criminal record mid east airlines

[soakingpilot]

Just a quick update on this but most job applications for foreign apps will ask for "no criminal record"

had a dui when I was 21 ( misdemeanor NOT felony ) myself over 14 years ago with NO other convictions/etc etc now flying an Ejet for a regional in the states FO.

Am I disqualified period ? Is that question more pertaining to no armed robbery or attempted murder type things ?

thanks

[captseth]

Any kind of arrest record regardless of a conviction makes one ineligible for a "good conduct certificate" from LEA and thusly unlikely to be considered for foreign employment.

[captseth]

LEA = Law Enforcement Authorites. I know this from having to get a good conduct certificate in NY for my current overseas employer and through the many applications I've made over the years to various other foreign carriers.

In the mean time, don't blow your brains out. There are decent jobs in the States if you need one. Maybe not the best money, but living in the sandbox or some polluted Chinese city is not necessarily worth what they might say they will pay you.

[tarkagks]

Seeing it was 14 years ago and a relatively minor offence why no try to obtain an Expungement, you probably qualify, good luck

[troff]

What if Soakingpilot could get himself a pardon from the authorities? Would he no longer have a record?

[Fuzuma]

Soaking......

Have a search on the net, depending on which state the DUI offense occurred, and the time that has lapsed since that incident, you may be able to apply for the record to be "expunged". There are plenty of good criminal defense lawyers who specialize in this field, and would be able to assist or give you some good advice or information.

Have a look at criminaldefenselawyer.com

:)

[WrldWide]

Soakinpilot,
I do not think a misdemeanor 14 years ago would hinder your chances of a ME job. Get your police/FBI file and see what comes up.

[soakingpilot]

Sidenote, any mid east airlines going to hire now with just a FO on ERJ 175 time?

[natops]

In the UAE a DUI is not a minor offence at all.
When it happens here, you'll go to jail, and once they release you, you will be deported...

Is this DUI still in yr file, or is it taken out after so many years?
If taken out, I would carefully consider ever talking about it once hired.

Good luck.
N.:ok:

[soakingpilot]

oh its on my record for forever in the state it occured. if i cant do the uae this just quitting the bizz alltogether might be the best choice so i can stop trying to live this stupid existence.

[ExDubai]

If it is on your record, forget the ME.

[Aluminium shuffler]

I doubt it'd be a problem in Europe, and there is a lot of movement there right now.

[ExDubai]

Sweet, at least I can end this facade and just blow my brains out now because a decent job in the USA isn't happening anytime soon.
Why not talk to an specialized lawyer first?

[KaptinDamit]

Once you are CONVICTED you can not get it expunged. Trust me, I've looked into the matter. Do a Google search and find out for yourself.
I never disclosed and it has not been a problem for me.

[Enos]

Soakingpilot just give it a try, I can't remember from when I joined here if they ask, but if they do just say no, guy on my course was on furlow they asked if he was, he said NO he told them 8 months later when he left.

I also know personally of a pilot who was in a car wreak and did a lot worse than you, actually two pilots.

Any guys from the US that can definitely say that they know for a fact that info is requested from the US authorities and given out.

I would apply, remember they will probably tell untruths at the interview as well.

[Ecam321]

Just apply, they give the impression they leave no stone unturned but believe me they do. It would be missed in any reference checks, sure of that.
If that fails ( I doubt it will), try Hong Kong Airlines

[Ecam321]

Sorry I forgot to mention..., lie through your teeth, it never happened. As previous poster mentioned they sure as hell will be lying to you.

[soakingpilot]

In terms of the specialized lawyer I had essentially "the wolf" of lawyers and basically in this north east state its next to impossible to get it expunged. he said it really would have been easier if i had committed 2nd degree murder, maybe just a little armed robbery. ya know petty stuff.

the whole lying on the application though I dunno how I feel about that I mean I just feel that that could bite me in the ass royally and I have never been one to lie about anything.

[nolimitholdem]

Good god, just put no criminal record on the application and see what happens. If they check and find it and you don't get the job, you won't be any further behind than if you put you have a DUI and they reject you. Of course if you have to provide a clean criminal record check that could be difficult. You say it's on record in a certain state, perhaps you could have a check run in another state that wouldn't show it? There are always ways.

As far as lying on the application, after living there for a decade and being basically lied to constantly I'd have no problem whatsoever for something like this. Bite you in the ass? There are so many other things that could do that to you on a daily basis in the ME it doesn't bear worrying about. As long as you don't talk about it once hired.

If every criminal was ejected from Dubai the place would be empty.

[soakingpilot]

Just sucks as it was such a silly event that just F's with my life so hardcore now.

what are the requirements these days for mid east places? and for the record the honest thought is just DO NO MENTION IT at all ?

[soakingpilot]

BUMP.. any new thoughts on this.. am looking at all mid east carriers including Turkish. so

do i even put it on my application or not?


Thanks..

[Obbie]

Look, it's just not about saying no and hopefully you get it.
You will be asked to produce a official report from your
country's authorities indicating no criminal convictions.
Also most airlines use a private third party service that goes
looking into everything about you, so they sure as hell will
find it. Try to get it pardoned or expunged.

[soakingpilot]

Cannot get it pardoned or expunged.. not in that state. was a misdemeanor no injuries no crash non of that ****. was also now 15 years ago and since then no nothing on record. either aviation or other.

So I still say yes on the application since they are going to check everything and then get denied eh?

[sheikhitup]

Better to say no on the app with the chance it might go through than to say yes and for sure be denied.

[Evanelpus]

Someone asks a fair question looking for advice, others give those answers and then a debate takes place as to whether said posters are talking butter ollocks or what.

Welcome to PPRuNe!

[soakingpilot]

so a guaranteed denial? is this the consensus?

[PILOTHEAD]

All this talk about blowing brains sounds a little proactive. Perhaps you need a few more years stateside before you can have the diplomatic sense for an overseas contract. In the ME or even Asia things you do and say can be taken very serious and some people may find them offensive. That's more than once talking about blowing brains out. If you can't handle working in the states so bad, and you're an fo in a regional, what makes you think you could survive working overseas. If you want to quit, just quit already. Less competition for pilots who aren't so easily willing to "blow their brains out" lmfao. Dude grow up and stop bitching

[soakingpilot]

Im not quite sure about bitching more than an agonizing situation and therefore looking for information as to how to remedy that. I have already worked overseas and believe me its a heck of allot better than working here. So what ill gather from your post is that you have no information to actually contribute.

check.

[soakingpilot]

got a message from another forum stating directly not to put it on the app.... thoughts from anyone with actual experience?

[PanAmFalcon]

Ignore the guy giving no constructive criticism. He's one of the people that take out their frustration online due to their miserable lives. Lol

[Obbie]

Be careful what you are doing with this, their background checking
service will most likely locate the criminal record, and if you are
on the property when they do, you might find yourself in a middle-east
jail cell. Obtaining a QCAA pilots licence under false declarations is
a crimimal offence, and they like to punish first, figure out later, in this part of the world.
Be very careful making any false statements over here,
it's not a game in this part of the world.

[ExDubai]

Be careful what you are doing with this, their background checking
service will most likely locate the criminal record, and if you are
on the property when they do, you might find yourself in a middle-east
jail cell. Obtaining a QCAA pilots licence under false declarations is
a crimimal offence, and they like to punish first, figure out later, in this part of the world.
Be very careful making any false statements over here,
it's not a game in this part of the world.

Yepp, that was also my first thought. Also posting such a question on PPRUNE might not be the best idea. Somebody in the bouncy castle might read it......

[UAL777]

It never happened. Now go get the job you desire in the Middle East.

[Obbie]

Actually it has happened, but even if it hadn't,
your advise is to be the first ?

[PILOTHEAD]

Keep posting your frustrations here on pprune. I'm sure these are probably read by the same people doing your background checks. And what's your remedy? Well wait ten years and expunge it. Than apply overseas when you have a clean record. Until than enjoy working in the us. Lots of companies will be more than happy to hire you. That's my contrinutable information. Good luck!

[soakingpilot]

bump? any new input?

[azhkman]

Wow, we're almost at two years from the initial post. Hopefully, it's gotten better. It would seem after 15+ with a clean record, for a misdemeanor, going by what you stated, you may be able to petition to have it expunged. Whether you can or cannot, it would depend on the state. You could check with a competent lawyer in the state of the occurrence and pay the one hour for a consultation.

If not, it would not just be your overseas license that puts you at risk, even your visa to live in said location in that part of the world requires a police report that demonstrates a clean record.

I also agree with Obbie, if you are caught lying while on the ground in the Middle East, the rules and protection that you enjoy in your home country do not apply. While nothing more may happen than your denial of visa & employment, it is a risk.

Your better bet would be to go somewhere where some additional dollars can make people look past these things, like flying Cargo from a base in the Ukraine. I met a CX Cargo pilot here, who left the Ukraine and totally regrets it. Not joking.

[Landflap]

Cripes, medical recovery period allowing me to scan Pprune. Lovely stuff & this discussion is just brilliant. I thought USA was the "Land of free " ? If you doubt, ask OJ Simpson !


Worse, mate of mine, ex long-time in the ME, got very close to a job with the Royal Flight. He was rejected for, allegedly, having a Police Record. Closer investigation showed no record. Upon leaving, application for Police Record showed no offences on the certificate. He has framed it and proudly displays the same on his office wall.


People ask him why he failed to get into the RF, he tells them of the "Police Record" and then points to the framed "No Record" on the wall.


Sorry, SOAKINGPILOT. Of no real comfort I know, but, good grief ; what a weird world we live in, eh ?

[Winged Lion]

What would lying on the application do you any good if you know for sure beforehand that after getting a job offer you have to get a police record anyway? They will 100% ask for it. You will 100% have to hand it over to your future employer before signing a contract.

So it will only be an issue if you can not get any police record from the states without the DUI showing,

Btw, about the part that it was just a silly thing: thank god it was just a silly thing and no-one was injured at the time. People like you set a great example on why to take rules and laws serious. So this is indeed how the system works as far as I can tell.

[soakingpilot]

People like you set a great example on why to take rules and laws serious. So this is indeed how the system works as far as I can tell.

im not sure if this is sarcasm or not.

[Derfred]

If I was an employer (regardless of state), and I had access to both your Police Record and your PPRuNe posts, I would probably overlook your DUI, but then positively exclude you on the basis of the way you conduct yourself online.

I would assume that your online etiquette (or lack thereof) might reflect your flight deck CRM skills, which would preclude you from any consideration of a job offer.

Have a think about what I've said and report back in another 2 years - if you're still in the industry... If you're not then my first impressons were correct.

If you don't understand what I've said, then think about it for another 2 years. If you still don't understand, then yes you do need a different career.

Kind regards,

Fred

Good luck.

[soakingpilot]

I would argue that since these are the responses and not answering questions still nobody really knows or has any recent experience...

[GillEx737]

I would argue that since these are the responses and not answering questions still nobody really knows or has any recent experience...

So give it a go then??

[harry the cod]

3 pages in and I would argue that you have more than enough answers and suggestions. Perhaps you'd like one of us to make the decision for you and complete the application?

soakingpilot, to put it bluntly, for someone who's been charged for DUI your handle is a bit of a piss take. Lack of maturity or a troll, either way your manner just seems odd and inappropriate for these forums.

Time to close this thread in my opinion.

Harry