View Full Version : Virgin Atlantic Classics
shrek
25th Jun 2002, 19:07
Rumour control has suggested that Virgins Classics, currently residing in a sand pit, are to be dug out and used later this year, with Virgin again???
Can/will anyone quash or uphold this rumour please.:confused: :confused:
chiglet
25th Jun 2002, 23:08
Two VS Classics at MAN, yesterday and today :D
Both TF...
That's all I know:rolleyes:
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy
Colonel Klink
26th Jun 2002, 07:19
It may be that the Virgin management want to dig them out of the desert for use, but who is going to fly them? Almost all Virgin classic FE's have been snapped up by quality operators, most pilots have moved on to better jobs also, so please don't tell us that the Virgin managers think that for 6 months all their ex-staff have been sitting around pining for their old jobs back, and will forgive them for the way they have been treated??
joebanana
26th Jun 2002, 12:25
Couldn't agree more Colonel!
I'm more than happy in my new job and have absolutely no desire to go back to VS after the shambolic events since September.
However I suspect that there will still be plenty of CVs sitting on JT's desk.
iwish
26th Jun 2002, 12:28
Hi Shrek!
Hows it going at Transjet? Are they still flying those old Classics or have you moved on?
Hope things are going well and you got all the money Transjet owed you, unlike some of us!!!!
MarkD
26th Jun 2002, 19:18
Lisa said:
Toronto back on line
oh please please please :D
BA and AC need some competition...
Have already booked for August but at least two trips due in the next 18 months...
chiglet
26th Jun 2002, 19:21
Hey Lisa
I'd watch it if I were you. You just might get "clamped" ;)
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy
Wycombe
26th Jun 2002, 20:35
....ah well, I was looking forward to a nice shiny new -400 when I go "bucket & spading" with the wife and kids to UVF in November.
BEagle
27th Jun 2002, 05:45
joebanana wrote:
"I'm more than happy in my new job and have absolutely no desire to go back to VS after the shambolic events since September"
This is a point of view I have heard from many Virgin Atlantic pilots after their treatment last year post 9/11. It seems that the company has lost the confidence of many - if there were another downturn in air transport, they are simply not prepared to trust Virgin, it would seem.
People used to fall over themselves to fly for Sir Richard; regrettably that no longer seems to be the case from what they have told me.
shrek
27th Jun 2002, 07:23
Lisa
Thank-you for your reply, you seem to be rather well informed, so am I correct to assume that the Classics in the desert are to exhumed???
:confused:
Cornish Jack
27th Jun 2002, 08:34
Interesting how people with no direct experience of VAA are prepared to comment on internal matters. As one of those employees (not a pilot) who was made redundant post 9/11, I could see no difference between our treatment and that of any other large company dealing with redundancies. The difference for the pilot work force was essentially a product of their Flight Deck committee's arrangements on their behalf..... and that, I suspect, was a no-win situation. LIFO was the basic principle and, while its application may have seemed a little odd in certain areas, it was never going to be any easier or more even-handed in EVERYONE's eyes.
For those not involved in the commercial aviation sphere, IT IS A VOLATILE EMPLOYMENT AREA. Always has been, always will be. A VERY large commercial operator employed one of their senior captain/managers for some three years together with the necessary administration set-up to examine the 'peaks and troughs' of the operation with a view to 'ironing them out'. Result? Zilch, Rien, Nada.
While VAA may well be Sir Richard's favourite 'toy', at the end of the day he is a business man. Having worked for both VAA and BA, both have inherent management problems but my previous 35 + years in the RAF prepared me well for that. ;)
evolante
27th Jun 2002, 15:31
There are at least five Classics - two are in service with Air Atlanta Icelandic three are parked in the desert and one at LHR I believe
Inside track with VS indicates they will be looking to sub lease out at least three in the next few months. I would guess that they dont want to take a book loss by selling them.
Thrawn
27th Jun 2002, 17:18
Some of what Lisa said above isn't entirely even a good rumour!!!
2 Classics will be back from the desert not sure which ones yet.
The present 747-400 fleet based at LGW will stay at LGW for the present future as will the LGW-MIA.
A340-600 comes online at the end of july
Lisa check your source first!!!!!
Denzil
27th Jun 2002, 18:13
The only truth is that there are 5 aircraft in Mojave (take a glance at www.cactuswings.com to check) and 2 in use by Air Atlanta
Rumours are very actively doing the rounds on the other subjects and only time will tell if they are true;)
bolts
28th Jun 2002, 08:46
Cornish Jack
I trust your redundancy was voluntary?
Brgds
Cornish Jack
28th Jun 2002, 09:34
Bolts - Involuntary voluntary ! :( In other words, if I didn't apply I would have to go anyway, so not too much choice. As the'elderly statesman' (or knackered old git) of the team I was 'standing well above the parapet', so it didn't come as a huge surprise. Could have been worse and not having to get up early every day has its compensations. :)
Astronut
28th Jun 2002, 09:40
Are these replacements or additions to fleet
Digitalis
28th Jun 2002, 14:20
The A340-600s are likely to replace most of the 10 existing -300s. Possibly up to 3 -300s may be retained to allow limited route expansion. At the moment, I believe that 2 of the 3 stored Classics are being considered for use on bucket-and-spade routes for Virgin Holidays. As VAA no longer has the 742 on its AOC, a third-party operator would have to operate the aeroplanes on VAA's behalf. Where the crews would come from is another question, as most (but not all) of the Virgin ex-Classic crews have retrained or have left the company for pastures new - whether voluntarily or not.
Personally, I wouldn't put too much faith in this project coming to fruition, but you never know!
Denzil
29th Jun 2002, 14:08
Digitalis, the A346 plan you mention was the original one that has now changed and the A343 will mostly be staying. What routes they will be flying is the question everyone wants an answer to!!
scroggs
29th Jun 2002, 16:32
Some words of wisdom from our MD last week suggest that Digitalis' summary is pretty close. I think we have the option of keeping more of the 343s but, as yet, only one is confirmed as staying. There was some route info; I'll place it on our forum.
Kato747
2nd Jul 2002, 18:32
Can anyone confirm whether or not the 2 "Classics" from Air Atlanta are on wet or dry lease?? Have heard that the crews are ex- or current VS, and NOT Air Atlanta....
If it's a dry lease.....someone please tell Malcom we're available!!!
:D
Dunhovrin
2nd Jul 2002, 19:56
The 'back form the desert' story has been doing the rounds for a while now. Methinks it was idle speculation about a possible cost-recovery exercise that has grown into the return of the First Fleet. Of course the VS MAN-BGI story is completely untrue....;)
Obsolete Observer
3rd Jul 2002, 09:14
Kato 747,I think you'll find Malcolm is long gone.........:)
crewrest
3rd Jul 2002, 13:34
Etops773
Despite what you think of the 747-200 (and we all love nice new jets) Virgin are still paying leases on the 747-200s and will have to for the time being; therefore they either leave them in the desert rotting until the leases expire or operate them in an attempt to re-coop some of the costs.
They (ex-ANZ) are in quite good nick and have the latest interiors and IFE, they don't even use that much gas, so are quite good for using on certains parts of Virgin's route network.
RB wouldn't look to good in the press if VS bring the classics back as he was in the press last week advertising how young the VS fleet is now. Just forgot to mention that you may well be flying on an older classic even having bought a VS tkt.
Seloco
3rd Jul 2002, 14:19
There was certainly a Virgin Classic at LHR on Monday afternoon, resplendent in the new livery and with a TF registration. Anyone know what this is being used for?
SnapOff
3rd Jul 2002, 14:50
The Classic at LHR is doing the Lagos for the next few months due to the late arrival of the new -600's. (and who knows where else they will end up!!!!)
Dear ETOPS773
Without wanting to take things personally, but I think an explanation as to why you suggest that Virgins Classics are, 'stupid' and 'useless', please.
You are quite obviously an experienced and professional aviator judging by your profile (C152, PA 28), or perhaps you are just an ignorant tw@t.:mad:
richie smith
3rd Jul 2002, 18:06
Shrek
You said it, I thought it.
The Big Easy
3rd Jul 2002, 21:42
Shek/Ritchie
Shrek said it....... Ritchie thought it....... I second it !!
Is that guy for real?
The Big Easy.
crewrest
3rd Jul 2002, 22:46
Boys, may I suggest his comments are naive at best, and leave it at that. Doesn't Danny's sticky at the top of this forum mention posts of that type.
Oh, and what happened to Lisa's post?
AlphaCharlie
22nd Jul 2002, 18:24
Today at 1703 (BST) a Virgin coloured 747 classic landed on 27R at Heathrow. Its registration was TF - ATN and it parked on Lima 23 (possibly 25).
TF is the prefix for Iceland. I assume this aircraft belongs to Air Atlanta Iceland and they are operating flights for VS over the summer. In previous years Air Atlanta have operated VS flights however, this is the first year I recall them painting their aircraft in VS colours.
Unless of course, Virgin have just reobtained this aircraft as rumoured earlier in the post! Doubtful I know.
Denzil
22nd Jul 2002, 21:01
The aircraft is VS (ex G-VBEE) on lease to AAI (as is the aircraft at MAN), it is on temp lease back to VS on the Lagos route. AAI have had a few VS Classics on lease as can be seen by checking out their website www.atlanta.is/
Whalerider
22nd Jul 2002, 23:12
TF-ABA (I think) has op from both LGW and MAN in past in full VS livery.
London Lagos Jul 11, 2002
London – Lagos, two out of three airlines use Air Atlanta.
During summer 2002 Air Atlanta will be operating for two of the three airlines flying scheduled services between Lagos, Nigeria, and London Heathrow in the United Kingdom. Virgin Atlantic has awarded Air Atlanta the contract to operate six flights a week using Boeing 747-200, registration TF-ATN, through to early September. Air Atlanta already operates Boeing 767-200, registration TF-ATY, three times a week for Nigeria Airways on a contract that runs through to November.
In addition Air Atlanta also operates Manchester to Orlando for Virgin Atlantic and also has a Boeing 747 operating for Nigeria Airways from Lagos on scheduled services to New York.
The Lagos station now has almost 60 flight deck and cabin crew, engineers and operations personnel. Engineers have also set up a station at Heathrow to support the aircraft.
MarkD
24th Jul 2002, 17:45
Makes a bit of a mockery of having "choice" on the routes...
If you wish to fly that route, be my guest!
I would be quite interested to hear how the Atlanta crews survive the unique 'Lagos experience' though.
doubledolphins
26th Jul 2002, 10:16
Saw a TF registered 747 classic at MAN yesterday from close up. Parked next to it. I was a little bit upset to see it had the usual nose art, with the union jack hankie. Why? Could not the artist have altered it to an Icelandic hankie? (He only had to remove the diagonal stripes after all.) Could it be that Branson is trying to cover up this nasty example of flaging out?
HotDog
26th Jul 2002, 10:29
Dolphins,nasty example of flaging out? .Is this another means to describe flagellation?:D
Have a look here. (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=57663&perpage=15&pagenumber=3)
Air Atlanta are operating 2 Virgin B747-200's on lease. I believe Virgin no longer have the 747-200 on their ACO, thus have to use Air Atlanta to operate them.
TF-ATN is G-VBEE and is operating LHR-Lagos.
TF-ATW is G-VSSS and is operating MAN-MCO.
Denzil
26th Jul 2002, 11:58
The Lagos flights only went out to conract due late delivery of A340-600 and the Manchester flights although on VS flight numbers are only in operation at the request of Virgin Holidays. The only UK operator would be EAAC and they would use there own ex BA B742's, AAI are using VS owned aircraft in full VS livery and with full VS cabins including IFE with games etc. As a punter you are better off flying on these than the ex BA aircraft.
BTW many of the aircrew are ex VS as are the ground engineers at MAN, LHR aircraft maintained by VS. This has ensured that as many UK jobs are protected as possible.