New Year's Honours - 2016

[Could be the last?]

New Year's honours 2016: the full list | UK news | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/dec/30/new-years-honours-2016-the-full-list)

Well done Pip.

[NutLoose]

Ahhh... The annual awards for doing your job.

[CoffmanStarter]

RAF New Years Honours List 2016


http://www.raf.mod.uk/news/newyearshonours2016.cfm

[hunterboy]

It does seem a shame that the odd award given to truly worth individuals seem to be swamped by the awards given to political cronies.All it does is devalue the whole system. Makes you wonder if the traditionally regarded heroes of yesteryear like Sir Walter Raleigh, etc, were just the David Beckhams of their day.

[Pontius Navigator]

Looks like most of the RAF got something.

😈

[MPN11]

hahaha PN, although the list had to be padded with innumerable commendations from assorted Air Officers with incomprehensible appointments!

[thunderbird7]

At least one of them got something for dropping a CAMBS buoy on a yacht... ;)

[ShyTorque]

Ahhh... The annual awards for doing your job.

Not on the list, then? Never mind, maybe next year...... :p

[glad rag]

Not on the list, then? Never mind, maybe next year...... :p


About time to ditch this anachronism!!

Those who selflessly work for those less better off than themselves have far higher ideals than....

"Those who swamp the awards system by presenting them to their political cronies"

[sidewayspeak]

Pointless trinkets. Unless they have a monetary value to realise on e-bay?

[Vendee]

About time to ditch this anachronism!!

Those who selflessly work for those less better off than themselves have far higher ideals than....

"Those who swamp the awards system by presenting them to their political cronies"
Where's the "like" button :D

[Toadstool]

Ahhh... The annual awards for doing your job.

I remember someone getting a Commendation for doing their job. The citation waxed lyrical about said person doing over and above for a 2-week period, working sometimes till 1800hrs on a night and sometimes being in before 0800. Wow these blunties earn their pay:ok:

[NutLoose]

You do wonder when reading the requirements and nomination system for the the OBE etc if those senior officers in receipt of the likes of the OBE, KCB etc simply have a luncheon date and sit around the table and say "I say Charles, if I nominate you for a KCB then you can in return nominate me for an OBE, then next year we will swop around"

And as for knighthoods and lordships etc, awarding them to the likes of Prescott for doing his job which he was handsomely paid for and still is, I would much prefer to see them going to the likes of the Houses of Parliaments toilet cleaner who has probably worked there for 30 odd years etc, after all the place is so full of sh*t she has her work cut out.. They are the people that truly deserve it, working for a pittance day in day out, year on year.

The whole system seems as corrupt and meaningless in today's society where those rewarded are often simply politically motivated.

It's like the bloody Oscars, an award system where the Luvies award themselves an award thus patting themselves on their own backs.

..

[Pontius Navigator]

And as for knighthoods and lordships etc, awarding them to the likes of Prescott for doing his job which he was handsomely paid for Did he?;)......

[MPN11]

I have to settle for my [now very ancient] AOC Air Cadets Commendation from when I were an ATC Cadet Flt Sgt.

That was a VERY good year, actually ... Commendation, Flying Scholarship and International Air Cadet Exchange :D

After that, it was just a relatively undistinguished trudge through the RAF career.

[Genstabler]

NutLoose

Ahhh... The annual awards for doing your job.

Chips on shoulder evident as usual in Nutty's posts.
There is good reason to be cynical about the civilian awards, especially the political ones, but I can't see how awarding the loo cleaner a gong would improve the system.
As far as the military are concerned, however, I believe the system is as fair and reasonable as it can be, and nothing like as Nutty depicts it. Of course there is always an element of luck, right place, right time etc. All I can say is that the military awards to three generations of my own family were well deserved and hard earned, as were those of all my other military acquaintances.

[Pontius Navigator]

hahaha PN, although the list had to be padded with innumerable commendations from assorted Air Officers with incomprehensible appointments!
How long before someone suggests a medal ribbon for each level of citation, especially the team ones?

[4everAD]

NutLoose



Chips on shoulder evident as usual in Nutty's posts.
There is good reason to be cynical about the civilian awards, especially the political ones, but I can't see how awarding the loo cleaner a gong would improve the system.
As far as the military are concerned, however, I believe the system is as fair and reasonable as it can be, and nothing like as Nutty depicts it. Of course there is always an element of luck, right place, right time etc. All I can say is that the military awards to three generations of my own family were well deserved and hard earned, as were those of all my other military acquaintances.

Fair and reasonable? If that is the case why do 95 odd % of the honours go to Officers (Commissioned and Warranted?) Are you really saying that in majority of the Royal Air Force there aren't people deserving? Or is it as has been alluded to a case of people neither being able to or bothered to write up juniors?

[Pontius Navigator]

Genstabler, I got one of my contractors an AOCs commendation. The result was a she-cat bursting in to my office spitting feathers.

Another time handbrake house intercepted my recs. One was downgraded to a station cdr and the other declined. My turn to spit feathers as we were a remote independent unit and the station cdr had never visited and wasn't in the CoC.

[Stanwell]

I'm disappointed.
Our ex PM down here in OZ, (Tony Abbott) awarded Phil the Greek a Knighthood last year.

Have another look in the bag for me, will you?
Nothing for him in there? ... you sure?
Bloody ungrateful Poms!

[Genstabler]

4everAD

Fair and reasonable? If that is the case why do 95 odd % of the honours go to Officers (Commissioned and Warranted?) Are you really saying that in majority of the Royal Air Force there aren't people deserving? Or is it as has been alluded to a case of people neither being able to or bothered to write up juniors?

It is because it is mostly the officers, commissioned and warranted, who are in a position of sufficient responsibility and who have the power to make a significant difference, or catastrophic cock-up, in a challenging situation. That is why the system rewards exceptional achievement.
If you favour a Corbinistic system where everyone gets a VC and KBE for successfully driving a refuelling truck, good luck to you.

[salad-dodger]

It is because it is mostly the officers, commissioned and warranted, who are in a position of sufficient responsibility and who have the power to make a significant difference, or catastrophic cock-up, in a challenging situation. That is why the system rewards exceptional achievement.
...and in the public sector (military included) manifestly fails to penalise failure. On that note, I see the head of HMRC got another award.

Nutloose may show a bit of bias in his posts, but I think many would agree there is a fair degree of truth in what he has written. In many cases, MoD departments and parts of the military succeed despite the people at the top, not because of them.

Oh, and did I mention the blinkers some people seem to wear when posting GS?

S-D

[Pontius Navigator]

..
Oh, and did I mention the blinkers some people seem to wear when posting GS?

S-D

I don't believe you did or we might know what you meant.

[salad-dodger]

I don't believe you did or we might know what you meant.
And there was me thinking I had got the subtlety just about right......

S-D

[NutLoose]

I wasn't wanting to be sounding biased, just when I think back to my time at Odiham, we had two civilian tanker drivers on the section, one was coming up to retirement at 70 and had served the RAF man and boy, both in and out of uniform from school continuously up until his retirement, that was a person who deserved an award in my eyes, not someone who is awarded something for serving in a post for a couple of years on the backs of those that made it happen..

[MPN11]

Ha ... like my wife's [not] Silver Jubilee. She was going to get it, as the fg off ADC, but instead it was given to a wg cdr who was leaving the Service, who presumably never wore it again.

She's still a bit pi$$ed off by that.

[handleturning]

Having seen both sides of the fence, I'd say it's far easier to get an award for doing a good job in the military than the equivalent person in civvie street. Think this is mainly due to the fact that MOD has a system in place to deal with nominations, whereas your average divvy wouldn't have a clue where to start, let alone have access to a command chain providing experienced peer review.

[Vendee]

There is good reason to be cynical about the civilian awards, especially the political ones, but I can't see how awarding the loo cleaner a gong would improve the system.

Your comments sum up the problem with "the system". Why would the loo cleaner be less worthy of an award after, say, 40 years of hard work?

I would say scrap the award system but the people in a position to do that are the main beneficiaries of "the system" so it isn't going to happen.

[Genstabler]

Vendee

Your comments sum up the problem with "the system". Why would the loo cleaner be less worthy of an award after, say, 40 years of hard work?

If we are discussing the state honours system, in the military you don't get an honour for years of worthy but undistinguished service, whatever your place in the hierarchy. Single out the worthy loo cleaner for an award and you have to give it to every other Tom, Dick and Harriet who completes an honest working life. All are equally worthy, but perhaps not of a state honour bestowed by the Queen. Honours are not, and should not be, the equivalent of a LSGC medal.

[Easy Street]

I can't comment on how senior officers gain their knighthoods. But for the 'lesser' awards of MBE, OBE and CBE, it is a good rule of thumb that the award says as much about the writer of the nomination as it does about the recipient. There are plenty of deserving individuals out there whose chain of command has failed to write them up for awards, either through poor admin or by applying an unnecessarily harsh level of initial screening. And there are plenty of senior officers out there who couldn't write a decent report or citation if they tried (as anyone who has sat on a promotion board can all too easily attest). But there are some officers whose subordinates always seem to do well come honours time.

As long as different senior officers take differing perspectives on the honours season (from "a pain in the a*se" to "a chance to reward my most deserving individuals" to "a chance to show how great I am by getting awards for as many subordinates as possible, deserving or otherwise") then there will be apparent oversights and inconsistencies. Unavoidable really!

[Tankertrashnav]

My dad got awarded the Royal Victorian Medal as a WO2 in North Africa in 1943 for arranging security for the king. He got the ribbon by hand from HM at the time, and a week later his commission came through. Had he been commissioned before the royal visit he would have received the MVO, which unlike the medal, carried with it post nominal letters.

After the war he returned to his job in the AA, who always quite incorrectly referred to him as "Supt M. Bloggs, MVO", right up to his retirement in 1968, as they thought it rather good to have a member of staff with post-nominal letters. Total snobbery of course, which amused dad, but he happily played along with it!

[salad-dodger]

Unavoidable really!
No, not really. We could get rid of parts of the whole anachronistic and archaic system. I can't help but feel that this will become inevitable anyway if the system continues in its current form. Cameron awarding his crony Crosby is probably one of the worst awards we have seen. Even that fat, useless, belligerent, obnoxious parasite from Hull was more deserving than this one.

S-D

[LowObservable]

Checks list, fails to find own name.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/59/9d/7b/599d7b95afc94f39473ba1d00a694052.jpg

[Wensleydale]

"Cameron awarding his crony Crosby is probably one of the worst awards we have seen. Even that fat, useless, belligerent, obnoxious parasite from Hull was more deserving than this one."

SD - not strictly true, as Gordon Brown gave his election campaign manager a peerage, and he didn't even manage to win!!

[tmmorris]

As a VRT, sitting just on the fence between the military and the civvy world, it seems to me that those who do well in the military are rewarded twice - once with a gong, and once with a promotion. In civvy life you get one or other - a promotion at work, or a gong for valuable voluntary service (including, to be fair, a few in the ACO each year).

Is that unfair?

[Easy Street]

tmmorris,

A little unfair in some cases. The stereotypical recipients of military MBEs are hoary old WOs with no aspiration for commissioning, or Flt Lts / Sqn Ldrs who have long since fallen off the career ladder. None of these will be promoted but continue to give dedicated service which only receives formal recognition in the shape of some sort of award. Same is true (to a lesser extent) for OBEs and CBEs as officers hit their career ceiling higher up the ranks.

Of course there are some who gather these gongs while also climbing upwards, and you may have a point in thoses cases. But how do you write a rule that only makes those with no further promotion prospects eligible for awards?

[Genstabler]

Easy Street

As this is a rumour forum I suppose it is acceptable for you to post complete tripe. The stereotypes you describe are just that; stereotypes. If you were better informed and carried a smaller chip you would see that.

[Hangarshuffle]

I always think more of people who were asked if they wanted something, but actually turned them down. David Bowie (a one time jazz musician of some note) and also Nigella Lawson apparently (a comely chef) spring to mind. Source- what I read somewhere once).


Other, far more successful (and a lot fairer) countries don't bother with all this nonsense, and it would be a sign of progress somehow if neither did we.


"The wheel that squeeks the loudest gets the most grease".* includes the military.

[rlsbutler]

Let me put cards on the table: I think our honours system evolved in the 19th century into an almost perfect model of its type. I was never likely to benefit from it, but the colour of it certainly brightens otherwise drab uniforms.

With respect to Hangarshuffle, almost every country has an honours system of some sort although who of us would know how fair those systems are. We might note the pictures of royal weddings in Scandinavia or Monaco and feel mildly pleased that we do the baubles business so much better.

We are though peculiar in using the post-nominal letters for our awards. Apart from one or two ex-dominions, does any other country do it ? The USA has a panoply of medals and decorations, but you might never know the old airman’s achievement once he enters civil life; indeed, while he is still in uniform, you need an encyclopaedia in your hand to tell his distinctions from his other service medals.

We surely reward the loo-cleaners (and the lollipop ladies), especially those who have stuck it for 40 years - although as ever with any awards system it is a bit hit-or-miss. We had to bring back the BEM perhaps just to fill that need.

What PPRuNers might have noticed is how the rewards have become a little less for the very senior serving officers. A 3-star in my day would have expected a knighthood (or not); now he might “only” get a CB. The colonel or group captain often now has to be satisfied with an OBE rather than a CBE – indeed this time that is true for a 1-star. To my mind it makes plain that the recipient has still done a good job, but the job was less worth doing than it used to be.

However entitlements might have been degraded, there is still no doubt that considerable rank is needed to earn the higher awards. Rank gives gearing to whatever achievements have been made.

Yet, while the achievements even possible down the gradient from Sqn Ldr to LAC reduce drastically with rank, the one reward on offer is in each case the MBE. If what the Corporal did is as valuable as what the Sqn Ldr did, should not the Cpl be quickly promoted ? I say bring back the military BEM.

Looking at civvie street, we might all have wondered at the elevation of Barbara Windsor. Peter Simple (whose name be praised) imagined our monarchy in the hands of King Norman and Queen Doreen, but he never imagined the Second Class of our Most Excellent Order of the British Empire being occupied by a professional Cockney termagant using the very name his monarchs seemed to have discarded.

[Genstabler]

As I understand it, the BEM was abolished for the sake of appearance and political correctness. The thinking was why should non commissioned personnel have their own demeaning honour instead of qualifying for all honours on a level playing field? I believe it was a mistake to do so and agree with risbutler's balanced and reasonable post.

[NutLoose]

the trouble is in the military the system appears rigged to award those that are in a position to nominate those awards, true you get the odd one that is not an officer or of higher rank, but one see's those as a token effort.

[Tankertrashnav]

When I was at university reading Russian I did a dissertation on Russian and Soviet orders as part of my degree.

The Soviet system of awards which evolved from the old Czarist Russian ranks of nobility made our own system look positively niggardly, as medals were awarded on every conceivable occasion including appropriately enough the Order of Motherhood which awarded medals in 6 grades for producing children for the Motherland!

Recipients of medals received more than just a bit of tin and a ribbon. Holders of the Order of Lenin, for example, were accorded the right to go straight to the front of a queue wherever it may be. As long queues were a daily part of Soviet life this was quite a useful perk. Heroes of the Soviet Union and Soviet Labour not only received a solid gold medal, but were granted a "time share" in a dacha (holiday home) usually at a Black Sea resort, with free train travel there and back.

Interesting that a system where everybody was supposed to be equal enthusiastically built up an honours system in which everybody was certainly not equal. I haven't kept up with the post 1992 Russian orders system, but I wouldn't be surprised if it followed the lines of its Soviet predecessor

[BEagle]

Russians? Pah - mere amateurs in the gong-grabbing stakes:

One wonders quite what perks this lot now have!

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/PRNK_zpsavxut9ye.jpg (http://s14.photobucket.com/user/nw969/media/PRNK_zpsavxut9ye.jpg.html)

Does one of them really have a gong dangling from his willy?

[CoffmanStarter]

Perhaps it's to recognise 'Length of Service' :E

[4mastacker]

is that General Wun Hung-Lo?

[CoffmanStarter]

Might also be General Ti Gong Kok ...

[BEagle]

Comrade General Gong on Dong?

[JAVELINBOY]

Looks more like the Moscow Chapter of their version of Pearly Kings

[Vendee]

the trouble is in the military the system appears rigged to award those that are in a position to nominate those awardsSpot on Nutty and to be fair, the same applies to the civil system too. Its just human nature. People in power tend to favour the people closest to them. I know that in the civil system, anyone can "nominate" someone for an honour but its still the people at the top of the tree who have the final say. At the end of the day, the top awards seem to go to the people at the top of the system.

[Heathrow Harry]

To be fair Beagle if your mid ranking US officer wore the actual medals they are awarded (as our friends in N Korea do) rather than than just the ribbon they'd need a pickup truck to carry them around

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/73/Curtis_LeMay_%28USAF%29.jpg/220px-Curtis_LeMay_%28USAF%29.jpg

[brakedwell]

...and in the public sector (military included) manifestly fails to penalise failure. On that note, I see the head of HMRC got another award.

The woman is a serial failure!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lin_Homer#Controversy_and_alleged_incompetence

[air pig]

One award of a CBE went to an ex army reservist surgeon who spent 6 months as a trauma surgeon at Bastion. He managed an Ebola hospital in Sierra Leone for 4 months and then soon after went to Nepal for the earthquake. As well as fighting the waste of space that is the WHO he was also heavily clinically involved in patient care.

The medics honoured for their response to the Ebola crisis also include Dr Timothy Brooks, head of the rare and imported pathogens laboratory at Public Health England (CBE), and Professor Christopher Bulstrode, Emeritus Professor at Green Templeton College, Oxford (OBE).

Chris is a very humble person and a gentleman. One of the better awards I think.

[skua]

As to be expected, Private Eye this week puts a very sharp spear through many of those getting this year's gongs, including that wombat from the HMRC. Depressing reading.

[air pig]

Skua:

Sir, you malign a fine creature, unless you wanted to fire the recipient out of a wombat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L6_Wombat

[skua]

Indeed :-)

[MOSTAFA]

Heathrow Harry, to be even fairer your picture emphasing your comment about mid ranging American officers is of a 4* General. As high as it goes here in the UK.

[Union Jack]

Heathrow Harry, to be even fairer your picture emphasing your comment about mid ranging American officers is of a 4* General.

To be even fairer still, the photograph features the very notable General Curtis LeMay - and a British DFC in addition to his US one, and so many others. No surprise there.

As high as it goes here in the UK.

Although five star promotions "lapsed" in 1995, Royal Family promotions such as The Prince of Wales excepted, there have been a trio of such promotions to honorary five star rank for former CDSs since, namely Charles Guthrie in 2012 and Mike Boyce and Jock Stirrup in 2014.

Jack

[Heathrow Harry]

I was looking for this picture TBH - General Cheeseburger

http://www.polarimagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Kenny.jpg
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[MOSTAFA]

Union Jack

5* is now only a ceremonial appointment only and I think that's probably the same with the US nowadays as well?

[Union Jack]

No big whoop as far as I'm concerned, Mostafa, ceremonial or not, but still five stars - unless of course you wish to tell F...., sorry, Lord Guthrie otherwise.:D

With one notable exception, I believe that the cousins have kept the lid on five star promotions, or appointments if you so prefer, since 1945.

Jack