mature. Interesting.