Take the ....... photograph

[Busta]

The recent alleged remark by D o E at BoB 75th flypast reminded me of a story I heard a long time ago; I have no idea if it is true, based on truth or just happy hour banter. No doubt someone out there will know

A trusty and well beloved pair from an RAFG squadron operating Swifts were taking a photograph for the Christmas card; this involved the lead flying inverted past a well known Schloss whilst no 2 took the pics.

After enough practice the photo run started, soon after the lead inverted no2 reported "your jetpipe's on fire" (not an unknown occurence, I think).

The lead replied "I know, take the ....... photograph!

[Haraka]

These could fill a thread.
For example:
Recce Hunter coming back to Gutersloh during a Taceval flames out in the overhead out of fuel. Pilot skilfully deadsticks and rolls to a halt at which point
MFPU ( Mobile Field Processing Unit ) team roll up and download the film back for interpretation - it was 30 minutes in those days from engine-off to MisRep ( Mission report) out.( none of the later 45 minutes NATO RecceExrep, dictated by those other nations who couldn't hack it).
Whilst fast film processing ( well over 100 feet per minute per camera ) is going on - film being flung on to light tables for rapid interpretation and P.I.'s knocking out reporting, all are suddenly aware of a kerfuffle among the judges .
.
Arguing as to when "engine off" time should be calculated.........

[BEagle]

JENKINS asked: Did Puddy fly the Swift?

As far as I'm aware, no he didn't. Meteors and Hunters, Provosts and Strikemasters were his metier.

Pat King (later Inspector of Flight Safety) did though - his tale of flying one through German fir trees is related in his own inimitable style in Nigel Walpole's book Swift Justice....:eek:

[newt]

Actually BEagle he was rather taken by the Hawk in later years! Took ages to get him to try The Pisspot but after one trip he loved it!:ok:

[BEagle]

Indeed he did, newt, you're absolutely correct. I was referring more to his RAFG-era (and desert time).

[Haraka]

Beags,
Yes, Puddy was most definitely Guterlsoh Recce Hunters.
Still well remembered and respected in my community.

[Groucho]

I say, Philip - how dare you swear before the Queen?


....all together now...............

[John Farley]

One day Puddy came to collect a new Hawk. We were having a chat in our coffee bar when he looked around checking we were on our own. The he said “When you did 1v1 with the Hunter you always finish up lower than you started. With the Hawk you finish up higher – why is that?” I said “What do you do when an aircraft can give you more g than you can handle?” “Climb” he said. “Think about it” I said.

[Basil]

more g than you can handle?” “Climb” he said
Was that a reference to aircraft perf or pilot advancing years? ;)

[NutLoose]

Prince Philip Aims F-Bomb At RAF Photographer (http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/prince-philip-aims-f-bomb-at-raf-photographer/ar-AAcOQkD?ocid=iehp)


An RAF photographer no less, he should have told him to shut up, it's their day not his.... Ignorance is not an excuse.


I wonder if his credit cards are only spewing out 60 Euros

[John Farley]

Was that a reference to aircraft perf or pilot advancing years?

In 1976? Wot do you think.....?

[Shack37]

An RAF photographer no less, he should have told him to shut up, it's their day not his.... Ignorance is not an excuse.

Agreed. If it had been some plonker press photog it would have been funny.
With an OR not there by his own choosing, less so.

[Pontius Navigator]

I wonder who the photog was, not his name but rank and experience. Was he attached to Northolt or MoD or pinched from somewhere.

[BEagle]

Who gives a stuff? It's like the exasperation faced at weddings when some photographer is mincing about trying to get the 'perfect shot' - just take the darn photos and let the guests get on with their day!

Stavros wanted to get on with making sure that the ex-BoB veterans had a good day - so telling the snapper to get on with it seems not unreasonable, even though his language might have been a bit barrack room.... The Royal party wasn't there for some MoD photo-op, they were there to celebrate the 75th anniversary of the start of the BoB!

Who hasn't had to hang about (usually squinting into the sun), whilst some RAF snapper faffs about with his cameras.....

[oxenos]

For years the clicky would have put up with jokes about " some day my prints will come "
At last his Prince comes - and swears at him.

[Pontius Navigator]

Heart, all heart.

[Exascot]

I wonder if his credit cards are only spewing out 60 Euros

No because most of the machines here only have 50 Euro notes so 50 is the max :ugh:

[goudie]

Stavros wanted to get on with making sure that the ex-BoB veterans had a good day

Feeling the need to chuck a couple of drinks down his neck, more likely.

[BEagle]

goudie wrote: Feeling the need to chuck a couple of drinks down his neck, more likely.

Unlikely.

If indeed this was an RAF snapper (not some civvie contractor....), he should have been pre-briefed not to waste time when taking such group photos if Stavros was to be included.

[typerated]

It appears to me that he has the height of bad manners.
I don't care who he is, he should behave better than that.


I imagine the photographer is trying to do a professional job and some of that involves a bit of set up.


BEagle - now imagine doing your preflight and he comes in with "get this aircraft in the F***ing air right now"

[Groucho]

While we are examining Stavros, do we know if:

a) He is going, philanthropically, to chuck some of his dosh into the Greek pot for 'old times sake'?

b) He might have kept a stash of Drachma under the royal bed?

[drustsonoferp]

This little episode might illustrate Phillip's lack of understanding of the modern world. I think there have been great efforts behind the scenes to adapt the Royal Family to modern media and a need to appear to have more of a personal connection with people.

As very few people make any contact with the royals in person, the media will dictate what actually happened, and how. Now we have a story, flash in the pan or otherwise, which could eclipse what the pre-planned story of showing respect to BoB veterans was supposed to be. I don't think you'd ever find Liz being either so crass, or so sloppy.

Of course, it's only the latest example of a very long string, but for the rest of the family I think the public reactions after Diana's funeral marked a turning point.

[NutLoose]

A photographer needs to take control of situations like this and it matters squat who is the subject, he needs to be firm and polite, simply saying I will take the photographs when everyone is in position and not before and can everyone please be quiet and listen to instructions..... I found a whistle was an ideal tool for getting everyone's attention and shutting them up...
It's surprising how much stress you have on you when doing group shots and one could imagine the disappointment amongst those present if the image was blurred or the veterans were looking round or down etc.
People might mention weddings, but could you imagine if none of the images were useable because of guests, family etc not playing ball, it's a once in a lifetime opportunity to get right.


they were there to celebrate the 75th anniversary of the start of the BoB!

Surely commemorate and remember those lost, not celebrate... One does not celebrate a war.

..

[hunterboy]

Personally, I think it's marvellous as it shows people the royals are no better than the rest of us. Perhaps people should stop treating them so.....

[goudie]

Unlike the Queen, Phil never did embrace 'Noblesse Oblige'. This was a prime example. His impatience to get it over with was, I think, a crass insult to the BoB veterans for whom, this photo session was a unique occasion.
And no way to speak to a member of the RAF either, for whatever reason.

[Pontius Navigator]

Hunter, we might think that but would not dream of saying it.

We had an RAF Cpl for my first daughter's wedding. He said how calm it all was. That was in no small part due to him. He was not available for No 2. All I can remember of that civfot was disappearing for an hour of more with the star guests leaving everyone to drink more pink lemonade (Kir Royale).

[Biggus]

Yes, it might not have been his finest hour, but....

The guy is 94 ffs! It was a "luncheon" at the RAF Club, the photo was no doubt taken before eating, and I have no doubt he spent most of his time during the meal talking to the veterans outside the glare of the media. Further, if you check the Court Circular (what do you mean you haven't got a copy!) you will see that later in the same day he was opening a Police Training Complex in Yorkshire a couple of hundred miles away - not sitting with his feet up at the palace drinking G&Ts as some of you seem to imagine.

I defy most people slagging him off here to be working as hard as he does at 94, and he has no plans for retirement!!

[Wander00]

Biggus, I am with you on this - still working at 94. Have met him twice and found him articulate, knowledgeable and easy to converse with.


Incidentally, regarding the "drachmas" comment earlier, ISTR he and his mother escaped from the revolution in Greece with little more than the clothes on their backs.


All in all, the guy has IMHO done a bl@@dy good job over the years

[sharpend]

BEagle... Your comment reminds me of the time at Brawdy when a number of us went to the Druidstone (the only place we could get a beer on a Sunday). We drank until the early hours watching the 40 knot fog roll in. A certain officer with the initials PK stated that he had his IRT the next morning, but the weather would be dog sh*t. As we returned to Brawdy up the hill we broke into bright sunshine. To his credit, that senior office did well on his IRT despite being just a little over the limit. I promised to report him to the I of FS, but then I remembered!

[BEagle]

A very fine chap, PK!

I was once doing a session of licensed hooliganism at SORF/RFS, as was PK. I'd just read the RAFG Flight Comment or some similar crash comic and announced to no-one in particular - "F... me - things must have been different then. Talk about pressonitis, you want to read this story of some d*ckhead flying a Swift through a German forest!".

After a brief pause, Air Cdre (I think he was) Pat King piped up "Actually, that was me....."

But he then continued "....and you're absolutely correct, young ( :suspect: )man - it was indeed pressonitis and I subsequently gave the AOC a sound listening-to!"

Pat King would hold court in the coffee bar and all those present learned hugely from his war stories (as we did from yours at Chiv., Bluntie ;) ). He had a very clever style too; as a VSO he looked around the shambles of dirty coffee cups, grubby coffee bar top and announced "Well, I guess it's MY turn to be duty housewife today!", before doing the washing up and cleaning the place up - the implied message being "If I can do it, so can you lot!". Which had the desired effect.

Back to Stavros, after he advised that RAF snapper to take the photo, there is a brief hint of a wicked grin on his face.

But his comments didn't always go down too well with Brenda; a mate who was looking after a Royal road route somewhere in deepest, darkest Lincolnshire was at some unmanned level crossing making sure that the train had been stopped to allow unimpeded crossing by the Royal party. As the limo whooshed past, mate came to the salute and spotted rather an unhappy looking Stavros clearly on the receiving end of a one-to-one debrief from Brenda....:uhoh:

Anyway, there's probably a private "Sorry, young man" message on the way from BH by now.....

[Shack37]

Anyway, there's probably a private "Sorry, young man" message on the way from BH by now.....


Certainly would like to think so. Something the lad could cherish for the rest of his career/life. Be worth the odd pint or two from his mates.

[Groucho]

@Wander

"he and his mother escaped from the revolution in Greece with little more than the clothes on their backs." - so we have indeed been told. I stress I have no other information, but a healthy element of caution for some such stories (particularly involving anything 'Greek' and 'poverty'..)

Our learned friend 'Bronx' counsels (elsewhere)

"Scepticism with regard to 'news' stories is healthy regardless of newspaper/media outlet."

As always, his comments are well-founded.

[Tinribs]

In any argument between photo man and HRH I will bet on the prince
for his wisdom courage and honesty.
Who has not been subject to the fiddling about that photogs get up to
forgetting their efforts are an extra not the main theme of the event

[tarantonight]

There is a time and place for everything (word).

That was the wrong time and place, whoever you are.

TN.

[Shack37]

In any argument between photo man and HRH I will bet on the prince
for his wisdom courage and honesty. Who has not been subject to the
fiddling about that photogs get up to forgetting their efforts are an extra
not the main theme of the event.


All very well Tinribs but some of the important people in the photograph may not have another chance to have their photo taken for the next BoB anniversary. Of course you can bet on the prince in this situation, he´s the one with the rank and in this case he abused it.

[Genstabler]

I expect he was speaking for everyone there but he was the only one with the status and balls to actually say it. Good for him.

[Secret1]

'Someone' at the event fouled up.

That someone should have had the guests all in perfect position just as the 'Greek-one' walked in and for him to immediately plonk himself down ready for photo-man to utter those famous 2 words, 'say cheese'.

All photo-man needed to do in the preliminaries was frame his shot and set the focus, ready to click when Stavros immediately sat down and smiled in response to, 'say cheese'.

Someone should by now have had words of wisdom spelt out to them by that helicopter pilot from Newark, and who was sat next to Phil.

Elementary project management. Or not in this case.:mad:

[teeteringhead]

Have to agree with Biggus - and Secret1.

In the unlikely event(s) that I:

a. Make 94

b. Am still working

then I shall allow myself public grumpiness with being f***ed about unnecessarily. (last word is the key)

[Lima Juliet]

Concur - busy people still working at 94 are allowed a certain level of grumpiness and need to be stage managed so their creaking bodies can cope.

LJ

[dctyke]

RAF photographers do not **** people around unnecessarily, they do their job in a professional manner........ Like the rest of the service. He would have been the first in line if the photograph had not come up to expectation.

[John Farley]

Leon.

Isn't that the truth.

[Lima Juliet]

JF

Yup, or copious amounts of ibuprofen blunts the edge! :ok:

Dctyke

I agree, that RAF photogs don't plan to mess people about. But the thing is, if there was a well executed plan then the Duke would not be getting grumpy. Poor show on the RAF team that missed the opportunity to swoosh HRH for a quick photo with his '4 score years and 10' veteran buddies, before getting on with the rest of the day. For ceremonial duties, prior planning prevents p!ss poor performance (and some will need to p!ss quite regularly at their age!).

LJ

[goudie]

The BoB veterans, whose day it was, are roughly the same age as Phil but no mention made of any discomfort they may have also felt by the photo shoot taking too long. It would be nice to believe Phil was cursing at the photographer on their behalf

[NutLoose]

'Someone' at the event fouled up.

That someone should have had the guests all in perfect position just as the 'Greek-one' walked in and for him to immediately plonk himself down ready for photo-man to utter those famous 2 words, 'say cheese'.

All photo-man needed to do in the preliminaries was frame his shot and set the focus, ready to click when Stavros immediately sat down and smiled in response to, 'say cheese'.

Someone should by now have had words of wisdom spelt out to them by that helicopter pilot from Newark, and who was sat next to Phil.

Elementary project management. Or not in this case


Err No, you seem to have missed the point that the chaps you would have standing ready and at the whim of Stavros are probably older than Stavros.

Concur - busy people still working at 94 are allowed a certain level of grumpiness and need to be stage managed so their creaking bodies can cope.



Odd though, the Battle of Britain veterans who are possibly older than him, didn't come across as rude nor as obnoxious as someone who should know better, it is one of his many gaffs reflecting badly on a day that was for one purpose, to Commemorate those lost and to thank those who survived for their service.

[NutLoose]

Same thought, at same time Gouldie :)