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Glonass
12th Mar 2016, 13:02
This morning, in SCEL, Ed Force One suffered a damage to its engine no.2. Still investigating what happened.

Sorry, I haven't found a link in English... Insólito: Avión De Iron Maiden Resultó Dañado En Aeropuerto De Santiago De Chile - ModoCharlie (http://bit.ly/1RdiVET)

telster
12th Mar 2016, 13:12
Photo here: https://twitter.com/AirwaysNews/status/708653449991299072

wanabee777
12th Mar 2016, 13:25
Google Chrome translation:

In a story that is going around the world, the Boeing 747 'Ed Force One "Iron Maiden was at least one of the engine nacelles damaged this morning at the Arturo Merino Benitez Airport, Santiago de Chile. The fact was registered in this that has led laps in social networks, where shown at least external damage to the nacelle engine No. 2 (wing left, just in case) image.

http://modocharlie.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Accidente-motor-Boeing-747-Ed-Force-One-Iron-Maiden-Chile-800x534.jpg

We are waiting for further information, both aerodino repair, as the aircraft in which the rock group have to move to the city of Cordoba in Argentina.

Rhys S. Negative
12th Mar 2016, 13:42
Photos on another website show damage to both No.1 and No.2 engine cowlings, with a very mangled ground vehicle (tug?) that seems to have been struck by both.

speedbird_481_papa
12th Mar 2016, 13:45
another post here again not in English but with a lot more photos.

Looks like a fuel truck went into it but could be wrong....

Ed Force One: avião do Iron Maiden se envolve em acidente no Chile ~ IRON MAIDEN 666 - BRASIL (http://www.ironmaiden666.com.br/2016/03/ed-force-one-aviao-do-iron-maiden-se.html)

lomapaseo
12th Mar 2016, 14:04
Looks like a fuel truck went into it but could be wrong....

Just idle speculation based on eyeballs, but it looks like a hydraulic boom hit it

flybyday
12th Mar 2016, 14:06
Ed Force One badly damaged in Chile (http://ironmaiden.com/news/article/ed-force-one-damaged)

JumpJumpJump
12th Mar 2016, 14:09
The Link above is in Portuguese... It says...

Um acidente no Aeroporto Internacional Comodoro Arturo Merino Benítez em Santiago, capital do Chile, danificou dois motores do Ed Force One, Boeing 747-400 do Iron Maiden. Segundo as primeiras notícias, um veículo na pista teria se chocado com a aeronave da banda.

Ainda não há informações sobre a gravidade do acidente e suas consequências para os planos da banda, que deveria seguir para a Argentina e depois para o Brasil após o show na capital chilena.

Mais fotos e informações em breve...

An Accident at the International airport in Santiago, capital of chile, have damaged two Engines of Ed Force One, Iron Maiden's 747-400. According to initial reports, a ground vehicle may have colided with the bands aircraft [this part is deliberately vague as it isn't saying who hit whom]

There is still no information regarding the seriousness of the accident and its consequences on the bands plans, the band should be leaving for Argentina and then onwards to brazil are the show iin the chilean capital.

More fotos and info shortly

speedbird_481_papa
12th Mar 2016, 14:13
On closer look at the pictures again, it looks like the tug to push/tow the aircraft tried to take a short-cut under the left wing but failed. Miserably. The cab of the tug has been ripped clean off and hydraulic fluid I am guessing from the tug has gone everywhere. Someone is now jobless....

sunny11410
12th Mar 2016, 14:15
Ed Force One was this morning tethered to a tow truck to be taken for refuelling prior to flying over the Andes to Cordoba for the next show. On moving the steering pin that is part of the mechanism that connects the ground tug to the aircraft seemingly fell out. On making a turn the aircraft had no steering and collided with the ground tug badly damaging the undercarriage, two of the aircrafts engines and injuring two ground tug operators, both of whom have been taken to hospital. We hope of course that they make a full and speedy recovery and we will be closely monitoring their progress. The flight engineers are on site and evaluating the damage, but their initial report is that the engines have suffered large damage and will require an extended period of maintenance and possibly two new engines.
We are currently making contingency arrangements to get to the show in Cordoba tomorrow with band, crew and equipment intact. Fortunately the 20 tons of equipment had not been loaded onto Ed Force One at the time of the accident. Although this is tragic for our beautiful plane we do not expect this to affect our concert schedule including the next 2 shows in Cordoba and Buenos Aires. And we hope to find a new Ed Force One to continue this adventure with us in the near future. We will keep everyone updated when we know more, so keep checking only on this site for official news.

To finish on a high note however, our visit to Chile was a huge success with 58,000 fans coming to the show as totally brilliant as ever in the Stadium Nacional last night. We love you guys!
-> Ed Force One badly damaged in Chile (http://ironmaiden.com/news/article/ed-force-one-damaged)

Una Due Tfc
12th Mar 2016, 14:54
Someone is now jobless....

2 people in the tug are critical in hospital so I think they have bigger things to worry about.

STN Ramp Rat
12th Mar 2016, 15:29
just looking at the pictures of the tug and the wording of the press release. you can see the towbar is still attached to the tug and the tug is at a right angle to the aircraft.

I believe that the training for a tug driver says in the event of a separation you should accelerate out of the way of the aircraft as fast as you can and that it is the responsibility of the person on the aircraft brakes to stop the aircraft. if I am correct then one possible scenario is a towbar separation which was noticed by the tug which then turned sharp left to get out of the way, the brakeman however did not notice the separation or was not able to stop the aircraft in time and effectively ran the tug over.

and before anyone asks it is not that common for the tug to be in contact with the aircraft during a towing operation.

sb_sfo
12th Mar 2016, 16:20
and before anyone asks it is not that common for the tug to be in contact with the aircraft during a towing operation.
If you meant to say that while towing an aircraft it is not common to be in contact with the flight deck brake-rider or flight crew, where in the world do you work? What are headsets for?

Edited to add that I'm not talking about jockeying bizjets around an FBO ramp, but moving commercial heavies around without tug-flightdeck comms is nuts, and at my home base, if you don't have comms due to APU inop or whatever, you get an Airfield Ops escort.

dash6
12th Mar 2016, 16:40
Report seems to indicate the steering bypass pin dropped out.Presumably the tug turned and the aircraft continued straight ahead. Tug and aircraft remained attached.

sb_sfo
12th Mar 2016, 16:50
My bet is that the steering lockpin fell out during the tow. Can't tell from the picture, but I would bet that the towbar head is still attached to the airplane. For those that aren't familiar, the 747 steering pin has a spring-loaded ball about halfway down the pin length to lock it in place, but they have fallen out before. If the ground handler used a 777 pin instead (same diameter, but the locking ball is at the end) you could expect a similar result as this. UA modified their 747 fleet to use a longer pin that drops in from the top, as gravity is your friend, but most other operators left theirs unmodded to insert the pin from below.
If the pin drops out during a tow, the next turn you make with the tug will have the hydraulic pressure centering the gear, and the shear bolts will break, leaving the tow head on the aircraft and the tug/bar combination wandering free. If the tug is turning, it will continue, and the aircraft will go straight until it piles into the tug, generally with the results seen here.

andrasz
12th Mar 2016, 17:26
Exactly the same happened to a Saudia T7 at Jeddah a couple of years ago.

750XL
12th Mar 2016, 17:31
Happens more often than you'd like to believe. I assume that the front bit of the towbar is still stuck to the aircraft and the shear pins did their job and popped the bar off, only for the aircraft to run over the tug.

None of the airports I've worked at have had mandatory communication between tug and engineer/brake rider during towing so I doubt they were in communication either.

Hoping for a speedy recovery for the two tug guys

sb_sfo
12th Mar 2016, 18:06
Whether comms between a towed aircraft and the tug is mandated or not, it's stupid and unprofessional to do without. A DC headset is about $250, and a good extension cable from these folks Cables (http://www.promodgse.com/what-we-do.html) is about $110. I wonder what the insurance company that is going to pay for the damage to this aircraft is going to say about the ground handler that is too cheap to buy the proper equipment to do the job?

And, if you're towing without comms, how in the world are you going to get the word to the tug to yield to traffic, change of tow route, et cetera?

Note to beancounters: Yeah, you can probably get away with this 99 times out of 100, but that 1 time will bite you real good. 2 guys in the hospital, minimum $3,000,000 damage to the airplane, high drag/side load pylon inspection, the cab ripped off the tug, and god knows how much for the trip interruption and negative publicity. Smart move, that. The difference between third-world and first-world aviation can be seen right here.

SMT Member
12th Mar 2016, 18:39
Edited to add that I'm not talking about jockeying bizjets around an FBO ramp, but moving commercial heavies around without tug-flightdeck comms is nuts, and at my home base, if you don't have comms due to APU inop or whatever, you get an Airfield Ops escort.

Good for you. Meanwhile at my home base every single towing operation is done with towbar-less tugs and by a single person. As in, the one driving the tractor. This also includes towing which enters the manoeuvring area and crosses active runways. Single-man is also how the vast majority, say more than 75%, of all push-backs are performed. And it's not just us, that's how every single airline and ground handler does it.

Operators across the airport have done it like that for more than a decade, yet to have an accident.

Different when you're using a towbar though. Then you need someone riding the brakes, but there are no requirements to maintain intercom contact. But nobody here ever uses a towbar for towing anymore, just for push-backs.

STN Ramp Rat
12th Mar 2016, 18:41
Sb SFO

to clarify with the coms, the aircraft and the tug would both be in contact with ATC but the aircraft and the tug would probably not be in contact with each other. this is certainly not uncommon in Europe, I am sure there would have been coms during the pushback but possibly not in the tow.

Alber Ratman
12th Mar 2016, 20:03
Absolutely right, the handlers communications with the brake man is more than likely been brakes off / brakes on hand signals. Certainly was for the tow operation I was involved with as a brakeman on Thursday around LBA.

Tupperware Pilot
12th Mar 2016, 20:40
They should be more careful moving heavy metal.......i will get my coat!

telster
12th Mar 2016, 21:05
From the Iron Maiden Facebook page:

ED FORCE ONE BADLY DAMAGED ON THE GROUND IN COMODORO ARTURO MERINO BENITEZ (SANTIAGO, CHILE) AIRPORT
CONCERTS IN ARGENTINA TOMORROW AND TUESDAY EXPECTED TO GO AHEAD AS PLANNED


Ed Force One was this morning tethered to a tow truck to be taken for refuelling prior to flying over the Andes to Cordoba for the next show. On moving the steering pin that is part of the mechanism that connects the ground tug to the aircraft seemingly fell out. On making a turn the aircraft had no steering and collided with the ground tug badly damaging the undercarriage, two of the aircrafts engines and injuring two ground tug operators, both of whom have been taken to hospital. We hope of course that they make a full and speedy recovery and we will be closely monitoring their progress. The flight engineers are on site and evaluating the damage, but their initial report is that the engines have suffered large damage and will require an extended period of maintenance and possibly two new engines.


We are currently making contingency arrangements to get to the show in Cordoba tomorrow with band, crew and equipment intact. Fortunately the 20 tons of equipment had not been loaded onto EF1 at the time of the accident. Although this is tragic for our beautiful plane we do not expect this to affect our concert schedule including the next 2 shows in Cordoba and Buenos Aires. And we hope to find a new Ed Force One to continue this adventure with us in the near future. We will keep everyone updated when we know more, so keep checking only on this site for official news.


Further updated:


We are happy to tell our fans in Cordoba that our Killer Krew has sorted out all logistics for us to be there with our full show for you all tomorrow. We expect no disruption to the tour in any way and are looking for a replacement 747 Ed Force One while our current beauty is healed. More news on that later. Until then, believe me, we will get to you all on this tour one way or another wherever you are.


We are also delighted to say that we have been officially informed that the two Chilean airport staff who were injured following the malfunction of the tow truck connecting bolt will make a complete recovery. Best wishes to them and their families.

Capn Bloggs
12th Mar 2016, 22:32
to insert the pin from below.
Why would you design such a system?

sb_sfo
12th Mar 2016, 22:54
Why would you design such a system? I've been asking myself why Boeing would do that for more than 30 years. And they kept it with the -8! Reason prevailed with the triple, however. Commonality issues with the 747?

GrandPrix
12th Mar 2016, 23:10
The rumor is that the next show will have a live sacrifice to appease Eddy. Enjoy the show.

Ngineer
13th Mar 2016, 05:17
Looks like a couple of Iron Maiden fans wanted the band to hang around a bit longer. Up the Irons!!http://pipesmokersforum.com/community/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/headbang.gif (http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwi_k9az9LzLAhXFkZQKHZTjD7AQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.zappa.com%2Fmessageboard%2Fviewtopic.ph p%3Ff%3D8%26t%3D12187%26start%3D1625&psig=AFQjCNFYMI-xVdI9ZePmr_N5sxKAr2TfQQ&ust=1457932622312880)

crewmeal
13th Mar 2016, 07:14
Any guess as to what the replacement will be and where from?

glad rag
13th Mar 2016, 08:33
Why would you design such a system?
Why? I dunno but the other WHY is why it has never been changed???????

Grandfather rights??

RAT 5
13th Mar 2016, 11:11
Was anybody 'upstairs' watching over things; like brakes etc?

JumpJumpJump
13th Mar 2016, 15:24
When you consider the amount of 747's that are being tugged around globally every day.... I stop to wonder why this particular one had this particular accident... One question that springs to mind is how often, does santiago have to deal with 747's, is it rare for them to be there and as such was there a lack of familiarity in moving the type and dealing with any perculiarities in moving the model.... second, due to the high profile nature of this particular aircraft.... Was everybody focussed on the job, or were the ground crew busy using cameraphones and tweeting/instergramming/facebooking to their friends?

Or, is this type of incident quiete common, but just under-reported?

safelife
13th Mar 2016, 16:08
Why are nosewheel steering lockout pins used at all?
I flew the Fokker 100 and they just had a switch. Unlikely for that to fall out isn't it.

harrryw
13th Mar 2016, 16:13
@JumpJumpJump

I believe QANTAS had some flying reguarly there last year and I am sure there are a lot more especially freight.

Krystal n chips
13th Mar 2016, 18:43
" Why are nosewheel steering lockout pins used at all?
I flew the Fokker 100 and they just had a switch. Unlikely for that to fall out isn't it.

True, but equally more likely to fail in comparison to a large robust lump of metal, albeit a glorified pip-pin.

Having towed 747's, as an engineer on the F/D, with the 1/2 /300 series, there were always two upstairs, one sat at the F/E's panel and another in the Capt's seat.

The view from the cockpit is limited to say the least, in comparison to other types, because the 747 tow bar is very compact and hence the tug is underneath the aircraft. Hand signals were more than sufficient from the tug crew however.

I will admit that, I have witnessed engineers take a very cavalier and indifferent approach to operating the brakes....the worst being when one let his ten year old son effectively perform the operation, not on a 747 I hasten to add. Others sat there with their feet on the combing and just assume "all will be well". As ever, much depends on the operator and professional standards of the engineer.

As for the pin location, true, it's not the best design and this was remedied with the 757/767 with a large handle added in addition to the pin installed vertically.

Regarding this incident however, as with all accidents and incidents, lets wait for the report shall we.

And my sympathies go out to the tug crew for a full recovery as well as to the engineers involved.

TURIN
13th Mar 2016, 22:35
Sb SFO

to clarify with the coms, the aircraft and the tug would both be in contact with ATC but the aircraft and the tug would probably not be in contact with each other. this is certainly not uncommon in Europe, I am sure there would have been coms during the pushback but possibly not in the tow.

Tug driver communicates with tower. Brake rider on board may be monitoring the frequency but doesn't get involved.
Comms between flight deck and ground crew through hand signals.

That's the only way I have known it done at most airports I have worked in UK and Europe.

NSEU
13th Mar 2016, 23:15
to insert the pin from below.

Considering the height of the summing lever/steering valve and it's associated cowling, it might be difficult for some people to reach up and locate the hole if the hole was above the assembly. On our tows in Australia, we would inspect the pin (and spring-loaded balls), insert the pin then pull down to test the locking abilities.

747 tow bars have two shear pins. If both break, yes, you can drive away quickly. If one shear pin breaks, and the tug driver is not driving at reckless speeds around corners, then gentle braking should bring the aircraft to a halt (with the aircraft still attached).

Tug driver communicates with tower. Brake rider on board may be monitoring the frequency but doesn't get involved.
Comms between flight deck and ground crew through hand signals.

We had either headsets with long leads (sometimes plugged into the tug intercom system depending on where we were riding on the tug) or wireless headsets.. plus walkie talkies and hand signals as back up.

Comms were required between the people downstairs and upstairs in case there was an urgent issue, such as an APU fire during the tow.

sb_sfo
14th Mar 2016, 06:47
I may have been a little rough on you Europeans with your towbarless tugs and all. In my neck of the woods, most airline tows are done that way, with radios in the tugs. The ground handlers such as Swissport here don't have fancy stuff like this, and certainly don't have radios. I suspect much the same down south. Ad-hoc charters tend to use whoever is available on the airfield, and the results can be interesting.

Taildragger67
14th Mar 2016, 06:55
@JumpJumpJump

I believe QANTAS had some flying reguarly there last year and I am sure there are a lot more especially freight.

Qantas has had RPT 747-400 services into Santiago for about four years now; several times per week, if not daily.

Quite a few 747Fs go through SCL as well.

graemetacon
15th Mar 2016, 12:35
There is a post on Iron Maidens twitter that reads:
'Operation Ed Fix One is well underway - we'll let you know'

Anyone have anymore details ?

Jet II
15th Mar 2016, 15:33
We had either headsets with long leads (sometimes plugged into the tug intercom system depending on where we were riding on the tug) or wireless headsets.. plus walkie talkies and hand signals as back up.

Comms were required between the people downstairs and upstairs in case there was an urgent issue, such as an APU fire during the tow.


Over the years I've done it both ways, using headsets and hand signals. Neither way is foolproof though - I was once being pushed back at AUH and the tug started pushing us the wrong way, I contacted the tug crew over the headset and informed them of their error - however as they didn't speak much English the only response I got was "Yes Boss" as we continued pushing in the wrong direction.

All I could do was apologise most profusely to the Tower ATC who were understandably quite p*ssed. :sad:

Swedish Steve
15th Mar 2016, 16:38
I flew the Fokker 100 and they just had a switch. Unlikely for that to fall out isn't it.
I used to sit on the brakes when towing Fokker 100s and we had a lot of problems. The steering lock out switch was on the ground power panel, and when you shut the panel, the switch was moved to the normal position.
On the tow down the hill from the hangars at ARN there was a bump in the taxyway, and the panel swung shut and disconnected me from the tug. It needed a Heath Robinson panel lock open device to keep the steering lock out switch open for towing!
And then a few weeks later a helpful tug driver closed the panel before we set off, and the shear pins went again.
Give me a TBL any time.

750XL
15th Mar 2016, 17:20
Once had a F100 ready for pushback. Headset connected, but wasn't working for whatever reason so resorted to hand signals.

Half way through pushback the ramp agent closed the hatch (as there was no need for it to be open with no headset connected, so he thought). Bang, shearpin goes and towbar ends underneath the aircraft almost.

Tech Guy
16th Mar 2016, 12:29
The rumor is that the next show will have a live sacrifice to appease Eddy. Enjoy the show.
Sacrificial Virgins? :ooh:

matkat
16th Mar 2016, 12:42
Having previously worked for AAI for several years ( 10 years ago) I was tasked as a flight technician on many occasions so would be surprised if none were on board this one.

HamishMcBush
16th Mar 2016, 13:17
Sacrificial Virgins? :ooh:
Another 747 to succumb to damage ???

sunny11410
21st Mar 2016, 20:50
Ed Force One is back in service.

Nice report:
ED FORCE ONE - ONWARDS AND UPWARDS AGAIN (http://ironmaiden.com/news/article/ed-force-one-repaired)

Pictures:
Iron Maiden - Through the Years (http://ironmaiden.com/gallery/#11)

Summary:
http://ironmaiden.com/fefiles/edforceonerescue.pdf

Well done:ok::ok:

Niner Lima Charlie
22nd Mar 2016, 19:33
Iron Maiden's Ed Force One has been repaired and is in the air now on its way to Brasilia to rejoin the band's tour. TF-AAK can be tracked on Flightradar24.com

Tech Guy
23rd Mar 2016, 00:55
Looks like a good bit of overtime for the engineers. :)
I am sure Eddie approves.

Didacts and Narpets
23rd Mar 2016, 11:23
Did they have to bring extra life support equipment to keep the band animated long enough for the rest of the tour? Does the band get priority/early boarding on their own jet? "Anyone needing assistance or extra time boarding may do so now"!

"Santiago ops, Ed Force One, we need 6 wheelchairs for our arrival"!

Didacts and Narpets
23rd Mar 2016, 11:25
Sorry Bruce. A little Brevity. I do love you guys even if it's a Spinal Tap reunion!

Jet Jockey A4
23rd Mar 2016, 11:34
That was fast! Great job by the ground crews which makes for a great story along with pictures.

India Four Two
24th Mar 2016, 03:59
I sent this link to a friend of mine and he replied with a typical engineer's comment:
Wonder if they had to prop up the starboard wing when they removed both port engines...

It's not clear from the photos, but it looks like they changed the engines one at a time. Is that correct?

The list of names under the photo of the Air Atlanta tech crew reads like the crew of a Viking ship!

sunny11410
24th Mar 2016, 09:56
It's not clear from the photos, but it looks like they changed the engines one at a time. Is that correct?
Yes, one at a time

barit1
24th Mar 2016, 12:56
Don't want the whale to capsize, do we?
:p