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Capot
8th Mar 2015, 15:38
UK readers will be happy that the publicly funded, corrupt, unaccountable, right-wing organisation trading as ACPO (Association of Chief Police Officers) will be closed by the present Government within a month.

If this is a vote-winning gambit for the election, so what. It's worked for me.

This organisation operated as a secret Government; it used tax-payers funds in huge quantities to serve its own ends, decided which laws the Police would actually enforce, introduced measures that removed civil rights one by one from UK citizens without any democratic input from Parliament.

It consisted of 400 or so senior Police officers from around the country, with a hugely bloated and expensive secretariat. By definition, these people are unlikely to understand the concept of civil liberties and freedoms.

We are well shot of it; perhaps its end was signalled by the introduction of Police and Crime Commissioners with a remit that was in direct contradiction to ACPO. Perhaps not; the PCCs turned out to be equally corrupt, and few if any dared to take on ACPO head-on.

Whatever the reason, here's another huge "Well Done" for Theresa May, the first politician in decades with the guts and determination to take on the Police and ACPO, and win.

UniFoxOs
8th Mar 2015, 15:44
While I am happy to see the end of ACPO I will reserve judgment on take on the Police and ACPO, and win.

These people are so totally convinced that their view of the world is the only one, that I don't think they will give up so easily.

Tankertrashnav
8th Mar 2015, 17:15
Next step is to rationalise the organisation of the police in England and Wales which still consists of 43 different forces, constabularies or services, whatever you want to call them. Each has its own chief constable and deputy and police commissioner all drawing large salaries, and its own HQ with its attendant admin costs. Petty jealousies and poor inter-force communication all reduce the effectiveness of law enforcement.

Scotland has recently adopted a unified police service, and in the military the British army has reduced the number of infantry regiments from over 60 in the 1950s to 12 today. Nowadays you hardly ever see a bobby wearing a helmet -so why the need for 43 different helmet badges?

Andy_S
8th Mar 2015, 17:28
Next step is to rationalise the organisation of the police in England and Wales which still consists of 43 different forces

While there are some merits in the idea, I suspect that what would actually happen would be one of those classic public sector re-organisations in which the rationalised organisation ended up with more staff rather than fewer, more pay bands and even bigger salaries for those at the top of the organisation.

Pleased to see APCO going, though. A thoroughly sinister, self serving and unaccountable organisation.

G-CPTN
8th Mar 2015, 17:59
One drawback of 'centralisation' is that those dispatching and coordinating the forces (be they police or breakdown services) have no local knowledge on which to base their decisions.
Geography (and social circumstances) can greatly influence a suitable response and deployment.

Checkboard
8th Mar 2015, 18:17
They don't have to live there for that. The operatives gain the local insight though the experience of dispatching and coordinating the forces.

Air Traffic Controllers operate a particular geographic sector, and gain experience operating that sector - even though the ATC centre may be several countries distant.

Fortyodd2
8th Mar 2015, 19:11
ACPO gone :)
and replaced by the National Police Chiefs Council :uhoh:

Same old same old....

When all else fails, Re-brand.

west lakes
8th Mar 2015, 21:47
They don't have to live there for that. The operatives gain the local insight though the experience of dispatching and coordinating the forces.

Trouble is that it takes time to gain that experience

In these parts all the dispatching is done from Lancashire and is computer based
So in the early days we saw the fire service asking for assistance from Scotland for a fire on the Cumbrian side of the Solway Firth as it was closer as the "Crow Flies".
That the vehicles had to go through Carlisle (two fire stations) and past another to get to the fire was totally missed!!

This winter has seen ambulances dispatched from Barrow-in-Furness to the Fleetwood area as they were closer, forgetting Morecambe Bay in between and the additional 80 miles by road.

But the computer said so!

There is also a great fear with the more rural forces that they will lose out to the demands of the cities, something our local TV news is suggesting has started to happen in the South of Scotland

jimtherev
8th Mar 2015, 23:53
In the seat of everything great and organised (ahem, ahem) - i.e. the Metropolitan Police, they tried the consolidation route starting in IIRC 2003-4. Three control rooms replacing 23 - one in each borough. Enoooormous hogsnortons were perpetuated in the name of efficiency. Many experienced control room officers decided to seek employment elsewhere instead of a long commute, often at unsocial hours.
I lost contact with police consultancy about then, but hear rumours that they're still not sorted.

Tankertrashnav
9th Mar 2015, 00:22
I don't see that if you have one large police force that automatically means you can't have regional control rooms/despatching centres, as at present. But I take your point that they could well end up firing a lot of indians and keeping all the chiefs. (Am I allowed to say that these days? ;))

Be interesting to hear from someone who knows how it's working out in Scotland.

skydiver69
9th Mar 2015, 10:34
Next step is to rationalise the organisation of the police in England and Wales which still consists of 43 different forces, constabularies or services, whatever you want to call them. Each has its own chief constable and deputy and police commissioner all drawing large salaries, and its own HQ with its attendant admin costs. Petty jealousies and poor inter-force communication all reduce the effectiveness of law enforcement.

Unfortunately TTN current Tory political dogma gets in the way of that idea. The Tories are wedded to the idea of PCCs and won't consider anything which weakens that experiment no matter how much money it would save. Talk about cutting your nose to spite your face. The closest the Tories have come to allowing mergers is in back office functions and some specialist departments such as dogs and firearms, where some forces such as West Mercia and Warks are collaborating.

Having said that there is scope for cuts in senior ranks but very few chief constables have done that meaning that deeper cuts have been made in the numbers of PCs and civi staff to compensate.

cockney steve
9th Mar 2015, 13:55
I would suggest that the top hierarchy are purely policy-makers and administrators....therefore, they should be superfluous, as 26 different "empires" should all be run to a common set of standards and rules.

Local police stations are normally manned by Local people, though I do believe they are shunted-around a bit to ensure that any minor deviancies in administering the law, are made difficult or eliminated. ( blind eye being turned where it suits them, persecution where "they" have a score to settle.... (remember the motorist who was hounded mercilessly?, tip if the iceberg) Nevertheless, this is where local Knowledge lies , and such "intelligence" should be properly used.

Local stations are , effectively , branches or outposts of a NATIONAL, COORDINATED organisation....about time they were made to rationalise this archaic "old boys" network structure. too much admin between the top brass and the "Grunts"

I've seen letters, from various forces, to another...."motorcar ABC123 was parked contrary to..........on our patch......it is registered to j bloggs on your patch.........waffle waffle.....

WTF??? secretaries , wasting time and money sending formal letters to another "Empire"? "national"...."Joined-up? nah!.


Individual coppers are generally OK, commonsense, conciensious individuals It's the entrenched, unfit for purpose, antiquated Admin edifice which needs demolishing and a better, more streamlined system introduced, with proper consultation with the men and women holding the 5h1tty end of the stick, the public -facing plod.

I spotted some stolen rolls Royce wheel-trims on Ebay.....offered to give a colour-sample which would prove they were, in fact, stolen......Plod dicked me about, told me not to bid and buy them, as they would make sure they were recovered......2 days after Auction ended.....2 Plod on the doorstep

"Well they were 200 miles away, you can't expect us to send an Officer down there to collect them" NO, FKUKWIT, I could have bought them and the vendor would have posted them in a SEALED parcel, which you could have opened, colour-matched and checked the other unique identifiers I showed you".....very conveniently, they were now on their way to Turkey.

So, in the 21st. century, Email, PDF documents, J-peg high -def photos, express/ registered post, overnight Courier services, are all alien concepts to Greater Manchester Police.... I suggested they remove their personages and waste someone else's space.
That's just my most recent dealing with them. many more examples....and the classic "co-operate or we'll make things awkward" threat, or when it suits them, "nothing to do with us, it's a Civil Matter" :yuk: (in lieu of a spitting one.)