RFDS QLD Advertising for Pilots

[sl235]

Hi all,

Interested on any info on working conditions, rosters etc for RFDS QLD section as advertised below. (Hold Pool)

Pilot (http://flyingdoctor.applynow.net.au/jobs/RFDS70-pilot)

Most recent thread I could find did not seem like there was a good environment regarding current management situation, is this still the case or have things improved / deteriorated further? What are the major issues?

PM if you prefer not to state on here.

Thanks.

[Grogmonster]

Just curious how the ATPL requirement is going to be met in future as it is impossible to gain one unless you are in an airline now.

Groggy

[Horatio Leafblower]

Maybe they are looking for people with a few grey hairs?

[Arm out the window]

As far as I can work out from Part 61, ATPL(A) needs:

>21 years old
CPL or Multi-Crew licence (A)
Theory pass
Flight training for ATPL
Pass the flight test IFR turbine with co-pilot, or in an approved sim
Multi-crew co-op course pass

Experience:
>1500 hrs aeronautical experience
>1400 as a pilot
>750 as pilot (A)

either >500 PICUS(A)
or >250 PIC or PICUS (70 must be PIC)

and >200 cross country(A)
and >100 cross country PIC or PICUS (PICUS being the new ICUS:rolleyes:)

and >100 night that's not dual

and >75 IF
and >45 IF(A)

How is this impossible? Costly, yes, but ...

[sl235]

Not sure how this turned into an ATPL thread? Does anyone have any info on the original post?

Thanks

[Jamair]

To answer your questions,

the Pilot EA for RFDSQ is on the AFAP website

The rosters are constructed to support a 24/7 SPIFR service, 0600-1800-0600 or variations thereof

Working conditions are excellent as are the aircraft and team. The fleet is currently all Proline 21-2 dual FMS B200 Kingairs with a couple of pc12s getting ready to retire; a new B350HW is enroute from USA, should be landing in Oz tomorrow.

Most vacancies in RFDSQ are as a result of retirement or expansion; very few pilots leave the organisation for another job. Should give you an insight into the 'environment'.

[Swamp Duck]

I second that Jamair, best gig in aviation, but not for the inexperienced.

Landing on dirt station strips in the middle of the night, frequent in flight diversions etc, all single pilot in a B200.

The ability to think on your feet is definitely a prerequisite as is the abitlity to work as part of a small team of pilot, doctor and nurse managing some times very challenging situations.

It is much more than just a flying job. Its being part of a team of very skilled individuals, flying late model, very well equipped and maintained aircraft, helping some of the most remote people in the country. Doesn't get any better than that :-)

[Judd]

all single pilot in a B200.

Certainly one of the most demanding jobs in aviation in Australia. Beats me though why they don't carry two pilots as the environment surely often tests a single pilot to his limits.

I recall from many years ago the Essendon branch of the RFDS or Aerial Ambulance, employed a Swiss national who had thousands of hours on the King Air. He resigned after three weeks saying it was crazy flying single pilot in the RFDS environment. He had been used to doing the same job in Europe where the regulations required a two pilot crew for all multi-engine turbine ops.

In retrospect, it was possible that RFDS two pilot ops could well prevented the death of an RFDS pilot who was killed several years ago, while on final approach at night to Mt Gambier. He was highly experienced. ATSB was unable to pin down the cause of the crash which happened 4 miles out on final and a witness seeing the landing lights.

The weather at the time (mist, light rain and very dark) was conducive to erroneous indications by the T-VASIS due light signal refraction caused by high moisture. It was later revealed that the Mount Gambier T-VASIS was well known by local pilots for this problem.

[clear to land]

I would argue that the Swiss national had not been doing the same job in Europe as he would have always had an ILS nearby, no remote landings let alone remote areas, no flare or car headlight landings and extremely good radar coverage. Also, it is likely he had minimal single pilot experience and SP versus Multi crew is a completely different operation and mindset. Also coming from Europe the concept of something as simple as the distances to travel in Australia are completely foreign. Yes he would have had significant weather flying experience, but again multi crew in a radar controlled environment with numerous alternates. The skill sets required do not transfer over easily, although if the individual did resign then obviously he was mature and professional enough to recognise it was not for him. Having done both RFDS and now years of worldwide multi-crew operations I can categorically say that RFDS flying was, at times, the most personally challenging and professionally rewarding that I have ever done.

[440]

Two pilots would be a luxury that the operation can't carry, the ranges required vs the gear that is carried virtually rule out two pilots (just can't carry the weight).

[Swamp Duck]

It is not crazy to fly single pilot in thr RFDS environment. You just have to employ the right people with the right experience level, skill set, and mind set. As I said, it is not a job for the inexperienced.

If you look through the pilot ranks within Queensland RFDS you will find some of the most experienced aviators in the country with some amazing back grounds and yes quite a bit of grey hair.

This is complimented by excellent equipment including dual FMS, Proline 21 King Airs with paperless cockpits.

The training is second to none, done by the cream of these outstanding aviators to ensure a safe operation.

The culture within the RFDS is one of support and training as these aviators have nothing to prove so you can rely on support without criticism from any of your fellow pilots which is a vast knowledge base any time of the day or night.

Yes we do fly single pilot, but we are also a team.

The RFDS motto "Can Do, Can Do Safely" is what it is all about.

[Swamp Duck]

All positions are advertised internally first based on seniority before going out to new recruits Most new positions, but not always will be in the remote traditional bases, Charleville or Mount Isa.

The remote traditional bases do offer the best flying as they do mainly primary retrieval. The coastal bases, other than Cairns as it is traditional do mainly hospital transfers, so pilots that transfer from the remote bases to the coastal bases generally only do so for family reasons.

[The Butcher's Dog]

"The training is second to none, done by the cream of these outstanding aviators to ensure a safe operation.

The culture within the RFDS is one of support and training as these aviators have nothing to prove so you can rely on support without criticism from any of your fellow pilots which is a vast knowledge base any time of the day or night.

Yes we do fly single pilot, but we are also a team."

Pity this can't be said for other sections....................:*

[DynaBolt]

Gota be a whole lot betta than the South East section at present.
Lotta issues there at present...from what I hear!!!!
Dynabolt

[Howard Hughes]

Pity this can't be said for other sections....................
Geez mate that's a bit harsh!

Give them time they will get there, the RFDS is a slow moving animal! ;)

On the subject of two crew, my guess is it will start to appear in RFDS operations within the next 5 years. Most likely driven by contractual requirements for the various State (and Territory) contracts.

And not before time too! :ok:

[The Butcher's Dog]

Harsh........................? No, not really. The rest of what you say is likely though;)

[Swamp Duck]

Why do you all think that you need two pilots to fly a King Air. Last time I looked it was a single pilot aeroplane. If you're not up to it I suggest that you need not apply.

[Metro man]

RFDS pilots are a different breed, true bush pilots rather than the automation managing cadets being churned out today who know the books inside out but would balk at less than 2000m of tarmac with an ILS at both ends.

[Judd]

As I said, it is not a job for the inexperienced.

Nor, as most people would think, is the first officers job in an A380, B777, B737 - you name it. But that hasn't stopped airlines hiring and regulators approving 300 hour TT pilots from being second in command of a bloody great jet transport...

[A37575]

This is complimented by excellent equipment including dual FMS, Proline 21 King Airs with paperless cockpits.

The training is second to none, done by the cream of these outstanding aviators to ensure a safe operation.

The culture within the RFDS is one of support and training as these aviators have nothing to prove so you can rely on support without criticism from any of your fellow pilots which is a vast knowledge base any time of the day or night.

Cue the playing of bands, twirling of dancing girls, the TV cameras scoping the hero aviators of the RFDS and all the other associated bull***t look at what supermen pilots we are.

[Stationair8]

Where is the B350 going to be based?

[Hempy]

I'll throw in a hand grenade and ask if some of the people asserting that single pilot ops in that environment are safe also claimed that the PC-12 was a poor choice because it's a single engined aircraft? :ouch::E

[prospector]

I will catch that grenade and throw it in the water.

Like any operation, it is as safe as it is made to be. Surely the record speaks for itself. After many years SPIFR operations, and still lasting to collect my pension, I would say it is, for the right operators, as safe as any other flying. Perhaps more so, you know you have no one to catch any mistakes so you avoid making them.

The single engine against the twin is a different kettle of fish. My personal choice would certainly be for a twin engine mount for SPIFR, or any IFR actually, having had in my career three engine failures, all of which were no great hastle as long as the other one kept breathing.

[Hempy]

Whats the fuse delay? :p

Human factors in modern aviation suggests that the weakest link these days is the human element..Just sayin'

[prospector]

Human factors in modern aviation suggests that the weakest link these days is the human element..Just sayin'


Human factors in modern aviation?? I do believe that statement is correct, trying to figure out why it is so in this day and age with so much fail safe technology, the ability to know what your exact position is at any time via GPS, the vastly improved range of Air Traffic Control Radar for separation, etc etc etc why human factors are such a problem is certainly a cause for concern.

[Captain Nomad]

Folks, the main reason why RFDS does not have 2 pilots is cost. RFDS would have to at least double its pilot numbers to operate as a 2 crew operation. The cost impost of this on a non-profit organisation would be horrendous. Sure there is big money in RFDS contracts and fund raising but there is never enough to go around as it is... It is also likely that a competitor will tender a cheaper contract saying that they only require a single pilot to fulfil the terms of the contract and bingo, RFDS goes 'out of business.' The government surely won't pay for it and fund raising would most likely be insufficient so risk vs reward returns to default...

[thorn bird]

"The cost impost of this on a non-profit organization"

The RFDS like Care flight is not a not for profit organization.

They bid for, and win commercial contracts. They do not do that for any other motive but "PROFIT", where that profit gets absorbed is up to them, directors fees and bonuses, management salaries and bonuses, etc. etc. entirely up to them.

[Grogmonster]

I have to agree with Thornbird as he is spot on.

Groggy

[SpyderPig]

Just another question on this if I may. Is there internal progression options onto the Kingair for people initially employed on the 208? Always wanted to be a part of the RFDS but yet don't meet the requirements for the Kingair. Seems like a good chance to get into the organisation:ok: PMs welcome

[morno]

Depends how you define "profit" thornbird. The days of RFDS relying on the CWA to sell cakes to keep the local aircraft in the air, are long gone. To continue providing the mantle of care, other avenues are required to obtain these funds in the modern environment.

So "profit" to the RFDS, is simply excess money that they have after receiving money from various contracts etc., that they can then further invest into providing a health service to ALL Australians. Classic examples - new aircraft. I believe VH-FDN, a brand new 350 for QLD, touched down in Australia the other day.

The RFDS annual reports are all on their website. Nothing to hide. While I'm sure that the directors etc. are all earning comfortable salaries, I doubt that they are extravagent.

Spyderpig,
Yes, there is. Regardless of hours, they're looking for the right type of person. Get the right type of person, and after a while, hours fade away into the background.

A37575,
Do I sense some sour grapes or something? I spent a number of years working at RFDS, and "Superman pilots" definitely was not the attitude by any of the pilots. We were/are all quite down to earth guys who were lucky enough to be flying for an organisation which put the effort in to employ people with the right attitude and the will to learn the tricks of the trade.

One thing that was heavily heavily stressed during every training event, was the need to not become complacent any time you were in the cockpit. Recognition that single pilot was our downfall, so therefore self discipline and a non-complacent approach to every flight was required.

I did several years at RFDS. Enjoyed it, learnt a lot, got some invaluable experience out of it, saw some things that I'd rather not see again in my life (both in the cockpit and behind the curtain, or on the tarmac), and met some people who were true characters in many ways.

One thing I will add - don't go to RFDS purely to get some flying experience, you won't last. The 'air ambulance' bases, you could get away with it for a while, but if you're sent out to the 'traditional' bases, then you're there to provide a service and a helping hand to the community. They (the community) expect someone who is professional in every way, and approachable and easy to talk to, especially when their loved one is lying on your stretcher with the doctor and nurse busy working on them, and you're the only person there for that person to talk to. You are the RFDS to those people, so make sure you live up to the reputation of professionalism.

morno

[Swamp Duck]

Well said Morno, they just don't get it :-)

[Centaurus]

A37575,
Do I sense some sour grapes or something?

Methinks A375 was more concerned at the tendency for company trumpet blowing by an enthusiastic member of the organisation than displaying sour grapes. Nothing wrong with that as long as the trumpet playing is not over the top - which some could argue it is..:ugh:

[Swamp Duck]

I apologize for the poor wording of my earlier post and am horrified that it was taken as "trumpet blowing", not my intention.

My point was they go to a lot of effort to employ the right people with the appropriate personality and skill set for the type of flying we do and equally as diligent in selecting the right people for check and TRAINING. You know "Old School".

[Famzos]

Folks, the main reason why RFDS does not have 2 pilots is cost. .........fund raising would most likely be insufficient so risk vs reward returns to default...
I suspect it could indeed be done but it would require a major shift in accounting outlook to overcome what is, and has long been, the fiscal status quo in that organisation. This usually requires regime change.

[Captain Nomad]

Famzos, I raise you by one. It would take more than internal RFDS change - it would require external government contractual requirement change. If not, a single-pilot contract tendered (by RFDS or otherwise) will win hands-down on cost every time. Now when the government does not always fully foot the bill for these contracts there is already a cost shortfall so the government would have to make a strong case for why the contract requirement should change. Then the bun fight over who should pay would really hit overdrive...!

[Saltbush]

Hey everyone, I see QLD Section have advertised again, second time in as many months. Are the positions coastal or remote? B200, B350, C208 or Platypus???

Saltbush

[Stationair8]

According to the Townsville refuellers offsider, a little bit of an exodus from RFDS QLD is about to happen.