Requested cruising level

[BwatchGRUNT]

A quickie for all you civil pilots out there?When you know your actual requested cruising level is different from that in your flight plan, why not tell us rather than make us feel you are being made to climb too high or god forbid not being climbed high enough? Better still on transfer from Terminal Control to us stressed lads and lasses at NERC state your requested level with your cleared altitude and any heading on first call. Surely this would make all our lives easier :confused: :confused: :confused:

[DrSyn]

I must admit to being slightly surprised by this one, BwG. I was under the impression that most of us already did what you suggested, as it seems to be common sense, really. There is a particular FIR where, having making such request on first call, one is invariably asked subsequently for final level - but it isn't near your patch!

I guess there may be an assumption that cruise level is on the flight strip and politeness makes some of our colleagues feel they are stating the obvious :). However, as most FPLs are filed by Ops well in advance of departure, based on assumed weights, final levels desired may differ due to actual weights achieved. Therefore it would seem quite sensible to tell the controler which level one is looking for.

Thanks for making the point.

Perhaps this thread would get a wider airing on Aircrew Notices?

[PPRuNe Pop]

So do I! Good idea. ;)

[Avman]

Even giving us your RFL on first contact can be too late and still cause extra workload. PLEASE ask your ops to send a CHG message with your revised RFL. The only company I know that does this effectively is KLM (well done you guys). We have to plan forward and RFL information obviously plays a significant role. Having worked it all out it can be a real pain when you then tell us you can't take the planned level. Oh, and can someone from BA have a word with their ops and ask them to send a TYP CHG message when substituting a B734 for a B773. That kinda helps too!

[kriskross]

Trouble with that ,Avman, is that with check-in closing 20 minutes before departure, and the load sheet arriving 5 minutes normally before doors close, it is too late for us to realise that we want a better level and ask for it.

I do do what the first posting requested, or before push back, I tell local ATC that I request a different level. Trouble is with pax numbers that have differed by up to 50, up and down, it is only realistic to plan on a max payload, which gives normally too low a level, or more difficult from ATC point of view, extra pax and maybe fuel tankering which gives a lower possible level than requested.

If we want to go higher, ask for it and can't get it because of the traffic, so be it, but it would be more difficult for you guys if you were expecting us to go to FL 370, say, but we could only make FL 330!! RVSM does make it easier, I guess, with the extra levels available to us and to you

[RadarContact]

I usually try to remember forwarding final levels when requesting startup. I think this should give everyone enough time to adjust plans... However, depending on your point of departure or the sector you are passing just then, thist request might not have arrived at all... :(

[BwatchGRUNT]

It appears there are a considerable number of factors to this equation and that a large number may revise their RFL prior to pushback or maybe whillst taxiing on ground. Perhaps the boys at the busier airports like EGLL do not realsise the implications of not inputting this change into NAS (our wonderful computer system) and therefore the pilots effort is wasted. I still feel the solution is to state your RFL on first call to the frequency you know will be climbing you to these cruising levels. Yes they change quite frequently but you must be familiar with them to a degree. Whilst on this point those of flying the short hops to EGCC from EGLL for example dont ask to stay at FL190 when you must know the vertical split is FL195, state it before being transferred. I appreciate due to not being able to get on the freq you may have already levelled off, but the request triples our workload for that one aircraft. These are not major gripes but things that I hope would make all our lives easier!!:D :D :D

[Captain Stable]

Quite often, of course, pilots may not know about the true winds aloft until they're actually up there. If there's a stonking great tailwind aloft, they'll want to get into it. Or not, if a headwind. So which ATCO is going to have a go at them for not amending the FPL?