Unofficial Aircrew - WW2

[pulse1]

An book has recently come into my possession on line which describes the life of a young man who joined the RAF in 1940 and was initially trained as an aircraft mechanic. His first job was as ground crew on Hampden bombers based at Scampton.

At the time, the RAF did not have enough aircrew to meet their commitments and this guy was "volunteered" to act as lower gunner. He was given some training on the Browning .303 and provided with a Sergeant's shirt in case he became a POW. He went on several raids, mostly dropping leaflets, until his aircraft was shot down while on the approach to land back at Scampton. He was the only survivor and only had minor injuries, one of which was to his hearing. Because his aircrew role was unofficial his injured status became somewhat of an embarrassment to the RAF. He found that he couldn't tolerate the noise involved in his main role as a mechanic and, although he kept the mechanics rating, he spent the rest of the war in a variety of non-jobs. In one job he was posted to an as yet non existent Station and lived in digs in the village for several months.

He has written the book mainly to give to his family, not for general release, so I do not feel free to divulge too much detail at this stage but I had never heard of ground crew becoming unofficial aircrew before. I wondered if this was a common practice and anyone here knows anything about it.

[JW411]

It was common practice on my last RAF Squadron (53) for groundcrew to volunteer as air gunners on the Hawker Hectors flown from 1937 until 1939. They used to wear a brass "flying bullet" on the lower left sleeve. They also received some flying pay. When the Hectors were replaced with Bristol Blenheims, this practice continued and, indeed, several volunteers with rudimentary navigational experience were press-ganged into becoming observers. I have a note which says "One of the best of these was Sgt W J Cronin who was also the Sergeant Fitter in "A" Flight.

The practice seems to have ended when the Squadron came back from France in June 1940. Then, the air gunners wore the "AG" brevet and the observers were wearing the "O" brevet (which was re-introduced in 1937). All aircrew then had the minimum rank of Sergeant which ensured that they got into a better class of prison camp if they were unlucky enough to be shot down and captured.

[longer ron]

Probably the most numerous would have been the very early Airborne Interception (AI) radar operators,the Battle of Britain Memorial (BBM.org) website has many AC2/AC1/LAC operators who flew without Flying Badge or NCO rank - later the system caught up and the survivors who remained as aircrew would have become at least Sgt W Op/Radio Op etc until the system settled down to Radio Observer then Navigator.
I have just copy/pasted one individual - there are many names on the BBM list....

Robert Sydney Brown was born on 2nd October 1915 in Gateshead and was educated at Shipcote School and Gateshead Secondary School. He joined the RAF in early June 1940 and after his initial training he volunteered for flying duties.

At the end of June he went to Yatesbury for a short course on airborne radar and on 20th July was posted to 604 Squadron at Gravesend. He had yet to fly in an aircraft.

On the night of 1st November 1940 Brown was in a Blenheim on a fighter patrol. The aircraft went out of control and he and the Air Gunner were ordered to bale out, which they did and landed safely. The pilot regained control of the Blenheim and returned to Middle Wallop.

Brown flew operationally with 604, firstly in Blenheims and then Beaufighters until December 1940, when he was posted back to Yatesbury for another radar course.

In these five months he flew without rank or flying badge and was paid three shillings a day, this including one shilling flying pay.

After completing the radar mechanic course and gaining practical experience, Brown was attached to RAE Farnborough, where he remained until his release from the RAF in February 1946.

[longer ron]

Perhaps the best known (at one time anyway) would have been the handful of decorated photogs...

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv316/volvosmoker/dfm_zps6844rrv8.jpg



LAC Alan Fox was also awarded the DFM

[longer ron]

LAC Alan Fox later became quite well known...

When the Second World War broke out, Fox joined the Royal Air Force (RAF) and applied for aircrew training, but was rejected due to poor eyesight.[2] He served initially as a ground staff photographer in India and Burma, with the rank of Corporal. He volunteered for service as an aerial photographer with No. 3 Photographic Reconnaissance Unit, which undertook hazardous missions over Japanese-held areas, using North American Mitchell aircraft. Fox, who was promoted to Sergeant, received the Distinguished Flying Medal (RAF). After the war, Fox worked for the Forestry Commission in Scotland.

In 1947–48, he undertook a diploma in public administration at Ruskin College, an independent institution in Oxford. Fox then entered the University of Oxford, where he spent the majority of his academic career, studying economics and political science at Exeter College. In 1950, while lecturing at Ruskin, he completed a Bachelor of Letters (B.Litt.) thesis on the history of industrial relations in the Black Country.[3] That same year, Fox married Margaret Dow, with whom he had two sons. In 1958, he became a research fellow at Nuffield College and in 1963, he became a lecturer at Nuffield, in the Department of Social and Administrative Studies.

Fox rose to prominence with a 1966 paper, Industrial Sociology And Industrial Relations, written for the Donovan Royal Commission on Trade Unions and Employers' Associations (1965–68). In it he described the dominance in industrial relations of two, rival ideological/theoretical perspectives.[4] The first, for which Fox coined the name "unitary" (later unitarist), denies that the interests of employers and employees were significantly different from each other.[5] For the other perspective, he used an existing term from political science: "pluralist", a perspective which suggests that multiple parties are involved in decision-making. However, Fox himself was strongly influenced by a third major theoretical position: the "radical" perspective, especially Marxism.[6]

[pulse1]

Wow! Such a wealth of information and so quickly. Thank you very much for your responses. One lives and learns.

[izod tester]

LAC Reynolds was the gunner of the 12 Sqn Battle shot down whilst attacking the bridge at Veldwezelt on the Albert canal on 12 May 1940. The pilot, Fg Off Garland and the Reverse, Sgt Gray, were both awarded the Vicoria Cross. LAC Reynolds received no recognition.

[papajuliet]

Isn't it true to say that the men mentioned in previous posts were, no matter their rank, "official" aircrew?
What about those who had no business being on operational flights but were smuggled aboard? Whilst I can't, at present, find the sources, I've read of non aircrew, even WAAFs being taken on ops.

[om15]

Richard Dimbleby flew on twenty bombing raids with the RAF including one on Berlin, also Ed Murrow flew and reported on twenty five allied raids.
I am not sure if they held some form of temporary commission to protect them if they fell into enemy hands, or if they flew as civilians.

[longer ron]

Isn't it true to say that the men mentioned in previous posts were, no matter their rank, "official" aircrew?
What about those who had no business being on operational flights but were smuggled aboard? Whilst I can't, at present, find the sources, I've read of non aircrew, even WAAFs being taken on ops.

Yes but the OP's example was also 'official' in that the RAF knew he was flying as part of a crew - which is why I posted those particular Airmen !

One of the 'airmen' DFM holders later had some trouble because it was unheard of for groundcrew to have an operational flying medal - but I cannot remember which one !

[longer ron]

From WW1 -

One of my favourite books is 'Flight Path' by Frank T Courtney...he was not allowed to join the RFC as a pilot because he wore glasses and also was an experienced a/c mechanic !! rare in those days !!
He was posted as an Air Mechanic 2nd class (AM2) to Farnborough and because he had a pilots ticket he managed to become an unofficial instructor,eventually given his wings (still as an AM2) without a military flying course - he even managed to get into action against Trenchards wishes (because of his spectacles)...great book,he later became a freelance test pilot inc for Cierva on autogiros.

[longer ron]

A slightly different type of 'unofficial' aircrew :)

Thomas Dobney

Joined RAF aged 14yrs 3months
awarded wings 15yrs 5months
Flew (I believe) 20 ish operations on AW Whitley bombers before being grounded.

'Shopped' by his Father (separated parents) after being photographed meeting the King...the RAF immediately grounded him but told him he could rejoin when old enough.
He later became a Captain on Kings flight !

He wrote an autobiography but cannot remember the title

[om15]

One of the 'airmen' DFM holders later had some trouble because it was unheard of for groundcrew to have an operational flying medal - but I cannot remember which one !

I'm pretty sure it was the two airmen that flew with Warburton, the book by Tony Spooner (Warburton's War) does mention this.
Both Norman Shirley and Ron Haddon had problems caused by wearing the DFM ribbons as they did not have an aircrew badge and were picked up on this again and again, they both adopted the policy of not wearing the ribbons where they we not known. Norman Shirley believes the reason that they were both offered commissions was to get them out of this predicament.

ISBN0907579434 published by Crecy

[ian16th]

Before the outbreak of WWII, besides the volunteer gunners with the winged bullet, I believe that wireless operators could also fly as signalers under a similar scheme.

I heard of this happening in India on the NW Frontier, but I cannot quote a reference.

[reynoldsno1]

My father qualified as an air gunner during his RAF service between 1924 & 1936. He was an admin clerk.
He was still on the active reserve in 1939 and called up with the BEF to France in 1939/40. He was a clerk again, but his log book shows he flew on Battles as an occasional air gunner/wop. He was commissioned later & flew on Liberators 'unofficially', as his position on the Sqn as adjutant/intel officer meant he was 'officially' banned from operational sorties. Photos at the time show he sometimes wore an AG brevet, sometimes not. In 1946 he was again a Sqn adjutant, and sometimes flew as W/Op on trooping flights to Palestine and India.
I still recall him and an old friend talking to each other in morse code whilst having a beer at the local ...:ok:

[rolling20]

On a similar note, there were apparently cases of WAAFs flying un officially on Bomber Command operations. This is from Max Hastings Bomber Command: It was not unknown for Bomber Command crews to take
occasional passengers on operations. Some were authorized –
station commanders or reporters. Others were quite illicit – members
of ground crew and in extremely isolated cases, WAAFs. The
Germans sought to make propaganda capital out of an episode
early in 1942 when they claimed to have found a dead WAAF in
a shot-down Stirling

[papajuliet]

Rolling20 - that reference to Waafs on ops. must be what I was thinking of [ see my earlier post].
I also recall reading of a WAAF, illicitly on an operation, who lost consciousness because of oxygen failure. It was put right and she was OK but when the crew were asked what they would have done if she had died, the reply was "dropped her in the North Sea"....!

[rolling20]

Papajuliet, IIRC Max Hastings interviewed a pilot who took a WAAF on ops. I daresay the gentleman in question unfortunately has passed away by now. I for one would love to have heard the story.

[longer ron]

Possibly the best known pilot to have been 'caught' with a WAAF passenger was Roly Beaumont when he took a WAAF A.S.Officer to a dance at Pembrey in his Hurricane - for which he was court martialled and istr the circumstances might have partially led him into test flying :)
Am away from books at the mo - so cannot check details !

[ancientaviator62]

If you look at the crew list for OC 78 Sqns a/c on the Peenemunde raid you will see another W/C listed. I am reliably informed that he was an Admin Officer from Bomber Command who did have the blessing of the C in C.

[rolling20]

He must have been a brave man flying in a Halibag II @ that stage of the war!

[ICM]

I doubt that 78 Sqn was alone in having Staff Officers from Command or Group fly the occasional sortie, and similar examples occur from time to time in the 10 Sqn records - including one officer from Anti-Aircraft Command, presumably keen to find out how the opposition organised their defences. Also, in mid-1944, the 10 Sqn Adjutant was 'awarded' a Flying Adjutant badge by his aircrew colleagues - FA in the wreath, with a quill pen for the wing. I have not spotted his name on a crew list but, around the same time, he was listed as Mentioned in Despatches for distinguished conduct, and I'm tempted to think that he might have flown on at least one sortie, even if unofficially.

[Bawburgh]

I am researching my Uncle's time in the RAF. He ferried Beaufighters for 1, Ferry Sqdn and 1, Overseas Aircraft Delivery Unit, RAF Portreath.
Does anyone know what a delivery to North Africa involved.
Thanks, hopefully.